While nice, that doesn't seem to be my experience. Unsupported things tend to cause lockups in my experience, but maybe my experiences are unusual. Either way, it is also up to the builder to pick parts that are supported in the configuration they want.
While nice, that doesn't seem to be my experience. Unsupported things tend to cause lockups in my experience, but maybe my experiences are unusual. Either way, it is also up to the builder to pick parts that are supported in the configuration they want.
See, that's what I thought. That's what the Intel rep seemed to think too. But the Nvidia rep I spoke to said "No, it won't work." And then I talked to her supervisor and he also said "No, it won't work." If it does work and I'm just a niche case, then Nvidia support screwed up big time.
EDIT: Or are you just talking about the Intel/AMD integrated graphics being present but not using the display outputs? If that's the case, you're either missing the point or trying to get a reaction.
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RussianSensation
Elite Member
- Sep 5, 2003
- 19,458
- 765
- 126
A friend was choosing between an i5 4690K + cheap dedicated GPU vs. i7 4790K and no dedicated GPU. I recommended the i7 4790K since it was faster and since he didn't play games at all, for basic work the GPU in the 4790K should have been more than sufficient.
My friend had only 1 requirement: run 3 identical 1920x1080 2014 model year Asus monitors on his i7 4790K setup without using a dedicated GPU. I told him to get the MSI Z97 Gaming 3 board since it had 1x HDMI, 1x DisplayPort, 1x DVI and 1x VGA. Goal - run all 3 monitors over the digital connections off Intel's GPU so we don't have to use the VGA.
Since his Asus monitor only has VGA, HDMI and DVI, we decided to connect them as follows:
1st monitor HDMI to HDMI cable = MSI Gaming 3 HDMI
2nd monitor DVI to DVI cable = MSI Gaming 3 DVI
3rd monitor HDMI to HDMI cable = MSI Gaming 3 DisplayPort to HDMI Female Adapter would be used because I couldn't find a DP to HDMI cable as my searches kept getting me to miniDP to HDMI cable which wouldn't work.
End result, 3rd monitor wouldn't work. More research, calls with Intel's customer support and NCIX's tech, and we found out that you cannot run Intel triple monitor setup over digital connection with any adapters in the chain. All connections must be native (i.e., HDMI to HDMI cable, DVI to DVI cable, DisplayPort to DisplayPort cable). You cannot use any digital adapters with Intel's GPUs for triple monitor 2D or 3D work. The 3rd monitor will not work. Right now the temporary solution is running the 3rd monitor off VGA
Moral of the story: These rare cases are often not discussed on the internet since few people run such setups. For example, if you bought a monitor that had DP, HDMI and DVI and just used 3 different cables, you would have never known that Intel's 3 monitor surround fails with any adapters.
Do your research and pay attention to threads like HurleyBird's because if you run into a similar issue, you'll remember why!!!
Tens of millions of people had no issues with iOS8 while thousands had app crashes, degraded WiFi speeds, quickly deteriorating battery life, slow downs and freezes in the OS and Safari, and other general glitches. Just because millions do not have issues, doesn't mean a problem doesn't exist.
Just ignore those who always defend NV at all costs. I mean for years they didn't even know or acknowledge how Full RGB is completely broken out of the box on all NV cards over HDMI. But since most people cannot tell the difference without comparing 2 monitors side-by-side with Full RGB vs. Partial RGB, this problem "didn't exist" for 99.9% of NV users.
That's why OP sharing his experience with the forum is important. He even criticized his not so perfect experience with AMD drivers as well. He is not trying to claim that the competitor offers a perfect solution. He is simply sharing his experience.
My friend had only 1 requirement: run 3 identical 1920x1080 2014 model year Asus monitors on his i7 4790K setup without using a dedicated GPU. I told him to get the MSI Z97 Gaming 3 board since it had 1x HDMI, 1x DisplayPort, 1x DVI and 1x VGA. Goal - run all 3 monitors over the digital connections off Intel's GPU so we don't have to use the VGA.
Since his Asus monitor only has VGA, HDMI and DVI, we decided to connect them as follows:
1st monitor HDMI to HDMI cable = MSI Gaming 3 HDMI
2nd monitor DVI to DVI cable = MSI Gaming 3 DVI
3rd monitor HDMI to HDMI cable = MSI Gaming 3 DisplayPort to HDMI Female Adapter would be used because I couldn't find a DP to HDMI cable as my searches kept getting me to miniDP to HDMI cable which wouldn't work.
End result, 3rd monitor wouldn't work. More research, calls with Intel's customer support and NCIX's tech, and we found out that you cannot run Intel triple monitor setup over digital connection with any adapters in the chain. All connections must be native (i.e., HDMI to HDMI cable, DVI to DVI cable, DisplayPort to DisplayPort cable). You cannot use any digital adapters with Intel's GPUs for triple monitor 2D or 3D work. The 3rd monitor will not work. Right now the temporary solution is running the 3rd monitor off VGA
Moral of the story: These rare cases are often not discussed on the internet since few people run such setups. For example, if you bought a monitor that had DP, HDMI and DVI and just used 3 different cables, you would have never known that Intel's 3 monitor surround fails with any adapters.
Do your research and pay attention to threads like HurleyBird's because if you run into a similar issue, you'll remember why!!!
Tens of millions of people had no issues with iOS8 while thousands had app crashes, degraded WiFi speeds, quickly deteriorating battery life, slow downs and freezes in the OS and Safari, and other general glitches. Just because millions do not have issues, doesn't mean a problem doesn't exist.
Just ignore those who always defend NV at all costs. I mean for years they didn't even know or acknowledge how Full RGB is completely broken out of the box on all NV cards over HDMI. But since most people cannot tell the difference without comparing 2 monitors side-by-side with Full RGB vs. Partial RGB, this problem "didn't exist" for 99.9% of NV users.
That's why OP sharing his experience with the forum is important. He even criticized his not so perfect experience with AMD drivers as well. He is not trying to claim that the competitor offers a perfect solution. He is simply sharing his experience.
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was not surprised. remember the hybrid physx? nvidia purposely locked it. and nvidia doesnt even want any other card except nvidia.
SolMiester
Diamond Member
- Dec 19, 2004
- 5,331
- 17
- 76
Intel is the only vendor whose HDMI audio output isn't complete garbage. It's actually quite good.
On second thought I might not quite have grasped the question correctly. Windows treats HDMI audio devices as displays, you can set their resolution and everything. The only "display" I have connected via Intel graphics is the HDMI audio device. If I called it a display earlier, that's just because of how windows sees it as one.
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Aikouka
Lifer
- Nov 27, 2001
- 30,383
- 912
- 126
Hm, I use a GTX 780 Ti, and I have my iGPU enabled and the drivers installed to enable QuickSync support; it has never given me any problems. If you'd like, I could try hooking a monitor up to see what happens?
It sounds like you were using a passive adapter. It's really not uncommon for low-end cards (or in this case, the iGPU) to lack enough TMDSs to support every connection. To get around the lack of a TMDS to support the signaling, you'll need an active adapter, which performs the conversion for you all while appearing to be a DisplayPort connection. The only downside is that while a passive conversion cable can be had for less than $10, active adapters are a bit more expensive. Here's an example of one.
1st monitor HDMI to HDMI cable = MSI Gaming 3 HDMI
2nd monitor DVI to DVI cable = MSI Gaming 3 DVI
3rd monitor HDMI to HDMI cable = MSI Gaming 3 DisplayPort to HDMI Female Adapter would be used because I couldn't find a DP to HDMI cable as my searches kept getting me to miniDP to HDMI cable which wouldn't work.
End result, 3rd monitor wouldn't work. More research, calls with Intel's customer support and NCIX's tech, and we found out that you cannot run Intel triple monitor setup over digital connection with any adapters in the chain. All connections must be native (i.e., HDMI to HDMI cable, DVI to DVI cable, DisplayPort to DisplayPort cable). You cannot use any digital adapters with Intel's GPUs for triple monitor 2D or 3D work. The 3rd monitor will not work. Right now the temporary solution is running the 3rd monitor off VGA
It sounds like you were using a passive adapter. It's really not uncommon for low-end cards (or in this case, the iGPU) to lack enough TMDSs to support every connection. To get around the lack of a TMDS to support the signaling, you'll need an active adapter, which performs the conversion for you all while appearing to be a DisplayPort connection. The only downside is that while a passive conversion cable can be had for less than $10, active adapters are a bit more expensive. Here's an example of one.
That would be hugely appreciated! I'm still kind of sceptical about what Nvidia support told me, although when I got it to work on my own they were surprised enough that they asked for steps to reproduce what I did. If you're able to run monitors on both adapters that would give me cause to start looking for a real solution, but would also make Nvidia support look a bit foolish.
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Could the problem be that even though you are only using the audio the nVidia driver sees it as using another brand GPU for rendering (like when you try and use an nVidia GPU for PhysX) and is disabling the nVidia GPU?
You can't actually "only" use HDMI for audio. That's not the way Windows treats an HDMI audio device. It treats it, anything connected with HDMI really, as a display. You can go in and change it's position, resolution, and heck, even the refresh rate.
Maybe it does have something to do with Nvidia being protectionistic about their features, it wouldn't surprise me, but going to an unusable blank screen until you uninstall the Geforce drivers in safe mode doesn't seem like the kind of behaviour a company would willingly engineer.
That said, I was playing Borderlands 2 with GPU PhysX earlier with the HDMI audio running out of Intel integrated graphics and it worked just fine. So long as I never turn off my PC the current solution seems to work flawlessly. Whatever is getting in the way must be pretty insignificant in engineering terms or that wouldn't be the case.
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It's a bit more complex than that. I do run a TOSLINK cable between my Smyth Realiser and Grace m903, but the Realiser is where the chain needs to begin and that only accepts HDMI input.
RussianSensation
Elite Member
- Sep 5, 2003
- 19,458
- 765
- 126
Thanks for the tip. Maybe that will work but my friend says he is OK with using the 3rd monitor under VGA. I doubt he will care to spend $30 now as he hates wasting time tinkering with his computer. I'll keep this in mind for someone else's future build and will be sure to try it. ^_^
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Update, going into sleep mode also causes the blank screen issue. Only fix is, still, going into safe mode and uninstalling the Nvidia drivers. Here I thought AMD's crash on wake was annoying.
Well, tried to do the same steps as before to get my configuration to work again and now Windows appears to be bricked. Thanks Nvidia.
From what little I've been able to tell they seemed pretty equivalent. With the exception of needing to shut down a bunch of programs first, I did think the Nvidia surround setup process was a bit more streamlined.
From what little I've been able to tell they seemed pretty equivalent. With the exception of needing to shut down a bunch of programs first, I did think the Nvidia surround setup process was a bit more streamlined.
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This all all i have read so i may have missed an important difference.
I have 4 screens connected at the same time which one is my Plasma 50" KURO connected through HDMI and i have no issue with HDMI audio what so ever.
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HDMI can be somewhat fickle at the best of times. It's possible that AMD has improved their HDMI driver since the last time I tried to use it, or perhaps it has less compatibility issues with a stereo device. In any case, glad to hear you're doing good with it.
So, while trying to repair the damage Nvidia's drivers did to Windows (although I'm pretty much resigned right now to the fact that I'm going to need to do a fresh install), the Nvidia display driver just completely refused to uninstall when I tried to remove it in safe mode. Awesome. Fortunately there are third party programs that can do the job, but this is seriously scary stuff.
I'm going to return the GTX 980 and go back to my 7970 until 20nm AMD cards come out. I can't even begin to explain how seriously disappointed I am in Nvidia right now. After this experience I can't see myself buying one of their products again -- their drivers are dangerously sub par.
I'm going to return the GTX 980 and go back to my 7970 until 20nm AMD cards come out. I can't even begin to explain how seriously disappointed I am in Nvidia right now. After this experience I can't see myself buying one of their products again -- their drivers are dangerously sub par.
Interesting thread for a use case that is uncommon.
Heck, I'm just happy my Nvidia HDMI audio doesn't snap, crackle, and pop like my AMD HDMI audio did with my Denon receiver.
Heck, I'm just happy my Nvidia HDMI audio doesn't snap, crackle, and pop like my AMD HDMI audio did with my Denon receiver.
Why should any Intel feature stop working because nVidia/AMD doesn't want you using it? Those companies should make drivers that don't interfere with the functionality of other software/hardware. It's not like an Intel iGPU is some niche component.
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The 980 is so new, why don't you hold off to see if there is a fix in the pipeline?
Nvidia's drivers failed in such a spectacular fashion that I'm now forced to do a fresh install of Windows. Why exactly should I give them a second chance?
hawtdawg
Golden Member
- Jun 4, 2005
- 1,223
- 7
- 81
I've had more driver problems with my 780's than I did with 3 generations of AMD cards. I also had a metric assload of driver issues on the AW M17x I owned. It was so bad that AW ended up replacing all of the 285m's with 4870m's, and this was on a motherboard with an Nvidia chipset.
I've had more problems in two days with my GTX 980 than I did over the two years I've owned my 7970. Interesting how real world experience seems to be the exact opposite of internet propaganda, although I'm sure there are people out there who have had the opposite experience to us just based on luck of the draw.
I'm left with the thought that AMD drivers probably do have more issues (you certainly see more problems on the AMD side when it comes to compatibility with new releases), but when they fail it's more or less elegant. Nvidia drivers probably fail less often, but when they do they are more often to fail spectacularly -- eg. needing to uninstall the driver just to get back into Windows, or having Windows corrupted entirely. I haven't seen anything even close to this bad happen because of Catalyst.
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