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Toyota trucks == Rust Buckets

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Bottom line: If Toyota doesn't pay for corrosion protection the supplier won't use it. Toyota can't claim they didn't know the frames were basiclly bare metal with a coat of grey paint when they started receiving them by the thousands - not to mention all the frames are inspected on delivery and again in the factory. Toyota knew there was no corrosion protection on the frames because that's how they ordered them! Toyota is at fault and they KNOW they are at fault, which is why Toyota is eating the cost and NOT the parts supplier.
 
Originally posted by: iFX
Bottom line: If Toyota doesn't pay for corrosion protection the supplier won't use it. Toyota can't claim they didn't know the frames were basiclly bare metal with a coat of grey paint when they started receiving them by the thousands - not to mention all the frames are inspected on delivery and again in the factory. Toyota knew there was no corrosion protection on the frames because that's how they ordered them! Toyota is at fault and they KNOW they are at fault, which is why Toyota is eating the cost and NOT the parts supplier.

DCX (at that time) started skimping on rust protection in 2001-2002ish, IIRC. I had a friend who worked at a company that stamped a lot of their body panels and frames. Not sure they Chrysler is still following suit, but I wouldn't be suprised, my leased Ram's frame was f already showing tons of surface rust on the frame at turn in time.
 
I grew up in Minnesota.
For 15 years my dads '91 pickup never had much rust on the undercarriage until he sold to my blonde, teenage cousin. She never took proper care of that thing and it rusted away in a couple of years.

So either they were made better back then, or my dad took better care of it than the average Minnesota pickup owner. We cant be sure.

But one thing is for certain: Blondes are dumb!
😛
 
Originally posted by: marincounty
Text

Despite an arctic-inspired name, certain Toyota Tundra full-size pickups may have problems withstanding harsh winter climates. Toyota is investigating reports of frame rust problems in 2000 and 2001 Tundras similar to those that caused the Japanese auto giant to extend warranties, buy back entire trucks, or repair or replace severely rusted frames in its 1995-2000 and 2001-04 Toyota Tacoma midsize pickups last year

We contacted Toyota after reading a story from Boston television station WCVB about Tundra owners with frames so badly corroded that some trucks might not be considered fit for work or resale.

?At this stage, we?re trying to grasp the situation,? said Brian Lyons, Toyota?s Safety and Quality communications manager. ?We don?t know whether we have an issue with Tundra or not.?

Other Tundra owners have filed similar complaints with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, where more than two dozen corrosion claims about 2000 and 2001 Tundra frames are on record

According to Lyons, 1995-2004 Tacoma pickups and 2000-01 Tundras shared the same frame supplier: Toledo, Ohio-based Dana Holding Corporation. In investigating the Tacoma?s rust complaints, Toyota discovered that Dana hadn?t properly prepped Tacoma frames to resist corrosion before they were shipped to Toyota?s NUMMI manufacturing plant, where the Tacoma is assembled.

?Because of the Tacoma, we are taking a look at other vehicles of similar make and production elements. This includes the Tundra,? Lyons said. ?[Dana] used the same rust treatment [for the Tacoma and Tundra] during manufacturing.?

2000 was the Toyota Tundra?s inaugural model year. It was introduced as a replacement for the earlier Toyota T100 pickup. The first trucks were built in 1999. In 2000, 100,455 were sold, and another 108,863 were sold in 2001.

Most rust-damaged Tundras have been reported in what Toyota defines as severe cold-weather states, like Massachusetts, where brutal winter road conditions can take their toll on under-protected metal.

For now, a team of Toyota engineers and technicians out in the field is inspecting reports of rusted Tundras as they?re flagged by Toyota dealers or Toyota?s national Customer Experience Center. Toyota has yet to send out a formal letter about the issue to its dealers or to Tundra owners, like it did for the Tacoma in 2008.

We need to look at each vehicle and understand its history ? where it?s been driven and how it?s been driven," Lyons said. ?It?s a little complicated because the warranty on these 2000-01 vehicles has run out. We can?t just warranty the frame. We have to deal with them on a case-by-case basis.?

Lyons says Toyota is still trying to figure out how it will support customers complaining about these vehicles, but part of Toyota?s short-term response could be paying for repairs even though the trucks are well past their factory warranty periods.

Over the long term, if the situation warrants, Toyota could take similar blanket action with the Tundra as it did with the Tacoma.

Lyons says 2000-01 Toyota Tundra owners with questions or trucks showing frame rust problems should call Toyota?s Customer Experience Center at 1-800-331-4331


My god man, over two dozen complaints of rusted frames out of over 200,000 trucks sold.
The sky is falling.

And did you notice, the frames were made by Ohio-based Dana Holding Corporation?
Toyota discovered Dana didn't properly prep the frames to resist corrosion.
If true, there was no problem with the Toyota design or the steel, it was the prep done by an American supplier.

Meanwhile, my '87 Toyota Corolla continues to run, rust free, with over 214K.

Haha, play the blame game. It's toyota's responsibility to QC and approve the parts they get. But lets just blame it on big dumb Americans. Maybe they can get the president to appologize on their behalf.
 
Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Originally posted by: marincounty
Text

Despite an arctic-inspired name, certain Toyota Tundra full-size pickups....

Haha, play the blame game. It's toyota's responsibility to QC and approve the parts they get. But lets just blame it on big dumb Americans. Maybe they can get the president to appologize on their behalf.

In the comments in the linked article you hear all kinds of crazy comments, such as:

"It's always been well known that foreign vehicles are made from inferior steel than you would find on an American vehicle, If you don't believe me go look at the frame underneath a F series and you will see just how thick it is and it comes properly rust coated from the factory. My family has two plow trucks ( 96 Bronco, 97 F350) and both have been plowing since new and look great underneath with no serious corrosion, You guys should really just avoid buying foriegn trucks from now on and buy a truck that won't ever experience frame rust."

. 28, 2009 5:12pm EDT | from steves

The frames are made in America by Americans.

Rednecks have been bad-mouthing japanese cars forever. This is just another opportunity for them due to some widely publicized problems with Toyota trucks. I realize people are pissed that Toyota kicked Detroit's ass.

Does anyone have any numbers of how many trucks this is affecting? The article I quoted mentions more than two dozen trucks. Is this a real problem or is this just a few trucks?

And your comment about the president is uncalled for and has nothing to do with the subject.
 
Originally posted by: marincounty
Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Originally posted by: marincounty
Text

Despite an arctic-inspired name, certain Toyota Tundra full-size pickups....

Haha, play the blame game. It's toyota's responsibility to QC and approve the parts they get. But lets just blame it on big dumb Americans. Maybe they can get the president to appologize on their behalf.

In the comments in the linked article you hear all kinds of crazy comments, such as:

"It's always been well known that foreign vehicles are made from inferior steel than you would find on an American vehicle, If you don't believe me go look at the frame underneath a F series and you will see just how thick it is and it comes properly rust coated from the factory. My family has two plow trucks ( 96 Bronco, 97 F350) and both have been plowing since new and look great underneath with no serious corrosion, You guys should really just avoid buying foriegn trucks from now on and buy a truck that won't ever experience frame rust."

. 28, 2009 5:12pm EDT | from steves

The frames are made in America by Americans.

Rednecks have been bad-mouthing japanese cars forever. This is just another opportunity for them due to some widely publicized problems with Toyota trucks. I realize people are pissed that Toyota kicked Detroit's ass.

Does anyone have any numbers of how many trucks this is affecting? The article I quoted mentions more than two dozen trucks. Is this a real problem or is this just a few trucks?

And your comment about the president is uncalled for and has nothing to do with the subject.

See, to me you are just the opposite of the "red necks" as you call them who bash Toyota because all you are concerned about is "kicking Detroit's ass" and "stupid red necks". Both groups are extreme and both are stupid.
 
Toyota kicked our asses in the truck dept.?

I never knew that. I thought they consistently lost badly to the F150 and the Ranger.
 
Originally posted by: marincounty
The frames are made in America by Americans.

So what are you saying by that statement, are you implying that if they were made in japan they wouldn't rust? Or that americans are sabotaging toyota frames?

Shouldn't matter where they are made, it is up to the company to be sure the parts meet standards. If the frames met standards and rust faster than they should, then obviously the company standards aren't high enough.
 
Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
Originally posted by: marincounty
The frames are made in America by Americans.

So what are you saying by that statement, are you implying that if they were made in japan they wouldn't rust? Or that americans are sabotaging toyota frames?

Shouldn't matter where they are made, it is up to the company to be sure the parts meet standards. If the frames met standards and rust faster than they should, then obviously the company standards aren't high enough.

No, I'm not saying if they were made in Japan they wouldn't rust. I'm saying that idiots are blaming this on "It's always been well known that foreign vehicles are made from inferior steel than you would find on an American vehicle, If you don't believe me go look at the frame underneath a F series and you will see just how thick it is and it comes properly rust coated from the factory."

I'm asking, is this a real problem or is it just a few trucks?
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Toyota kicked our asses in the truck dept.?

I never knew that. I thought they consistently lost badly to the F150 and the Ranger.

No, Toyota didn't kick OUR asses in the truck dept. They kicked Detroit's ass in car sales.
Or maybe you didn't notice Toyota's sales increasing as GM's sales fell.

And the Tundra was the 2008 Motor Trend Truck of the year.
 
Originally posted by: marincounty
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Toyota kicked our asses in the truck dept.?

I never knew that. I thought they consistently lost badly to the F150 and the Ranger.

No, Toyota didn't kick OUR asses in the truck dept. They kicked Detroit's ass in car sales.
Or maybe you didn't notice Toyota's sales increasing as GM's sales fell.

And the Tundra was the 2008 Motor Trend Truck of the year.

Most companies have won car or truck of the year. Motor Trend requires the vehicle to be new or significantly updated.
 
Toyota extends rust warranty to 15 years for all 1995-2000 Tacoma pickups. I have to commend Toyota for doing this, most companies will stonewall your problems.

Text

Toyota had begun receiving a few reports from customers that excessive corrosion was occurring on the frames of some older Tacoma pickups, specifically 1995 to 2000 models. The Japanese automaker determined that during this half decade of production, some Taco frames may not have received the kind of corrosion protection from the factory that's needed to withstand harsh climes, especially ones where salt is used to deice roadways. While there is no recall and Toyota says that the number of instances where it has found rust go beyond the surface of the frame to penetrate the metal is small, the automaker is pulling an unorthodox move and doing something about anyway.

Toyota is extending the rust perforation warranty on all 1995-2000 Tacoma pickups, some 813,000 units, to 15 years from the original date of purchase, AND you don't have to be the original owner, or the second or the third even. Anyone who owns a Tacoma from this era and finds rust perforation on the frame can have his or her truck officially inspected for rust damage, in which case Toyota will either repair or buy back the truck regardless of its condition. Owners will start receiving letters by mid-March, and those who don't can visit a dealership for a free inspection.
Now if you'd excuse us, we need to start shopping for a used 1995-2000 Toyota Tacoma in Syracuse, NY
 
Well, it's good to hear that Toyota is doing this for the owners.

I still say though that Toyota dropped the ball on this one. Two different models with a problem so severe that they need do a buybacks for the same type of issue isn't excusable. It shows a lack of learning from their past issues.
 
It's funny because I was behind a Toyota Tundra and chips of rust were flying off of it as it was going down the highway. Now I know why...
 
Originally posted by: Bignate603
Well, it's good to hear that Toyota is doing this for the owners.

I still say though that Toyota dropped the ball on this one. Two different models with a problem so severe that they need do a buybacks for the same type of issue isn't excusable. It shows a lack of learning from their past issues.

Yep. It's called damage control. They fucked up and when it became newsworthy, they're backpedalling.
 
I can't tell you how many FOrd and GMs in the mid to late 90s I've seen with defective paint and those peeling and expanding circles.

This crap happens to all manufacturers one time or another.

Quit arguing. It's lame.
 
Originally posted by: nerp
I can't tell you how many FOrd and GMs in the mid to late 90s I've seen with defective paint and those peeling and expanding circles.

This crap happens to all manufacturers one time or another.

Quit arguing. It's lame.

Paint problems and severe frame rust are vastly different issues. One make the vehicle look bad, the other is a safety concern.
 
Or maybe you didn't notice Toyota's sales increasing as GM's sales fell.

Everyone who left GM went to Toyota? Surely not just Toyota's sales went up as GM's fell.

At any rate, somebody's sales had to go up to take up the slack, didn't they? 😀

I could have sworn the topic was trucks, though.

Let me check...

Why yes, yes it was.
 
I can't tell you how many FOrd and GMs in the mid to late 90s I've seen with defective paint and those peeling and expanding circles.

That problem was with many vehicles sold in the US. It was due to an EPA rule about the VOC's in the paint, iirc. The changes made to adapt caused the paint not to stick. Some mfgs used different paints to try to comply, others tried eliminating the primer.
 
Yeah that paint thing was a nasty mess. GM, Ford, and Chrysler all had paint issues during that time. The imports weren't immune either, unless some of the toyotas, hondas, and nissans running around here of the same timeframe had someone peeling their paint for them.

I'm glad my car doesn't have that botched paint (it's a 98). The paint is scratched enough already, if it was peeling that would be nasty.
 
Originally posted by: iFX
Originally posted by: marincounty
Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Originally posted by: marincounty
Text

Despite an arctic-inspired name, certain Toyota Tundra full-size pickups....

Haha, play the blame game. It's toyota's responsibility to QC and approve the parts they get. But lets just blame it on big dumb Americans. Maybe they can get the president to appologize on their behalf.

In the comments in the linked article you hear all kinds of crazy comments, such as:

"It's always been well known that foreign vehicles are made from inferior steel than you would find on an American vehicle, If you don't believe me go look at the frame underneath a F series and you will see just how thick it is and it comes properly rust coated from the factory. My family has two plow trucks ( 96 Bronco, 97 F350) and both have been plowing since new and look great underneath with no serious corrosion, You guys should really just avoid buying foriegn trucks from now on and buy a truck that won't ever experience frame rust."

. 28, 2009 5:12pm EDT | from steves

The frames are made in America by Americans.

Rednecks have been bad-mouthing japanese cars forever. This is just another opportunity for them due to some widely publicized problems with Toyota trucks. I realize people are pissed that Toyota kicked Detroit's ass.

Does anyone have any numbers of how many trucks this is affecting? The article I quoted mentions more than two dozen trucks. Is this a real problem or is this just a few trucks?

And your comment about the president is uncalled for and has nothing to do with the subject.

See, to me you are just the opposite of the "red necks" as you call them who bash Toyota because all you are concerned about is "kicking Detroit's ass" and "stupid red necks". Both groups are extreme and both are stupid.

No, I think the people concerned about "kicking Detroit's ass" are less worse because that attitude is what's going to get us nothing but higher quality cars from domestic producers.

All you people fussing at Toyota over this-- you're welcome to go back to buying your American cars; but Toyota has a track record for quality, excellence, and customer satisfaction; and as was seen with the Tacoma incident, they'll make it right no matter what.

This does nothing to reduce my interest in buying new or used Toyota's, quality is still top notch, and if there's a problem in the future, their history of fixing it--making previous issues right (Tacoma, now these Tundra problems) is plenty for me-- if it happens again they'll fix it again, like they're doing now.

Kaizen. American producers have much to learn. Sad that the Taxpayer keeps having to give them another chance. Again. And Again.
 
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
All you people fussing at Toyota over this-- you're welcome to go back to buying your American cars; but Toyota has a track record for quality, excellence, and customer satisfaction; and as was seen with the Tacoma incident, they'll make it right no matter what.

This does nothing to reduce my interest in buying new or used Toyota's, quality is still top notch, and if there's a problem in the future, their history of fixing it--making previous issues right (Tacoma, now these Tundra problems) is plenty for me-- if it happens again they'll fix it again, like they're doing now.

Kaizen. American producers have much to learn. Sad that the Taxpayer keeps having to give them another chance. Again. And Again.

While I certainly do not think that this indicates endemic problems at Toyota, it does show that it is much more difficult to maintain a high level of quality with a larger model lineup. In Toyota's heyday they had a much more limited lineup of cars and production was also more centralized. As the lineup of cars expanded and as more and more manufacturing plants came online the quality began to decline slightly. Not drastically, and not catastrophically, but certainly perceptibly.

Between that slight decline and continuous improvement from domestics it's simply willful ignorance for anyone to honestly claim that Toyota or Honda currently offers higher quality vehicles than Ford or even GM (GM is a little more hit-and-miss, but the Malibu is certainly right on target and they are definitely improving).

ZV
 
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
All you people fussing at Toyota over this-- you're welcome to go back to buying your American cars; but Toyota has a track record for quality, excellence, and customer satisfaction; and as was seen with the Tacoma incident, they'll make it right no matter what.

This does nothing to reduce my interest in buying new or used Toyota's, quality is still top notch, and if there's a problem in the future, their history of fixing it--making previous issues right (Tacoma, now these Tundra problems) is plenty for me-- if it happens again they'll fix it again, like they're doing now.

Kaizen. American producers have much to learn. Sad that the Taxpayer keeps having to give them another chance. Again. And Again.

While I certainly do not think that this indicates endemic problems at Toyota, it does show that it is much more difficult to maintain a high level of quality with a larger model lineup. In Toyota's heyday they had a much more limited lineup of cars and production was also more centralized. As the lineup of cars expanded and as more and more manufacturing plants came online the quality began to decline slightly. Not drastically, and not catastrophically, but certainly perceptibly.

Between that slight decline and continuous improvement from domestics it's simply willful ignorance for anyone to honestly claim that Toyota or Honda currently offers higher quality vehicles than Ford or even GM (GM is a little more hit-and-miss, but the Malibu is certainly right on target and they are definitely improving).

ZV

It is most certainly not willful ignorance. To suggest than _any_ of the current GM cars will drive for 300,000 miles without more than a $500 repair is, however.

The Toyota's do this no problem.

Further, you're welcome to point out Toyota has supply problems, but that's not the point. The point is how they've handled it in the past, how they're handling this situation, and how they will continue to handle problems like these, and the effect it has on consumer confidence. If Toyota and Honda were on the verge of bankruptcy and only surviving thanks to continued life support from the government, these supply quality control issues would be much greater problems. Toyota's not going anywhere; they're more than solving the problems with current vehicles, so the whole point is moot.

Even the rednecks are figuring out Toyota just plain makes a better truck. See the linked BBC video above.
 
Lol
Thats right Toyota is magic, the service centers on the sides of their buildings are for oil changes and fixing other manufacturers stuff 😀
 
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