Trump administration pushing the United States into a war with Iran

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Ajay

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2001
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It seems unlikely that the Iraqis would choose the US over Iran. I doubt they want to be part of what really is a wag the dog maneuver.
Probably not, but one look at the map and I suspect the administration will make them an offer they can’t refuse.
 

Ajay

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2001
5,078
151
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Fuck. You don't just move 120,000 Troops without using them. At the very least, prepare for $5+ Trillions of Debt, 10s of thousands in casualties, and a fucking 2020 victory for Trump because of "War Time President" BS idiocy.
I get ill thinking that the only reason Trump might be for this is so he can win in 2020.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
59,795
401
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I need a political cartoon where Trump walks up to a table and takes a saw to one of the legs. It starts to lean over. The you see Trump with a bunch of military troops pointing guns at the table saying "IF YOU FALL OVER THEY'LL SHOOT YOU!".

Because that's exactly what this feels like. An entirely manufactured conflict.
 
Feb 6, 2002
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Note, it's not Trump that wants war with Iran, it's his administration, which has Hillary's, Bush's, and Cheney's tentacles in it.
What does Hillary have to do with this? None of her people work for Trump.
 

DarthKyrie

Senior member
Jul 11, 2016
544
385
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What does Hillary have to do with this? None of her people work for Trump.
Hilary appointed all of Trump's people, except the people that agree with Trump on everything.
 
Jul 12, 2006
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What makes you think that Trump doesn't want a war with Iran?

1) He's been belligerent towards them since before he even got into office.
2) He very close and potentially has corrupt financial conflicts of interest with Iran's primary adversaries in the Middle East.
3) He hired John Fucking Bolton to be his National Security Adviser.

The idea that you hire John Bolton and are then shocked, shocked I tell you that he would try to involve the US in a war with Iran requires a level of stupidity that I think is beyond even Trump. The more likely answer is that Trump is aware of this and is fine with it.
Because your interpretation is frankly more reasonable than mine, and actually less terrifying. I'm not currently in a state to accept that the worst possible situation is not the one that we are actually experiencing. The president obliviously letting his underlings force him into decisions and situations, completely against whatever he claims he may want, completely incurious about consequences, and fundamentally ignorant with regard to anything happening in the world, truly seems to be exactly where we are.

I don't think he understand the consequences and connections between any of those points that you mention. With Bolton, he seems to have not liked him at all early on, but felt that he could provide a good liberal-enraging distraction and Trump, being Trump, assumes that he can control anyone. This is a guy who has spent the last 3 or 4 years being controlled by nearly everyone around him, so it's not really surprising.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
52,757
2,676
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Probably not, but one look at the map and I suspect the administration will make them an offer they can’t refuse.
Heh. Like what, exactly? We'll bomb the Iraqis too?

War with Iran would shut down commercial shipping to all the states who border the Persian Gulf. Ships won't go there simply because their insurance is void in a war zone.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
59,795
401
126
That and just one massive, bloody distraction from the shit storm of legal issues he's facing right now. It's not just 2020, it's about kicking the ball to the other side of the field for everyone to chase. And the media fucking loves to cover war footage.
 

Jon-T

Senior member
Jun 5, 2011
267
38
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Wait.

I thought Trump was a Russian puppet, doing whatever his puppet master Putin says.

Now ya'll are telling me Trump is going to war with one of Russia's biggest allies?
 

Ajay

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2001
5,078
151
136
Heh. Like what, exactly? We'll bomb the Iraqis too?

War with Iran would shut down commercial shipping to all the states who border the Persian Gulf. Ships won't go there simply because their insurance is void in a war zone.
No, they’ll pledge a ton of foreign and military aide and suggest that doing otherwise will have some terrible cost. Bolton is much more clever on the evil genius bit than I am - though not at Cheney's level.

As far as the Persian Gulf goes, I suppose the Navy would provide safe escort after Iran's anti ship missile defenses were destroyed.

All of this would be a clusterfuck that would make the war in Iraq look like a walk in the park.
 
Jul 12, 2006
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to be fair, this is exactly what all internal intelligence was reporting, leading up to the Iraq invasion. It was thoroughly covered, thoroughly reported, that it was all fabricated nonsense by Cheney and Bush Co.

Oh, but of course a few years later when that all became obvious to everyone, it became the media's fault and Dems' fault for not stopping it. Fucking GOP: useless motherfuckers the whole lot of them.
 
Jul 11, 2001
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to be fair, this is exactly what all internal intelligence was reporting, leading up to the Iraq invasion. It was thoroughly covered, thoroughly reported, that it was all fabricated nonsense by Cheney and Bush Co.

Oh, but of course a few years later when that all became obvious to everyone, it became the media's fault and Dems' fault for not stopping it. Fucking GOP: useless motherfuckers the whole lot of them.
I can't for the life of me think of a reason to contradict that conclusion. Why anyone would be a Republican I can't fathom. If it's to honor your clan, think again, think for yourself.
 
Jul 11, 2001
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Wait.

I thought Trump was a Russian puppet, doing whatever his puppet master Putin says.

Now ya'll are telling me Trump is going to war with one of Russia's biggest allies?
Well, Russia will be on Iran's good side and WTF do they care? How many Russians live in Iran? Putin can look the other way. As long as his boy gets reelected in the US, he's happy.
 
Dec 11, 2000
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Gotta manufacture a war in time for 2020 voting. right?
The guy who ran on a platform of non intervention? I'm sure his supporters will quickly change their stance. Inconsistency is the only thing they are consistent about.
 
Mar 11, 2004
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You know, I was just thinking, if there's some major electricity storage breakthrough killing oil's viability and making renewables huge, that just means that the Middle East is going to be desired for the solar and wind output since the open desert expanses would probably be good for both. Its always going to be a strategic region for energy by the rest of the world.

Wait.

I thought Trump was a Russian puppet, doing whatever his puppet master Putin says.

Now ya'll are telling me Trump is going to war with one of Russia's biggest allies?
You do know that Putin would have plenty to gain from that, right? Putin doesn't give a shit about Iran beyond what they can offer him (which is to say beyond what they can do to be a thorn in the US by buying Russian military equipment), and he'd love the US to waste trillions in another misguided clusterfuck of a war that only hurts the US and will push more countries to buddy up to Russia (since their nukes would provide the only deterrent from warmongering Republican presidents) and it undermines the US geopolitically. Meanwhile Putin makes money selling arms and services to Iran while helping them needle the US and gaining intel about the US military while having to put very little Russian resources in play. Plus it would almost definitely make the price of fossil fuels rise which helps Russia too.

We have pretty much nothing to gain from going to war with Iran.

Putin has tons to gain by stirring up issues and pushing the US to go to war even with "allies" of his (like him helping North Korea bypass sanctions, or see him buddying up to Maduro to stir that up, Iran of course as its long been a desired target for warmongering US officials, Russia was actively helping groups in Afghanistan to fight US forces there - not unlike what we did to them in the 80s, and he's been buddying up to Saudi Arabia and Israel because he knows there's lots of contention in the US over its alliances with those; likewise Putin's been trying to deflect Russian intelligence and hacking activities by blaming it on China stirring up issues between the US and China; oh and Turkey and Ukraine where he's been working to try and stymie and even break up NATO).
 

VRAMdemon

Platinum Member
Aug 16, 2012
2,444
739
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The impression of the Trump base is that he can fail all day long on the foreign stage and it will not matter one bit. Surely they'll hand-wave it away like any other bad (sorry "fake") news. But how high does foreign policy rank on the radar of the nationalist, protectionist, 'Merica-first Trump voter? They like him because he won't play with all those foreign loser types.

This is the guy who tanked the Paris Accords, backs out of trade deals, regularly denigrates the UN and NATO. If he does well with anything they'll say "Look what a deal-maker he is!" But if we end up in, say, a trade war with China it's because, "He's a tough negotiator and won't take any crap!" The myth of Trump as the mighty negotiator persists and explains all the successes and all the failures.

Trump understands that foreign crises or even war are the way to divert from domestic problems, so will keep war-monger Bolton around so he can egg Trump on. Other than Bolton, who are Trump's top foreign policy advisors? Kushner, Hannity and Putin? Any others? Stephen Miller?? Does Trump still look to Steve Bannon for guidance?

Kushner is way past his Peter Principle ceiling and, at best, can be trusted to relay the wishes of two MidEast tyrants: Netanyahu and MBS al-Saud. Hannity will say whatever will leave him in Trump's good graces.

This leaves Putin. Trump pretty much does Putin's bidding. Putin will deploy his asset carefully: he doesn't want the asset to become ineffective from excessive ridicule.

So..IMO (right now) war with Iran is a long shot. Trump drums up a war against Iran on even weaker reasons than the war against Iraq. That would be a big re-election mistake
 
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Jul 17, 2003
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If Bolton and Pompeo lead Trump into a war with Iran, hoooly shit. No legal justification, no allies, no real plan.

It will make Iraq 2.0 look like Entebbe. Putin and Xi both will experience priapisms and need to consult doctors.
 
Feb 6, 2002
18,363
1,563
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You know, I was just thinking, if there's some major electricity storage breakthrough killing oil's viability and making renewables huge, that just means that the Middle East is going to be desired for the solar and wind output since the open desert expanses would probably be good for both. Its always going to be a strategic region for energy by the rest of the world.



You do know that Putin would have plenty to gain from that, right? Putin doesn't give a shit about Iran beyond what they can offer him (which is to say beyond what they can do to be a thorn in the US by buying Russian military equipment), and he'd love the US to waste trillions in another misguided clusterfuck of a war that only hurts the US and will push more countries to buddy up to Russia (since their nukes would provide the only deterrent from warmongering Republican presidents) and it undermines the US geopolitically. Meanwhile Putin makes money selling arms and services to Iran while helping them needle the US and gaining intel about the US military while having to put very little Russian resources in play. Plus it would almost definitely make the price of fossil fuels rise which helps Russia too.

We have pretty much nothing to gain from going to war with Iran.

Putin has tons to gain by stirring up issues and pushing the US to go to war even with "allies" of his (like him helping North Korea bypass sanctions, or see him buddying up to Maduro to stir that up, Iran of course as its long been a desired target for warmongering US officials, Russia was actively helping groups in Afghanistan to fight US forces there - not unlike what we did to them in the 80s, and he's been buddying up to Saudi Arabia and Israel because he knows there's lots of contention in the US over its alliances with those; likewise Putin's been trying to deflect Russian intelligence and hacking activities by blaming it on China stirring up issues between the US and China; oh and Turkey and Ukraine where he's been working to try and stymie and even break up NATO).
Also war in the Middle East would destabilize oil prices causing a spike. Guess who that benefits??
 

DrunkenSano

Diamond Member
Aug 8, 2008
3,586
46
106
If Bolton and Pompeo lead Trump into a war with Iran, hoooly shit. No legal justification, no allies, no real plan.

It will make Iraq 2.0 look like Entebbe. Putin and Xi both will experience priapisms and need to consult doctors.
Which is fine with them I'm sure. They don't want a quick and easy victory, the longer the war drags out, the more money can be made and the easier it is to paint the browns as the devil.
 

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