It isn't the material I mind so much as having my whole foot encased. These look like I can still grip the board with them, that will minimize the "disconnected feeling" I get from booties.
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Vibram Five Fingers
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SociallyChallenged
Elite
Ah, gotcha. Makes sense.
On a side note, I tried mine out today and they are pretty neat. Running in them was interesting (check my newest post) and squatting in them was great. My balance was complimented by the subtle actions of my toes and I didn't lose my balance at all. Overall, I liked them. I'll continue working out in them and work my way up to some jogs/running workouts.
check out this t nation article. he mentions wearing the vibrams. seems there are quite a few people out there who wear these when working out. i wear it on my leg days. http://www.t-nation.com/free_o...ques_youve_never_tried i'm still waiting on my vibram five fingers kso
StageLeft
No Lifer
No, but I've run a decent bit on very light shoes. Aquasocks for about $6 are also decent if you want a very minimalist shoe.
FWIW I got into the whole forefoot running thing for a while but mostly think it's a gimmick, at least as prescribed by its key evangelicals, especially since the majority of elite runners don't espouse it. For some people it does work, though.
I do think there is a lot to be said for minimalist shoes in general, though. A lot of people are scared of going from a "running" shoe to something else, despite much of the technology in running shoes being completely unproven (like the high-heel, being the main one).
FWIW I got into the whole forefoot running thing for a while but mostly think it's a gimmick, at least as prescribed by its key evangelicals, especially since the majority of elite runners don't espouse it. For some people it does work, though.
I do think there is a lot to be said for minimalist shoes in general, though. A lot of people are scared of going from a "running" shoe to something else, despite much of the technology in running shoes being completely unproven (like the high-heel, being the main one).
ubercaffeinated
Platinum Member
for you guys with second toes that are longer than the big toe... how does it fit?
SociallyChallenged
Elite
Fits fine. Haven't really had anything noticeable stem from it.
Also to GenHoth, they can handle those things just as well as any other shoe. I wouldn't really TRY to run over glass/nails/etc in any type of shoe, but the sole is thick enough for fairly thorough protection.
heres an article on tnation about barefoot working out. http://www.t-nation.com/free_o...refoot_to_get_stronger
i just got my vibram five finger kso from kayakshed.com and they are great. i wear them with slacks and nice shirt throughout the day now unless it rains. if you order the kso i would recommend measuring your feet from heel to big toe and ordering the size 1/4 above your foot measurement.
i just got my vibram five finger kso from kayakshed.com and they are great. i wear them with slacks and nice shirt throughout the day now unless it rains. if you order the kso i would recommend measuring your feet from heel to big toe and ordering the size 1/4 above your foot measurement.
I just put my Vibram Five Fingers Classic Mens Size 41 (US shoe size 9 to 9 1/2) up for sale in the For Sale forum in case anyone is interested since I figured more people would be interested in this forum. Vibram For Sale
I just got myself a pair of Vibram FiveFingers KSO today and tried them out with some POSE running. I know it'll take my feet a while to adapt to these, so I really took it easy and just did two very easy 800m runs on an olympic track. It's so odd feeling the world under your feet, as well as having your toes separated, but I have to admit that I really enjoyed it. On the way home, I intentionally walked on a bunch of random surfaces (grass, sidewalk, gravel, dirt, etc) just to see what they felt like. I also found that trying to do POSE - at least what I understand of it - became much easier/natural since landing on your heels in VFF's is very punishing. It was a very fun experience and I'm looking forward to using these more.
roguerower
Diamond Member
What's the chances of stubbing ones toes with these?
And does anyone have that link for the REI mailing list? All I can find is their membership which costs $20.
And does anyone have that link for the REI mailing list? All I can find is their membership which costs $20.
You can sign up for their newsletter on the bottom rightThe toes are protected by rubber so you don't to worry about it.
roguerower
Diamond Member
Thanks for the reply, but they didn't have my size. Bought a pair of Black KSOs from kayakshed...will review when I get
The underside of the toes have the same puncture proof material that the rest of the sole is made from, so there's not much worry of just stepping on a random sharp object. As for just slamming your foot into a random object along the way... I guess it's no more likely than when you're wearing shoes. When you're running, your toes aren't exactly flailing about, so I can't say I ever felt like I was in danger of stubbing them. Just watch where you're going like you always should and you'll be fine.
It is worth mentioning that having the toes separated feels a bit weird, but once you're used to it is kind of fun. In fact, when running up hill, I could feel my toes somewhat digging into the ground for better traction, which was pretty cool.
Question: is there some special technique, either specifically for the VFF's or for POSE in general, for running on a treadmill?
As part of the process of getting my feet used to the VFF's and POSE, I ran an easy mile on the treadmill today. It seemed that when my foot would strike the track, the backwards motion of it would pull the VFF back on my foot a bit, which was creating discomfort on my pinky toe. This did not happen at all when I ran a mile outside the other day, so I'm guessing that I'm doing something wrong on the treadmill. I'm definitely landing mid foot and pulling my foot back with my hamstrings as I did before. The rest of my body feels just fine, but my pinky toes feel like they are getting jammed. Any ideas?
As part of the process of getting my feet used to the VFF's and POSE, I ran an easy mile on the treadmill today. It seemed that when my foot would strike the track, the backwards motion of it would pull the VFF back on my foot a bit, which was creating discomfort on my pinky toe. This did not happen at all when I ran a mile outside the other day, so I'm guessing that I'm doing something wrong on the treadmill. I'm definitely landing mid foot and pulling my foot back with my hamstrings as I did before. The rest of my body feels just fine, but my pinky toes feel like they are getting jammed. Any ideas?
SociallyChallenged
Elite
That's surprising. I actually have the complete opposite. I went running for about 2-2.5 miles outside and my pinky toe was sore afterward while on the treadmill, I have no problems at all. It may be where you strike on the middle of your foot. If you hit most of the weight on the outside of your foot instead of distributing it throughout the ball, then that may contribute. I don't know why there would be a difference between treadmill and regular running though. Hrm.
Just found this article on POSE treadmill running which explains some of the differences. I'll try these tips out and see if I fare any better today.
Update: ran two miles with VFF's/POSE today on the treadmill and had some mixed results. The first mile went very well: no issues with my pinkies and I felt light and comfortable on my feet. Along with the tips in the page I linked above, I found this video with Dr. Romanov to be pretty helpful. The second mile, which I did at the end of my workout after 100 pull-ups, 200 push-ups and 300 squats, was a lot worse. However, this was likely because I was too exhausted to maintain proper form. I found that this time I had the opposite issue: my big toe was landing oddly and I ended up with a painful blister on it. Hopefully, with more practice, these issues will go away.
I am an avid fan of the VFF's. I purchased the Classic's last year around the middle of April right from the Vibram website. I also purchased 3 pairs of Injinjis from the REI website. I had done some reading prior and thought I would give the barefoot / almost barefoot running a try. (I was starting to get pains in the hips and knees.) I knew the first week would be tough, I cut back on the mileage from ~ 40 to around 15-20 in a week. My calves were very sore by the end of the first week. I knew to expect this though. After that the soreness started going away as my calves adjusted to running differently. I land with the balls/mid foot and let the heel compress down to the ground and then lift up again. The heel does not make hard contact though, just a light grazing. I also make the attempt to keep the toes up. The zen concept of the landing is to think that you should be pulling up your foot as it is landing. You will push off from the ground and this is where the seperated toes really comes in handy. (I try to focus on the flexion as I push off with the toes). It took me about 5 weeks of running in the VFF's to get back to a speed that I was comfortable with and was comparable to prior to using them. I ran in them almost every day except when I took a real barefoot day. (I even did some barefoot completely on concrete/blacktop, can anyone say ouchie.) The VFF's were not meant to do that much roadwork. They will wear out quicker. Within another month I was running just as quick in the VFF's as I was in sneakers beforehand. But now my calves and feet were stronger. I did start doing something unwise, I tried to change my foot landing to try and compensate for an old ankle/foot injury. I wound up getting a stress fracture and was out of running for 5 weeks. (Do not drastically try to change your natural pronation/supination.)
Luckily I had swimming to keep me going (you can swim with the legs isolated). I was back to running the day the doctor said all better. I now wear an ace compression bandage during every run (just in case I slightly twist the ankle, it helps to stabilize the ankle).
I have since the fracture changed to running hard runs with sneakers on pavement and easy runs with VFF's on grass/trails. I did not use the VFF's during December-February due to cold. I am enjoying using them as everyday walking footwear and easy run footwear. I did adopt my sneaker running to landing the same way ( or as close as possible ) as when using VFF's. I have noticed that I do not get the calf soreness anymore. I even did a 7 mile run with them on and did not notice any soreness. I will caution that stones will hurt, the rubber sole only protects so much.
In regards to arch support, for running and walking the arch support comes from the arch of the foot itself where it should be coming from. (I actually had someone ask me this when wearing them, the person said "What supports your arch?", my answer was simple, the Arch.) I have not disavowed sneakers, as I do use them, but I think the foot has become lazy with modern footwear and getting back to a more natural footwear would be beneficial for most people.
My fastest 5K time with the VFF's to date is 20:08, that was in mid July of 2008. If or when I do another 5K with the VFF's on I will post the time.
Fastest 5K time from last year was 19:50 with sneakers (fastest I could run after that was 20:08 with sneakers).
Current fastest 5K time is 19:11. (Expect to be around 18:40 this weekend.)
I really put on some speed after the stress fracture. I am shooting for 17:30 - 17:45 by October of this year.
Luckily I had swimming to keep me going (you can swim with the legs isolated). I was back to running the day the doctor said all better. I now wear an ace compression bandage during every run (just in case I slightly twist the ankle, it helps to stabilize the ankle).
I have since the fracture changed to running hard runs with sneakers on pavement and easy runs with VFF's on grass/trails. I did not use the VFF's during December-February due to cold. I am enjoying using them as everyday walking footwear and easy run footwear. I did adopt my sneaker running to landing the same way ( or as close as possible ) as when using VFF's. I have noticed that I do not get the calf soreness anymore. I even did a 7 mile run with them on and did not notice any soreness. I will caution that stones will hurt, the rubber sole only protects so much.
In regards to arch support, for running and walking the arch support comes from the arch of the foot itself where it should be coming from. (I actually had someone ask me this when wearing them, the person said "What supports your arch?", my answer was simple, the Arch.) I have not disavowed sneakers, as I do use them, but I think the foot has become lazy with modern footwear and getting back to a more natural footwear would be beneficial for most people.
My fastest 5K time with the VFF's to date is 20:08, that was in mid July of 2008. If or when I do another 5K with the VFF's on I will post the time.
Fastest 5K time from last year was 19:50 with sneakers (fastest I could run after that was 20:08 with sneakers).
Current fastest 5K time is 19:11. (Expect to be around 18:40 this weekend.)
I really put on some speed after the stress fracture. I am shooting for 17:30 - 17:45 by October of this year.
roguerower
Diamond Member
Ordered my KSOs Monday night but chose regular shipping so I won't recieve them until Tuesday of next week. Looking forward to trying them out.
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