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  • Community Question: What makes a good motherboard?

What is considered to be a mainstream CPU now?

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whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
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The problem with that is that you would probably create situations where a 4C/8T Ryzen would outperform the 6C/6T parts. Probably the same reason Intel didn't enable HT on the newer i3's.
AMD might be better off in the long run to have SMT enabled on all future APUs and CPUs.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
103,551
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Most people aren't gamers. Nor workstation class users. Pretty much any CPU in the $100 to $160 range from either AMD or Intel would fit the mainstream label.
This. Plus, consider that anyone buying a CPU on its own, to put in a box, is not going to be in the mainstream. Mainstream is basically what you will find in predominantly OEM, pre-built boxes: including cell phones and such. I think 4 core is pretty much there, with even low-end laptops putting out 4/4 options, if not 4c/8t for mid-tier options.

I think it is sometime yet to see 6-core get this kind of wide adoption because regardless of the nice pricing from AMD with their Ryzen 5 chips, AMD really isn't going to have the adoption rate any time soon, if ever, to define a new paradigm for what is mainstream. They might serve to push Intel in this direction, but it really doesn't happen until Intel decides to release a competing chip in that price/performance category that is attractive enough for OEMs to target their general consumer sectors with them.
 

Thunder 57

Golden Member
Aug 19, 2007
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I think it is sometime yet to see 6-core get this kind of wide adoption because regardless of the nice pricing from AMD with their Ryzen 5 chips, AMD really isn't going to have the adoption rate any time soon, if ever, to define a new paradigm for what is mainstream. They might serve to push Intel in this direction, but it really doesn't happen until Intel decides to release a competing chip in that price/performance category that is attractive enough for OEMs to target their general consumer sectors with them.
Anything from AMD needs an iGPU otherwise it will never be mainstream. I'll bet we see hex core APU's with Zen 2. I am very curious as to the amount of cores per CCX in Zen 2.
 

whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
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Anything from AMD needs an iGPU otherwise it will never be mainstream. I'll bet we see hex core APU's with Zen 2. I am very curious as to the amount of cores per CCX in Zen 2.
It would be a smart move by AMD for Zen2 to be 6c/12t and 8c/16t APUs. And release a 4c/8t one for the budget market.
 

Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
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It would be a smart move by AMD for Zen2 to be 6c/12t and 8c/16t APUs. And release a 4c/8t one for the budget market.
I disagree. Anyone that needs 6 cores or more, probably needs a discrete video card. Games, renderers, and the like all need discrete higher level video cards.
 

whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
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I disagree. Anyone that needs 6 cores or more, probably needs a discrete video card. Games, renderers, and the like all need discrete higher level video cards.
Will since Intel already has a six core CPU with iGPU and will later release an 8 core one, then maybe AMD should follow suit? However I kind of agree with you.
 

Thunder 57

Golden Member
Aug 19, 2007
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I disagree. Anyone that needs 6 cores or more, probably needs a discrete video card. Games, renderers, and the like all need discrete higher level video cards.
With 7nm they ought to have the die space to spare. There should certainly be a 6 core APU, maybe even an 8. I think it depends on what they do with the CCX. If they go to a 6 core CCX with Zen 2 you can bet on a 6 core APU.
 

whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
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With 7nm they ought to have the die space to spare. There should certainly be a 6 core APU, maybe even an 8. I think it depends on what they do with the CCX. If they go to a 6 core CCX with Zen 2 you can bet on a 6 core APU.
That should increase OEM sales at least.
 

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
12,968
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It would be a smart move by AMD for Zen2 to be 6c/12t and 8c/16t APUs. And release a 4c/8t one for the budget market.
I disagree. Anyone that needs 6 cores or more, probably needs a discrete video card. Games, renderers, and the like all need discrete higher level video cards.
I think mobile APU as 6c/12t and 8c/16t would be great.....particularly if the iGPU is large (with HBM memory)

However, if the iGPU is large (with HBM memory) I don't think it will work on a desktop socket meant for 16C CPUs without having to reduce PCIe lanes on the 16C CPU. (16C/32T CPU really isn't mainstream anymore so it really should be dedicated for high performance storage)
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
103,551
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Anything from AMD needs an iGPU otherwise it will never be mainstream. I'll bet we see hex core APU's with Zen 2. I am very curious as to the amount of cores per CCX in Zen 2.
Yeah, I think you're right. Need to see wide adoption in laptops/portable to consider that factor as mainstream.
 

LightningZ71

Senior member
Mar 10, 2017
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I'm assuming two things:
1) AMD won't tear up the CCX to make a 6 core one for Zen 2.
2) It appears that the iGPU on the current Raven Ridge processor is hitting the limits of what can efficiently be done with dual channel DDR4.

Assuming the scaling for 7nm would make the current RR die about 30% the size that it currently has, I'll guess the following:
1)The next APU die will have 2 X 4 core CCX units with more L3 cache than the current ones. Probably will go back to the 8MB per core like PR. This should take some memory load off of the DRAM controller, providing more for the iGPU.
2)The iGPU will see minimal tweaking, maybe one or two more CUs to take advantage of the marginal increase in available memory bandwidth.
3)In the same package size, with the above changes, there is room for a non-trivial L4 cache. That could be implemented to improve iGPU performance. I doubt that we'll see that though. There is also the possibility that, instead of doing an L4 cache, they implement a HBM controller instead. This can allow AMD to use a smaller die, and implement a back channel HBM stack in the same package using MCM or something like EMIB for high end APUs while leaving it off for low end products. This would be in keeping with AMD's current philosophy and offer substantial performance improvements for their APU stack.

The total die size will be reduced, increasing die yield per wafer, which helps AMD for production efficiency. This will be a compelling product for mainstream business and home OEM desktops and traditional format laptops.

Assuming that AMD revenues continue to increase as they have, and that they have more engineering resources, I expect that we'll also see a smaller APU die eventually created that is essentially a 7nm shrink of an optimized Raven Ridge die with the Zen2 core and uncore improvements. This can be targeted at the lower power ultraportable/convertible market.
 
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