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War with Pakistan? Let's suppose that Pakistan knowingly harbored Bin Laden.

WhipperSnapper

WhipperSnapper

Lifer
What do we do if we are able to confirm that the Paskistani government was fully aware of Bin Laden's location and essentially harbored him? Would that make Pakistan a mortal enemy of the United States? (I think so.) Now what? Do we launch some sort of a preemptive strike to destroy or capture all of their nuclear weapons while pursuing forcible regime change? (I'm sure our military has a number of scenarios and plans for doing this just in case.)
 
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At best Whippersnapper can make a 50% case. The bulk of the Pakistan government is squarely on the US side, but the Pakistan ISI is an exception. Nor can we go to the Pakistan army and purge out just the ISI, they don't wear ISI hats to tell them apart.

Now in terms of how many in the Pal government knew the location of Ossama Bin Laden, that is exactly what is probably being investigated. But I seriously doubt the current leader of Pakistan is on that short list.

As for hiding in plain sight, look how long Eric Rudolph and Ted Kazinski avoided detection.
 
WhipperSnapper said:
What do we do if we are able to confirm that the Paskistani government was fully aware of Bin Laden's location and essentially harbored him? Would that make Pakistan a mortal enemy of the United States? (I think so.) Now what? Do we launch some sort of a preemptive strike to destroy or capture all of their nuclear weapons while pursuing forcible regime change? (I'm sure our military has a number of scenarios and plans for doing this just in case.)
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Pakistan is more of a threat to themselves then anyone else. A lot of them still live in mud huts and you just have no clue how funny the idea of them being our "mortal enemy" sounds.

I once met a Pakistani who thought I was crazy when I mentioned that heavy objects don't fall faster then lighter ones. Being ignorant of basic 500 year old physics I can understand, but the guy was sent to the US to study nuclear reactors! A couple of his buddies bought themselves a new van, set the cruise control, and then jumped in the back expecting the thing to steer itself!

If the US ever feels the need to do something about these hillbillys I'm sure the government has a much better idea then me of exactly what might be the best course of action.
 
I'm not saying we should do it. I'm just putting the question out there. I'm sure that the answer is that it doesn't or wouldn't make any sense to initiate a war with them.

Lemon law said:
As for hiding in plain sight, look how long Eric Rudolph and Ted Kazinski avoided detection.
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Yeah, but they didn't build mysterious ostentatious fortified compounds with barbed wire walls next to military bases.
 
regardless of if we should or not, we wont .. because pakistan is a nuclear power
 
wuliheron said:
Pakistan is more of a threat to themselves then anyone else. A lot of them still live in mud huts and you just have no clue how funny the idea of them being our "mortal enemy" sounds.

I once met a Pakistani who thought I was crazy when I mentioned that heavy objects don't fall faster then lighter ones. Being ignorant of basic 500 year old physics I can understand, but the guy was sent to the US to study nuclear reactors! A couple of his buddies bought themselves a new van, set the cruise control, and then jumped in the back expecting the thing to steer itself!

If the US ever feels the need to do something about these hillbillys I'm sure the government has a much better idea then me of exactly what might be the best course of action.
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I guess it just goes to prove wuliheron is exactly one blind man in the story about the blind men and the elephant. What wuliheron describes is a tiny part of the 165+ million Pakistani population that mainly live in the tribal areas of Pakistan. The rest of Pakistan is mainly modern technological people with modern Western institutions.
 
cganesh75 said:
regardless of if we should or not, we wont .. because pakistan is a nuclear power
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We can't forget this because it matters.

Many are making same mistakes as Bush did with Iraq and it's largely a matter of our education. We are taught that people form nations that are defined by borders and the area within constitutes a country. We then learn a little more and are expected to be able to read a map. That's pretty much the end of it and being indoctrinated with those simplistic concepts automatically adhere to them. The round peg goes in the round mental hole. The problem is that this concept is not always a reflection of how other people think.

That is the case with Pakistan. Which one of those are we talking about? Is it the mostly westernized cities or is it the mountainous tribal regions where the idea of "nation"is incomprehensible? Which of the three governments are we referring to, the tribal, the military or the civilian? None of these hold ultimate authority or are even recognized as legitimate in the eyes if people within arbitrary borders.

We apply our grade school metric without due consideration expecting everyone else to conform to it. This is an illustration of a root cause of friction between us and other societies. We need an understanding of how others think before responding because favorable outcomes are not optional.
 
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WhipperSnapper said:
What do we do if we are able to confirm that the Paskistani government was fully aware of Bin Laden's location and essentially harbored him?
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1 - Bomb them back to the stone age.

2 - call in a company to dig out the entire country and turn it into a lake

3 - build pig farms around lake

4 - make sure pig feces drains into lake
 
Here's why we won't go to war with Pakistan by comparing them to the two countries invaded during the Bush regime and the country Obama enforced a no fly zone in with bombs.

Populations:
Afghanistan 28 million
Iraq 31 million
Libya 6.4 million
Pakistan 170 million

Actually has weapons of mass destruction (AKA nukes).
Afghanistan - NO
Iraq - NO
Libya - NO
Pakistan - Very much YES.
 
Whatever happened to trade with others and peace? Why must our first reaction for everything be war? The mindset of modern America concerns me, especially our leadership.
 
Humanity as a whole would benefit if the entirety of Pakistan were forcibly converted into a sheet of obsidian.
 
ASSUMING THIS CAN BE SHOWN CONCLUSIVELY:

We start with sanctions first. Pakistan isn't quite ask backwards as Afghanistan where sanctions would never accomplish anything. And these aren't just limited or American sanctions. If China or anyone else didn't join in the sanctions they'd see their economic growth halted when we imposed trade sanctions on all their crappy goods. Pakistan could escape the sanctions by agreeing to dramatic reforms and scrapping of their intelligence services along with reparations to the US.
 
For all you armchair hardasses in here talking about dropping bombs and nuking Pakistan.. I urge you to take a trip over there and mingle with the civilians. You'll come back to this country realizing how ignorant you are.
 
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