Valedictorian's Speech About Christ Prompts Controversy

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune

Of course the original meaning to that was to keep the state out of the church, not the church out of the state. This wasn't a public school matter. It was a student giving a speech. No different than those people who get on a box and shout the world is gonna end. They are on a public sidewalk aren't they?

People need to get a thicker skin and quit whining everytime they hear something they don't like.

You got it backwards... It's to keep church out of state. On the speech, well, she got her chance to say something she believes in. Doesn't mean you have to follow suit. You do have to listen since you chose to stay.

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Bull fscking sh!t. A commencement is no place for your stupid religious bullsh!t. :|

Freedom of speech anyone? I don't think she should have done it, but it is well within her right to. It is also well within the rights of the people present to tune her out.

 

[Canai]

Originally posted by: TallBill
I would have got up and walked out.

qft

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It's not that it's public.. It's that it's a government institution. Keep your religion out of my government, or get out of this country.

Big difference between the school officials talking about religion vs a student doing it.

 

[sdifox]

I just want to remind the people who want to burn her the following quote about Freedom of Expression.

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. ~Voltaire

 

[dandruff]

:laugh:

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Isla
LOL, it's a story out of Jacksonville, FL. That's how them folks are up there. You have to drive at least south to Tampa before you reach civilization again. It's not exactly a melting pot up there.

Heck, I got picked on for being a Catholic growing up here. If you weren't a white protestant, you could pretty much count on being considered 'less than'.

In a way, that was a good experience for me because it helped me to see how religion does little more than create 'us' and 'thems' based on ethnicity. Sad, really.

Funny you mention that. I grew up in an area that was largely Catholic and if you weren't a Catholic they didn't really care or bother you. I was raised Methodist but honestly I think religion is a load of horsesh!t.

 

[toekramp]

burrrrn

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune

Originally posted by: moshquerade
not really a fan of yours.

i don't mind conflicting views but when you have to add "Was that just a random blip from your butt or did you just say something?" or something to that effect in every post it gets old fast.

Well, you are free to overlook it. It's far better than flying off the hinge with every post I dislike like some other members *cough* Jules *cough* *cough* Witty, yet cliched remarks work so much better dontchathink?

And besides, you have been here long enough to know that one word posts are disagreeable with the rules here.

Relax and have a drink of whatever you like. Road of life is long, you already have enough detours to make, why stop for speed bumps?

They might if you made some.

 

[JS80]

Leftists believe in freedom of speech unless it's something they don't believe it.

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: JS80
Leftists believe in freedom of speech unless it's something they don't believe it.

I believe those are called hypocrites, not leftists.

 

[sdifox]

Question to all ATOTers. I am pretty sure this post belongs in P&N... As in News... Why is it here?

 

[KeithTalent]

Originally posted by: sdifox
Question to all ATOTers. I am pretty sure this post belongs in P&N... As in News... Why is it here?

Agreed, keep your chocolate out of my peanut butter!

KT

 

[imported_mitchnozka]

Too bad she did not read her BIBLE and realize that such a public exhibition of her "faith" is one of those steps to Hell.

St. Matthew, chapter six, read the whole thing.

I've read it. Still don't see the connection.

Much of that passage was directed towards the hypocrites of the time, who sought their own glory with public prayer, giving to the needy while showing off, etc. How does that relate in this instance?

Mitch

 

[dmcowen674]

Topic: Valedictorian's Speech About Christ Prompts Controversy

What controversy?

In America

Church=School

School=Church

 

[imported_mitchnozka]

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune

Originally posted by: Leros
I went to a small town graduation recently (public high school) and the ceremony included two prayers and every speech talked about God and Jesus. My friend and I were talking about during the ceremony and everybody around us gave us horrible looks like we were the devil.

It bothered me a bit, but there are so many Christians here that I have gotten used to being saturated with it.

And is it that sickening man? Look at what us Christians have to put up with here

Again, quoting a Mod:

"No. Deal with it."

AnandTech Modertator

I'm a Christian and there is no way I would want that to be the subject of a valedictorian's speech. It's not the right place. period.

What is the 'right' place? Why was the podium there the 'wrong' place?

Mitch

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: mitchnozka

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune

Originally posted by: Leros
I went to a small town graduation recently (public high school) and the ceremony included two prayers and every speech talked about God and Jesus. My friend and I were talking about during the ceremony and everybody around us gave us horrible looks like we were the devil.

It bothered me a bit, but there are so many Christians here that I have gotten used to being saturated with it.

And is it that sickening man? Look at what us Christians have to put up with here

Again, quoting a Mod:

"No. Deal with it."

AnandTech Modertator

I'm a Christian and there is no way I would want that to be the subject of a valedictorian's speech. It's not the right place. period.

What is the 'right' place? Why was the podium there the 'wrong' place?

Mitch

Because it was a captive audience that was not there for that purpose. They were there to see friends and family graduate from high school, not be lectured and preached to that they were going to go to hell unless they converted to a particular religious faith. It's inconsiderate actions like these that give Christians a bad name in the first place. She could have spent the whole time thanking her god for her acheivements and most of the audience would have just slept through it. But starting threatening fire and brimstone on the "infidels" and you cross a line. If they had wanted to hear that, they would have gone to church.

 

[imported_mitchnozka]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: mitchnozka

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune

Originally posted by: Leros
I went to a small town graduation recently (public high school) and the ceremony included two prayers and every speech talked about God and Jesus. My friend and I were talking about during the ceremony and everybody around us gave us horrible looks like we were the devil.

It bothered me a bit, but there are so many Christians here that I have gotten used to being saturated with it.

And is it that sickening man? Look at what us Christians have to put up with here

Again, quoting a Mod:

"No. Deal with it."

AnandTech Modertator

I'm a Christian and there is no way I would want that to be the subject of a valedictorian's speech. It's not the right place. period.

What is the 'right' place? Why was the podium there the 'wrong' place?

Mitch

Because it was a captive audience that was not there for that purpose. They were there to see friends and family graduate from high school, not be lectured and preached to that they were going to go to hell unless they converted to a particular religious faith. It's inconsiderate actions like these that give Christians a bad name in the first place. She could have spent the whole time thanking her god for her acheivements and most of the audience would have just slept through it. But starting threatening fire and brimstone on the "infidels" and you cross a line. If they had wanted to hear that, they would have gone to church.

Captive? I'm sure they were free to get up and leave if they so desired.

In summation, most of the comments on this topic here illustrate what Jesus said, that those who follow him will be mocked and persecuted, but that we (Christians) should rejoice if this happens.

Did you listen to the speech? I listened to it (albeit doing a couple things at the same time), and she mentions once that some will go to Heaven and some to Hell. If you don't believe in it, then it's no harm according to you.

Mitch

 

[KCfromNC]

Originally posted by: lupi
BTW, I hate to break it to you but state and local goverments have already been making rulings on the teaching of evolution/creation.

Yeah, and the courts have been consistently ruling that creationism is a religious belief which has no place being taught in public school classrooms. This goes against your peculiar interpretation of the establishment cause of the 1st amendment so I'm sure you'll have some way to explain how these republican-appointed activist judges don't know what they're doing.

 

[DrPizza]

lmao, a couple years ago, the salutatorian went off on some weird tangent and jokingly said that he was going to take over the world.

When the salutatorian did her speech, she said, "I'm sorry, Josh, but you're not going to take over the world. Mr. (me) is going to take over the world."

It's always nice to be mentioned by students during those two speeches. (about every other year for me.)

 

[jagec]

Not the right time or place, but are people so malleable that a single speech is going to permanently change their theology? And do we have a "right to comfort" in the constitution?

 

[sandorski]

Just to sum up what most of us object to: We don't deny her Right to say what she did. We just recognize it as tasteless and inappropriate to the occasion.

She had the opportunity to turn a joyous occasion into an opportunity to create a good lasting impression, then blew it and created the opposite. The religious mind is kinda funny though, as she probably doesn't even recognize her error and probably feels vindicated by all the attention this situation is receiving.

A few have tried to make it a Church/State issue, but they are wrong as this would never legally stand on such a charge. This was a simple "faux pas", aka Social Error.

"She had a right to say anything she wanted"---not really and if she was really really offencive school officials would have removed her from the stage. I think anyone here would go apeshit if she started talking about sending Jews to camps, for eg.

 

[Toasthead]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
I dont get all the fuss... again.. Everyone wants to fuss about something. If hearing those words "Jesus saves" causes you to melt or something then sure, it shouldn't be allowed. But comon people, no one died, no heads assploded, no one bled out the ears after hearing it. They are WORDS. Do you people have nothing else to bitch about than something someone else says? It's her speech. Let her say whatever the heck she wants. If you are so traumatized by the words that it might cause permanent scarring to what brain you have, then leave. That simple.

Separation of church and state. It was a public high school.

The uproar about this is notable, but nothing compared to the uproar that would have been if she made a speech proclaiming Islam as the path to salvation.

I would have personally walked out than be force fed any religious BS during a graduation ceremony at a public school.

This has nothing to do with seperation of church and state...do you even know what that means? In no way was the school promoting one religion over another. this was one students opinion.

 

[engineereeyore]

Originally posted by: mitchnozka
Captive? I'm sure they were free to get up and leave if they so desired.

In summation, most of the comments on this topic here illustrate what Jesus said, that those who follow him will be mocked and persecuted, but that we (Christians) should rejoice if this happens.

Did you listen to the speech? I listened to it (albeit doing a couple things at the same time), and she mentions once that some will go to Heaven and some to Hell. If you don't believe in it, then it's no harm according to you.

Mitch

Sure, they were free to leave. Leave a ceremony they came for because of a talk they didn't come for. :roll:

Fact of the matter is very simple. A person going to heaven or hell has absolutely no bearing on a graduation ceremony, therefore there was 100% zero need to have a talk that in no way, shape, or form correlated to anything that was going on. As I said before, if the person talking wishes to thank God or Christ for being able to graduate or for the day or whatever, fine. But as soon as you start lashing out judgments or discoursing his teachings, you've crossed the line.

Sad thing is, the girl doesn't have any freakin clue what's she talking about anyway.

 

[Leros]

Originally posted by: mitchnozka

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: mitchnozka

Originally posted by: moshquerade

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune

Originally posted by: Leros
I went to a small town graduation recently (public high school) and the ceremony included two prayers and every speech talked about God and Jesus. My friend and I were talking about during the ceremony and everybody around us gave us horrible looks like we were the devil.

It bothered me a bit, but there are so many Christians here that I have gotten used to being saturated with it.

And is it that sickening man? Look at what us Christians have to put up with here

Again, quoting a Mod:

"No. Deal with it."

AnandTech Modertator

I'm a Christian and there is no way I would want that to be the subject of a valedictorian's speech. It's not the right place. period.

What is the 'right' place? Why was the podium there the 'wrong' place?

Mitch

Because it was a captive audience that was not there for that purpose. They were there to see friends and family graduate from high school, not be lectured and preached to that they were going to go to hell unless they converted to a particular religious faith. It's inconsiderate actions like these that give Christians a bad name in the first place. She could have spent the whole time thanking her god for her acheivements and most of the audience would have just slept through it. But starting threatening fire and brimstone on the "infidels" and you cross a line. If they had wanted to hear that, they would have gone to church.

Captive? I'm sure they were free to get up and leave if they so desired.

In summation, most of the comments on this topic here illustrate what Jesus said, that those who follow him will be mocked and persecuted, but that we (Christians) should rejoice if this happens.

Did you listen to the speech? I listened to it (albeit doing a couple things at the same time), and she mentions once that some will go to Heaven and some to Hell. If you don't believe in it, then it's no harm according to you.

Mitch

How would you feel if some Muslim kid spoke about Islam at your graduation? It doesn't matter if you like it or not, its just not the time or place.