Video Editing/ Rendering build

[mfenn]

It's strange that you say it works with 1600, because it says: DDR3 1866(OC)/1333/1066. No mention of 1600.

That's just the way ASUS specs their boards. They list the official memory speeds and then the highest memory speed. DDR3 1600 WILL work.

 

[Davidh373]

AMD : $1786.16

Intel price: $2106.18

-Build-

NZXT Whisper

Corsair 650TX

Gigabyte AM3 870A

Phenom II X6 2.8

Gskill Ripjaw 8GB 1333

Crucial RealSSD 64GB

2X Caviar Black 1TB

LG Bluray

Geforce 460

Logitech Z323 2.1 speakers

2X Hanns G 1080p 23" (sorry, $600 worth of monitors just isn't in the cards right now... later )

 

[mfenn]

Looks fine as long as you realize that the Hanns G monitors will never be color accurate.

 

[Davidh373]

Looks fine as long as you realize that the Hanns G monitors will never be color accurate.

I'm ok with that. They haven't been all that much of an issue so far. Like I said, later. Are there other monitors you would recommend that aren't $300 a piece that have better accuracy?

 

[mfenn]

I'm ok with that. They haven't been all that much of an issue so far. Like I said, later. Are there other monitors you would recommend that aren't $300 a piece that have better accuracy?

There is the U2211H at $259.

 

[Davidh373]

I think i'm alright where i'm at for now. When we get a larger sum of money to spend we can get the design monitors. Would you guys have any objection to changing the case to the Thermaltake Armor? It's on sale now for about $40 cheaper than the Whisper, has free shipping, and has more cooling from the looks of things.

 

[Sp12]

I'm ok with that. They haven't been all that much of an issue so far. Like I said, later. Are there other monitors you would recommend that aren't $300 a piece that have better accuracy?

The Dell IPS is only 100$ more, so it's really like 200$ more for monitors. Though definitely not ideal, if the budget's really tight I would get 1 IPS monitor for the main project, and the palattes and such can live on the cheaper TN.

 

[mfenn]

I think i'm alright where i'm at for now. When we get a larger sum of money to spend we can get the design monitors. Would you guys have any objection to changing the case to the Thermaltake Armor? It's on sale now for about $40 cheaper than the Whisper, has free shipping, and has more cooling from the looks of things.

The Armor sucks in my opinion. Big, heavy, and very crappily-designed tooless system.

 

[Davidh373]

What palettes? When Photoshop is used for anything it only occupies one screen, and even then it spends most of it's time behind a web browser, Encore, or After Effects. Photoshop is nowhere near a main priority. We'll either decide we have the money and get both, or decide to hold off.
To be completely honest, We have ~$4000 coming in from a client (which would be the 50 % (why does it have a problem with displaying percent?) upfront). If we spend $1800 on the software (Adobe Production Premium CS5), and $1800 on the hardware that leaves us with $400 for a lighting kit we need that costs ~ $350. We are stretching out budget thin already. We will upgrade our monitors when the time is right, but for now it's more important to have the Power to push through the project. We have my computer, but I don't have the time to dedicate it to the rendering we'll need done. I have a whole batch of animation classes coming up and they'll require a lot of hours of rendering and just good old fashioned work time.

I suppose if we cut the ram to 4GB, or the video card to something older, we would have wiggle room to spring for the monitor, but I really don't see either of those compromises being worthwhile...

 

[Davidh373]

The Armor sucks in my opinion. Big, heavy, and very crappily-designed tooless system.

Alright, I'll stick to the Whisper.

 

[Sp12]

What palettes? When Photoshop is used for anything it only occupies one screen, and even then it spends most of it's time behind a web browser, Encore, or After Effects. Photoshop is nowhere near a main priority. We'll either decide we have the money and get both, or decide to hold off.
To be completely honest, We have ~$4000 coming in from a client (which would be the 50 % (why does it have a problem with displaying percent?) upfront). If we spend $1800 on the software (Adobe Production Premium CS5), and $1800 on the hardware that leaves us with $400 for a lighting kit we need that costs ~ $350. We are stretching out budget thin already. We will upgrade our monitors when the time is right, but for now it's more important to have the Power to push through the project. We have my computer, but I don't have the time to dedicate it to the rendering we'll need done. I have a whole batch of animation classes coming up and they'll require a lot of hours of rendering and just good old fashioned work time.

I suppose if we cut the ram to 4GB, or the video card to something older, we would have wiggle room to spring for the monitor, but I really don't see either of those compromises being worthwhile...

In that case, waiting on the IPS monitors makes sense.

I wouldn't know a ton about photoshop as I use gimp (open source freebie), which can split your palattes/editing tools off to another screen.

 

[Davidh373]

Do you guys recommend the whisper for this sort of build, or are their better cases for the price?

 

[jchu14]

That seems like an awful lot of money for a case. If you're going for quietness, a $80 case plus a $40 cooler will be much quieter than a $120 case and stock cooler. The 1050t coolers cools well enough at full speed but it also has a high pitched whine that can be heard across rooms (I am serious, I ran my 1055t with the stock cooler while waiting for my aftermarket cooler to arrive).

If you're looking for cooling and price, why not something like this Rosewill Destroyer for $45 that comes with three 120mm fans and have space for four more.

 

[Cerb]

If you're spending that much on a case, why not get an Antec Solo? It's tried and true, and well loved by quiet nuts and performance nuts alike, and will be a fine case to house future systems, up until ATX dies.

 

[Davidh373]

If you're spending that much on a case, why not get an Antec Solo? It's tried and true, and well loved by quiet nuts and performance nuts alike, and will be a fine case to house future systems, up until ATX dies.

Do you know for sure one 120mm fan will be cool enough? Not only is there one less fan and it has less space as it a mid-tower as opposed to the full-tower Whisper. I'm not necessarily a "Quite nut" as much as I am a "cooling nut," although a quite case would be a bonus.

Might do the destroyer, but that case seems like it's going to sound like a wind-tunnel. Plus there are a few reviews saying the electronics fried or it came beat up. I've not heard much good coming from this community about the cheaper rosewill cases.

 

[Cerb]

Do you know for sure one 120mm fan will be cool enough?

If not, then the Whisper won't keep it, cool, either. It has a single 120mm exhaust, with no intake options, from what I can see. Those extra fan(s) (1 included) don't do the CPU or video card one bit of good.

Not only is there one less fan and it has less space as it a mid-tower as opposed to the full-tower Whisper.

With the flipped design, and separated compartments, you have room for quite a few drives, but overall, there's not going to be much extra space. A great deal of the space is wasted.

While on that note, however, your video card's length could be an issue for choosing a case. You've got to fit both the card, and any auxilary power connectors.

I'm not necessarily a "Quite nut" as much as I am a "cooling nut," although a quite case would be a bonus.

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cases/2008/11/07/nzxt-whisper-review/4
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NZXT/Whisper/6.html

It just looks like they went, "hey, we should get something like that P180 those kids from California are selling," and stopped when they had something that looked similar.

If you want a larger case, with that kind of 'flipped' design, and drive cages, and sound killing features, the P183 isn't too much more (if buying from Newegg, FI, $15 more).

Some cheaper ones to look at, on top of the Solo, would be Antec's Sonata, and Cooler Master's Centurion 5 (CAC-T05), Gladiator 600, CM 690 II, and HAF 922 (and probably half a dozen more slightly different CM cases superior to their Elite series). Lian-Li's K58 and K60 look nice, too, but I haven't used them.

Might do the destroyer, but that case seems like it's going to sound like a wind-tunnel. Plus there are a few reviews saying the electronics fried or it came beat up. I've not heard much good coming from this community about the cheaper rosewill cases.

Rosewill is largely a rebrander of cheaper stuff, so there's not much consistency--except that most will come in black. One model will be good, yet another one complete crap. The Destroyer could be one of the good ones. As far as sounding like a wind tunnel, that's where a great big ol' heatsink, and a few quiet 120mm fans come in, using the the savings gained from going with such a case.

 

[Davidh373]

Some cheaper ones to look at, on top of the Solo, would be Antec's Sonata, and Cooler Master's Centurion 5 (CAC-T05), Gladiator 600, CM 690 II, and HAF 922 (and probably half a dozen more slightly different CM cases superior to their Elite series). Lian-Li's K58 and K60 look nice, too, but I haven't used them.

I like the look of the Gladiator. Would that fit the 460?

 

[Cerb]

I like the look of the Gladiator. Would that fit the 460?

With room to spare (or, to install or or swap PSUs without removing anything else). The GTX 460 should fit fine in any case that can have a full-depth ATX board installed in it, without having to remove parts.
http://www.coolermaster-usa.com/upload/product/2929/feature11.jpg
Card length: 210mm
I would also either add a rear exhaust fan, or block the rear exhaust grill, too, since it seems to only come with the top exhaust fan.

 

[Davidh373]

Alright, sounds good. Anything else?

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

Intel is worth the extra. I'd drop the SSD, get this case http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811119215 (CM 690II Basic), get an i7 930, sub $200 motherboard, and 6GB of ram. You could also go with an i7 860 if you don't mind the 1156 platform. You could get two 750GB Caviar Blacks for $60 each from newegg if 1.5TB is enough.

 

[Sp12]

Intel is worth the extra. I'd drop the SSD, get this case http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811119215 (CM 690II Basic), get an i7 930, sub $200 motherboard, and 6GB of ram. You could also go with an i7 860 if you don't mind the 1156 platform. You could get two 750GB Caviar Blacks for $60 each from newegg if 1.5TB is enough.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/147?vs=47

There is not a single scenario in which the i7 provided 45% better performance, and it was often worse in multithreaded benchmarks. That's before the additional cost of an Intel mobo. AM3 also holds greater longevity in that as software apps shift from mostly single to mostly multithreaded, the benchmarks are going to increasingly look better for the X6. The AM3 also has an ugpradepath to bulldozer.

Regardless, the SSD is going to end up saving more time overall than the processor in just about every scenario, before accounting for the comparable bang/buck of the AMD and Intel processor.

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

Phenom II X6 loses in almost every benchmark in that comparison and that was compared to a 920, not a 930. Socket 1366 will allow him to upgrade to the upcoming Core i7 990X. AM3 still hasn't been confirmed to support Bulldozer and we don't know how well it will perform or how much it will cost. SSDs aren't worth it now due to them being too expensive and unreliable, especially if is not an Intel drive. Again, Phenom II can't compete with the i series.

 

[Sp12]

Phenom II X6 loses in almost every benchmark in that comparison and that was compared to a 920, not a 930.

So add 5%, there is no 930 to compare to. And when you say losing, do you mean the single-threaded apps where it's ~4 seconds behind the i7? There's just no way to claim the i7 offers a better price/performance than that x6. Even in the single best case, Dragon Age (a singlethreaded game), it only offers ~30% more FPS. Even then it's been made clear he doesn't have the additional budget to spend.

Socket 1366 will allow him to upgrade to the upcoming Core i7 990X.

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Extreme-.../dp/B00143O62K

Extreme Edition processors take 5+ years to go down in price. Not a viable upgrade path :/

AM3 still hasn't been confirmed to support Bulldozer and we don't know how well it will perform or how much it will cost.

While true, we can be pretty sure it'll beat an i7. We know Ontraio/IGP bulldozer will get a new socket for small form factors (new socket for the IGP), but there's no reason for workstation class chips to move sockets.

SSDs aren't worth it now due to them being too expensive and unreliable, especially if is not an Intel drive.

Ummm no. An SSD is the single largest upgrade you can make. I don't know if you've never used one, but they're up to ~250x faster than a mechanical hard disk in things like access time/random reads. Definitely worth it, and Anand agrees. While expensive, I would always pick a Phenom x6+SSD over an i7 without.

Again, Phenom II can't compete with the i series.

No, but it gets pretty close, as Nahalem is only ~15-20% better per clock in most apps. Add in the fact that the X6 has 50% more cores, and it actually does better in multithreaded apps. P2 primarily competes on a price/performance basis.

 

[mfenn]

Phenom II X6 loses in almost every benchmark in that comparison and that was compared to a 920, not a 930. Socket 1366 will allow him to upgrade to the upcoming Core i7 990X. AM3 still hasn't been confirmed to support Bulldozer and we don't know how well it will perform or how much it will cost. SSDs aren't worth it now due to them being too expensive and unreliable, especially if is not an Intel drive. Again, Phenom II can't compete with the i series.

I see that Sp12 has already thoroughly rebutted most of your nonsense, but the bolded statement is just hilarious. You do realize the the RealSSD C300 is one of the fastest SSDs on the market right now?

Anyway, the extra cost of the X58 build is simply not worth it for people who actually have a finite budget.

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

The take away point is that compared to Penryn, Phenom II is slower clock-for-clock. The gap grows with Nehalem; Phenom II only gets close in older game engines, while the rest of the time Nehalem is 30-60% faster at the same clock speed.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2702/4

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Extreme-.../dp/B00143O62K

Extreme Edition processors take 5+ years to go down in price. Not a viable upgrade path :/

You are showing the most expensive EE part ever made that doesn't even work on the consumer LGA 775 socket. The 980X retails for $1000 or less at Frys and will drop when the 990X arrives.

While true, we can be pretty sure it'll beat an i7. We know Ontraio/IGP bulldozer will get a new socket for small form factors (new socket for the IGP), but there's no reason for workstation class chips to move sockets.

How so? Phenom II competes clock for clock with Kentsfield, which came out in 2006. You can't assume Bulldozer will work with AM3, so until it's confirmed you can't say socket AM3 gives an upgrade path.

Ummm no. An SSD is the single largest upgrade you can make. I don't know if you've never used one, but they're up to ~250x faster than a mechanical hard disk in things like access time/random reads. Definitely worth it, and Anand agrees. While expensive, I would always pick a Phenom x6+SSD over an i7 without.

Weren't you just talking about bang/buck? He would be spending $160 for a 64GB drive versus $60 for a 750GB. Also, Anand had that drive and it bricked itself.

No, but it gets pretty close, as Nahalem is only ~15-20% better per clock in most apps. Add in the fact that the X6 has 50% more cores, and it actually does better in multithreaded apps. P2 primarily competes on a price/performance basis.

Refer back to first response.