Verizon increases SMS Rates

[sciencewhiz]

Originally posted by: Raduque

And if anybody thinks I'm going to let them out of a contract because text rates are going up, well, think again. VZW, like all carriers reserve the right to change your contract at any time, it's right there if you bothered to read the contract. If they give you notice (which we do, it's on your bill, again if you bothered to read past the "amount due" line), they can legally change your contract pretty much at any time.

From the current Verizon Customer Agreement at http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/glob...T&jspName=footer/customerAgreement.jsp

Our Rights To Make Changes
Your service is subject to our business policies, practices, and procedures, which we can change without notice. UNLESS OTHERWISE PROHIBITED BY LAW, WE CAN ALSO CHANGE PRICES AND ANY OTHER CONDITIONS IN THIS AGREEMENT AT ANY TIME BY SENDING YOU WRITTEN NOTICE PRIOR TO THE BILLING PERIOD IN WHICH THE CHANGES WOULD GO INTO EFFECT. IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE YOUR SERVICE AFTER THAT POINT, YOU'RE ACCEPTING THE CHANGES. IF THE CHANGES HAVE A MATERIAL ADVERSE EFFECT ON YOU, HOWEVER, YOU CAN END THE AFFECTED SERVICE, WITHOUT ANY EARLY TERMINATION FEE, JUST BY CALLING US WITHIN 60 DAYS AFTER WE SEND NOTICE OF THE CHANGE.

 

[Raduque]

Originally posted by: sciencewhiz

From the current Verizon Customer Agreement at http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/glob...T&jspName=footer/customerAgreement.jsp

Our Rights To Make Changes
Your service is subject to our business policies, practices, and procedures, which we can change without notice. UNLESS OTHERWISE PROHIBITED BY LAW, WE CAN ALSO CHANGE PRICES AND ANY OTHER CONDITIONS IN THIS AGREEMENT AT ANY TIME BY SENDING YOU WRITTEN NOTICE PRIOR TO THE BILLING PERIOD IN WHICH THE CHANGES WOULD GO INTO EFFECT. IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE YOUR SERVICE AFTER THAT POINT, YOU'RE ACCEPTING THE CHANGES. IF THE CHANGES HAVE A MATERIAL ADVERSE EFFECT ON YOU, HOWEVER, YOU CAN END THE AFFECTED SERVICE, WITHOUT ANY EARLY TERMINATION FEE, JUST BY CALLING US WITHIN 60 DAYS AFTER WE SEND NOTICE OF THE CHANGE.

Yes, but unless you IMMEDIATELY stop using any and all vzw-related services after receiving the notice on your next bill, you're effectively accepting the changes.

 

[Platypus]

Originally posted by: GeekDrew

Originally posted by: Platypus
This is bullsh!t, verizon already has ridiculous restrictions. I'm switching to Cingulair after my contact is up.... it just sucks because they have the best coverage around here.

I agree that they lock their phones down way too much, but other than that, is there anything else horrible about them?

<shrug> I'm a relatively captive audience. Verizon is the only carrier that comes close to working well in my area, and in most other areas that I travel to. They probably know that their network is more valuable to me (and many others) than even 2x the price I'm currently paying. Their coverage is infinitely more valuable to me than a phone. I'd rather a crappy phone work well than a wonderful phone not work, or work poorly.

And for everyone else, it didn't take me long to find this link, and it may explain things somewhat clearer for you:

http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/glob...?contentType=Legal%20Notice&textId=122

They disable every useful feature possible with their ridiculous firmware tweaks. The first Verizon phone to allow unlocked Bluetooth that I can recall just came out a few weeks ago, the LG EnV or w/e. That is insane considering everyone I know on other carriers never have problems with this. That phone is a giant scam because there's no unlimited SMS plan but everything cool you can do on that phone requires lots of text messaging.

They treat their customers like absolute crap, which most carriers probably do, but Verizon is by far the worst for nickle and diming the sh!t out of you.

Case in point, the only way to get pictures and ringtones that you don't want to pay $2.99 for each time for one year's pleasure of use, you had to email them to your phone or vice versa.. well apparently they 'updated' their network to disallow your phone from receiving pictures and music. People obviously flipped out and Verizon of course denied that their update caused this, which I had to force out of the operator because at first she denied they did anything at all... and thus they offered a 'fix' that you had to call and ask them to push out to your phone, just to receive messages again.

Their network is the best in this area which is the only reason I'm still with them as a carrier but I'm getting really tired of getting raped for services that should cost way less than they do.

 

[jersiq]

The company is screwing me?

It's simple Supply and Demand economics. And for those asking "how much does it take to send a text message?", why don't you look it up?

 

[QueBert]

I have Verizon, they charge too damn much. Thought I would pass along some info I read on howards forums, I don't have the link *sorry* but the dude who posted said if you have the unlimited data plan on a PDA/Smartphone and call Verizon CS you can get 300 text messages a month for free. I know a lot of people who pay the 4.99 for texting, could save a few people a few bucks. I was skeptical when I read this as I never remember Verizon giving me anything for free. But it's something worth looking into...

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Platypus
They treat their customers like absolute crap, which most carriers probably do, but Verizon is by far the worst for nickle and diming the sh!t out of you.

The free calls to any other VZW customer negates all of the nickel and diming for me. I don't even use any of my minutes ever because everyone I call has VZW. So no matter how much I use my phone, I can use their lowest plan.

 

[Platypus]

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: Platypus
They treat their customers like absolute crap, which most carriers probably do, but Verizon is by far the worst for nickle and diming the sh!t out of you.

The free calls to any other VZW customer negates all of the nickel and diming for me. I don't even use any of my minutes ever because everyone I call has VZW. So no matter how much I use my phone, I can use their lowest plan.

That's nice if you only call VZW customers, I wish I was so fortunate :\

 

[Reckoner]

Huge YMMV regarding whether you can get out of your contract or not. They're basically copying Cingular and Sprint with these increases.

Thread of Note Regarding the Cingular SMS increase fiasco

 

[Inspector Jihad]

YESSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[SketchMaster]

Originally posted by: Platypus
They disable every useful feature possible with their ridiculous firmware tweaks. The first Verizon phone to allow unlocked Bluetooth that I can recall just came out a few weeks ago, the LG EnV or w/e. That is insane considering everyone I know on other carriers never have problems with this.

...

Their network is the best in this area which is the only reason I'm still with them as a carrier but I'm getting really tired of getting raped for services that should cost way less than they do.

I too am pissed about how much my Razor was neutered when I really started playing with it. "Oh you want to take the pictures off that you took? You need our overpriced software to do that."

 

[BeauJangles]

I don't understand, yeah the increases suck but do you have any idea how much it costs them to provide "free" calling after 9 pm or over weekends? Or how much it costs them to provide you with a cell phone free with a contract? The cellular business is brutal. No argument that they are price gouging in this case, but it balances out if you look at what they provide for free.

 

[Inspector Jihad]

so what do i have to do to get out of the contract?

 

[GeekDrew]

Yeah, it is annoying that they restrict some phone features... but I view those as a much lower priority than being able to communicate. But that's just me.

 

[Inspector Jihad]

Originally posted by: BlinderBomber
I don't understand, yeah the increases suck but do you have any idea how much it costs them to provide "free" calling after 9 pm or over weekends? Or how much it costs them to provide you with a cell phone free with a contract? The cellular business is brutal. No argument that they are price gouging in this case, but it balances out if you look at what they provide for free.

telecoms make absurd amounts of money.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Inspector Jihad

Originally posted by: BlinderBomber
I don't understand, yeah the increases suck but do you have any idea how much it costs them to provide "free" calling after 9 pm or over weekends? Or how much it costs them to provide you with a cell phone free with a contract? The cellular business is brutal. No argument that they are price gouging in this case, but it balances out if you look at what they provide for free.

telecoms make absurd amounts of money.

Telecoms have been hurting for a few years now.

 

[getbush]

I'd like to take this space to remind everyone that a lot of the bullshit terms we agree to everyday will not actually hold up in court. Companies like to make a bunch of sh|t up in their terms but if certain things were actually challenged they would be thrown out.

end PSA

I'd like to add that if raduque posts again in this thread he agrees to let me garnish a portion of his punk phone retailer wages as I see fit from here until all eternity. Thems the terms.

 

[Reckoner]

Cingular made record profits of $847 million last quarter. They aren't hurting.

 

[James Bond]

Nvm

 

[Parasitic]

Also Cingular just changed their arbitration cause to prevent customers from suing them in court.


Edit: by agreeing to pay associated arbitration costs.

 

[Pepsi90919]

you have to pay to RECEIVE text messages? lol

 

[blurredvision]

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919
you have to pay to RECEIVE text messages? lol

That's what I always hated about text messaging.

Most everyone in this thread it right, though, about the nickle and diming bullsh|t, but what can we do about it? I don't text much at all, because I'm more of a person to actually use my phone for it's primary use. Only when I want to make one comment without the commitment to a conversation . I send/receive about 10 texts a month at most.

I'm with Cingular, by the way, who, like said before, are also raising their text pricing to $0.15 per, starting on Jan 27th I believe.

 

[fleshconsumed]

roflamo this is ridiculous. It costs next to nothing to provide sms messaging, it should be provided complete free of charge as an extra perk for signing the plan. Yet cell phone companies capitalize on young teenagers who can secretly send sms messages in class.

Here's quick run down on the costs of sms messaging vs talking on the phone.

Assuming sms message is 160 characters long (which it never is btw), and assuming it's using ASCII encoding at 7 bits per character entire message is 160*7 = 1120 bits long. So the final price per bit is 15cents/1,120bits.

If my memory serves me right, a typical voice stream over cellular network is 3-7kbps with newer codecs being at the lower range by severely mauling sound quality. We'll assume that the rate is 5Kbps at which point in one minute your phone transfers 5000bits*60seconds = 300,000 bits

Now the average price per minute of talk (and I'm approximating here) is 5 cents a minute if you're subscribing to a plan so the final cost of voice stream is 5cents/300,000bits

See where I'm heading with it.

Now if we divide the cost per bit of data of sending sms message vs. talking on the phone we will learn just how much more expensive sending sms message vs talking on the phone really is...

So...

x = (15/1120)/(5/300000)

x = 803

So it is 803 times more expensive for the cellular networks to keep voice traffic flowing than transfer sms message. This also means that the consumer is getting ripped off by a factor of 800 when sending sms message.



RIPOFF!!!


And I know it's convenient to send an sms message instead of calling because recipient may not pick up his phone and when he does the message will be there. However, next time just leave a voice message, surely you can say everything you could type in one sms message in under one minute. So it will cost you and recipient only 5 cents instead of 15.

 

[jersiq]

Originally posted by: fleshconsumed
roflamo this is ridiculous. It costs next to nothing to provide sms messaging, it should be provided complete free of charge as an extra perk for signing the plan. Yet cell phone companies capitalize on young teenagers who can secretly send sms messages in class.

Here's quick run down on the costs of sms messaging vs talking on the phone.

Assuming sms message is 160 characters long (which it never is btw), and assuming it's using ASCII encoding at 7 bits per character entire message is 160*7 = 1120 bits long. So the final price per bit is 15cents/1,120bits.

If my memory serves me right, a typical voice stream over cellular network is 3-7kbps with newer codecs being at the lower range by severely mauling sound quality. We'll assume that the rate is 5Kbps at which point in one minute your phone transfers 5000bits*60seconds = 300,000 bits

Now the average price per minute of talk (and I'm approximating here) is 5 cents a minute if you're subscribing to a plan so the final cost of voice stream is 5cents/300,000bits

See where I'm heading with it.

Now if we divide the cost per bit of data of sending sms message vs. talking on the phone we will learn just how much more expensive sending sms message vs talking on the phone really is...

So...

x = (15/1120)/(5/300000)

x = 803

So it is 803 times more expensive for the cellular networks to keep voice traffic flowing than transfer sms message. This also means that the consumer is getting ripped off by a factor of 800 when sending sms message.



RIPOFF!!!


And I know it's convenient to send an sms message instead of calling because recipient may not pick up his phone and when he does the message will be there. However, next time just leave a voice message, surely you can say everything you could type in one sms message in under one minute. So it will cost you and recipient only 5 cents instead of 15.

Large assumption concerning whether or not a voice call and an SMS have the same backhaul from the perspective of the provider.

A voice call does not equal a text message.

 

[fleshconsumed]

Originally posted by: jersiq
Large assumption concerning whether or not a voice call and an SMS have the same backhaul from the perspective of the provider.

A voice call does not equal a text message.

I didn't know anyone was still on analog network. It's all digital now, it doesn't matter if you're talking or sending sms message, it's all zeros and ones.

 

[oogabooga]

I pay 5 bucks for 250 text messages... and will continue to do so?

People are willing to pay for texting, why not let them. I didn't sign up for VZW cause they gave me the best price, but cause it works damn near everywhere for me. Not that other companies don't nickel and dime you.