was the EU doomed from the start?

[BlahBlahYouToo]

i never understood how you can unify 20+ nations without political integration.
it's hard enough to agree on fiscal, monetary and political policies internally (see USA).

heck, even culturally, they are more different than alike. at least we have (or had, before the influx of illegals) that going for us.

 

[CanOWorms]

They thought that the desire for Empire would overpower xenophobia. They underestimated.

I don't understand your influx of illegals argument, but Europe has a large influx of refugees (not illegals, but a subclass of legal immigrant).

 

[Anarchist420]

I agree with the OP. It was indeed doomed from the start as centralization of power never works. Centralization of power turns into total chaos. See Nazi Germany and USSR for starters.

 

[feralkid]

A little premature, boys.

 

[Infohawk]

i never understood how you can unify 20+ nations without political integration.
it's hard enough to agree on fiscal, monetary and political policies internally (see USA).

heck, even culturally, they are more different than alike. at least we have (or had, before the influx of illegals) that going for us.

I agree that this is premature. More importantly what is now the EU has existed in some form for 60 years and has been growing. To say that it has been doomed is silly. Even if it ends tomorrow it existed for a fair amount of time, and that's not going to happen based on current events.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Truth be told the EU was designed to do what the German`s could not do during ww2 and that was to rule all of Europe!!

 

[LegendKiller]

Anarchist's usual stupidity aside, yes, it was doomed to fail. The three legs of society, especially in regards to Germany and France, being monetary, political and fiscal, weren't intact. You can't have a stable society on one leg.

Even with some type of political integration you'll still be missing fiscal.

 

[Anarchist420]

Truth be told the EU was designed to do what the German`s could not do during ww2 and that was to rule all of Europe!!

That could be true.

 

[cybrsage]

Confederations fail due to the lack of central power to make all the relevant states play nice.

 

[IGBT]

they never had a viable business plan. Just liberal intentions.

 

[freegeeks]

LOL, as usual most Americans have no clue about the difference between the EU and the EMU. Even without the Euro, the EU will still exist

carry on

 

[sm625]

Its not a failure from certain people's perspective. They have the pieces in place. They just need the right crisis to "facilitate" political integration. They will be convinced to sacrifice their sovereignty in the name of security. Does it really take a genius to figure this stuff out?

What gets me is how/why the german people are so tolerant of a paradigm where they make less in wages than their "friends" in greece and elsewhere. The germans literally do more work for less money, lots more. And they are being asked to do even more work for even less money. I cant believe they arent kicking their entire government to the curb. But when I look over here at all the crap we tolerate, I begin to understand.

You guys probably dont know much history, but germany was basically a tool of the Rothschilds in WWII. The fact that they marched right into russia was the final proof of that. But now Rothschilds have gotten smart and they've worked on the EU for 50+ years, using the central bank as the means of control. There will be another world war once these central banks get all the power they desire. It is inevitable simply because of the dynamic between German and Greek labor and work ethics. Germans will get more and more angry about the ECB bailing out those lazy fools at the expense of the hard workers. Just like the US central bank. Imagine if the US central bank repeatedly bailed out institutions in a racially motivated manner, ie giving money to hispanics or african americans. There would be an explosion in racial violence and it would erupt into total chaos, driven by the central bank. Of course that wont happen here because the US central bank is under Rothschild control, but its just an example of how it works. They operate differently here, they use class warfare. But in europe I expect the ECB to try to ignite old ethnic tensions. The ECB should never be given the power to print money.

 

[Anarchist420]

Why shouldn't they go back to their own countries?

Switzerland didn't join for a reason.

 

[freegeeks]

Its not a failure from certain people's perspective. They have the pieces in place. They just need the right crisis to "facilitate" political integration. They will be convinced to sacrifice their sovereignty in the name of security. Does it really take a genius to figure this stuff out?

What gets me is how/why the german people are so tolerant of a paradigm where they make less in wages than their "friends" in greece and elsewhere. The germans literally do more work for less money, lots more. And they are being asked to do even more work for even less money. I cant believe they arent kicking their entire government to the curb. But when I look over here at all the crap we tolerate, I begin to understand.

You guys probably dont know much history, but germany was basically a tool of the Rothschilds in WWII. The fact that they marched right into russia was the final proof of that. But now Rothschilds have gotten smart and they've worked on the EU for 50+ years, using the central bank as the means of control. There will be another world war once these central banks get all the power they desire. It is inevitable simply because of the dynamic between German and Greek labor and work ethics. Germans will get more and more angry about the ECB bailing out those lazy fools at the expense of the hard workers. Just like the US central bank. Imagine if the US central bank repeatedly bailed out institutions in a racially motivated manner, ie giving money to hispanics or african americans. There would be an explosion in racial violence and it would erupt into total chaos, driven by the central bank. Of course that wont happen here because the US central bank is under Rothschild control, but its just an example of how it works. They operate differently here, they use class warfare. But in europe I expect the ECB to try to ignite old ethnic tensions. The ECB should never be given the power to print money.

crack must be cheap in the US of A

 

[Broheim]

americans discussing the EU, this should be good.

/lawnchair and popcorn

 

[Whiskey16]

LOL, as usual most Americans have no clue about the difference between the EU and the EMU. Even without the Euro, the EU will still exist

carry on

This.

Ignorance is extreme.

 

[Broheim]

aaww thread died on us... let's see if we can't get this going again.

the EU has 27 member states that can consistently agree on some very unpopular topics, the US has 2 political parties that couldn't agree to buy more toilet paper even if they were all out and everybody had Diarrhea.

 

[Doppel]

Yes, it was, at least the currency.

 

[PingviN]

EU is going nowhere.

 

[werepossum]

EU is going nowhere.

LOL That can be read two very different ways . . .

Perhaps a better question would be is the Euro doomed, for it seems to me that the EU can exist largely unchanged with looser monetary ties. I'm guessing though that the days of a common currency are nearing an end. I'm not sure anyway if one can have a common currency without unified fiscal policy, but looks like at least some countries prefer junk currency to austerity. Unless PIGIS are bluffing, in which case carry on.

Of course, it's always possible that the EU can persuade the USA to borrow enough money from China to bail them out and save the Euro from its day of reckoning . . .

 

[tommo123]

i do wonder if they'll try again, but a smaller union? maybe just france, germany and the UK.

 

[Macamus Prime]

Yes.

Because they did not consult everyone on these forums and their vast knowledge/experience with governing various countries, cultures and monitary systems.

 

[bpatters69]

I am surprised it has lasted this long. With the centuries old dislike and in some cases hatred from one European country to another, I do not know how they set up the EU in the first place.

 

[tommo123]

each generation has different attitudes to europe. they should have (around 20 years ago) started to teach various languages properly. in the UK the attempt (till recently) to teach french for example has been a joke - maybe even a gap year in another euro country during high school time.

 

[AnitaPeterson]

I am surprised it has lasted this long. With the centuries old dislike and in some cases hatred from one European country to another, I do not know how they set up the EU in the first place.

Because they figured that they've had too many wars already, and it's time to figure out how to avoid them?

Seriously... leaving intercontinental divide, ignorance and cultural relativism aside, it's frightening to see how few people bother to read and understand history and political science nowadays.