What are the best cases these days for watercooling?

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

okey i missed the pair, so im sorry about that. Thanks for the correction. Im flashing back and forth at work. Didnt mean any offense, just your hardware wasnt on PAR with his cuz i missed the 2nd xfire card.

Also, one of my peeves is when people compare dual cores with quadcores expecially in aspect to heat and overclocking.

Still your overshooting your system. I gave you the number estimates for the radiator and class. If you have 440W just on your gpu, and your CPU is another 130W your system's entire load is around 570W!

Holy cow thats a lot of heat....

I honestly think you'd see better results if your cards were on air and you watered the CPU only.


Also true you wont load up your CPU And GPU's at the same time unless your playing an insane game, or your a DCer. But im willing to guess your temps are near on or on PAR to air. Which isnt what the OP wants. Unless he's looking at just silencing the machine.


If i ment offense my bad.... sometimes i cant express what i mean in the way i want when i type things. And im glad you called me on it.


Also if you want to test why i mean your overshooting your system. Run RTHDRIBL + Prime95 on your machine.

My testing was done running ATI Tool and Prime95 (small fft) at the same time.

Temps were actually pretty good compared to the aircooling I have run. CPU was ~39-41C and the GPU's hit ~49-50C. Ambient temps were around 78F.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: Elfear

My testing was done running ATI Tool and Prime95 (small fft) at the same time.

Temps were actually pretty good compared to the aircooling I have run. CPU was ~39-41C and the GPU's hit ~49-50C. Ambient temps were around 78F.

This is all off a MCR320? Im actually kinda impressed because your the first person to tell me that this works.

Hmmm.... when i was testing out my CM690 build, adding a 8800GTX was killing the temps on the cpu side. Another member named Karl was verifying the results with his simular build. [you have an extra gpu, we have extra 2 cores] So im going to assume your system will still generate a bit more heat.


Are your gpu blocks full cover or core only? Because im starting to think maybe full cover blocks might not be worth it anymore if the mosfet heat and ram heat is adding that much to kill the performance.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

This is all off a MCR320? Im actually kinda impressed because your the first person to tell me that this works.

Hmmm.... when i was testing out my CM690 build, adding a 8800GTX was killing the temps on the cpu side. Another member named Karl was verifying the results with his simular build. [you have an extra gpu, we have extra 2 cores] So im going to assume your system will still generate a bit more heat.


Are your gpu blocks full cover or core only? Because im starting to think maybe full cover blocks might not be worth it anymore if the mosfet heat and ram heat is adding that much to kill the performance.

Pmed you back. I was actually using a modded Bonneville heatercore.

 

[Rodknock]

Thanks for all the informative replies

I have what may seem like a dumb question, and I can speculate as to its answer but I'd like to be sure: what happens if your cooling setup's performance is not better or equal to the heat dissipation requirements of components, ie CPU, GPU, NB, etc. Why does it seem like this is only taken into account for water setups, and not for air HSFs? I never read anything like this for air setups, about "205W under load" etc.

Can anyone recommend an adequate radiator setup that does NOT include a 120x3 radiator? I'm worried about being able to fit this stuff in the case, afterall. Something tells me I'd need to go to work with some adamantium claws to be able to accomodate a 3x120 rad.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: Rodknock
Thanks for all the informative replies

I have what may seem like a dumb question, and I can speculate as to its answer but I'd like to be sure: what happens if your cooling setup's performance is not better or equal to the heat dissipation requirements of components, ie CPU, GPU, NB, etc. Why does it seem like this is only taken into account for water setups, and not for air HSFs? I never read anything like this for air setups, about "205W under load" etc.

Can anyone recommend an adequate radiator setup that does NOT include a 120x3 radiator? I'm worried about being able to fit this stuff in the case, afterall. Something tells me I'd need to go to work with some adamantium claws to be able to accomodate a 3x120 rad.

Yes and no. You can most certainly run a dual 120mm radiator, just not to cool the cpu AND the video card. A dual 120 will more than adequately cool either one but, not both.

 

[Rodknock]

What are my options then, aside from going with a triple 120? Can I have a single 120 cooling the GPU (or whichever of the two puts out less heat, I'm assuming the GPU)?

Is it just me, or does this all seem a bit impractical? I don't see how watercooling is regarded as so superior if you have to clear out your kitchen pantry to accomodate an adequate radiator(s)? Why are these radiators even marketed then if they're apparently so useless? Not everyone is using them to cool low-heat home theater equipment, ya know. I'm not trying to be overly-frugal or something, quite the contrary. I am completly willing to spend the necessary money on the best setup for the price. But really, two radiators? Is that even common? And how the hell do you fit a triple 120 radiator into an ordinary case anyway?

Moreoever, how do OEM's have watercooled 'gaming' setups now? Are they using like 9 radiators or something? Sorry for the rant, but this just seems a bit ridiculous. What if I wanted to cool the CPU, the GPU, the NB and SB, the memory and the hard disks? Would I need a radiator off of a Mack truck? Radiators to cool the radiators? My computer might as well be one big heatsink in that case, like thermalright's hideous-looking prototype case.

I would definitely require the CPU and GPU to *both* be watercooled. To me, there's really no point in going to the trouble of building a WC system if I'm not employing it to its fullest potential. Cooling only the CPU seems like a waste.

With that in mind, can anyone suggest a radiator solution, whether it's two or one or whatever the case may be, that is common for a rig comparable to mine?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: Rodknock
What are my options then, aside from going with a triple 120? Can I have a single 120 cooling the GPU (or whichever of the two puts out less heat, I'm assuming the GPU)?

Is it just me, or does this all seem a bit impractical? I don't see how watercooling is regarded as so superior if you have to clear out your kitchen pantry to accomodate an adequate radiator(s)? Why are these radiators even marketed then if they're apparently so useless? Not everyone is using them to cool low-heat home theater equipment, ya know. I'm not trying to be overly-frugal or something, quite the contrary. I am completly willing to spend the necessary money on the best setup for the price. But really, two radiators? Is that even common? And how the hell do you fit a triple 120 radiator into an ordinary case anyway?

Moreoever, how do OEM's have watercooled 'gaming' setups now? Are they using like 9 radiators or something? Sorry for the rant, but this just seems a bit ridiculous. What if I wanted to cool the CPU, the GPU, the NB and SB, the memory and the hard disks? Would I need a radiator off of a Mack truck? Radiators to cool the radiators? My computer might as well be one big heatsink in that case, like thermalright's hideous-looking prototype case.

I would definitely require the CPU and GPU to *both* be watercooled. To me, there's really no point in going to the trouble of building a WC system if I'm not employing it to its fullest potential. Cooling only the CPU seems like a waste.

With that in mind, can anyone suggest a radiator solution, whether it's two or one or whatever the case may be, that is common for a rig comparable to mine?

aigmora has a source for all the thermal wattages of cpus, video cards and radiators but, I'm pretty sure you could use an MCR220 which is a dual 120mm radiator for your CPU and a PA120.1 for your video card. The PA is a superior radiator so I'm pretty sure it could keep an 8800GTX cool. I only reccomend the MCR220 because it is thinner and with good fans it will perform quite well enough for your CPU. I would reccomend a pair of MCP355's with some 3rd party top plates(OCLabs or petratop) but, check with aigmora, he may reccomend the MCP655's or another pump, those are the two i'm the most familiar with. The MCP355 has better head(pressure) but, the MCP655 has greater almost double the GPH. With the CPU loop you can use accelerators on the CPU block which will give you the best performance. For CPU blocks he's told me about the MC-TDX, which is brand new but, besides that the standard is basically the D-tek Fusion, especially with accelerators. I like the swiftech microres personally as it's very small and flows incredibly well. As for your video card, there are two basic options, a full coverage block or a GPU-only block. For your circumstances you may have to go with a GPU only block and put some heatsinks on the RAM and Mosfets cause I'm just not sure if even the 120.1 can cool a full coverage.

Hope that helps.

 

[Elfear]

A good dual rad will work FINE for the cpu and gpu. I had really good temps running two voltmodded X1900XTs and an oced E6600 and a Q6600/8800GTX combo will work the cooling system less. I'd recommend running a universal gpu block like the Maze4 or MCW60 instead of the full block. If you get some little sinks for the vregs and ram and some decent airflow in your case, you'll be fine. The only reason I'd go with a triple rad for a Q6600/8800GTX combo would be for super silent operation or shooting for benchmarking records.

 

[aigomorla]

Usually what people do when numbers get too high. They split the loop up.

The GPU's will not overclock better with cooler water unless your volt moding.

The CPU's are dependant on temps so its best to keep this guy as cool as possible if your overclocking.

Splitting the loops up into smaller loops will allow you to use 2 mcr220's instead of 1 large class radiator. Remember as long as gpu's temps dont get anywhere near threshold there fine.


When you overshoot your wattage, your coolant temps go up. This also leads to overall system temps going up. Since coolant is connected to each block, warm water means warm temps overall. This is why most people will look at dual loop solutions once 2 gpu's are involved.


Elfear brought about my attention that full cover blocks might dump a significant amount of heat into the water more then core only blocks. His heat wattage is insane but yet his system is holding out. I need to do more testing on this, but im willing to guess maybe around 50-80W extra in heat is being dumped by the vregs/mosfets/ram on the card @ load if you use full cover blocks. Times that number by 2 and you got another dual core cpu overclocked

 

[Rodknock]

I probably should've mentioned (even though it is in my sig) that I'm running a HR-03 on my 8800gtx, complete with ramsinks etc. If I do decide to get a water block for the gpu that only covers the core, I will just keep the thermalright ramsinks on it, since they seem to work really well (I've got my card pretty heavily OC'd, without overvolting).

 

[DerwenArtos12]

I would split it into two loops. Call me crazy, call me stupid, call me whatever you want but, I would keep the heat from that 8800 away from the CPU so you can get the best OC. A single good radiator will keep the 8800 cool enough, cooler than your hr-03 more than likely but, not necissarily by much and the keeping it on it's own radiator will keep more than 200watts of heat out of your main loop. I honestly think this is your best option, especially considering the more than decent budget you've got laid out.

 

[Rodknock]

I suppose if that's the most effective option I definitely need to consider doing two loops. Aside from the dual 120 rad mounted top-side as exhaust, am I correct in assuming that the next most logical radiator placement site --for the single 120, that is-- is the rear exhaust port?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: Rodknock
I suppose if that's the most effective option I definitely need to consider doing two loops. Aside from the dual 120 rad mounted top-side as exhaust, am I correct in assuming that the next most logical radiator placement site --for the single 120, that is-- is the rear exhaust port?

Yes but, you have to, have to, have to make sure there is enogh intake to feed those radiators, that may mean getting creative with fan mounts in the 5.25 bays or on the side pannels. I woudl make it neutrally or positively pressurized a little to help keep dust out. With three fans on radiators and your pus i would reccomend having four intake fans of the same model as your radiators with fan filters on them. The filters won't restrict quite as much as the radiators(depending on the filter) so it'll be a little pisitively pressurized to keep dust from seeping in through every crack, gap and hole in the case.

 

[Rodknock]

Well with a double 120 rad covering the top two exhaust ports, a single 120 covering the rear port, all that leaves is one front 120mm fan slot open. How can I possibly put in 3 more intake fans? Is the Silverstone TJ09 just not a case apt to watercooling or is there something I'm overlooking? I've resumed my hunt for more WC-friendly cases, what do you guys think about this one?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16811233026

It has the dual 120mm rear slots which would presumably be great for a dual rad, plus it has a dual 80 or 90mm (can't tell from the pic and it's not listed in the specs) fan setup for the hard drives, but I could put another dual rad there and relocate the drives to other empty bays up above. Here's a pic of that hard drive side fan slot:

http://images10.newegg.com/New...mage/11-233-026-06.jpg

Internal view:

http://images10.newegg.com/New...mage/11-233-026-11.jpg

External:

http://images10.newegg.com/New...mage/11-233-026-02.jpg

edit: are image tags not allowed or something?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: Rodknock
Well with a double 120 rad covering the top two exhaust ports, a single 120 covering the rear port, all that leaves is one front 120mm fan slot open. How can I possibly put in 3 more intake fans? Is the Silverstone TJ09 just not a case apt to watercooling or is there something I'm overlooking? I've resumed my hunt for more WC-friendly cases, what do you guys think about this one?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16811233026

It has the dual 120mm rear slots which would presumably be great for a dual rad, plus it has a dual 80 or 90mm (can't tell from the pic and it's not listed in the specs) fan setup for the hard drives, but I could put another dual rad there and relocate the drives to other empty bays up above. Here's a pic of that hard drive side fan slot:

http://images10.newegg.com/New...mage/11-233-026-06.jpg

Internal view:

http://images10.newegg.com/New...mage/11-233-026-11.jpg

External:

http://images10.newegg.com/New...mage/11-233-026-02.jpg

edit: are image tags not allowed or something?

I would probably go with a stacker 810 before that gigabyte case. They are one of the most versatile water cooling cases on the market. Only cases I can think of that are more versatile are the Ll343 or MM cube.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12
aigmora has a source for all the thermal wattages of cpus, video cards and radiators but, I'm pretty sure you could use an MCR220 which is a dual 120mm radiator for your CPU and a PA120.1 for your video card.
Hope that helps.

absolutely!

Dual loops is always prefered because you only have 1 heat source to worry about.

And im personally not a fan in supercoolign my gpu's when it doesnt help it overclock[excluding volt modding]. I watercool for silence on that. Even at full load my gpu's are dead silent.


yeah i threw in that volt modding for ya elfear.