UPDATED !!!MOBO/CPU Decision Help PLEASE !!!! UPDATED !!!

[shoRunner]

well since the price difference isn't that big, i'd go with it cause i always have more hard drive than i know what to do with and it also has raid5 which could be fun, i really doubt you'll keep it long enough to get a drive that needs sata2, or ever probably use the raid5, but you'll have the option. for the average user though i really don't think its worth the extra money.

*edit* average transfer rates for a raptor are under 80 MB/s

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: shoRunner
well since the price difference isn't that big, i'd go with it cause i always have more hard drive than i know what to do with and it also has raid5 which could be fun, i really doubt you'll keep it long enough to get a drive that needs sata2, or ever probably use the raid5, but you'll have the option. for the average user though i really don't think its worth the extra money.

*edit* average transfer rates for a raptor are under 80 MB/s

Thanks Sho !

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: shoRunner
well since the price difference isn't that big, i'd go with it cause i always have more hard drive than i know what to do with and it also has raid5 which could be fun, i really doubt you'll keep it long enough to get a drive that needs sata2, or ever probably use the raid5, but you'll have the option. for the average user though i really don't think its worth the extra money.

*edit* average transfer rates for a raptor are under 80 MB/s

There's a comment by a grooge over at this anandtech thread about the Soltek NForce 4 board and related topics that may interest you.

He states about nForce4 ULTRA that

Originally posted by: grooge"...There is no SATA2 HDD now and NCQ is not really a performance edge that even worth being mentionning. And about the firewall.. well, yeah. Still buggy in some area and incompatible with some router. So, no a big miss for me.

I wonder, does that mean that nForce 4 ULTRA (because of the built-in support for ActiveArmor firewall) may be incompatible with some broadband cable modems ???

That would be a BIG problem for me !!! :Q

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: wisdomtooth
...Also, the Fortron Blue Storm is not the best choice, not at that price. That PSU does not have active PFC and is not particularly quiet. And pray tell why do you need 15 amps on two rails if you are not building a mega-gaming machine? The only reason to get that much amps is if you are going to run an SLI rig....

You know what wisdom, I shouldn't be so hard on myself. No matter who you talk to you get a different opinion. Here's just some of the excellent reviews I found on the Fortron Source AX-500A Power Supply over here at cluboverclockers and over here at Hardwaremodz, AND over here at Short-Media AND over here at Silent PC Review AND even an excellent review on this Power Supply over at TOMS. The Fortron Source P/S company in general has received rave reviews at sites like InsaneTek, Xtreme Computing, AMD Review, ClubOC, HERE at ANANDTECH and at over 20 other PC websites worldwide.

I guess I didn't go with a really crappy P/S after all !

 

[Fisher999]

Guys I'm closer to making a mobo decision. May I ask your advice on the nForce4 ULTRA boards I am considering???

First, should I consider EITHER of these budget solutions? The ECS KN1 Extreme Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra or the BIOSTAR NF4UL-A9 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra ??? They both appear to have similar features and pretty good layouts. They each have a parallel port and 3 PCI slots along with the PCI-E slot. They BOTH have SATA 150 (SATA 300 on the ECS), onboard Gigabit LAN (the ECS actually has TWO onboard LANs - one is Gigabit, the other is 10/100Mbps), onboard Audio (6 and 8 channel respectively), onboard firewire and plenty of usb 2.0. I realize their quality may not be high nor their reliablity though. Actually, the BIOSTAR board looks warped in the photo, lol.

Then I thought, well why not step up to the this ASUS A8N-E Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra which (along with wonderful ASUS quality and good board layout) has the obligatory SATA150, onboard LAN, 8 channel audio, parallel (but no serial) port and plenty of USB 2.0. Then I realized it DOEN'T have onboard firewire. I realize I could get a PCI/firewire adapter card but that swallows up one of the PCI slots.

Now I will probably have no use for SLI but ASUS A8N-SLI Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI board doesn't sacrifice a PCI slot to add the additional PCI-E graphics slot, it has firewire, Gigabit LAN, onboard 8 channel Realtek audio, SATA 300 (not 150) and tons of USB 2.0 ports/headers.

The last two considerations are the MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra board and the GIGABYTE GA-K8N Ultra-9 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra board. (I ruled out the EPoX 9NPA+ Ultra because I don't like the placement of the P/S connector). Both the MSI and Gigabyte boards are quite similar. The MSI board has 4 PCI slots, SATA 300, 2 Gigabit LANs, 8 channel Realtek audio, plenty of USB 2.0 and onboard firewire. The Gigabyte has one less PCI slot (3) but has two Gigabit LANs, 2 firwires, and everything else is very similar to the MSI.

What is your opinion of these options ???

Again, your opinions would be greatly appreiated.

Thanks,

Greg

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: the wombat
I would go for:
1) OCZ Modstream
2) K8N Neo4 Platinum
3) Athlon 64 3000+
4) 2 512mb CVS sticks
5)That x700 that you wanted i guess
6) XP Home, or Pro I guess

That looks similar to my system, and I havent had any problems yet.

Wombat, thanks for your suggestions.

I am definetly goning with the Athlon64 3000+ Winchester 939 and possible the MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum motherboard. The motherboard decision is my "holdout" right now. BTW, I have already ordered the Asus/Radeon x700 PCI-E videocard along with 1 GB of Patriot 2-3-2-4 DDR400 and a Fortron Source AX500 A P/S.

Thanks Again,

Greg

 

[shoRunner]

i'd go with the MSI, or if you want a cheaper solution the ecs(yeah i'll get flamed for that one). i haven't seen a bad review for the ECS and they are a huge manufacture, supplying many OEMs. the only cons i can see are, not the best overclocking options and a less than stellar onboard audio. other than that its cheaper than the rest and has almost all the features you could want

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: shoRunner
MSI RS480M2-IL $92.50 (has on-board video-- Add PCIe vid card later)

Sho, I just wanted you to know that the MSI board with the ATI chip is now in stock again over here at NewEgg just in case you have any one else in mind for this board.

Greg

 

[The Pentium Guy]

Yo greg,
I don't think that fortron was a poor choice , it's good enough anyways. I usually opt for lower-end PSUs anyways

I heard that the MSI was really loud (northbridge) just to let you know... if noise bothers you anyways. A few of my friends have MSIs (neo2 actually) - kind of problematic to set up at first, a bit of a hassle to overclock as well (you gotta find JUST the right settings). Btw, in a LAN Party setting, the noise won't bother you (several friends brought computers with these boards in) but in your bedroom if you leave ur computer on it might annoy you a bit.

Keep up with the research man, you're just like me - you research a lot before buying stuff. A couple friends just buy stuff and end up having problems with it (compatibilities, "I wanted this feature, "Why does it not like this ram?" ... etc). I usually spend 2 months on research before buying - that's just me I guess.

-The Pentium Guy
-The Pentium Guy

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: cscpianoman
I personally was considering the soltek and from reading the reviews would go with the board. Are you actually using any PCI legacy devices? With the video card you'll get good results either way. I'm personally a fan of ATI, but others will argue against that. If you have the funds get the X700. Overall it would save you some money.

Cscpianoman:

Which Soltek board are you referring to, the SOLTEK SL-K890Pro-939 Socket 939 VIA K8T890 mobo or the SOLTEK NF4PRO-939 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 ???

BTW, Yes I do still use legacy PCI devices. My sound card (because I like it's external break-out box), a standard tv tuner capture card, a HDTV Tuner Card and possible a dvd-decoder card.

Thansk

Greg

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: cscpianoman
With the video card you'll get good results either way. I'm personally a fan of ATI, but others will argue against that. If you have the funds get the X700. Overall it would save you some money.

Yes, I ordered and received it today. It seems one does get one pays for; either that or ASUS has really gotten "cheap" the last couple of years. When I purchased an ASUS GF 2 GTS VIVO card in 2001 it came in a nice big protective box with good packaging and plenty of software. This Asus/Radeon x700 came in a litle flimsy box that would remind you of somthing that gainward/cardexpert or Powercolor would use. Also the board itself is rather small and not "hefty" felling. I associate "helt" with quality. Also, the HSP on the gpu looks rather flimsy (I'm going to have to be careful when installing that videocard). Anyeay, I can't describe its performance yet until I get a PCI-E mobo to run it in.

Thanks,

Stay tuned !

Greg

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: The Pentium Guy
I don't think that fortron was a poor choice it's good enough anyways.

I heard that the MSI was really loud (northbridge) just to let you know... if noise bothers you anyways. A few of my friends have MSIs (neo2 actually) - kind of problematic to set up at first...
Keep up with the research man, you're just like me - you research a lot before buying stuff...

-The Pentium Guy

PentiumGuy:

Thanks for responding !!!

I received the Fortron Source P/S today, along with the Patriot RAM and the Asus/Radeon x700 PCI-E card. I can't test any of them until I order my mobo but I CAN tell you the Fortron Source P/S weighs a TON; I've never had such a heavy P/S; even heavier than an Enermax EG-465P VE (FC). It looks so cool too! I realize most important is it's power delivery, stability and quietness.

I hope the MSI boards aren't TOO "problematic" to set up. It has been 2 years now since my last system build; an Amd Athlon 1.4 GHz Socket A/IWILL KT-266/Via KT-133A combo I built for my nephew. VIA boards are often a "pain" to set up but that IWILL board set up went real smooth. What a surprise if you've ever had to mess with a VIA chipset mobo before, lol.

Please let me know what you hear about that Platinum MSI board. I will be making my mobo decision in a day or two so that I can have the mobo by the end of next week.

Thanks so much for your help and suggestions.

Greg

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: Fisher999

Thanks so much for your help and suggestions.

Greg

Here's the CURRENT situation:

I believe I've decided to go the Athlon64/3000+/"Winchester"/nForce4 route.

To remind you of the mobo dilemma:

I ALREADY have previously purchased some of the components that will be used in the system like a WD 100 GB/8MB Cache/7200 RPM/ATA 100 hard drive, Lite-On 56X CD-RW, Pioneer DVD-106S, Hercules Game Theatre XP soundcard/box (the original model), Logitech Cordless Desktop Pro Mouse/Keyboard, Samsung AG-type 19" monitor...

The main PURPOSES for which I will be using this PC are :

1) CD burning ? transfer of vinyl/CD to PC music file formats
2) Microsoft Office products
3) Digital Image Editing from images captured from a Digital Camera with possible future DVD encoding
4) Web browsing
5) Limited gaming

BTW, this will be about my 11th system build since 1998.

I have already purchased 1 GB of Patriot 2-3-2-5 T1 DDR400 and an Asus EAX-700X/TD/128 Radeon x700 PCI-E graphics card and a Fortron Soucre AX-500 A P/S.

I will need a socket 939 board for the Athlon.

I have decided on an nForce 4 Ultra board.

May I ask your advice on the nForce4 ULTRA boards I am considering???

First, should I consider EITHER of these budget solutions? The ECS KN1 Extreme Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra or the BIOSTAR NF4UL-A9 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra ??? They both appear to have similar features and pretty good layouts. They each have a parallel port and 3 PCI slots along with the PCI-E slot. They BOTH have SATA 150 (SATA 300 on the ECS), onboard Gigabit LAN (the ECS actually has TWO onboard LANs - one is Gigabit, the other is 10/100Mbps), onboard Audio (6 and 8 channel respectively), onboard firewire and plenty of usb 2.0. I realize their quality may not be high nor their reliablity though. Actually, the BIOSTAR board looks warped in the photo, lol.

Then I thought, well why not step up to the this ASUS A8N-E Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra which (along with wonderful ASUS quality and good board layout) has the obligatory SATA150, onboard LAN, 8 channel audio, parallel (but no serial) port and plenty of USB 2.0. Then I realized it DOESN'T have onboard firewire. I realize I could get a PCI/firewire adapter card for $20 delivered like the Koutech at NewEgg but that swallows up one of the PCI slots.

Now I will probably have no use for SLI but ASUS A8N-SLI Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI board doesn't sacrifice a PCI slot to add the additional PCI-E graphics slot, it has firewire, Gigabit LAN, onboard 8 channel Realtek audio, SATA 300 (not 150) and tons of USB 2.0 ports/headers.

The last two considerations are the MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra board and the GIGABYTE GA-K8N Ultra-9 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra board. (I ruled out the EPoX 9NPA+ Ultra because I don't like the placement of the P/S connector). Both the MSI and Gigabyte boards are quite similar. The MSI board has 4 PCI slots, SATA 300, 2 Gigabit LANs, 8 channel Realtek audio, plenty of USB 2.0 and onboard firewire. The Gigabyte has one less PCI slot (3) but has two Gigabit LANs, 2 firwires, and everything else is very similar to the MSI.

BTW, I have also ruled out the wonderful DFI nForce4 Ultra series of motheboards because they only have two standard PCI slots (I will probably need 3) and because they leave out the legacy parallel port which I will need for my legacy printer and because I am neither an overclocker nor a gamer and the DFI boards cater to that crowd.

Finally a new dillema has arrived since I originally posted this thread and this thread over here at Anandtech. That is, the vanilla, non-ultra Nforce4 based MSI K8N Neo4-F for $93.50 delivered at NewEgg. Do you think this board would be a nice trade-off??? Someone, somewhere here at anandtech told me that the MSI nForce4 boards can be a little tricky to set up and that the HSF on the NForce4 chip is noisy.......

What is your opinion of the options ???

Again, your opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Greg

 

[ribbon13]

Biostar as a company gets nothing but :thumbsdown: from me.

The A8N-SLI is great for those who are skilled in the Art of PC.

The Gigabyte is a nice solid board from my experience with it.

Why will you need 3 PCI?

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: ribbon13
Biostar as a company gets nothing but :thumbsdown: from me.

The A8N-SLI is great for those who are skilled in the Art of PC.

The Gigabyte is a nice solid board from my experience with it.

Why will you need 3 PCI?

First, thanks for responding to my thread !!!

I probably will need (3) 32 bit PCI slots, one for my soundcard (just because I love it's break-out box), one for a Standard TV tuner, and possibly one for an eventual HDTV Tuner. One of the HDTV tuners I've looked at, sorry I can't remember which one right now ( maybe an ATI) explained at their website (which I can't find right now, lol) that one would STILL need to employ a STANDARD TV tuner along with it. I am considering either this ATI E-HOME WONDER or this ATI TV Wonder Elite Remote Control Edition or this Hauppauge WinTV-PVR250MCE PCI Interface Video Recorder, TV/FM Tuner Card .

At any rate it looks like I MAY need (3) 32 bit PCI slots.

What do you think of this NON-ultra NForce4 this MSI K8N Neo4-F Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 ATX AMD Motherboard at NewEgg for $87 delivered ???

Thanks again for your response Ribbon!

Greg

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: ribbon13
Biostar as a company gets nothing but :thumbsdown: from me.

The A8N-SLI is great for those who are skilled in the Art of PC.

The Gigabyte is a nice solid board from my experience with it.

Why will you need 3 PCI?

I found the HDTV Tuner card I think I will be installing. It is the ATI HDTV Wonder Remote Control Edition PCI TV Tuner over here at ZipZoomFly.

According to what's stated on Zip's website, it appears I will NOT need both an analogue TV tuner seperate from this ATI HDTV tuner although I thought I remember it saying so at the ATI website.

BTW I plan on installing this Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005.

Thanks for your help!

Greg

 

[ribbon13]

I suggest looking at this thread. As well as this one

That board looks like it will suite your needs just fine.

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: ribbon13
I suggest looking at this thread. As well as this one

That board looks like it will suite your needs just fine.

Thanks for the TWO threads, I read them both completely and then subscribed to them.
It seems getting the "proper" standard or HDTV setup on the PC is a little more difficult than I thought. I have been using an older ATI TV WONDER PCI card on an older system with an Intel 700MHz PIII and AOpen AX6BX (intel 440 BX chipset) and 256 MB of Crucial RAM Cas 2-2-2 PC 100 running Windows 98 SE and the tuner worked very well.

When you say that "That board looks like it will suit your needs just fine." what "that" board are you referring to???

And is the Gigabyte board you like the GIGABYTE GA-K8N Ultra-9 ???

Also, what do you think of this MSI K8N Neo4-F for $87 delivered ??? Thanks again Ribbon !

Greg

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

I go with the Neo4. MSI is a much better board for overclocking. Plus, it runs really fast at stock speeds.

I skipped the previous replies but if I'm correct you went Athlon 64? I would certainly hope so. It doesn't seem like you'll be doing intensive stuff every single day so basically clock for clock vs a P4 you would be pretty much the same. Gaming you might have an advantage iwth an A64, but encoding will be slightly better with P4.

I think the only thing that matters for CPU at this point is price/performance. A 3200+ is cheaper than a 3.2 so I get a 3200+. Plus a 3200+ overclocks to... 4200+ speeds? RAWRRRR.

Ok, that's my rationale for buying processors. Your limit is not speed. It's price. So you look at what $200 buys you for Intel and what $200 buys you for AMD. Then you compare those 2 processors for performance and overclockability, weigh the two and you decide. It's sometimes hard when you're biased like me, but with sufficient evidence you can overcome those biases (yes I loved Intel from Northwood 533/800 => Feb 2005 and AMD from Thunderbird => Spring 2003 right before Northwood 800 came out)

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: DLeRium
I go with the Neo4. MSI is a much better board for overclocking. Plus, it runs really fast at stock speeds.

I skipped the previous replies but if I'm correct you went Athlon 64? I would certainly hope so. It doesn't seem like you'll be doing intensive stuff every single day so basically clock for clock vs a P4 you would be pretty much the same. Gaming you might have an advantage iwth an A64, but encoding will be slightly better with P4.

I think the only thing that matters for CPU at this point is price/performance. A 3200+ is cheaper than a 3.2 so I get a 3200+. Plus a 3200+ overclocks to... 4200+ speeds? RAWRRRR.

Ok, that's my rationale for buying processors. Your limit is not speed. It's price. So you look at what $200 buys you for Intel and what $200 buys you for AMD. Then you compare those 2 processors for performance and overclockability, weigh the two and you decide. It's sometimes hard when you're biased like me, but with sufficient evidence you can overcome those biases (yes I loved Intel from Northwood 533/800 => Feb 2005 and AMD from Thunderbird => Spring 2003 right before Northwood 800 came out)

THANKS !!!

 

[Fisher999]

Shameless Bump !

 

[Fisher999]

anyone with an opinion ????

 

[Fisher999]

one last shameless bump

 

[Gerbil333]

I think Newegg made a mistake. According to the A8N-E product page, the board has "4 x SATA 3Gb/s," which is SATA II. Although, that is rather vague. Also, both Newegg and Asus indicate that the A8N-E has one Gigabit ethernet port. But because you need firewire, I think you should ignore this board

I'd also eliminate the A8N-SLI since you won't be gaming much; you'd have no need for the extra PCI x16 slot, and other motherboards offer the features you need.

The Gigabyte looks nice, but the passive northbridge heatsink concerns me, especially since it's beneath the video card. I know that wouldn't work well for me, but since you will have a mid-range GPU, I guess it would work well. Keep this one in consideration.

The Gigabyte has one less PCI slot (3) but has two Gigabit LANs, 2 firwires, and everything else is very similar to the MSI.

Could you use two firewire ports?

Next, SATA II is currently pointless. I have a WD 74gb Raptor and it averages 60-70 Mb/sec and burst transfer rates of somewhere around 100 Mb/s. At the SATA I speed of 150 Mb/s, hard drive speeds still need to double to saturate the bus. Unless we see some major technological breakthroughs, I can't imagine that happening in the next two years. I have a 3-4 year old IBM 20gb Deskstar that still runs (hehe...Deathstar still running) and it averages 32 Mb/s. Comparing it to my 10k Raptor isn't fair, so my modern Seagate 120gb 7200.7 pulls 37.4 Mb/s. That's an entire 5 Mb/s improvement in 7200rpm drives in the past 3 years. More cache, improved seek times, and of course data density have improved, but not average transfer rate is hardly improving. Therefore, SATA I should be acceptable years to come, and by that time, you'll be ready to rebuild with SATA III.

With that said, either MSI board appears to meet your needs well. They have an excellent layout and all the features you need. I've had mixed luck with MSI boards due to their mediocre quality assurance. I've had a few problems with multiple boards, but replacement boards have always done the trick. If you search a few forums for MSI users, you'll likely find this same opinion. That said, when I receive a flawless MSI board, it performs wonderfully. For example, I had a multitude of problems with an MSI K7N2-L. It randomly failed to POST until resetting it a few times, it would randomly BSOD, it had a few USB/PS2 issues, and was unstable despite it having the same high-end components from my previous machine. On the other hand, I have an MSI K7N2G-L from the same timeframe (same design, but with an integrated GPU), and it has been running for over 2 years without a single problem now

I recently used an MSI Neo4 Platinum SLI board in a local computer shop and was highly impressed. Maybe it was the case, but I couldn't hear the northbridge hsf. In 20 minutes of gaming and then messing around with the BIOS a bit, I had no problems. Yeah, that's not much time or experience. My initial impressions were good though, and I'm considering an MSI board myself. I've come across a few reports of mixed production quality with their nF4 boards, as I've experienced with older boards. If you decide on an MSI and end up having problems, RMA it. No more problems

Summary: I'd choose between the Gigabyte GA-K8N Ultra-9, MSI K8N Neo4-F, and the MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum.

 

[Fisher999]

Originally posted by: Gerbil333
I think Newegg made a mistake. According to the A8N-E product page, the board has "4 x SATA 3Gb/s," which is SATA II. Although, that is rather vague. Also, both Newegg and Asus indicate that the A8N-E has one Gigabit ethernet port. But because you need firewire, I think you should ignore this board

I'd also eliminate the A8N-SLI since you won't be gaming much; you'd have no need for the extra PCI x16 slot, and other motherboards offer the features you need.

The Gigabyte looks nice, but the passive northbridge heatsink concerns me, especially since it's beneath the video card. I know that wouldn't work well for me, but since you will have a mid-range GPU, I guess it would work well. Keep this one in consideration.

The Gigabyte has one less PCI slot (3) but has two Gigabit LANs, 2 firwires, and everything else is very similar to the MSI.

Could you use two firewire ports?

Next, SATA II is currently pointless. I have a WD 74gb Raptor and it averages 60-70 Mb/sec and burst transfer rates of somewhere around 100 Mb/s. At the SATA I speed of 150 Mb/s, hard drive speeds still need to double to saturate the bus. Unless we see some major technological breakthroughs, I can't imagine that happening in the next two years. I have a 3-4 year old IBM 20gb Deskstar that still runs (hehe...Deathstar still running) and it averages 32 Mb/s. Comparing it to my 10k Raptor isn't fair, so my modern Seagate 120gb 7200.7 pulls 37.4 Mb/s. That's an entire 5 Mb/s improvement in 7200rpm drives in the past 3 years. More cache, improved seek times, and of course data density have improved, but not average transfer rate is hardly improving. Therefore, SATA I should be acceptable years to come, and by that time, you'll be ready to rebuild with SATA III.

With that said, either MSI board appears to meet your needs well. They have an excellent layout and all the features you need. I've had mixed luck with MSI boards due to their mediocre quality assurance. I've had a few problems with multiple boards, but replacement boards have always done the trick. If you search a few forums for MSI users, you'll likely find this same opinion. That said, when I receive a flawless MSI board, it performs wonderfully. For example, I had a multitude of problems with an MSI K7N2-L. It randomly failed to POST until resetting it a few times, it would randomly BSOD, it had a few USB/PS2 issues, and was unstable despite it having the same high-end components from my previous machine. On the other hand, I have an MSI K7N2G-L from the same timeframe (same design, but with an integrated GPU), and it has been running for over 2 years without a single problem now

I recently used an MSI Neo4 Platinum SLI board in a local computer shop and was highly impressed. Maybe it was the case, but I couldn't hear the northbridge hsf. In 20 minutes of gaming and then messing around with the BIOS a bit, I had no problems. Yeah, that's not much time or experience. My initial impressions were good though, and I'm considering an MSI board myself. I've come across a few reports of mixed production quality with their nF4 boards, as I've experienced with older boards. If you decide on an MSI and end up having problems, RMA it. No more problems

Summary: I'd choose between the Gigabyte GA-K8N Ultra-9, MSI K8N Neo4-F, and the MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum.

Gerbil333:

What a well-though-out, well-written, educational post !!! THANK YOU !!!

I feel like a weight has been lifted off of my shoulders, truly !

I really needed some detailed but easy-to-understand no-nonsense advice that touched upon some of the really important issues like the quality assurance records of some of these board companies and what one might expect in real life experiences. :thumbsup:

I particularly appreciate the "heads up" on MSI qualty control issues with their Mobos. I do not have much patience for the RMA thing and some of those Asian companies can be a real pain to work with so I've heard.

You didn't mention the quality control issue problem with Gigabyte boards. I'll assume that they have better quality assurance than MSI.

Since you started your post talking about Asus boards and frowned when you mentioned I can't purchase the A8N-E because it doesn't have firewire leads me to believe that your believe in Asus quality. I hope I'm not assuming incorrectly.

I'm not so sure I need firewire; I do not use it now; I just didn't want to have a board that was firewire-less since I know that many vidoe-related components utilize (or at least did) the firewire interface. I could always add a PCI/Firewire card like this Koutech down the road if necessary.

SO, you have helped me narrow it down to the Gigabyte GIGABYTE GA-K8NF-9, GIGABYTE GA-K8NF Ultra-9 or the Asus A8N-E.
BTW, the Gig GA-K8NF-9 uses an active hsf rather than just a heatsink which we see on the Ultra 9.

Thanks again for your input and hopefully, you can check back at my response and give me one last opinion.

Greg