What can save PC Gaming?

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: meltdown75
i think if more people actually bought new games, the problems would dissipate. so... imho piracy is the main issue.

but more innovation is needed on the creative side of things. for example, many sequels tend to be retreads of previous versions, released early and without a lot of differences from the originals, in an attempt to grab the exact same demographic. as a result i believe the user base for these particular games decreases instead of increases. HL2 would be an exception, since I think more people play it now than ever before.

if thats the case, then why are console software sales going up? piract affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming.

Piracy for a console isn't a simple matter of going to the latest warez site and downloading a cracked version of the game. I wouldn't say it affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming. Any idiot with a broadband connection and copy of kazaa can download most popular titles. Didn't you have to mod your xbox to play cracked games or something? I don't think your average kiddie did that.

 

[WhoBeDaPlaya]

Originally posted by: Vaerilis
New ideas could save the industry.
I'm not interested in the eleventy-billionth rehashes of old games. Why can't they produce games like Fallout, X-Com, Freespace or Worms any longer?

QFT. I demand Freespace, Descent, Freelancer/Starlancer, Wing Commander and Sam 'n Max 2 - now!

 

[KoolDrew]

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
By getting rid of all the non mature players.

:thumbsup:

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: larry89
It seems that nothing can save PC gaming now.

It has gotton to the point where we arent WOWED by the games at all we usually expect something better and better and better. Well alot if not most of us..

This is true, to an extent.
I expected FEAR to be "wow", but there are little things which get to me, like voice/subtitles not matching, and rockets not blowing chunks out of the walls, those got to me because I was expecting more.
Boiling Point: Road To Hell on the other hand, was INCREDIBLY buggy, full of errors much worse than those in FEAR, but I was wowed by it, possibly more than FEAR. It was a *fun* game most of the time, while FEAR is a lot of the same over and over.
The little things in a high profile game get to you, but they don't matter when you have lower expectations and the game tries to be so much like in BP.

 

[Al Neri]

the industry needs more jazz jackrabbit...

 

[Al Neri]

the industry needs more jazz jackrabbit...

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: matstars
the industry needs more jazz jackrabbit...

Unreal > Jazz

 

[HumblePie]

WAIT WAIT WAIT... where the hell are those revenue numbers coming from??? If they are talking from Microsofts own pocketbook, then yes, PC gaming is going down FOR THEM. Not everyone else. If anything, it's growing exponentially.

Uhh, do you know what the most played, popular, and money making PC game is out on the market right now?


TEXAS HOLDEM.

Go to sites like pokerparty, pokerstars, paradise poker, and whatever. They have MILLIONS playing at any one time and are raking in the cash. LOL. PC gaming going in the toilet. Who the hell came up with that? Morons that's whom.

Microsoft's market in the PC gaming section is going down hill, but then again, what the hell have they really released recently that was GOOD? Flight simulator? ROFL.

Look at valve and see how much they've made in the last year compared to the year before.

Look at companies that are making GOOD and HIT games, and see why. CoD, BF2, WoW, HL2, Source, UT, and the list goes on and on. Don't make crap games like Cabalero's Hunting part 8.

 

[sswingle]

As others have said, we need games that aren't broken. I got Black and white 2, patched it first thing, and it still crashes all the time

 

[dexvx]

Originally posted by: EpsiIon

Originally posted by: MustangSVT

Originally posted by: kb315

Originally posted by: EpsiIon

Originally posted by: venk
Don't forget:

$400 Console every 4 Years

vs

$1200 Computer Every 3 YEars

False.

XBox 360 (just an example): ~$400 + $90 for extra controllers + $20 per memory card + $xx per month to play online (on top of broadband costs).

That's a $500+ entry fee to enjoy ONE console (if you want to own a PS3 and a Revolution, too, start thinking about $1000+).

In contrast, I've spent ~$600 in the past four years and I'm STILL enjoying my PC AND playing the newest games.

The price difference really isn't a huge factor anymore. Consoles are popular because they're faster and simpler. It's nice for people who know nothing about technology to be able to simply "plug and play." In the meantime, notice that the most involved and interesting games have been released on the PC. PC gaming wasn't dead 5 years ago. It's not dead now. It won't die any time in the near future.

How did you spend $600 for a 4 year old pc that still can the newest games?

he is enjoying the newest games.. just not with everything up and chop chop chop

Hehehe, kinda. HL2 gets a bit choppy in multiplayer, but the FEAR demo (and all other SP games I've tried) ran fine. I've got an Athlon XP 2500+ (~$100 of that $600 two years ago), 768 MB or RAM, and a GeForce 6800 GT (2/3 of that $600). I'm sure I'll have to upgrade that CPU soon, which could incur a number of costs, but that's to be expected. I'm thinking I'll just max out my CPU on this motherboard for now and then spring for an entirely new system in another year (when I have a real job).

Are you trying to imply you had a Geforce 6800 GT 4 years ago?

I'm running into a similar dilemma. I've always been a fan of PC games, but frankly, its much more cost effective to go console. $400 for an Xbox360 deluxe kit (that includes the 20GB HDD, 1 wireless controller) versus spending about that much every year for upgrades.

Another issue, whether people like it or not, is piracy. It's much easier to pirate games on a PC. I honestly do believe that piracy is a major turn-off in creating PC games (except for multiplayer only games where the company can have some level of control, eg MMORPGs).

 

[xboxist]

I can't speak for everybody... but on a personal level, I am sick to death of 3D games.

I mean, I still love the random great game like HL2. But we're stuck in this era of "OMG we have the capability to make EVERY SINGLE FRICKING GAME in 3D, so let's do it!"

Give me another quality Fallout, Castlevania or some RPG in 2D, and I'll come a-buying. People treat 2D as a stepping stone for the inevitable, where I feel that some games work BETTER in 2D than they do in 3D.

 

[Yzzim]

Originally posted by: PingSpike

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: meltdown75
i think if more people actually bought new games, the problems would dissipate. so... imho piracy is the main issue.

but more innovation is needed on the creative side of things. for example, many sequels tend to be retreads of previous versions, released early and without a lot of differences from the originals, in an attempt to grab the exact same demographic. as a result i believe the user base for these particular games decreases instead of increases. HL2 would be an exception, since I think more people play it now than ever before.

if thats the case, then why are console software sales going up? piract affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming.

Piracy for a console isn't a simple matter of going to the latest warez site and downloading a cracked version of the game. I wouldn't say it affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming. Any idiot with a broadband connection and copy of kazaa can download most popular titles. Didn't you have to mod your xbox to play cracked games or something? I don't think your average kiddie did that.

Exactly.

Looking at a popular torrent site will give you the download numbers:

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas

PC: 273,120
Xbox: 69,635
PS2: 20,466

Star Wars: KOTOR 2
PC: 137,631
Xbox: 15,811


Those are just a few examples (I'm not going to spend all day looking at downloads) but you get the idea.

Oh, and Sims 2 (PC) only has 40,235,243 downloads.

 

[ballmode]

Are they accounting fees to play games into that statistic? What about all the money made by WOW and other MMORPG's?

 

[meltdown75]

Originally posted by: Yzzim

Originally posted by: PingSpike

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: meltdown75
i think if more people actually bought new games, the problems would dissipate. so... imho piracy is the main issue.

but more innovation is needed on the creative side of things. for example, many sequels tend to be retreads of previous versions, released early and without a lot of differences from the originals, in an attempt to grab the exact same demographic. as a result i believe the user base for these particular games decreases instead of increases. HL2 would be an exception, since I think more people play it now than ever before.

if thats the case, then why are console software sales going up? piract affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming.

Piracy for a console isn't a simple matter of going to the latest warez site and downloading a cracked version of the game. I wouldn't say it affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming. Any idiot with a broadband connection and copy of kazaa can download most popular titles. Didn't you have to mod your xbox to play cracked games or something? I don't think your average kiddie did that.

Exactly.

Looking at a popular torrent site will give you the download numbers:

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas

PC: 273,120
Xbox: 69,635
PS2: 20,466

Star Wars: KOTOR 2
PC: 137,631
Xbox: 15,811


Those are just a few examples (I'm not going to spend all day looking at downloads) but you get the idea.

Oh, and Sims 2 (PC) only has 40,235,243 downloads.

WOW! :shocked: over 40 million?! jumpin' jillios

if half of those users bought the game @ (estimating here) $30 a pop, that's $600 MILLION in sales revenue alone!! and that's ONE GAME!! holy smokes.

 

[Leper Messiah]

Originally posted by: meltdown75

Originally posted by: Yzzim

Originally posted by: PingSpike

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: meltdown75
i think if more people actually bought new games, the problems would dissipate. so... imho piracy is the main issue.

but more innovation is needed on the creative side of things. for example, many sequels tend to be retreads of previous versions, released early and without a lot of differences from the originals, in an attempt to grab the exact same demographic. as a result i believe the user base for these particular games decreases instead of increases. HL2 would be an exception, since I think more people play it now than ever before.

if thats the case, then why are console software sales going up? piract affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming.

Piracy for a console isn't a simple matter of going to the latest warez site and downloading a cracked version of the game. I wouldn't say it affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming. Any idiot with a broadband connection and copy of kazaa can download most popular titles. Didn't you have to mod your xbox to play cracked games or something? I don't think your average kiddie did that.

Exactly.

Looking at a popular torrent site will give you the download numbers:

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas

PC: 273,120
Xbox: 69,635
PS2: 20,466

Star Wars: KOTOR 2
PC: 137,631
Xbox: 15,811


Those are just a few examples (I'm not going to spend all day looking at downloads) but you get the idea.

Oh, and Sims 2 (PC) only has 40,235,243 downloads.

WOW! :shocked: over 40 million?! jumpin' jillios

if half of those users bought the game @ (estimating here) $30 a pop, that's $600 MILLION in sales revenue alone!! and that's ONE GAME!! holy smokes.

that number has to be shens. I don't think there are 40 million households with PCs that can run the sims 2.

 

[Yzzim]

Originally posted by: Leper Messiah

Originally posted by: meltdown75

Originally posted by: Yzzim

Originally posted by: PingSpike

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: meltdown75
i think if more people actually bought new games, the problems would dissipate. so... imho piracy is the main issue.

but more innovation is needed on the creative side of things. for example, many sequels tend to be retreads of previous versions, released early and without a lot of differences from the originals, in an attempt to grab the exact same demographic. as a result i believe the user base for these particular games decreases instead of increases. HL2 would be an exception, since I think more people play it now than ever before.

if thats the case, then why are console software sales going up? piract affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming.

Piracy for a console isn't a simple matter of going to the latest warez site and downloading a cracked version of the game. I wouldn't say it affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming. Any idiot with a broadband connection and copy of kazaa can download most popular titles. Didn't you have to mod your xbox to play cracked games or something? I don't think your average kiddie did that.

Exactly.

Looking at a popular torrent site will give you the download numbers:

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas

PC: 273,120
Xbox: 69,635
PS2: 20,466

Star Wars: KOTOR 2
PC: 137,631
Xbox: 15,811


Those are just a few examples (I'm not going to spend all day looking at downloads) but you get the idea.

Oh, and Sims 2 (PC) only has 40,235,243 downloads.

WOW! :shocked: over 40 million?! jumpin' jillios

if half of those users bought the game @ (estimating here) $30 a pop, that's $600 MILLION in sales revenue alone!! and that's ONE GAME!! holy smokes.

that number has to be shens. I don't think there are 40 million households with PCs that can run the sims 2.

I don't want to link to the torrent site directly, because then I'd be a pirate myself. Maybe I can keep the mods at bay by not linking directly to the org.

 

[RandomFool]

It seems like nearly every new game that comes out should come with a new video card. I used to play HL, Thief and UT on 450mhz computer and they ran fine or at least good enough. Now if I run games on my new computer at the lowest possible settings it runs terrible.

I remember like 6 years ago I bought games all the time. Now I haven't bought a new game since HL2 came out mostly because there doesn't seem to be anything worth buying. Even HL2 sp was disappointing mostly because it made me feel sick whenever I played it. I want games that were fun to play, not insanly hard and have a good story.

MMORPGs aren't helping any either because people can play those game pretty much forever, as long as people pay each month.

I bet if you looked at high speed internet access vs game sales ifyou would see a trend.

 

[meltdown75]

Originally posted by: Yzzim

Originally posted by: Leper Messiah

Originally posted by: meltdown75

Originally posted by: Yzzim

Originally posted by: PingSpike

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: meltdown75
i think if more people actually bought new games, the problems would dissipate. so... imho piracy is the main issue.

but more innovation is needed on the creative side of things. for example, many sequels tend to be retreads of previous versions, released early and without a lot of differences from the originals, in an attempt to grab the exact same demographic. as a result i believe the user base for these particular games decreases instead of increases. HL2 would be an exception, since I think more people play it now than ever before.

if thats the case, then why are console software sales going up? piract affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming.

Piracy for a console isn't a simple matter of going to the latest warez site and downloading a cracked version of the game. I wouldn't say it affects console gaming just as much as pc gaming. Any idiot with a broadband connection and copy of kazaa can download most popular titles. Didn't you have to mod your xbox to play cracked games or something? I don't think your average kiddie did that.

Exactly.

Looking at a popular torrent site will give you the download numbers:

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas

PC: 273,120
Xbox: 69,635
PS2: 20,466

Star Wars: KOTOR 2
PC: 137,631
Xbox: 15,811


Those are just a few examples (I'm not going to spend all day looking at downloads) but you get the idea.

Oh, and Sims 2 (PC) only has 40,235,243 downloads.

WOW! :shocked: over 40 million?! jumpin' jillios

if half of those users bought the game @ (estimating here) $30 a pop, that's $600 MILLION in sales revenue alone!! and that's ONE GAME!! holy smokes.

that number has to be shens. I don't think there are 40 million households with PCs that can run the sims 2.

I don't want to link to the torrent site directly, because then I'd be a pirate myself. Maybe I can keep the mods at bay by not linking directly to the org.

ROFL priceless.

 

[TallBill]

Remember though when looking at downloading stats, that most people who download a game probably wouldn't purchase it if stealing wasn't an option.

 

[Patt]

I'm sure piracy has something to do with it, but as with Hollywood recently, the good titles are few and far between. As consumers, North Americans expect a little too much, like to hype things so far in advance that invariably some people feel let down by the final product.

Eye candy is well and good, but we need some smaller development houses to pump out some great, original gameplay.

I use the PC to game, and only own a PSOne (Tiger Woods 2001 is all I ever play on it), and won't be going the console route anytime soon. Not enough interest in my friends to justify the multiplayer sports games for the price.

 

[electricJ]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: kami

According to Gamespy, 2004 was a record breaking year for game sales of both PC and consoles

PC and Consoles combined.

Originally posted by: EpsiIon


False.

XBox 360 (just an example): ~$400 + $90 for extra controllers + $20 per memory card + $xx per month to play online (on top of broadband costs).

That's a $500+ entry fee to enjoy ONE console (if you want to own a PS3 and a Revolution, too, start thinking about $1000+).

In contrast, I've spent ~$600 in the past four years and I'm STILL enjoying my PC AND playing the newest games.

The price difference really isn't a huge factor anymore. Consoles are popular because they're faster and simpler. It's nice for people who know nothing about technology to be able to simply "plug and play." In the meantime, notice that the most involved and interesting games have been released on the PC. PC gaming wasn't dead 5 years ago. It's not dead now. It won't die any time in the near future.

No, people play consoles because theres more games, more variety, and like you said its effortless. Console games never need patches and rarely have problems. I enjoy PC and consoles, I don't force myself to choose. Tell Xbox modders that they "know nothing about technology"

I used to be strictly PC as well but it changed with the Xbox. Xbox 360 is narrowing the gap even more. The main difference used to be resolution and multiplayer. Well both of those are gone now with the next consoles. Yeah you gotta pay about $7.50 a month to play online but it works for every game. It's not that bad. Hell I pay 15/month to play WoW. The other complaint is controls for FPS games. Well first of all once you get used to the controller it works very well. Also what do you think the USB ports are for? Keyboards and mice should work.

The console itself will probably be cheaper than an equivalent graphics card (if its available by then from ATI) when it comes out in November.

xbox live is $50/yr ~= $4.25/mo, not $7.50/mo.

and to that other guy who knows nothing about xbox360, why would you buy a memory card when you already have the $400 system that has the 20gb HD with it, and where the hell are you buying controllers that cost almost $100 a piece?

yeah, his numbers show his bias towards pc gaming. You wouldn't have a need to buy the memory card with the harddrive. Also, he's adding $90 for extra controllers... the wireless controllers are to be priced at $49.99 based on the sites I've seen. If you do multiplayer PC gaming at the same unit, you'd still have to buy controllers for that situation. I'd imagine each wireless PC controller being the same cost as these 360 controllers (assuming you don't go with the extremely cheap manufacturers).

Its really more like:
$400 - console premium package
$50 - extra wireless controller
$4.25/month for the best online gaming service out there

Also, don't forget the cost of everything else you'd need when building a computer... fans, heatsinks, cables, harddrive, cd drive, power supply, case, etc. Starting from scratch, its more like a $1k investment unless you're recycling old parts.

 

[CravenTacos]

PC gaming? It can be saved by...cheaper video cards. EA going out of business, because console ports are an insult. Games shifting back to being games, and not focusing on who has the more realistic splatter pattern on the wall or better water reflectivity. Copy protection does not work, stop requiring people to have the CD in while they play the game it only pisses people off who scratch/lose CD's which is...everyone. Quit combining game genres, no RTS RPG FPS'ers ok? We like straight and true RPG, mind numbing predictable RTS, and insane kill em all FPS. Voice actors do not need to be celebrities, unless you can get Bruce Campbell or they are specific to the game (i.e. Star Trek - Picard/Kirk/etc...). You don't need to have an original concept to have a successful game, ID hasn't had an orignal idea in a decade and they still rock, they just make games WELL. And the last one I'll mention...no more movie/game crossovers. There hasn't been a good game based on a film or vice versa, ever. Stop trying

 

[EpsiIon]

Originally posted by: dexvx

Originally posted by: EpsiIon

Originally posted by: MustangSVT

Originally posted by: kb315

Originally posted by: EpsiIon

Originally posted by: venk
Don't forget:

$400 Console every 4 Years

vs

$1200 Computer Every 3 YEars

False.

XBox 360 (just an example): ~$400 + $90 for extra controllers + $20 per memory card + $xx per month to play online (on top of broadband costs).

That's a $500+ entry fee to enjoy ONE console (if you want to own a PS3 and a Revolution, too, start thinking about $1000+).

In contrast, I've spent ~$600 in the past four years and I'm STILL enjoying my PC AND playing the newest games.

The price difference really isn't a huge factor anymore. Consoles are popular because they're faster and simpler. It's nice for people who know nothing about technology to be able to simply "plug and play." In the meantime, notice that the most involved and interesting games have been released on the PC. PC gaming wasn't dead 5 years ago. It's not dead now. It won't die any time in the near future.

How did you spend $600 for a 4 year old pc that still can the newest games?

he is enjoying the newest games.. just not with everything up and chop chop chop

Hehehe, kinda. HL2 gets a bit choppy in multiplayer, but the FEAR demo (and all other SP games I've tried) ran fine. I've got an Athlon XP 2500+ (~$100 of that $600 two years ago), 768 MB or RAM, and a GeForce 6800 GT (2/3 of that $600). I'm sure I'll have to upgrade that CPU soon, which could incur a number of costs, but that's to be expected. I'm thinking I'll just max out my CPU on this motherboard for now and then spring for an entirely new system in another year (when I have a real job).

Are you trying to imply you had a Geforce 6800 GT 4 years ago?

I'm running into a similar dilemma. I've always been a fan of PC games, but frankly, its much more cost effective to go console. $400 for an Xbox360 deluxe kit (that includes the 20GB HDD, 1 wireless controller) versus spending about that much every year for upgrades.

Another issue, whether people like it or not, is piracy. It's much easier to pirate games on a PC. I honestly do believe that piracy is a major turn-off in creating PC games (except for multiplayer only games where the company can have some level of control, eg MMORPGs).

No, I bought the 6800 GT about a year ago. I simply hadn't needed to upgrade until then. I'm saying that I've spent around $600 upgrading my PC over the past four years. That clearly does not include the one-time entry fee of $2000 I spent about five years ago.

 

[PingSpike]

I think downloadable content might be the right way to go. There was a thread in S&G about rag doll kung fu released over steam. I know everyone hates steam, but it does provide a low cost 'publishing' option for smaller development houses. And its little companies that are willing to take the risk to make something new and different, rag doll kung fu definately looks like something different. We all know the big companies are after the bottom line first, they don't want to risk it so they just make more shovelware. And if you're only charging people $20 for a game, they're going to overlook no printed manual or CDs and be more willing to take a chance on your title.

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: Vaerilis
New ideas could save the industry.
I'm not interested in the eleventy-billionth rehashes of old games. Why can't they produce games like Fallout, X-Com, Freespace or Worms any longer?

I echo this sentiment. There's nothing really exciting to me out there or ground breaking any more. Seems like it's all been done before. They are gonna have to start coming up with some new concepts, create a new genre or something. Plus as consoles become more powerful and start to more resemble single-purpose PC's rather than black boxes, and considering how much cheaper they are than a PC, and the advent of HDTV resolutions on the TV screen. . .PC's for gaming are becoming less and less cost effective. They will be reserved for a small niche of power gamers who don't mind a steep learning curve for very complex games that the console just can't handle. People who really understand a lot more about PC's and how they work rather than just something they can play games on. People who like to build and play mods to popular games are a good example of the type of person that will continue to find PC games appealing. The PC can take the whole gaming experience to a level still untouched by consoles but not everybody is that serious about their gaming.