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Wave gun at car, get shot

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Nebor said:
I think you nailed it exactly. Especially considering he would be right at home if he just went one forum down to P&N where there are plenty of people that take life too seriously and always want to argue. The problem is that his attention share would be diluted there. I don't know why the mods allow him to run rampant in OT posting clearly political threads. That was a really stellar post though irishScott. If he acted like this in an actual public place, he would be laughed at, made fun of and ditched, and if he persisted, he would get his ass beaten. I think you're exactly right in that he loves being able to force himself on others, probably due to the fact that no one can stand him in real life.

Regardless, thanks for the post. You've inspired me to add the first person EVER to my Ignore List: HAL9000. :thumbsup: It's the virtual equivalent of ditching him.
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No problem, I might be joining you soon. Would minimize his posts, and responding to his posts is just becoming less and less worth it.
 
HAL9000 said:
I disagree IN MY OPINION planning to kill someone in the event of a certain set of circumstances is irresponsible. Planning anyones death or assuming you have the right to kill them is irresponsible. Taking that further and buying a weapon to make it easier to kill them is even more irresponsible.
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So no one should have contingency plans? Cause that's all that mine are. In the unlikely (but not negligible) chance someone breaks into my home, putting my life at danger I am prepared to shoot him/her. Granted every situation is unique, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't have general plans in place.

Personally I would like you to look a rape, robbery, home invasion, kidnap, or murder (of a loved one) victim in the eye and tell them they don't have the right to decide that the perpetrator should have died in the moment.

For that matter, I want you to go tell a victim of multiple rapes in the Congo that planning to kill a rapist in the act is irresponsible and amoral.
 
irishScott said:
So no one should have contingency plans? Cause that's all that mine are. In the unlikely (but not negligible) chance someone breaks into my home, putting my life at danger I am prepared to shoot him/her. Granted every situation is unique, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't have general plans in place.

Personally I would like you to look a rape, robbery, kidnap, or murder (of a loved one) victim in the eye and tell them they don't have the right to decide that the perpetrator should have died in the moment.

For that matter, I want you to go tell a victim of multiple rapes in the Congo that planning to kill a potential rapist is irresponsible and amoral.
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There is a difference between having a hypothetical contingency plan an owning a device that's only valid reason for being is to kill. By owning a gun you are more likely to kill someone than someone with out (Can't find the statistics I read this in, so apologies for not citing the source)
 
HAL9000 said:
There is a difference between having a hypothetical contingency plan an owning a device that's only valid reason for being is to kill. By owning a gun you are more likely to kill someone than someone with out (Can't find the statistics I read this in, so apologies for not citing the source)
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I'm more likely to kill someone in valid self defense sure, because that is the only foreseeable reason I would ever use my gun against another person(s). My morals are that solid. I'm not going to just randomly go into some type of gun induced rage and go on a killing spree.
 
irishScott said:
I'm more likely to kill someone in valid self defense sure, because that is the only foreseeable reason I would ever use my gun against another person(s). My morals are that solid. I'm not going to just randomly go into some type of gun induced rage and go on a killing spree.
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But the point is, if someone breaks into your house the first thing you are going to do is end their life, (maybe with a warning) that's irresponsible IMO.
 
amdhunter said:
I wish they'd allow carry laws in NYC (at least for those that aren't politicians or celebrities.) I've never felt less at ease in my neighborhood as I have this past year.

Car windows being shot out daily, there has been 2 murders (one in daylight) this year right in front of my window, and constant robberies in my building.

With the NYPD in my area not doing anything, I honestly believe (and I am being 100% serious) that I'll be dead before the end of this year. It's not that I am scared, it's because I am confrontational, and I will end up dying because I am going to say the wrong thing to the wrong person.

It's not the way people should live. I don't have enough to just pack up and leave. Anywhere I can afford will be just as shit as it is here.
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why don't you move?
 
amdhunter said:
I wish they'd allow carry laws in NYC (at least for those that aren't politicians or celebrities.) I've never felt less at ease in my neighborhood as I have this past year.

Car windows being shot out daily, there has been 2 murders (one in daylight) this year right in front of my window, and constant robberies in my building.

With the NYPD in my area not doing anything, I honestly believe (and I am being 100% serious) that I'll be dead before the end of this year. It's not that I am scared, it's because I am confrontational, and I will end up dying because I am going to say the wrong thing to the wrong person.

It's not the way people should live. I don't have enough to just pack up and leave. Anywhere I can afford will be just as shit as it is here.
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why don't you move? i recall you said in another thread you were managing to save quite a bit of $ each month. (unless you own your current place, then it is understandable)
 
HAL9000 said:
So you're capable of deciding who lives and who dies?
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Responsible people are, and do every day whether they own guns or not. I don't own a gun but I have plenty of things around the house that could easily kill someone if I wanted to. Knives, hammers, a chain saw, I could mix cleaning chemicals that would make chlorine gas, I've got gallons of gasoline that I could use to start a fire. Hell, I could use my car as a very effective weapon. If I wanted to kill someone I wouldn't need a gun. However, I'm a responsible person and unless someone is a direct, immediate and lethal threat to me, my family, or someone around I'm not going to be violent against them. Violence is a last resort, but when no other option is available I have no problem with people using it to defend themselves.

You keep on bringing up the value of a life. Obviously I highly value my own life. I know I'm a decent person that tries to do the right thing and I know that I'm not trying to hurt people. I also don't do anything that would make a reasonable person have a reason to kill me. Because I know that I'm a decent person that makes anyone trying to hurt me a not so decent person, good people don't try and physically harm or kill other good people. In my mind that makes protecting my life more valuable than protecting theirs.
 
Bignate603 said:
Responsible people are, and do every day whether they own guns or not. I don't own a gun but I have plenty of things around the house that could easily kill someone if I wanted to. Knives, hammers, a chain saw, I could mix cleaning chemicals that would make chlorine gas, I've got gallons of gasoline that I could use to start a fire. Hell, I could use my car as a very effective weapon. If I wanted to kill someone I wouldn't need a gun. However, I'm a responsible person and unless someone is a direct, immediate and lethal threat to me, my family, or someone around I'm not going to be violent against them. Violence is a last resort, but when no other option is available I have no problem with people using it to defend themselves.

You keep on bringing up the value of a life. Obviously I highly value my own life. I know I'm a decent person that tries to do the right thing and I know that I'm not trying to hurt people. I also don't do anything that would make a reasonable person have a reason to kill me. Because I know that I'm a decent person that makes anyone trying to hurt me a not so decent person, good people don't try and physically harm or kill other good people. In my mind that makes protecting my life more valuable than protecting theirs.
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An understandable viewpoint, but to my mind there is a difference between owning a kitchen knife and a gun, going out to buy a weapon to kill someone, is irresponsible if you ask me.
 
HAL9000 said:
But the point is, if someone breaks into your house the first thing you are going to do is end their life, (maybe with a warning) that's irresponsible IMO.
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The first thing I'll do is investigate the situation. This includes establishing how many intruders there are, if they're armed (and if so, with what), their positions, the relative locations of anyone else in the house, available cover if applicable, whether I can make the shot, etc, all leading up to a decision to fire.

Granted every situation is different and not all factors can be accounted for in the moment, but the fact is they put their own lives in danger when they broke into my house. If you walk into a known minefield, it's not the mine-layer's fault when you get blown up. Most sports clubs have people sign waivers stating exactly such logic under far less extreme circumstances.
 
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Numenorean said:
So you're a bisexual, bipolar person with aspergers, insomnia and memory problems? Bullshit.
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Wow! You must be like Dr House or something, if you can diagnose me from here! Could you send me a message with illnesses you think I have or don't have, that would be great! Thanks in advance.

Also seeing as you seem to have a better understanding of what's going on in my head / body than my doctors and I do, maybe you could PM me next time you think I'm hungry so I don't forget to eat. 🙄
 
irishScott said:
The first think I'll do is investigate the situation. This includes establishing how many intruders there are, if they're armed (and if so, with what), their positions, the relative locations of anyone else in the house, available cover if applicable, whether I can make the shot, etc, all leading up to a decision to fire.

Granted every situation is different and not all factors can be accounted for in the moment, but the fact is they put their own lives in danger when they broke into my house. If you walk into a known minefield, it's not the mine-layer's fault when you get blown up. Most sports clubs have people sign wavers stating exactly such logic under far less extreme circumstances.
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Just because you think about the practicality of your shot doesn't really change my view on the morality of it...
 
HAL9000 said:
There is a difference between having a hypothetical contingency plan an owning a device that's only valid reason for being is to kill. By owning a gun you are more likely to kill someone than someone with out (Can't find the statistics I read this in, so apologies for not citing the source)
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If the contingency plan involves getting a gun so one can defend themselves, then there is no difference.

Owning a gun does not make me any more likely to kill someone who is innocent. Perhaps slightly more likely to kill a criminal, but again I see no problem with that.
 
HAL9000 said:
Wow! You must be like Dr House or something, if you can diagnose me from here! Could you send me a message with illnesses you think I have or don't have, that would be great! Thanks in advance.

Also seeing as you seem to have a better understanding of what's going on in my head / body than my doctors and I do, maybe you could PM me next time you think I'm hungry so I don't forget to eat. 🙄
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You're the one who posted all of that about yourself.
 
Numenorean said:
If the contingency plan involves getting a gun so one can defend themselves, then there is no difference.

Owning a gun does not make me any more likely to kill someone who is innocent. Perhaps slightly more likely to kill a criminal, but again I see no problem with that.
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I do see a problem with that.
 
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