For starters, webster is a dictionary, not the monolithic authority of all opinions of man. Secondly, I take issue with that last point. Ok, gays like to sleep around a lot, moreso than straight men. Why? Think about it. Two guys. Gay or not, they're still guys, and will be more than happy to go at it if the chance arises. This guy is acting like straight men wouldn't do that if straight women were as easy as gay men. Secondly, that entire statistic is irrelevant. We're not talking about those gay men, no matter how numerous they are. We're talking about the ones that are in dedicated, loving relationships. That's like saying Jim and Susie can't get married because Madonna sleeps around a lot.
Many of the obvious problems with your post have already been mentioned but I will go over them again. You should expect, though, CW, that while they may be obvious to others they may remain opaque to you. It is a fundamental property of bigotry that the bigot is completely blind to his bigotry. Where the bigot reveals his presence is in his choice of words, words that in a cultural context are hot button, reactive, and pejorative a priori. Bigotry essentially is a belief that something is evil based on a Priori teaching that it is. It is established in the consciousness with pejorative language and relies on its self sustaining longevity by virtue of the negative implications of those defining words. Let's have a look:
CW: Morality to me is about social justice and enforcing ethical behaviors.
M: Here you attempt to draw us into the illusion of the existence of a good and evil without, of course, defining what social justice or ethics are. You merely imply that by believing in them you also know what they are. The two do not go together because all evil men are good in their own minds. They all justify their actions as actions ethically and socially required.
CW: Are homosexuals trying to have themselves removed from the jurisdiction of ethics? Other examples of groups attempting to live unethical lifestyles include philandering heterosexuals and racists. It seems to me that the homosexual lifestyle is obsessed with accruing a grotesque number of sexual partners, despite the obvious burden this places on both the individual and society as a result of high rates of STD contraction and emotional scarring from the philandering lifestyle.
M: Here we see your bigotry shining like a radiant light. You raise the question as to whether homosexuals are trying to be evil, ethics free, and without answering, because your bigotry makes the answer to you obviously yes, you then show us the unconscious sources of your reasoning, the pejoratives you unconsciously attach, 'obsessed', 'grotesque', 'obvious burden', STDs', emotional scarring', 'philandering', to namely. The bigot makes his case by piling up the pejoratives without ever establishing an ethical basis for his logic that is grounded in any testable reality. A bigot has only one argument. I am against what I am against because it is wrong and it is wrong because I was brainwashed to believe it was wrong and I love my brainwashing more than I respect the truth so I will not change my opinion until I am ready to die to what I was taught. That will require that I experience the humility of knowing I have lived my life as a bigot and have brought evil thereby into the world. I will have to feel for myself the contempt I feel for others. Because I cannot forgive myself I must not fall into that pit. I refuse to know that I am forgiven.
CW: You'd think that homosexuals would be an important voice of reason in today's society, as they like to portray themselves as enlightened, open-minded thinkers, but it seems they are basically obsessed with their quest for society to subsidize their unethical lifestyle choices through marriage benefits, among other things.
M: Hehe, you have a bad case. You cannot prove a point by implying that it contradicts logical thinking without actually showing that it contradicts logical thinking. For example, if I said that you would think a person who likes to think as much as CW does would be better at it by now, that will not prove that you haven't gotten better with practice. The proof would have to come from elsewhere.
And as I have already said, how things seem to you is the result of the coloring of your vision by bigotry.
CW: According to homosexuals, morality in public policy involves subsidizing hedonism, securing tax cuts for unions that produce no societal benefits, and coercing the majority to support their unethical lifestyles. How did the average homosexual's message become so twisted in the hands of these people?
M: And away we go again with the pejoratives.
What is love? Why does a person fall in love with another. What is the deep infatuation that can happen that rips the heart apart, that makes one think only of the other. What is this passion that is so so so so strong. What is the muse and the idol? Who can command whom we love and who would want to. Are you the soul that longs for love and kills another's lover?
CW: Morality to me is about social justice and enforcing ethical behaviors.
M: Here you attempt to draw us into the illusion of the existence of a good and evil without, of course, defining what social justice or ethics are. You merely imply that by believing in them you also know what they are. The two do not go together because all evil men are good in their own minds. They all justify their actions as actions ethically and socially required.
CW: Are homosexuals trying to have themselves removed from the jurisdiction of ethics? Other examples of groups attempting to live unethical lifestyles include philandering heterosexuals and racists. It seems to me that the homosexual lifestyle is obsessed with accruing a grotesque number of sexual partners, despite the obvious burden this places on both the individual and society as a result of high rates of STD contraction and emotional scarring from the philandering lifestyle.
M: Here we see your bigotry shining like a radiant light. You raise the question as to whether homosexuals are trying to be evil, ethics free, and without answering, because your bigotry makes the answer to you obviously yes, you then show us the unconscious sources of your reasoning, the pejoratives you unconsciously attach, 'obsessed', 'grotesque', 'obvious burden', STDs', emotional scarring', 'philandering', to namely. The bigot makes his case by piling up the pejoratives without ever establishing an ethical basis for his logic that is grounded in any testable reality. A bigot has only one argument. I am against what I am against because it is wrong and it is wrong because I was brainwashed to believe it was wrong and I love my brainwashing more than I respect the truth so I will not change my opinion until I am ready to die to what I was taught. That will require that I experience the humility of knowing I have lived my life as a bigot and have brought evil thereby into the world. I will have to feel for myself the contempt I feel for others. Because I cannot forgive myself I must not fall into that pit. I refuse to know that I am forgiven.
CW: You'd think that homosexuals would be an important voice of reason in today's society, as they like to portray themselves as enlightened, open-minded thinkers, but it seems they are basically obsessed with their quest for society to subsidize their unethical lifestyle choices through marriage benefits, among other things.
M: Hehe, you have a bad case. You cannot prove a point by implying that it contradicts logical thinking without actually showing that it contradicts logical thinking. For example, if I said that you would think a person who likes to think as much as CW does would be better at it by now, that will not prove that you haven't gotten better with practice. The proof would have to come from elsewhere.
And as I have already said, how things seem to you is the result of the coloring of your vision by bigotry.CW: According to homosexuals, morality in public policy involves subsidizing hedonism, securing tax cuts for unions that produce no societal benefits, and coercing the majority to support their unethical lifestyles. How did the average homosexual's message become so twisted in the hands of these people?
M: And away we go again with the pejoratives.
What is love? Why does a person fall in love with another. What is the deep infatuation that can happen that rips the heart apart, that makes one think only of the other. What is this passion that is so so so so strong. What is the muse and the idol? Who can command whom we love and who would want to. Are you the soul that longs for love and kills another's lover?
I think it is funny that the OP has not bothered replying to any of the feedback thus far.
The OP's post is so incredibly riddled with opinion, hate, assumptions, and bias that I am only going to address a few key points that apply to me as gay male:
1. I don't sleep with 20+ partners a year. Never once have I done this. Nor do any of my friends. I am LUCKY to get 5 to 10.
2. Most gay males are so picky about who they will nor will not sleep with (myself included) that many don't get any because their standards are so high. You want to get judged in about 4 seconds on your appearance? Talk to a gay guy and get his real opinion.
3. I have never had an STD. Don't plan on getting one.
4. I live in the second largest gay area of the country--Chicago Boystown. There were two murders about three years ago in my area, both men were gay and murdered by a straight guy posing as a gay guy in order to hookup and then rob/steal from them. He was never caught. There have been no murders since. I live in a very low crime area--far lower in comparison to the rest of Chicago.
As for the OP's opinion--he says we are obsessed with accruing a grotesque number of sexual partners. Wow. First, I am obsessed with my hair and facial care products. Not sex partners. I doubt I am any more obsessed with sex than the average straight guy. Second--even if I did have 100 sex partners a year, who gets to define "grotesque" and why is it "grotesque"? What is funny is that the OP seems to be jealous of gays based upon a generalization. Why else would he care?
Finally, as one poster has already indicated, the cognitive dissonance is amazing in the OP's mind. You want to deny gays their right to marry that just might result in what you would term a more "ethical lifestyle" and yet at the same time you refuse to recognize the societal benefit of gays marrying. That is just amazing thinking. One might get the thought that you wish to keep gays from marrying so you can continue to use generalizations to blame gays for societal problems and possibly also cover for some of your OWN insecurities and shortcomings.
The OP's post is so incredibly riddled with opinion, hate, assumptions, and bias that I am only going to address a few key points that apply to me as gay male:
1. I don't sleep with 20+ partners a year. Never once have I done this. Nor do any of my friends. I am LUCKY to get 5 to 10.
2. Most gay males are so picky about who they will nor will not sleep with (myself included) that many don't get any because their standards are so high. You want to get judged in about 4 seconds on your appearance? Talk to a gay guy and get his real opinion.
3. I have never had an STD. Don't plan on getting one.
4. I live in the second largest gay area of the country--Chicago Boystown. There were two murders about three years ago in my area, both men were gay and murdered by a straight guy posing as a gay guy in order to hookup and then rob/steal from them. He was never caught. There have been no murders since. I live in a very low crime area--far lower in comparison to the rest of Chicago.
As for the OP's opinion--he says we are obsessed with accruing a grotesque number of sexual partners. Wow. First, I am obsessed with my hair and facial care products. Not sex partners. I doubt I am any more obsessed with sex than the average straight guy. Second--even if I did have 100 sex partners a year, who gets to define "grotesque" and why is it "grotesque"? What is funny is that the OP seems to be jealous of gays based upon a generalization. Why else would he care?
Finally, as one poster has already indicated, the cognitive dissonance is amazing in the OP's mind. You want to deny gays their right to marry that just might result in what you would term a more "ethical lifestyle" and yet at the same time you refuse to recognize the societal benefit of gays marrying. That is just amazing thinking. One might get the thought that you wish to keep gays from marrying so you can continue to use generalizations to blame gays for societal problems and possibly also cover for some of your OWN insecurities and shortcomings.
heterosexual immorality is no better than homosexual immorality... comparing apples with apples here, sin with sin... neither one being unforgivable or unreedemable either.
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
I believe I can answer your question to Aidanjm:
I don't think gays are necessarily any more or less promiscuous than straight people. I think you get extremes on both ends of the scale, and people will use those extremes to generalize about a population.
Second, it is pretty easy to label a segment of society as promiscuous and immoral if they are denied the one thing that would "legitimize in the eyes of society" their relationship: marriage. It is like the old Jim Crow Laws for voting--making a test for legitimacy to do something so impossible or difficult (and that the average person regardless of race could not answer) that you prove your point that someone should not vote. Invalid test used to obtain a desired predetermined result.
sandorski
No Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 70,783
- 6,341
- 126
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
I will answer your first one, too. I am not the expert because I am gay. I can only speak from my point of view and do not want to generalize based upon my assumptions and biases either. That disclaimer out of the way:
1. Are you referring to lesbians or gay males? The long term relationship rate is, I believe, very high with lesbians. I have, however, seen many long term relationships between gay males. You have to be in the "scene" to see it, I suppose. If all you are exposed to is rhetoric and bias, then you are not getting the full story.
2. I would not characterize monogamous relationships as rare in the gay community. I would characterize them as just as subject to breakup and breakdown as straight relationships. There is a 50% divorce rate, and that is a legal contract, in the straight community. Is the unofficial boyfriend/girlfriend "divorce rate" (breakup rate) just as high or higher? No one really knows.
3. I edited my post to also include that if I can use the other gay males I know as a benchmark, including myself, that if we are truly obsessed with anything it is getting into a long term relationship. Religious zealotry, bigoted parental upbringing of gay people, internalized homophobia, external homophobia, etc. have erected many barriers to gay people obtaining and forming long term committed relationships. Yet, they do happen and pretty frequently in my experience.
None of your busineses, period.
Morality to you should stay strictly "Morality to you".
If you don't like someone elses "Morality" then leave the U.S. because the "values" that the core of the U.S. was built upon was to leave individual rights to the individuals.
It is the butting in the business of others such as what you and the rest of the Neo-Christian right are doing is what is destroying the U.S.
Congratulations on your success at destroying a good thing.
Damn, I am slow. I haven't tired either so don't really know. But I've always suspected that I would enjoy heterosexual immorality far and away more.
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Give Tab some leeway here. Yes, he did generalize based upon, most likely, popular assumption and rhetoric and spun the question as: "Sir, do you still beat your wife?" but I don't think he did it from a bigoted point of view. I have seen Tab post elsewhere regarding this topic and I think he is asking, from his point of view and experience of what he knows, a legitimate question.
Fortunately, he asked two gay guys what we thought as well. He is, from what I can see, trying to get educated on the topic rather than simply continuing with the assumption and shrugging off information that would challenge the assumptions he has had up to this point.
yeah, i know that... i was thinking of the few gays who mockingly call hetero couples "breeders."
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Well, living in the the rather red state North Dakota it's pretty common to see people holding the belief that homosexsuals are more promiscuous and tend to have more partners than gays; hence the higher rate of STDs.
I am not sure if this is true or not, but that's why I am asking. I am just not looking in the right places for my information, or what?
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Well, living in the the rather red state North Dakota it's pretty common to see people holding the belief that homosexsuals are more promiscuous and tend to have more partners than gays; hence the higher rate of STDs.
I am not sure if this is true or not, but that's why I am asking.
I am just not looking in the right places for my information, or what?
Why are you looking?
What business is it of your what others do behind closed bedroom doors???
There are good and bad people, gay or not, and all people can be prejudiced. Even gays.
The term "breeder" is not, in experience, used to describe a heterosexual couple per se, but heterosexuals in general. It is term I have been exposed to, but do not and will not use.
I think if a truly unbiased and indepth study was conducted on the impact of gays in society, we would find (my opinion only) that gays and straights are much more codependent than most people realize.
Without straight people procreating more gay people, then gay people would cease to exist.
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Well, living in the the rather red state North Dakota it's pretty common to see people holding the belief that homosexsuals are more promiscuous and tend to have more partners than gays; hence the higher rate of STDs.
I am not sure if this is true or not, but that's why I am asking.
I am just not looking in the right places for my information, or what?
Why are you looking?
What business is it of your what others do behind closed bedroom doors???
He is curious. Curiosity, even if it stems from interest in the sexual practices of someone else, leads to learning. He also indicated his environment that he lives in enforces negative and biased thinking of probably just about anyone else that is different than the local population. Please, give him some leeway to learn. Sometimes the question don't come out right, or come from an unfounded assumption or incorrect information, but as long as he is trying to learn something then it is perfectly OK by me to answer his questions.
One thing, though--my sexuality is just as pervasive in my daily thoughts and actions as yours is for you. You are heterosexual inside and outside of the bedroom. Your sexuality does not stop at the bedroom door and neither does mine. I just want to seperate the notion of sex from sexuality. Two different things.
Originally posted by: ChiPCGuy
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Well, living in the the rather red state North Dakota it's pretty common to see people holding the belief that homosexsuals are more promiscuous and tend to have more partners than gays; hence the higher rate of STDs.
I am not sure if this is true or not, but that's why I am asking.
I am just not looking in the right places for my information, or what?
Why are you looking?
What business is it of your what others do behind closed bedroom doors???
He is curious. Curiosity, even if it stems from interest in the sexual practices of someone else, leads to learning. He also indicated his environment that he lives in enforces negative and biased thinking of probably just about anyone else that is different than the local population. Please, give him some leeway to learn. Sometimes the question don't come out right, or come from an unfounded assumption or incorrect information, but as long as he is trying to learn something then it is perfectly OK by me to answer his questions.
One thing, though--my sexuality is just as pervasive in my daily thoughts and actions as yours is for you. You are heterosexual inside and outside of the bedroom. Your sexuality does not stop at the bedroom door and neither does mine. I just want to seperate the notion of sex from sexuality. Two different things.
True, OK to learn but must be without bias.
sandorski
No Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 70,783
- 6,341
- 126
Originally posted by: ChiPCGuy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Give Tab some leeway here. Yes, he did generalize based upon, most likely, popular assumption and rhetoric and spun the question as: "Sir, do you still beat your wife?" but I don't think he did it from a bigoted point of view. I have seen Tab post elsewhere regarding this topic and I think he is asking, from his point of view and experience of what he knows, a legitimate question.
Fortunately, he asked two gay guys what we thought as well. He is, from what I can see, trying to get educated on the topic rather than simply continuing with the assumption and shrugging off information that would challenge the assumptions he has had up to this point.
You are correct. P&N has a way of hardening the soul and in this case I seem to have exposed that hardening in myself. Thank you. :thumbsup:
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: ChiPCGuy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Give Tab some leeway here. Yes, he did generalize based upon, most likely, popular assumption and rhetoric and spun the question as: "Sir, do you still beat your wife?" but I don't think he did it from a bigoted point of view. I have seen Tab post elsewhere regarding this topic and I think he is asking, from his point of view and experience of what he knows, a legitimate question.
Fortunately, he asked two gay guys what we thought as well. He is, from what I can see, trying to get educated on the topic rather than simply continuing with the assumption and shrugging off information that would challenge the assumptions he has had up to this point.
You are correct. P&N has a way of hardening the soul and in this case I seem to have exposed that hardening in myself. Thank you. :thumbsup:
Both the sexual preference issues and abortion issues are highly charged because they deal with the contol of other individuals by those that oppose their individuality.
That was not supposed to happen in the U.S.
It is so sad that it has.
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: ChiPCGuy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Give Tab some leeway here. Yes, he did generalize based upon, most likely, popular assumption and rhetoric and spun the question as: "Sir, do you still beat your wife?" but I don't think he did it from a bigoted point of view. I have seen Tab post elsewhere regarding this topic and I think he is asking, from his point of view and experience of what he knows, a legitimate question.
Fortunately, he asked two gay guys what we thought as well. He is, from what I can see, trying to get educated on the topic rather than simply continuing with the assumption and shrugging off information that would challenge the assumptions he has had up to this point.
You are correct. P&N has a way of hardening the soul and in this case I seem to have exposed that hardening in myself. Thank you. :thumbsup:
Both the sexual preference issues and abortion issues are highly charged because they deal with the contol of other individuals by those that oppose their individuality.
That was not supposed to happen in the U.S.
It is so sad that it has.
So very true. My soul has hardened more than I would like too. But, you two like many other posters on this board (and even with their equally hardened souls) restore my faith in people every time. Thanks to you, as well.
Edited to say: MoonBeam restores my faith in other people on a regular basis. I just wish I could figure out exactly what sort of drugs he is taking.....
Originally posted by: ChiPCGuy
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: ChiPCGuy
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you are worried about promiscuity in the gay community, why not support same-sex marriages? That would be an excellent way to support and promote monogamous committments among same-sex couples.
Agreed, however not until recently same-sex couples often didn't speak out about their on going relationships. I know one specific individual who has had an on-going relationship with his partner for over ten years; of course this isn't common.
Aidanjm, I know you're gay. Why do you think there's more promisicutiy in the homosexsual community compared to the hetrosexsual community? Why are gay monogamous relationships rare?
EDIT: It seems that ChiPCGuy is gay as well, if you don't mind that'd be nice if you could address my question.
Is there? You're making statements of Fact with nothing backing it up. Even if it were true, don't you think the past need to remain secretive would have something to do with it? You know, in order to avoid suspicion.
Give Tab some leeway here. Yes, he did generalize based upon, most likely, popular assumption and rhetoric and spun the question as: "Sir, do you still beat your wife?" but I don't think he did it from a bigoted point of view. I have seen Tab post elsewhere regarding this topic and I think he is asking, from his point of view and experience of what he knows, a legitimate question.
Fortunately, he asked two gay guys what we thought as well. He is, from what I can see, trying to get educated on the topic rather than simply continuing with the assumption and shrugging off information that would challenge the assumptions he has had up to this point.
You are correct. P&N has a way of hardening the soul and in this case I seem to have exposed that hardening in myself. Thank you. :thumbsup:
Both the sexual preference issues and abortion issues are highly charged because they deal with the contol of other individuals by those that oppose their individuality.
That was not supposed to happen in the U.S.
It is so sad that it has.
So very true. My soul has hardened more than I would like too. But, you two like many other posters on this board (and even with their equally hardened souls) restore my faith in people every time. Thanks to you, as well.
Edited to say: MoonBeam restores my faith in other people on a regular basis. I just wish I could figure out exactly what sort of drugs he is taking.....
By the way Welcome to P&N, you seem pretty new around here.
I think it's just you... while there's a certain segment of the gay population for which that would be true, it's no different than heterosexual males trying to score with every chick they see.
Thanks to all for participating in my little experiment. The experiment was to determine how much outrage there would be if I made asinine sweeping, baseless generalizations about homosexuality relative to how much outrage aidanjm caused by doing the exact same thing about Christianity in this thread.
What are the results of my experiment? That the members of this forum are much, much more willing to tolerate intolerance towards Christians than towards homosexuals. Not only that, but more of the gibberish I inserted (in the exact same format as aidanjm, I might add) was factual than was the gibberish he inserted in his thread, yet more people have questioned it here. This leads me to believe that one of two conclusions is correct:
1. People are very ignorant about what Christianity is (as demonstrated by the lack of calling aidanjm out on his 'opinions', which are mostly patently false statements) and also ignorant regarding research conducted on homosexual promiscuity.
2. People are more willing to tolerate lies defaming Christianity than they are willing to tolerate facts that portray the 'homosexual lifestyle' in a negative light.
It could be that both are true. Sorry I didn't ask for consent before performing the experiment, but this would have invalidated the results. Also, please note that my initial commentary in the OP does not necessarily reflect my true opinions on homosexual politics and/or behavior.
What are the results of my experiment? That the members of this forum are much, much more willing to tolerate intolerance towards Christians than towards homosexuals. Not only that, but more of the gibberish I inserted (in the exact same format as aidanjm, I might add) was factual than was the gibberish he inserted in his thread, yet more people have questioned it here. This leads me to believe that one of two conclusions is correct:
1. People are very ignorant about what Christianity is (as demonstrated by the lack of calling aidanjm out on his 'opinions', which are mostly patently false statements) and also ignorant regarding research conducted on homosexual promiscuity.
2. People are more willing to tolerate lies defaming Christianity than they are willing to tolerate facts that portray the 'homosexual lifestyle' in a negative light.
It could be that both are true. Sorry I didn't ask for consent before performing the experiment, but this would have invalidated the results. Also, please note that my initial commentary in the OP does not necessarily reflect my true opinions on homosexual politics and/or behavior.
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