Thinking of joining Air Force, experience?

[Craig234]

Everyone has a duty to disobey unlawful orders (ie killing them the innocent.) Most homicides by US forces are in self defense. And most of the straight up killings aren't done by members of the military.

You're correct, but that doesn't address unjust wars. I'm not talking about the relatively few 'unlawful orders' that are nothing compared to the issue of unjust wars.

 

[ichy]

You're correct, but that doesn't address unjust wars. I'm not talking about the relatively few 'unlawful orders' that are nothing compared to the issue of unjust wars.

The OP started this thread to ask for real advice, not to hear lefty horseshit about eeeevil US imperialism.

 

[AyashiKaibutsu]

wait.. air force guys run??

i thought PT test was only once a year?

PT program varies depending on where you are, but it's generally 3 days a week of 45-60 minutes of unit guided exercise usually at least 30 minutes of it being cardio (if not everyday than one or two of the days). It varies greatly though and you could have things like not have to do as much if you maintain certain PT scores and such.

 

[Nebor]

You're correct, but that doesn't address unjust wars. I'm not talking about the relatively few 'unlawful orders' that are nothing compared to the issue of unjust wars.

I hate to break it to you, but anyone that's joined the military or stayed in it for the past 10 years (or more depending on how far back the unlawful wars go in your book) is a willing participant in these conflicts. Literally everyone I know joined the Army so they could go fight in Afghanistan, myself included.

It opened my eyes. I'll never support US ground invasion "wars of choice" again. But I know plenty of people that are chomping at the bit to roll into Iran or Syria behind a column of M1A tanks and Apache gunships.

 

[Craig234]

I hate to break it to you, but anyone that's joined the military or stayed in it for the past 10 years (or more depending on how far back the unlawful wars go in your book) is a willing participant in these conflicts.

I know. No news.

It opened my eyes.

Would you be willing to post a more complete story?

Again. In some other thread at some other time.
admin allisolm

A similar sentiment made General Smedly Butler write his famous book (and John Kerry become a national leader of 'veterans against war) and try to educate people what they learned.

 

[OBLAMA2009]

Been thinking this for a while, seems like a good way to get some of the school loans off my back and serve my country.

I have been posting on the military forums, but those guys expect me to know every term before I even ask a simple question, so i'll ask here.

I currently work IT, as a network administrator, and will have my BS complete in early 2014 (i'll be 27 years old, shit haha).

So I was thinking of going down the route of getting in with the air force as an officer, and then get out, and get a job with the one of the big government agencies out there, CIA/NSA/FBI, that sort of thing. It also seems to be very helpful when applying for jobs to have a VA preference.

So what jobs would be a good idea, assuming I can test into them, that I could take into the civilian world?

dont be a retard. youd just be throwing a couple years of your life away when you could otherwise be getting valuable experience and building a career

 

[OBLAMA2009]

I hate to break it to you, but anyone that's joined the military or stayed in it for the past 10 years (or more depending on how far back the unlawful wars go in your book) is a willing participant in these conflicts. Literally everyone I know joined the Army so they could go fight in Afghanistan, myself included.

It opened my eyes. I'll never support US ground invasion "wars of choice" again. But I know plenty of people that are chomping at the bit to roll into Iran or Syria behind a column of M1A tanks and Apache gunships.

good post. its almost unconscionable to join the military while the us is embroiled in these current wars.

 

[OutHouse]

You're correct, but that doesn't address unjust wars. I'm not talking about the relatively few 'unlawful orders' that are nothing compared to the issue of unjust wars.

flat out thread capping bullshit.

 

[OutHouse]

wait.. air force guys run??

i thought PT test was only once a year?

lol yea imagine that.

5 mile formation run 3 times a week. some SP (security police) squadrons were more hard core about it than others but generally you could expect it.

 

[Nebor]

good post. its almost unconscionable to join the military while the us is embroiled in these current wars.

I totally disagree with that statement. Also wars?

 

[Craig234]

flat out thread capping bullshit.

Good description of your post, and unfortuately this one responsing.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Good description of your post, and unfortuately this one responsing.

If people did not serve; you would not be able to spew your BS.

 

[Nintendesert]

That's a terrible reason to join... I wanted to enlist (despite having a degree) cause I wanted to "serve" and be among the 1% of the population that's served (Canada, so even less than US). Once I stopped blocking out the fact that you're really just serving politicians and the corporations nowadays that get them elected and give them kick-backs, I gave up on the whole nobility and honour thing.

Don't get me wrong. You ARE serving your country. Those corporations and politicians represent your country. Whether it's "noble" and the "freedom" thing they make it up to be is up to you - different people, different values.

My other reasons for joining were to shoot shit, go places, play with expensive toys, and to say "I served". Risking getting maimed and screwing up my mind just wasn't worth it to me in the end. I can do all of the above if I'm rich, which may be harder, but lower risk.

I'm not saying that's the reason to join, that however is the choice he is facing and those two outcomes are going to be presented to him based on his choice through the rest of his life. I'm simply stating only he can determine, and he needs to be very honest with himself, with which he can be ok with.

Some people can live with regret, others can't. He also needs to figure out if he'll regret not joining at all.

You made your choice not to serve, that's one only you have to live with. If you are completely honest with yourself to yourself and are ok with that, then everything else about it doesn't matter.

If you keep reciting that spiel you just puked into this thread to keep lying to yourself, then I'm sorry you have to live with that. Many do.

 

[Imp]

You need to come to terms with that on your own. If you are ok living with the regret (as already expressed by posters in this thread) and only walking up and thanking someone for their service as opposed to sharing a beer with another vet then there you go.
It's something only you can admit to yourself one way or another.

I'm not saying that's the reason to join, that however is the choice he is facing and those two outcomes are going to be presented to him based on his choice through the rest of his life. I'm simply stating only he can determine, and he needs to be very honest with himself, with which he can be ok with.

Some people can live with regret, others can't. He also needs to figure out if he'll regret not joining at all.

You made your choice not to serve, that's one only you have to live with. If you are completely honest with yourself to yourself and are ok with that, then everything else about it doesn't matter.

If you keep reciting that spiel you just puked into this thread to keep lying to yourself, then I'm sorry you have to live with that. Many do.

Your response was great up to the last sentence.

I'm not thread crapping nor lying to myself. Lying to myself would be "I should have joined the Army out of school to make $35k/year so I could more than likely be deployed to Afghanistan during my 5 year contract to help people, then leave once the country was on the road to prosperity and could stand on its own".

OP is considering joining and morality is a huge part of committing yourself to serving an entity for at least 3 years with no way to easily get out early with good outcomes. Explaining my decision is just insight. And I'm not trying to disrespect someone "serving their country". Just do it for the right reasons because you may be disappointed if one of your reasons to do it is to "do good".

Also, that's rather simplistic to say there's "two outcomes". Here's some of the outcomes I can think of:
- Don't enlist, have a shitty life with no regrets on not enlisting.
- Don't enlist, have a great life with no regrets. Period.
- Don't enlist, have a good life, but thank veterans for their service, moderate regret.
- Enlist, have a terrible time in the service, regret your decision to join.
- Enlist, have a great time, share beers with vets.
- <High suicide rate among military individuals>...

The military and service serves its purpose and is good in many ways, but it shouldn't be a decision the OP should take lightly. That's a cliff notes and only intention of this post, so don't try to spin it.

Sorry you took it personally?

 

[ViviTheMage]

I think, overall, the thread has been very helpful, compared to other forums/threads I have read on the subject. They tend to get backtracked to politics over what it was like for those who did go, and those who did not...after a pretty healthy raised I received today, I might end up looking more at reserves and getting jobs with a clearance.

Maybe I am being niave, but I imagine I won't end up near front lines, I imagine my job in a chair, AC, looking at servers/networking stuff all day...what I do today. With a side of physical requirements, and shooting some guns.

 

[ichy]

Maybe I am being niave, but I imagine I won't end up near front lines, I imagine my job in a chair, AC, looking at servers/networking stuff all day...what I do today. With a side of physical requirements, and shooting some guns.

You should never go into the military (at least in this day and age) with the assumption that you won't see combat.

Re: advice about joining, check out tank-net.com. There's a pretty big former military contingent over there. Be careful how you word your post though, if you say you're joining just for the benefits and to get a security clearance you will get flamed to death.

 

[Imp]

I think, overall, the thread has been very helpful, compared to other forums/threads I have read on the subject. They tend to get backtracked to politics over what it was like for those who did go, and those who did not...after a pretty healthy raised I received today, I might end up looking more at reserves and getting jobs with a clearance.

Maybe I am being niave, but I imagine I won't end up near front lines, I imagine my job in a chair, AC, looking at servers/networking stuff all day...what I do today. With a side of physical requirements, and shooting some guns.

Meh, you bothered to ask for a wide variety of opinions, so good on you. Do whatever you think is right.

But if you want to get some "serious" introspective thinking done, tell your family, talk to a recruiter in person, get yourself in shape to pass the basic physical requirements, and go sign all the submission forms. I did all that and the shit finally hit the fan in my head.

 

[ViviTheMage]

What was your response to all of the talking you did Imp? What made you not join exactly?

In what capacity could I see myself being deployed in, with a 'computer' job?

 

[OutHouse]

In what capacity could I see myself being deployed in, with a 'computer' job?

support role. you could go any where.

 

[OutHouse]

I cranked out 100 miles during OCS. Last three were on a bum knee.

Voluntarily took the 10 mile run with the troops when they were scheduled.

Sometimes exercise can be fun

sometimes is the key word. running at Grand Forks AFB in February with a ambient temp below zero is not fun, it flat out sucks.

 

[Nebor]

What was your response to all of the talking you did Imp? What made you not join exactly?

In what capacity could I see myself being deployed in, with a 'computer' job?

My SNAP (SIPR\NIPR Access Point, basically a military VSAT) operator was an Air Force guy (E-3.) He went out on foot patrols several times a week due to manning requirements. Back in the states, he works in an air force base network operations center, the type of cushy job you're expecting. When airmen and sailors are deployed to Afghanistan, they often end up outside the wire right alongside the soldiers and marines.

Or like I cited earlier in this thread, we had an Air Force major, who's job was to build flight schedules (Air Liason Officer) get killed on a foot patrol. The brigade commander just happened to ask him to come along that day, for whatever reason. He had an indoor, cushy desk job too.

 

[ViviTheMage]

good to know, I will take that into mind too.

 

[Craig234]

If people did not serve; you would not be able to spew your BS.

A small number, enough for defense, you're right, and I support that defense.

The huge number in excess of that, who don't 'defend' but are for 'power', you're wrong.

Some people, like you, are simplistic and can't tell the difference.

Read Eisenhower's 'Cross of Iron' speech about the cost of excessive military.

 

[Nintendesert]

A small number, enough for defense, you're right, and I support that defense.

The huge number in excess of that, who don't 'defend' but are for 'power', you're wrong.

Some people, like you, are simplistic and can't tell the difference.

Read Eisenhower's 'Cross of Iron' speech about the cost of excessive military.

Continue to be a consumer whore and create the need for our empire while continually decrying said empire. :awe:

 

[Imp]

What was your response to all of the talking you did Imp? What made you not join exactly?

In what capacity could I see myself being deployed in, with a 'computer' job?

In short, family threw a complete shit fit considering the danger concerning the job, which is understandable considering it was 2008 when Iraq and Afghanistan were on full blast. Friends weren't very supportive either - I'm in Canada where the military culture isn't that great and being ex-military isn't as respected as in the US probably. Also, I had a degree, and was planning on enlisting - I did not think I was competitive for direct officer entry.

Recruiter knew less about the job than I did, and honestly, it felt like he was doing his job, and was neither encouraging nor discouraging me. Nice guy though.

As for why I didn't join, lots of reasons. My reasons FOR joining were to serve my country, do something very few in the country has done, play with expensive toys, go to "exotic" places, and help people in shitty countries. I was going for rear-echelon trades, so I could get onto the Disaster Assistance and Relief Team (deployed to earthquake, natural disaster zones).

Honestly, I started losing my desire to join when I started learning about the politics (huge one, but I'll keep that shit to myself) involved in determining which wars are fought, the fact that you're government property and do/go where they tell you, you can't just quit when you feel like, you are a soldier first and one of the first things they do is train you to kill other people. I feel bad for bumping into people, so not a good fit? You do whatever the army needs you to do where it needs you.

That little exercise made me respect servicepeople more, but no thanks, not unless I get conscripted. If you can get over all of the above, go for it, and good for you.