Threadripper BUILDERS thread

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dnavas

Senior member
Feb 25, 2017
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https://www.sisoftware.co.uk/download-lite/
Just get the lite version and run the processor multi-core efficiency benchmark. Run it in both best-case and worst-case mode.
Will do.

I'm surprised your latency was that high.
It's about where it should be. 3200CL14 here: https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/amd_ryzen_threadripper_2950x_review,21.html

My numbers were "distributed mode". You're probably expecting local numbers? I won't get mid 70s (3200/3600*85.6) as I'm not running CL14, but I don't wind up in the mid 80s either because some of that is IF latency, not memory latency. I expect local latency to be almost exactly the same as the 3200CL14 numbers.
Current newegg pricing is $245 for the 3600CL15 pair vs $213 for the 3200CL14. 15% higher for ~13% better throughput and ~6% "gain" in latency. It's a pretty fair trade for bandwidth. If Ryzen ever gets the ability to use odd CLs, it would be a somewhat better trade in the latency department. I got the CL15 sticks over the 3600CL16 sticks mainly because I figured I'd increase my chances of being able to use these at 3200CL14 if I needed to. But I can't boot in 3200, so, joke's on me :) The 3600CL16 sticks are only 4% more ($223) than the 3200CL14, which seems pretty fair. What surprised me more was the increased throttling from running at higher memory speeds, which in my mind significantly lowers the value of the higher speed RAM, increases the value of running 3200CL14, and makes me even more unhappy that my board doesn't want to accept 3200 speed :sigh:. I'm as interested as you are in seeing the sisoft results.
 

Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
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May 16, 2002
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edit: Making this general for anyone with Liqtech cooler:

Just looking to confirm your failure symptoms - you observed the CPU downclocks rather than exceeds the temperature settings within Ryzen Master*? (Which is 68degC)


*is this even adjustable? In work and can't remember.
It was running 85c@500 mhz, so both. I am sure the temps made it downclock. It fine now, so it was not damaged
 

StefanR5R

Platinum Member
Dec 10, 2016
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max auto-boost all core is clearly tied to memory speed and count. Using Prime95:
2 sticks at 3200: 4.1G (I was thinking "wow, golden!")
4 sticks at 3466: 3.7G
4 sticks at 2933: 3.9G
4 sticks at 2400: 4.0G

...which is interesting, and not something I'd read before. I've read that clocking memory higher can boost apps, but not that downclocking memory can raise boost. Actually, it's probably a power draw limit -- I'm seeing a fair amount more power drawn with four sticks at 2400 than 2 sticks at 3200.
Depending on the FFT size, Prime95's throughput may depend on memory bandwidth. If so, decreased memory bandwidth would decrease utilization of the processor's FMA units during Prime95, which could be a reason for the processor firmware to apply a higher boost clock.
 

Markfw

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May 16, 2002
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edit: Making this general for anyone with Liqtech cooler:

Just looking to confirm your failure symptoms - you observed the CPU downclocks rather than exceeds the temperature settings within Ryzen Master*? (Which is 68degC)


*is this even adjustable? In work and can't remember.
THIS IS TO ALL WHO HAVE A LIQUITECH TR4 COOLER. ENERMAX NOW REQUIRES YOU TO PAY RETURN SHIPPING ON YOUR RMA, EVEN THOUGH ITS KNOWN THAT EVERY ONE WILL FAIL IN A YEAR.

I am not going to even bother, just never going to buy from them again, and please pass the bad news on, I hope they get real bad reviews and go bankrupt.
 

DethGasp

Junior Member
Feb 2, 2017
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THIS IS TO ALL WHO HAVE A LIQUITECH TR4 COOLER. ENERMAX NOW REQUIRES YOU TO PAY RETURN SHIPPING ON YOUR RMA, EVEN THOUGH ITS KNOWN THAT EVERY ONE WILL FAIL IN A YEAR.

I am not going to even bother, just never going to buy from them again, and please pass the bad news on, I hope they get real bad reviews and go bankrupt.
Ha! Check out this comment from a Enermax rep about the Liquitech TR4's.

https://hardforum.com/threads/enerm...coolers-review.1945204/page-4#post-1043848370
 

Markfw

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Ha! Check out this comment from a Enermax rep about the Liquitech TR4's.

https://hardforum.com/threads/enerm...coolers-review.1945204/page-4#post-1043848370
They say they will RMA, BUT YOU HAVE TO PAY SHIPPING, AND EVEN THEN YOU GET A VERSION ONE THATS STILL DEFECTIVE. SO WHAT GOOD IS IT.

I have 4 of these still version one, and no hope of getting version4, I am just not spending any more time or effort on these, just hoping to give them bad PR for what they have done to me WASTING $600 ON 4 OF THESE.
 

DethGasp

Junior Member
Feb 2, 2017
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They say they will RMA, BUT YOU HAVE TO PAY SHIPPING, AND EVEN THEN YOU GET A VERSION ONE THATS STILL DEFECTIVE. SO WHAT GOOD IS IT.

I have 4 of these still version one, and no hope of getting version4, I am just not spending any more time or effort on these, just hoping to give them bad PR for what they have done to me WASTING $600 ON 4 OF THESE.
If you read the whole thread, you will see that your not the only one feeling the pain of owning a Liquitech. What a disaster.
 

IEC

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
Jun 10, 2004
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From Kyle Bennett at [H]:
Well, I do not think we will be doing that, but we did rescind our rewards on all of these TR4 coolers and added notes into the reviews.
Lol, I think that will get Enermax's attention.
 

Markfw

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May 16, 2002
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If you read the whole thread, you will see that your not the only one feeling the pain of owning a Liquitech. What a disaster.
Until they change their policies, they deserve all the bad PR they get. I hope they go bankrupt ! $600 down the toilet, and that just for me.
 

DethGasp

Junior Member
Feb 2, 2017
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Until they change their policies, they deserve all the bad PR they get. I hope they go bankrupt ! $600 down the toilet, and that just for me.
That's probably why their charging for the RMA now, gotta save them pennies up for severance pay for Enermax's scapegoat.
 

Atari2600

Senior member
Nov 22, 2016
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Right so, its a s**t sandwich. Whats the best alternative anyone?


Noctua 140 / 120 / 92 ? (if so which?)

Thermalright Silver Arrow TR4?


Another AIO that doesn't cover the full IHS?

Another unknown air cooler that also covers full IHS?


I don't feel like doing a custom loop - don't trust myself not to make a balls of it and I want a quick solution.

Profanity is not allowed in the tech forums (even starred out).

Daveybrat
AT Moderator
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Apr 27, 2000
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I haven't seen any reviews of the Silver Arrow TR4, but I would certainly like to see one.
 

dlerious

Senior member
Mar 4, 2004
648
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Right so, its a s**t sandwich. Whats the best alternative anyone?


Noctua 140 / 120 / 92 ? (if so which?)

Thermalright Silver Arrow TR4?


Another AIO that doesn't cover the full IHS?

Another unknown air cooler that also covers full IHS?


I don't feel like doing a custom loop - don't trust myself not to make a balls of it and I want a quick solution.
I'm not sure about AIOs, but for air there's Noctua, the Wraith Ripper, and Fryzen.
 

Markfw

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Where is or when is the wraith ripper on sale ? And where ?
 

dlerious

Senior member
Mar 4, 2004
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Where is or when is the wraith ripper on sale ? And where ?
Hardware Unboxed did a review of that and the Fryzen, but he said it wasn't available in US yet while Fryzen was the opposite, available in US but not Australia (unless you got them as part of a review sample or know someone who did).

Cooler Masters store is currently down so I couldn't see if they had it. Did find it one place for ripoff price ($60 over MSRP) http://www.nextwarehouse.com/item/?...MIurzl_v7d3QIVgh5pCh29rQxyEAYYASABEgIX6fD_BwE Sorry
 

dnavas

Senior member
Feb 25, 2017
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I'm not sure about AIOs, but for air there's Noctua, the Wraith Ripper, and Fryzen.
Well, the Noctua can't keep my 2950X under 90C/63C even without OCing. The CPU is in thermal throttle as soon as I hit 300W (at the wall). I'm definitely not getting 250W of cooling out of it, though in fairness they only advertise 180 for the 2950. If you're going to run standard 2133 or 2400 RAM, it's fine, but if you want faster stuff ....

BTW, I got my RAM stable under 3200 by using tighter (14) timings (I think it was trying to default to 16-15-15-35, and I'm running w/14-14-14-34). Having searched until my eyes bled, I found the NUMA setting hidden under CBS (really Asrock?), and AIDA64 is showing the 3200s as running 95GBps at 63.x ns of latency, as expected for "local"/channel mode.

Anyway, back to coolers. TR deserves a good water cooling solution. It also really, really wants wider vector pipes. Or maybe it's just my software :)
 

Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
17,539
963
136
Right so, its a s**t sandwich. Whats the best alternative anyone?


Noctua 140 / 120 / 92 ? (if so which?)

Thermalright Silver Arrow TR4?


Another AIO that doesn't cover the full IHS?

Another unknown air cooler that also covers full IHS?


I don't feel like doing a custom loop - don't trust myself not to make a balls of it and I want a quick solution.

Profanity is not allowed in the tech forums (even starred out).

Daveybrat
AT Moderator
Right now I have 3 using the Noctura 14, and none are OC'ed, and all stay in a decent temp range. Since they run Linux, not sure at the moment, but I tried under windows first, and it looked OK, so I booted linux, I just forget the number.
 

dlerious

Senior member
Mar 4, 2004
648
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Well, the Noctua can't keep my 2950X under 90C/63C even without OCing. The CPU is in thermal throttle as soon as I hit 300W (at the wall). I'm definitely not getting 250W of cooling out of it, though in fairness they only advertise 180 for the 2950. If you're going to run standard 2133 or 2400 RAM, it's fine, but if you want faster stuff ....

BTW, I got my RAM stable under 3200 by using tighter (14) timings (I think it was trying to default to 16-15-15-35, and I'm running w/14-14-14-34). Having searched until my eyes bled, I found the NUMA setting hidden under CBS (really Asrock?), and AIDA64 is showing the 3200s as running 95GBps at 63.x ns of latency, as expected for "local"/channel mode.

Anyway, back to coolers. TR deserves a good water cooling solution. It also really, really wants wider vector pipes. Or maybe it's just my software :)
I went with the Watercool Heatkiller IV block and custom loop for mine. Haven't tried air on Threadripper, but I'm surprised the Noctua struggles and that they don't have a D15 for TR4.
 
Apr 27, 2000
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The NH-D15 struggles to keep my 1800x cool @ 4 GHz. Granted it's pushing over 230W in the heaviest workloads, but I routinely hit temps above 70C if I run stress tests. And that's with 3000 rpm Noctua IndustrialPPC fans. Sounds like a damn windstorm in here, woooosh.

Need to find a way to strap a massive car radiator straight to the CPU socket with huge heatpipes.
 

dlerious

Senior member
Mar 4, 2004
648
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The NH-D15 struggles to keep my 1800x cool @ 4 GHz. Granted it's pushing over 230W in the heaviest workloads, but I routinely hit temps above 70C if I run stress tests. And that's with 3000 rpm Noctua IndustrialPPC fans. Sounds like a damn windstorm in here, woooosh.

Need to find a way to strap a massive car radiator straight to the CPU socket with huge heatpipes.
I'm not having any problems with mine. I'm only running 3.9 at 1.325v on a Crosshair Hero VI with just one of the 2 fans it came with. I'll have to check the numbers again later.
 
Apr 27, 2000
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I'm not having any problems with mine. I'm only running 3.9 at 1.325v on a Crosshair Hero VI with just one of the 2 fans it came with. I'll have to check the numbers again later.
I wouldn't say that I'm having problems, but I can tell that anything less than the NH-D15 and there would be trouble. I really need a bigger heatsink for this CPU (and future ones) or I just need to go WC at some point, as much as I don't want to do so. I could probably get more out of this chip if I could keep temps below 50C at load.

For those of you that wanted to see the Silver Arrow TR4 vs Wraith Ripper, here you go.
Includes WCing results as well.
Interesting. Neither aircooler can touch the Raystorm. I mean, not even close, once you go into PBO mode. I think if you threw a big enough rad with enough flow at a 2950X, that you could hit 4.4 GHz on that thing. I like the idea of being able to aircool one of those monsters and get middling performance out of it, kind of like using a bang/buck HSF on a mainstream socket. But WC setups seem disproportionately desirable for the 2950X compared to results from mainstream sockets of yore. I remember stuff like the NH-D15 trading blows with AiOs. That just won't happen on TR2.
 

IEC

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
Jun 10, 2004
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For those of you that wanted to see the Silver Arrow TR4 vs Wraith Ripper, here you go.
Includes WCing results as well.
Amazon finally shipped the 1920X I ordered back in August at $249 (price mistake?). Guess I'm in the market now for a cooler, some RAM, and a X399 motherboard.

Thanks for the [H] link. I might have to consider rolling the dice on an AIO to start.
 

dlerious

Senior member
Mar 4, 2004
648
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116
I wouldn't say that I'm having problems, but I can tell that anything less than the NH-D15 and there would be trouble. I really need a bigger heatsink for this CPU (and future ones) or I just need to go WC at some point, as much as I don't want to do so. I could probably get more out of this chip if I could keep temps below 50C at load.
I'm not sure of my ambient temps (between 70-80F). My max (tdie) was 54.4C, max fan speed was 1061 as reported by HWINFO64 and max system draw was 333 watts including monitor as reported by my UPS. I can do over 4GHz, but temps really start getting out of control when I start getting near or over 1.4v , so I decided to run 1.325v and go for max at that voltage.
 

dnavas

Senior member
Feb 25, 2017
240
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Well, the Noctua can't keep my 2950X under 90C/63C even without OCing.
So, I just got my liqtech ii (I know, I know -- just pretend it's from someone else). Surprises -- the LEDs come on even though I don't have the LED cable installed. :( The base of the pump is quite warm, but it takes awhile for the hose to warm up. I can't detect any pump noise at all, though the BIOS does say it's running 2800rpm. Idle temps are lower, but still Tdie 40C (~13C over ambient, and actually, 40C is an average -- it's all over the map between 35C and 45C, which plays crazy games with the fan curves :sigh: ). In PBO mode running my video tests, all cores active at 4.05Ghz the CPU pulls 220W (320+ at the wall) and hits Tdie 65C without much trouble at all. That's better than hitting 65C at 3.7G with the air cooler, but I was hoping for something under 60C. Looks like I have to go custom with a RayStorm if I'm going to get lower peaks.... :ugh:

My RAM is stable at 3200CL14. Although 3466 survives Prime, it doesn't survive my video editor. My suggestion is to stick with the 3200 sticks, but, ymmv. Video editing tests are mixed. Some items obviously faster than my 1800X, others only marginally so. The 4:2:2 FHD footage is obviously faster in multi-cam, while the 4k footage clocks in at 67% CPU use vs the 1800X's 76%. Not sure how twice the number of active units provides so little in return, but there you are. If the GPU were busy, I'd be willing to blame it, but it isn't. Also, whatever features of the CPU Edius is using, they stress the heat even better than Prime does. The CPU will hit 92C+ about as fast as HWMonitor updates after I push play -- and that's with only 46% of the CPU busy! If I really crank on the editor, the system is (somehow) willing to let tdie exceed 68C by at least 5C before throttling. It throttles in Prime95 more aggressively.

Prime95 will pull 230+W at the package, or about 350W at the wall. PBO is only willing to boost to 3.95, although that's better than the OC I applied to my 1800X, so it's hard to complain there.

I should try to collect my thoughts in a review, I suppose :|
 


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