Valedictorian's Speech About Christ Prompts Controversy

Page 5 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

Madwand1

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2006
3,309
0
76
It was a good start, and then she got into the "I am a Christian" speech, as we've been through here ad nauseum.

http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...&STARTPAGE=7&FTVAR_FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear

We've heard it all before, and hearing it once again as declamation does nothing to strengthen the case for it. Nor does it really shock, as I'm sure the listeners have already heard it before and been shocked.

At this point it's trite, and repeating it as such weakens the case (if there is one remaining) of critical thought and discussion being taught in school, and moreover illustrates a position of spiritual poverty failing to associate anything meaningful to God-given life other than the supposed get out of hell free card of a particular peculiar faith.

The only sad thing is that the well-intentioned young woman didn't know any better, and was not taught any better. I guess that's not so sad after all, as perhaps in comparison to some others, her spiritual poverty is not the worst.
 

Bateluer

Lifer
Jun 23, 2001
27,730
8
0
Originally posted by: effowe
What kind of valedictorian speech is that? There is a time and place to preach, a public high school graduation is not one of them.

Seconded.
 

FDF12389

Diamond Member
Sep 8, 2005
5,234
7
76
Wait, lemme get this straight. A high schooler said something that could offend somebody or make them uncomfortable in front of a crowd!? Amazing, thats def newsworthy stuff right there. At my cousins HS grad ceremony someone mooned the crowd, didnt see that on the news.
 

miketheidiot

Lifer
Sep 3, 2004
11,060
1
0
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
I dont get all the fuss... again.. Everyone wants to fuss about something. If hearing those words "Jesus saves" causes you to melt or something then sure, it shouldn't be allowed. But comon people, no one died, no heads assploded, no one bled out the ears after hearing it. They are WORDS. Do you people have nothing else to bitch about than something someone else says? It's her speech. Let her say whatever the heck she wants. If you are so traumatized by the words that it might cause permanent scarring to what brain you have, then leave. That simple.
Separation of church and state. It was a public high school.

The uproar about this is notable, but nothing compared to the uproar that would have been if she made a speech proclaiming Islam as the path to salvation.

I would have personally walked out than be force fed any religious BS during a graduation ceremony at a public school.

Of course the original meaning to that was to keep the state out of the church, not the church out of the state. This wasn't a public school matter. It was a student giving a speech. No different than those people who get on a box and shout the world is gonna end. They are on a public sidewalk aren't they?

People need to get a thicker skin and quit whining everytime they hear something they don't like.

It's not that it's public.. It's that it's a government institution. Keep your religion out of my government, or get out of this country.

Apparently, you don't realize where many of the core values of our country originally came from...

roman and english common law?
 

senseamp

Lifer
Feb 5, 2006
35,787
6,197
126
She earned her right to speak about her imaginary God to everyone. While stupid, at least it was controversial, which is more than can be said about 99.999999999% of HS valedictorian speeches filled with boring idealist tripe that makes everyone in the room comatose after about 30 seconds.
 

mobobuff

Lifer
Apr 5, 2004
11,099
1
81
She used a Geico slogan for a quote in her commencement speech. A twenty minute speech. That's enough to tell you this chick is full of BS and that being intelligent is not required to graduate high school with a 4.0. All that is required is to be the sponge, absorbing anything you're told you should know. Just as she did with everything useless she absorbed in high school, she soaked up her inherited religion and, once sopping wet, decided to soak her audience with her polluted water.

All commencement speeches are usually mostly BS, but this one just happened to be 20 minutes long and entirely too preachy and pedantic.

People shouldn't be upset that it was about her views on religion, people should be upset that a mindless idiot like that is just the type of person that does well in our piss-poor educational system.
 

Siddhartha

Lifer
Oct 17, 1999
12,505
3
81
I am glad she found something that works for her.

But if I were there I would have gotten up and left. The world would be better place if people kept their religion to themselves.
 

Mill

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
28,558
3
81
She has a right to say what she wants as long as it didn't violate the guidelines of the event. If the Principal had said: "hey, this is a schoolwide belief and we are sponsoring her speech" then there would be a problem. She choose on her on free will to give a speech about religion.

None of you complaining have a legal leg to stand on. You can say you disagree with what she said, but that is about it. I disagree with things I hear all the time. Either I just ignore it, get up and move, turn off the TV, or walk away. Everyone had that choice. Not a single person was FORCED to listen to it. It was NOT school sanctioned.

If a Muslim, Jew, Buddhist, Atheist or a Pastafarian had wanted to get up there and say the same things I would defend their right as well.

Unless the speech is obscene, disruptive, or prevents education (which at a graduation it could not) it is allowed and free.

The guy from the Bong Hits for Jesus case is one such example that I would point to. He has a RIGHT to free speech.
 

iskim86

Banned
Jul 6, 2001
1,802
0
0
www.isaackim.org
Originally posted by: kedlav
Originally posted by: grrl
No one in the audience laughed?

Quote for truth. I always have laughed at evangelicals no matter where I meet them IRL

huh. now that i think about it, i probably laugh at them too. it's just not intentional so i don't remember it later on.

that or i see humor in everything
 

Isla

Elite member
Sep 12, 2000
7,749
2
0
LOL, it's a story out of Jacksonville, FL. That's how them folks are up there. You have to drive at least south to Tampa before you reach civilization again. It's not exactly a melting pot up there.

Heck, I got picked on for being a Catholic growing up here. If you weren't a white protestant, you could pretty much count on being considered 'less than'.

In a way, that was a good experience for me because it helped me to see how religion does little more than create 'us' and 'thems' based on ethnicity. Sad, really.

 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,703
11
81
Originally posted by: Mill
She has a right to say what she wants as long as it didn't violate the guidelines of the event. If the Principal had said: "hey, this is a schoolwide belief and we are sponsoring her speech" then there would be a problem. She choose on her on free will to give a speech about religion.

None of you complaining have a legal leg to stand on. You can say you disagree with what she said, but that is about it. I disagree with things I hear all the time. Either I just ignore it, get up and move, turn off the TV, or walk away. Everyone had that choice. Not a single person was FORCED to listen to it. It was NOT school sanctioned.

If a Muslim, Jew, Buddhist, Atheist or a Pastafarian had wanted to get up there and say the same things I would defend their right as well.

Unless the speech is obscene, disruptive, or prevents education (which at a graduation it could not) it is allowed and free.

The guy from the Bong Hits for Jesus case is one such example that I would point to. He has a RIGHT to free speech.

No one is saying what she did is illegal and should be jailed/sued. They're saying it was stupid. And it was.
 

shadow9d9

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
8,132
2
0
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
It's her right to freedom of speech. You aren't required to listen to it nor do most schools require attendance at graduation. If you can't ignore it for 17 minutes of your like then leave.

She earned the right to give a speech by being valedictorian. I, for one, am tired of the same speeches everyone gives..."It went way too fast...good times....blah blah blah" same ol' BS in everyone. At least she was original :D

I don't particularly care for her speech, I am Christian but I personally don't think its an effective setting to talk about religion. However, I would have no problem if someone chose to do so during their speech. And yes, that would apply to a muslim, buddist etc..valedictorian as well.

Most public schools have a moment of prayer to start out the ceremonies...they just try to get a person from multiple churches. I don't get all upset when the person giving the muslim prayer thanks Mohammed.

Freedom of speech does not apply here. If you knew anything about freedom of speech, you'd know that... but like many 5 year olds, people like to say "freedom of speech" without understanding the concept.

The school has the right to determine what is allowed and what isn't. If she went out on the street and said it, yes they would have the freedom.
 

shadow9d9

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
8,132
2
0
Originally posted by: PurdueRy
Originally posted by: Cuda1447
Here's the point guys. If this was a speech about ANY other religion, or lack of a religion - there would be a massive outrage. It just so happens that Christianity is given a pass in this country, and for no good reason. This is completely 100% unacceptable, just as it would be for a Muslim or Buddhist. And Im saying that coming from a Christian upbringing.

Why is it unacceptable? You have every right to leave, cover your ears, listen to music, etc. and ignore the speech if you like. It was her time to talk and she talked about what she wanted to. Again, I personally don't like the setting she chose to give this speech in, but its her choosing, not mine.

Oh, so they would have the right to scream out right? It is their "freedom of speech" to do so, right?
 

shadow9d9

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
8,132
2
0
Originally posted by: lupi
Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
What year is this? Last I checked, we have a separation of church and state, just like the other modern democracies.

Actually we have Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. I find it very disturbing that you don't even know your own constitution.

We don't have slavery anymore either, and women can vote!

Well goollleeee Mr. Pyle.

The fact that you even WANT religion to be a part of government is extremely disturbing.

Um, feel free to again read your constitution. And while doing it, perhaps you would enjoy the solace of the National Cathedral to read it in.

Take political science 101 before spouting uninformed nonsense.
 

shadow9d9

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
8,132
2
0
Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
Originally posted by: Cuda1447
Originally posted by: Googer
Originally posted by: yankeesfan
She worked hard enough for valedictorian, so let her say what she wants. She's probably had to hide her true beliefs in class to prevent her grades from being lowered by some radical atheist teachers, anyway.

"I think that was the most important thing to her, and I think she had the right to say it. She succeeded in becoming valedictorian, and that was her right," said attendee Carileen Bollinger.

:thumbsup:





So does that mean if I earn the right to be Val. I can get up there, give a speech about how Christians are ruining this country, they should all go to hell and need to convert to the "insert religion here" or suffer the consequences?


Hell no, not for 20 minutes and not at a public high school graduation ceremony.

Once again, I would say go right ahead. Sure, I would consider you full of crap, and wouldn't listen to a word you had to say, but you have every right to say it and I'd even try to stop a mobbing crowd coming upon you so you could say it. It's your right. I couldn't care less about what you say, but I'll defend to my last breath your right to say it.

Real world called.. It is wondering when you plan to drop by. You can't just say anything you want in a public place ..especially one controlled by a school. Stop talking ideologies.
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
0
Nothing like having to sit thru 20 mins of someone forcing their beliefs down your throat :roll:

You can very easily incorporate your beliefs in your speech and do it tactfully, but telling people to do jebus becaus they'll go to hell otherwise is just absurd. I would've left for sure.
 

thecoolnessrune

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2005
9,671
580
126
Originally posted by: shadow9d9
Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
Originally posted by: Cuda1447
Originally posted by: Googer
Originally posted by: yankeesfan
She worked hard enough for valedictorian, so let her say what she wants. She's probably had to hide her true beliefs in class to prevent her grades from being lowered by some radical atheist teachers, anyway.

"I think that was the most important thing to her, and I think she had the right to say it. She succeeded in becoming valedictorian, and that was her right," said attendee Carileen Bollinger.

:thumbsup:





So does that mean if I earn the right to be Val. I can get up there, give a speech about how Christians are ruining this country, they should all go to hell and need to convert to the "insert religion here" or suffer the consequences?


Hell no, not for 20 minutes and not at a public high school graduation ceremony.

Once again, I would say go right ahead. Sure, I would consider you full of crap, and wouldn't listen to a word you had to say, but you have every right to say it and I'd even try to stop a mobbing crowd coming upon you so you could say it. It's your right. I couldn't care less about what you say, but I'll defend to my last breath your right to say it.

Real world called.. It is wondering when you plan to drop by. You can't just say anything you want in a public place ..especially one controlled by a school. Stop talking ideologies.

Are you listening at all man? What I have been saying in nearly every post is wondering why people are fussing over such a little thing. You should have the right to say anything you want to say. It's just people like you and the rest of the forum get your panties so far up your asshole that you can only waddle around telling everyone how much of a bad mood they are in :p

As to the real world calling, tell him I'll stop by eventually, when he's taken a shower. Oh, and get me a soda while you're at it. Chop chop secretary, do something useful :p
 

DaShen

Lifer
Dec 1, 2000
10,710
1
0
Originally posted by: PottedMeat
Sure, she can say whatever she wants but if I were there my opinion of her would go way down.

Same.

I wouldn't mind saying that I was a Christian and that my beliefs had gotten me to where I was, and then maybe pointing out some of the fundamental beliefs of living honorably and treating others as yourself can take anyone far in life, but I wouldn't go into proselytizing for 20 minutes. Maybe just encourage the people to look ahead and look for ways to make a difference in society, but the 20 minute sermon is a little bit much.