V6 raw power

[Templeton]

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
The BMW 2.5 I6 takes up more space than the 5.7L LS1 V8.


Superior huh? The I6 wouldn't fit in any V6 engine bay. The V6 on the other hand will fit in any I6 engine bay.

Because v6s are generally transversally mounted.... FWD.

You can use V6s in both FWD, RWD and AWD applications. You can't say the same for I6s.

Sure I can. I6s can be used in all those applications. It's just that no one makes a FWD i6 because i6s are now only produced by good car companies, and those companies wouldn't touch FWD with a 10 foot inline 6 block.

Name one FWD or AWD car that has an I6. I can't think of any.

Volvo s80, fwd or awd I believe.

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Hell, I've hit the 122mph governor in the Civic. Takes forever, but it's doable. 😛

- M4H

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Templeton

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
The BMW 2.5 I6 takes up more space than the 5.7L LS1 V8.


Superior huh? The I6 wouldn't fit in any V6 engine bay. The V6 on the other hand will fit in any I6 engine bay.

Because v6s are generally transversally mounted.... FWD.

You can use V6s in both FWD, RWD and AWD applications. You can't say the same for I6s.

Sure I can. I6s can be used in all those applications. It's just that no one makes a FWD i6 because i6s are now only produced by good car companies, and those companies wouldn't touch FWD with a 10 foot inline 6 block.

Name one FWD or AWD car that has an I6. I can't think of any.

Volvo s80, fwd or awd I believe.

Yeah I was thinking that too, but after further investigation I found that the AWD has the i5. The Volvo XC90 has a turbocharged inline 6 with all wheel drive though.

So that's:
BMW 325xi
BMW 330xi
Volvo XC90
Chevrolet Trailblazer

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Sure I can. I6s can be used in all those applications. It's just that no one makes a FWD i6 because i6s are now only produced by good car companies, and those companies wouldn't touch FWD with a 10 foot inline 6 block.

Ahem - GM produces an I-6 for its midsize SUVs (albeit a rather coarse one), and they obviously make many, many FWD cars. Hell, Lexus also makes the FWD ES300.

 

[Wahsapa]

whenever you go over 120 mph its possible to flip your car in such a horrible way you never knew how it happened but your dead 1 min later, thats why its important to have a roll cage.... please be safe, just because your going fast doesnt mean your civic is ment to travel at that speed(you can tell by how freakin loud it gets past 90+ in some of thoes lighter jdm cars)

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Don_Vito

Originally posted by: Nebor

Sure I can. I6s can be used in all those applications. It's just that no one makes a FWD i6 because i6s are now only produced by good car companies, and those companies wouldn't touch FWD with a 10 foot inline 6 block.

Ahem - GM produces an I-6 for its midsize SUVs (albeit a rather coarse one), and they obviously make many, many FWD cars. Hell, Lexus also makes the FWD ES300.

Oh man Nebor, you got pwned. 😀

Obviously my statement needs bit of tweaking, heh.

 

[acemcmac]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Doesn't matter if the Mustang V-6 is governed or not, it won't stay close enough to a V-8 'Stang to even read its license plate.

As far as V-6's in general, the definitive answer is, no, you can't build one to be better than a larger V-8 with the same type of mods done to it.
There's not even any debate, it just can't be done.

Sure, you can build a V-6 to be more powerful than a lesser-modified V-8, but as far as potential goes, the larger engine is ultimately capable of pumping more air, and that's what making power is all about.

Wait, are you saying "there's no replacement for".... what was that word.... Cheese fries?

No replacement for displacement. The larger engine ALWAYS will make more power, given the same type of mods.

I don't think that was in question, but mabye I read it wrong 😕

 

[Mookow]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
There are more factors than just the engine. Drag co-efficient, torque and gearing also make a huge difference in the top speed of your friends Mustang. I had a '94 Mustang with 3.73 rear gears and I had it up to 140 on the speedo once. I think the car was probably doing 130 really though due to speedo error. It had more in it though but not much. Air was howling around that thing at that speed, sounded like an airplace. Mustangs aren't the most slippery when it comes to moving through the air.

So torque is a factor not determined by the engine?

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Mookow

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
There are more factors than just the engine. Drag co-efficient, torque and gearing also make a huge difference in the top speed of your friends Mustang. I had a '94 Mustang with 3.73 rear gears and I had it up to 140 on the speedo once. I think the car was probably doing 130 really though due to speedo error. It had more in it though but not much. Air was howling around that thing at that speed, sounded like an airplace. Mustangs aren't the most slippery when it comes to moving through the air.

So torque is a factor not determined by the engine?

Negative, torque is mainly determined by cupholder spacing.

 

[TheLonelyPhoenix]

Jesus... I post tech support questions to this forum and I'm lucky to get 2 or 3 responses. I post a vaguely worded car question, and now everyone has an opinion. 🙂

Its amazing the monster threads one can create at 3 in the morning with idle curiousity...

 

[SSibalNom]

Originally posted by: TheLonelyPhoenix
I was recently discussing this with a friend: he claims that the RPM limiter/speed governor in his V6 mustang is the only reason he cant get his car up to speeds 140+ (his argument is that once he has full power and control, and lack of power up against a V8 is made up for in weight). I think that there's no way that any V6 can push hard enough to break 120 mph.... and even for that speed, you'd probably need two minutes to do it. Not to mention, a V6 mustang's maximum horsepower is fairly low for the size of the engine. I was wondering if anyone had any insight into what a V6 really can be capable of.

a v6 can hit 120 easily if its a quality v6, my old 300k mile j30t would hit 130 pretty easy, and 140 on a straightaway, 3.0L v6

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: dc
he meant this thread is about v6's not inline's.

The arrangement of the cylinders doesn't matter, the whole basis of the thread is about power and delivery (especially since the OP doesn't have the slightest clue about what he's talking about).

And the power and delivery of inline 6 cylinders and v6s is very different. V6s are crap compared to the inline 6, that's why all the civilized car brands still use them. 😉

The power is very different?!?!?!? Then why does BMW still use i6's that only output 180hp :thumbsdown: They vary just as much as V6's do.

There hasn't been a v6 engineered yet that's capable of matching up with BMWs i6.

BMW 330Ci: 225 HP/214lbs, mileage: 21/30
Honda Accord (3.0L V6): 240 HP/212lbs, mileage: 20/30

I'd gladly take 15 more horsepower and $10,000 off the sticker for for 2 less pound-feet of torque and 1 MPG in the city. Honda V6 > BMW I6. Of course, the 330Ci has RWD and i'm sure it's nicer inside. but i'd say the honda's got the better engine, and for less money.

The only bimmer I6 that can beat the V6's is the M3's 3.2. Unfortuantly, its competition has a 4.2L V8 making more power and torque, and AWD to boot. doh!

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Eli
It's not like you can lump all V6's together..

It's certainly possible for a well-designed V6 to be more powerful than a mediocre V8.

The old Buick 3.8L V6 used to be used in some Champ (CART) cars, back around 1990. 750hp NA. Used to be wierd to hear the distinctive low V6 growl alongside the high-pitched 2.8L turbo V8 screamers the other cars ran (at that time).

That said, my wee little 4-banger can break 140 mph and beyond. There's simply too many other factors involved besides just the # of cylinders and their arrangement.

 

[TechnoKid]

I read a while back on some other car forums that many cars' speedometers are not calibrated to good accuracy beyond say, 115MPH.

You should really use a GPS device to track your real speed when you wanna go that fast.

 

[DaiShan]

my '96 accord v6 has done 140+ (probably about 140 factoring in that the speedo is probably a bit off at that speed, it went past the 140 mark (the last recorded mark on the speedo) and the tach had about 600rpm's left. The v6 mustang has 200hp, I don't think he can do more than 140, maybe 135 or so, its a heavy car.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: thomsbrain

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: dc
he meant this thread is about v6's not inline's.

The arrangement of the cylinders doesn't matter, the whole basis of the thread is about power and delivery (especially since the OP doesn't have the slightest clue about what he's talking about).

And the power and delivery of inline 6 cylinders and v6s is very different. V6s are crap compared to the inline 6, that's why all the civilized car brands still use them. 😉

The power is very different?!?!?!? Then why does BMW still use i6's that only output 180hp :thumbsdown: They vary just as much as V6's do.

There hasn't been a v6 engineered yet that's capable of matching up with BMWs i6.

BMW 330Ci: 225 HP/214lbs, mileage: 21/30
Honda Accord (3.0L V6): 240 HP/212lbs, mileage: 20/30

I'd gladly take 15 more horsepower and $10,000 off the sticker for for 2 less pound-feet of torque and 1 MPG in the city. Honda V6 > BMW I6. Of course, the 330Ci has RWD and i'm sure it's nicer inside. but i'd say the honda's got the better engine, and for less money.

The only bimmer I6 that can beat the V6's is the M3's 3.2. Unfortuantly, its competition has a 4.2L V8 making more power and torque, and AWD to boot. doh!

How is the Accord's engine superior? It will lose in a drag race or around a track. Plus most people know how an Accord engine feels... bleh. A BMW engine is like an extension of your body.

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: thomsbrain

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: dc
he meant this thread is about v6's not inline's.

The arrangement of the cylinders doesn't matter, the whole basis of the thread is about power and delivery (especially since the OP doesn't have the slightest clue about what he's talking about).

And the power and delivery of inline 6 cylinders and v6s is very different. V6s are crap compared to the inline 6, that's why all the civilized car brands still use them. 😉

The power is very different?!?!?!? Then why does BMW still use i6's that only output 180hp :thumbsdown: They vary just as much as V6's do.

There hasn't been a v6 engineered yet that's capable of matching up with BMWs i6.

BMW 330Ci: 225 HP/214lbs, mileage: 21/30
Honda Accord (3.0L V6): 240 HP/212lbs, mileage: 20/30

I'd gladly take 15 more horsepower and $10,000 off the sticker for for 2 less pound-feet of torque and 1 MPG in the city. Honda V6 > BMW I6. Of course, the 330Ci has RWD and i'm sure it's nicer inside. but i'd say the honda's got the better engine, and for less money.

The only bimmer I6 that can beat the V6's is the M3's 3.2. Unfortuantly, its competition has a 4.2L V8 making more power and torque, and AWD to boot. doh!

How is the Accord's engine superior? It will lose in a drag race or around a track. Plus most people know how an Accord engine feels... bleh. A BMW engine is like an extension of your body.

You're not directly talking about the engine, an engine doesn't make you feel anything. The feedback you're getting is from the rest of the components of the car. The Honda's engine has also been voted one of the 10 best engines by Ward's.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: thomsbrain

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: dc
he meant this thread is about v6's not inline's.

The arrangement of the cylinders doesn't matter, the whole basis of the thread is about power and delivery (especially since the OP doesn't have the slightest clue about what he's talking about).

And the power and delivery of inline 6 cylinders and v6s is very different. V6s are crap compared to the inline 6, that's why all the civilized car brands still use them. 😉

The power is very different?!?!?!? Then why does BMW still use i6's that only output 180hp :thumbsdown: They vary just as much as V6's do.

There hasn't been a v6 engineered yet that's capable of matching up with BMWs i6.

BMW 330Ci: 225 HP/214lbs, mileage: 21/30
Honda Accord (3.0L V6): 240 HP/212lbs, mileage: 20/30

I'd gladly take 15 more horsepower and $10,000 off the sticker for for 2 less pound-feet of torque and 1 MPG in the city. Honda V6 > BMW I6. Of course, the 330Ci has RWD and i'm sure it's nicer inside. but i'd say the honda's got the better engine, and for less money.

The only bimmer I6 that can beat the V6's is the M3's 3.2. Unfortuantly, its competition has a 4.2L V8 making more power and torque, and AWD to boot. doh!

How is the Accord's engine superior? It will lose in a drag race or around a track. Plus most people know how an Accord engine feels... bleh. A BMW engine is like an extension of your body.

You're not directly talking about the engine, an engine doesn't make you feel anything. The feedback you're getting is from the rest of the components of the car. The Honda's engine has also been voted one of the 10 best engines by Ward's.

June's prefers the BMW engine.

 

[SilentZero]

Originally posted by: geno

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: dc
he meant this thread is about v6's not inline's.

The arrangement of the cylinders doesn't matter, the whole basis of the thread is about power and delivery (especially since the OP doesn't have the slightest clue about what he's talking about).

And the power and delivery of inline 6 cylinders and v6s is very different. V6s are crap compared to the inline 6, that's why all the civilized car brands still use them. 😉

The power is very different?!?!?!? Then why does BMW still use i6's that only output 180hp :thumbsdown: They vary just as much as V6's do.

180 is their lowest output I6, they range from 180 to 333HP 🙂 A base model 3 series doesn't need much more than that for someone who's just commuting. And you miss the point of what he said, he said the power delivery is different, not the peak power 😛

Its actually 343hp, its only the US spec M3 that has 333.

 

[SilentZero]

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
The BMW 2.5 I6 takes up more space than the 5.7L LS1 V8.


Superior huh? The I6 wouldn't fit in any V6 engine bay. The V6 on the other hand will fit in any I6 engine bay.

Because v6s are generally transversally mounted.... FWD.

You can use V6s in both FWD, RWD and AWD applications. You can't say the same for I6s.

Sure I can. I6s can be used in all those applications. It's just that no one makes a FWD i6 because i6s are now only produced by good car companies, and those companies wouldn't touch FWD with a 10 foot inline 6 block.

Name one FWD or AWD car that has an I6. I can't think of any.

I do believe the Nissan Skylines. The RB26DETT in the R34 is a I6 I believe, and it is AWD.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: SilentZero

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
The BMW 2.5 I6 takes up more space than the 5.7L LS1 V8.


Superior huh? The I6 wouldn't fit in any V6 engine bay. The V6 on the other hand will fit in any I6 engine bay.

Because v6s are generally transversally mounted.... FWD.

You can use V6s in both FWD, RWD and AWD applications. You can't say the same for I6s.

Sure I can. I6s can be used in all those applications. It's just that no one makes a FWD i6 because i6s are now only produced by good car companies, and those companies wouldn't touch FWD with a 10 foot inline 6 block.

Name one FWD or AWD car that has an I6. I can't think of any.

I do believe the Nissan Skylines. The RB26DETT in the R34 is a I6 I believe, and it is AWD.

Correct. Longitudinally-mounted 2.6L I6 twin-turbo AWD. 😀

For what it's worth, the Suzuki Verona has a tranversely-mounted 2.5L I6 FWD.

So there's both an AWD and a FWD I6 🙂

edit: oh yeah, almost forgot... the BMW 330xi has AWD with a 3.0L longitudinally-mounted I6.

 

[SSibalNom]

Originally posted by: SilentZero

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
The BMW 2.5 I6 takes up more space than the 5.7L LS1 V8.


Superior huh? The I6 wouldn't fit in any V6 engine bay. The V6 on the other hand will fit in any I6 engine bay.

Because v6s are generally transversally mounted.... FWD.

You can use V6s in both FWD, RWD and AWD applications. You can't say the same for I6s.

Sure I can. I6s can be used in all those applications. It's just that no one makes a FWD i6 because i6s are now only produced by good car companies, and those companies wouldn't touch FWD with a 10 foot inline 6 block.

Name one FWD or AWD car that has an I6. I can't think of any.

I do believe the Nissan Skylines. The RB26DETT in the R34 is a I6 I believe, and it is AWD.

r34 is i6, theres also some older car from nissan (i think its the 280sx) thats an i6

 

[Childs]

I've done 120MPH in 4 cyl 1997 Civic EX. Wasnt even pushing it hard, in fact, I didnt even really know I was going that fast. Slowed down because that's reckless driving throw you ass in jail speeds.

I would think any decent V6 should be able to go pass 140+MPH if the limiter is removed.

 

[BatmanNate]

My car has a mere 3.0 l6, with no governor, and it can hit 145 in stock form.

 

[Vic]

One last time, the # of cylinders and their arrangement has virtually nothing to do with a car's top speed. While "there is no replacement for displacement", that only applies if the engines are equally built. Otherwise, there are 4 cylinders out there more powerful than some V8's.
Gearing is another factor. And aerodynamics. Ever see a lifted 4x4 with a 500hp V8 with a top speed of 80 mph?

The whole "6 cylinder" thing is mostly manufacturer propaganda anyway. Suzuki's Verona (which I mentioned a couple posts above) has a 6 cylinder with less horsepower than a base model Camry's 4 cylinder. Yet every Suzuki commercial advertises its "powerful 6 cylinder engine".
Mazda used to sell a terrible little car, called the MX-3, with a 130 hp 1.8L V6. That's right, a V6 with the displacement and hp of a small/medium sized 4 cylinder.

Repeat after me: the number of cylinders does not matter.
Engine design, configuration, build, and displacement are more important. If a particular larger displacement requires more cylinders in order to maintain smoothness, that's one thing. But just having more cylinders means nothing in and of itself.

So let's stop with the "my 4 cylinder does 120 so a V6 must do 140" arguments...