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Webber has some stones that's for sure...disregarding team orders?

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
http://www.itv.com/formula1/news/2011/7/webber-i-was-right-to-ignore-team-8720/

Webber: I was right to disregard team orders

Mark Webber has hit out at his Red Bull team's request for him to hold position behind team-mate Sebastian Vettel in the British Grand Prix - and revealed that he deliberately snubbed the instruction and carried on attacking the world champion anyway.

The two Red Bulls had a spectacular battle for second in the closing stages, with Vettel emerging narrowly in front.

Radio transmissions suggested that the team had tried to get their drivers to hold station, and Webber angrily confirmed this after the race.

Asked how he felt, the Australian replied: "I'm not fine with it, no, that's the answer to that.

"If Fernando [Alonso] had retired on the last lap, we would have been battling for the victory.

"So I was fighting to the end.

"Of course I ignored the team, because I wanted to try and get another place.

"Seb was doing his best, I was doing my best.

"For sure I don't want to crash with anyone, and that was it.

"I tried to do my best with the amount of one-way conversation I had - I wasn't talking too much back, but there was a lot of traffic coming to me...

"But I was still trying to do my best to pass the guy in front."

Webber won last year's British Grand Prix while still fuming over Red Bull's decision to take their latest front wing off his car for qualifying and give it to Vettel as the German's example had failed.

That led to a team favouritism storm, but Webber said he didn't regard today as a revival of that controversy and saw it more as a disagreement over the handling of this particular race.

"I just want to race to the end," he said.

"With four or five laps to go, they started to chat to me about holding my position.

"Of course they want the points, but I also need to try and get some more points as well."

Vettel was sanguine about the row, saying he was happy to race but understood the team's stance too.

"I tried to stay ahead, obviously we're racing each other and I think there's nothing wrong with that," he said.

"From a team point of view, if you have the cars quite isolated in second and third, the first car has gone away and the fourth car is quite far away as well, then from a team point of view there is no point in racing and trying to do something stupid.

"But naturally we try to race, so what can I say?"

I'm beginning to like this guy more and more. His starts are typically pretty poor and his teammate has had the better of him at nearly every race but you gotta like a guy who disregards team orders like this. If nothing else it makes for great racing and great controversy! 😀
 
Lol @ tags.

Yes.. I admire him for standing up against the orders. I felt disgusted.. Webber was clearly faster.
 
he's been upside down more than Vettel, they should have let him pass

but in all seriousness, everyone understands why, but nice job for Webber to stand up for himself
 
How much longer does Webber have with that team? I remember the commentators saying that this wasn't the 1st time the team has attempted to surpress him...
 
Good for him. Glad to see that he's not taking it lying down and is still fighting.

While I can appreciate Christian Horners concerns that they could both crash and lose all them points for the team, end of the day, this is still a sport. And unless they have a clear division of #1 & #2 driver, don't see any reason why Webber should not push as hard as he can (without doing something stupid of course).
 
I do find it amazing that team orders don't generate the frenzy that they did before when certain teams used them. Granted they are apparently legal now, but still... 🙂
 
Lol @ tags.

Yes.. I admire him for standing up against the orders. I felt disgusted.. Webber was clearly faster.

If he was clearly faster, why wait until the last 2 laps to try and pull off a pass instead of the other 50 laps?

Much ado about nothing, imo. He wasn't being told to give up position, and being told to coast in the last few laps when the points are in the bag isn't that big of a request.

All that said, Horner is a dick and Webber should go to Ferrari to replace the utterly hopeless Massa.
 
Wonder if Webber would have been ordered to move over and let Vettel pass if Webber was in front...

Since team orders are fine as long as Ferrari isn't giving them...
 
If he was clearly faster, why wait until the last 2 laps to try and pull off a pass instead of the other 50 laps?
b/c it takes time to close a gap. Webber hadn't closed enough of the gap to consider passing until there were only a few laps left. and even after he closed the gap, passing someone like Vettel is no easy feat, even if Webber was a few thousandths of a second quicker per lap. being quicker than someone and being able to pass him are two different things.

Much ado about nothing, imo. He wasn't being told to give up position, and being told to coast in the last few laps when the points are in the bag isn't that big of a request.
no kidding. nobody here is up in arms b/c Webber was told to give up a spot - its b/c he was told to not attempt to pass. and there's no reason to be content with one's position simply b/c he/she is in the points. the bottom line is that Webber needs the championship points more than Vettel does with his monstrous lead so far...not that Vettel should just give them up to Webber, but he should at least be allowed to race for those few extra points.
 
The whole "Team Orders" BS is what turns me off of F1 a bit. An engineer in the pits shouldnt be determmining the outcome of a race like that.
 
If Webber doesn't go to Ferrari I'm sure a team like Renault Lotus or Mercedes factory will pick him up. He's a great driver, but Vettel and Alonso have him outclassed by some margin at the moment.

I do think that he had every right to compete for 2nd and why wouldn't he? He knows the limit of his vehicle and he wouldn't put himself into a stupid situation where he'd destroy both cars just for personal points. He just wanted to get 2nd to better his position for the individual world championship, either way I think team rivalry is great as long as it doesn't get blown out of proportion. I would rather have this little scuffle than seeing another Alonso/Massa team, Massa has been utterly dismissed.

Oh and congrats for Alonso on the win!

EDIT: Nice tag.
 
If Webber was actually faster than Vettel, and that's what I saw, then Webber was indeed told to give up a spot, imo.

With the passing assistance, Webber could have easily blown by Vettel, imo.

Webber gave up Vettel's spot.
 
If Webber was actually faster than Vettel, and that's what I saw, then Webber was indeed told to give up a spot, imo.

With the passing assistance, Webber could have easily blown by Vettel, imo.

Webber gave up Vettel's spot.

I agree... I think he ultimately held his position. He lifted when he had the momentum to pass him. He knows Vettel would move into him like what happened at Turkey.
 
If Webber was actually faster than Vettel, and that's what I saw, then Webber was indeed told to give up a spot, imo.

With the passing assistance, Webber could have easily blown by Vettel, imo.

Webber gave up Vettel's spot.

The DRS zone is on the front straight at Silverstone so he would have needed another lap to pass him. He was close enough though if he had 1 more lap I'm sure he would have gotten Vettel.
 
The DRS zone is on the front straight at Silverstone so he would have needed another lap to pass him. He was close enough though if he had 1 more lap I'm sure he would have gotten Vettel.

I'm sure he had Vettel in the bag and then got in parade formation. 🙂
 
What are they going to do to Weber if he did pass Vettel?---treat him like hes thier number 2 guy? Oh wait they already do. 🙄
 
I think the penalty for disobeying team orders would be hefty.

It could also bring problems with the team morale and relationships.

Suddenly your pit stops are slow...
 
It probably has to do with tire degradation.. Webber may have preserved tires better than Vettel.

exactly. any tire goes from "cold" to "switched on" to "maximum". more than a couple laps of qualifying or attacking will shorten the life of the tire severely, especially the pirellis it seems. possibly, the attacker has to manage his tire wear even more than the defender.
 
exactly. any tire goes from "cold" to "switched on" to "maximum". more than a couple laps of qualifying or attacking will shorten the life of the tire severely, especially the pirellis it seems. possibly, the attacker has to manage his tire wear even more than the defender.

It is amazing to see how the tires go off so suddenly and then the lap times start to drop quite a bit. I was kind of wondering if Ferrari were going to keep Alonso out on those super softs and not pit for the final set of tires. Why they kept him out for a few laps after Vettel and Webber had pitted was beyond me. He had a good 10 seconds on Vettel when Vettel came in for his final stop so why risk Vettel closing that gap on fresh tires when Alonsos were getting old?

Of course, they did bring him in a couple laps later and he came out with a good gap and kept setting fast laps.
 
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