TheVerge.com: current Windows Phone devices will not get 'Apollo' upgrade

[Puddle Jumper]

I picked up a W7 phone a few weeks back and the sales rep over the phone assured me that the current phones would be upgraded to W8.

It doesn't get much more clearer or official than that - looks like we can put this discussion to bed.

QED ...

Sales reps will say whatever it takes to sell you the device. They have no more information then we do when it comes to these things.

 

[sequoia464]

Sales reps will say whatever it takes to sell you the device. They have no more information then we do when it comes to these things.

Just being humorous there, I'm hoping W8 will work on my phone but not counting on it.

 

[shortylickens]

The previous topic:
WebOS on a phone is awesome. On a tablet its just meh.
Also it was the first to do many things which are now standard. Shame they never got the huge app inventory.

 

[Puddle Jumper]

Just being humorous there, I'm hoping W8 will work on my phone but not counting on it.

Ah, that makes more sense.

 

[lothar]

Which is the sensible attitude. You buy a product because you are happy with what it is not what you think it might become.

People should be buying phones for what they are not what they will be. A phone doesn't become worse than it is because newer software came out. If the device isn't good enough for you as is buy something else. My $0.02.

But yet people keep trashing on Android because many of their phones don't get updates at all or take 4-6+ months to get Gingerbread, ICS, and whatever the next Android OS is.
Remember that OS update infographic comparing numerous Android phones to iOS?

Why is it that when WP7 does it, it's "okay" and people are quiet all of a sudden?
If I ever see a WP7 user complaining about slow(or the complete lack of) Android updates, I'll be sure to link them this thread.

I buy a Nexus because I expect future updates from Google for 2 years. If Google updated it only once 3 months after release and decides to cut off all future updates, I'd be pissed. Why get a nexus when you could have picked up any other phone on the Android commodity market?
I consider the phone for what it is now and also for what it "could" be in the future since I'm paying $600 for it. That why I only consider Nexus phones or phones with full support within the modding community.

 

[deathBOB]

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/nunos/archive/2012/04/19/my-comments-on-windows-phone.aspx

My comments on Windows Phone (English)

I recently participated in an interview with the Portuguese website Zwame, where I made some comments on the future of Windows Phone that created confusion. Rumors are swirling, so I feel the need to clarify my statements.

The point I was attempting to make was simply that existing Windows Phone applications will run on the next version of Windows Phone. This is the same guidance that Microsoft shared late last year.

I mistakenly confused app compatibility with phone updateability, which caused the rumors we saw yesterday. I did not intend to give the impression I was offering new guidance on any products under development or their upgradeability.

While we have given Windows Phone developers this preliminary guidance on app compatibility to help them with long term project planning, Microsoft does not have any further news to share on future products at this time.

As always, you can tell I am very excited about Windows Phone and I hope you are too!

Nuno Silva

Its not an encouraging sign when MS is silent on this issue. I did like the fact that I was sure to get most future updates when I bought my iPhone 4S. It's too bad MS can't get their act together, it's not like WP has any serious flaws.

 

[notposting]

In other news, WP8 has been spotted on the Lumia 610 (bottom of the barrel) and Lumia 800. There is no official word yet...I'm sure MS would like it to run on the older equipment, but making sure that updates will go smoothly and quietly for customers/carriers/manufacturers will receive a lot of testing before they can announce that. The limited hardware options should make things a lot more reasonable though.

 

[Ns1]

I consider the phone for what it is now and also for what it "could" be in the future since I'm paying $600 for it.

+1

 

[WelshBloke]

+1

In two years it'll be lodged at the back of a drawer or on eBay.

 

[SithSolo1]

http://www.phonearena.com/news/Paul...dows-Phone-8-for-any-current-handsets_id29342

 

[WelshBloke]

http://www.phonearena.com/news/Paul...dows-Phone-8-for-any-current-handsets_id29342

I wouldnt necessarily treat anything Paul Thurrott says as gospel, however he does have some really good contacts at Microsoft.

Maybe the growing weight of internet anger will get Microsoft to put a load of energy into porting WP8 onto the older handsets.

If it is because they are too underpowered to run it then that Nokia CEO is going to look a right tit!

 

[pantsaregood]

If this is true, Microsoft is shooting themselves in the foot. They may finally be obtaining a foothold, and I've supported the OS since launch. I loved my HD7, and my Titan is amazing.

The HD2, a phone from early 2010, is successfully running Android 4.0 at this point. In all of Microsoft's ability to extract great performance out of minimal hardware, you expect me to believe a 1.5 GHz CPU can't run something less bloated than ICS?

The HD2 is internally identical to the HD7. The CPU and GPU are significantly slower than the Titan. 50% higher CPU clock speed, as well as being faster per clock.

 

[WelshBloke]

It kinda reinforces the idea that Microsoft have been flailing around madly in the mobile area since WM6.1.
Hopefully, with WP8 they will have a clear vision and direction they want to head in.
I think there's definitely space in the mobile sector for another big player and I'd quite like to go back to Microsoft smartphones one day.

 

[Puddle Jumper]

The HD2, a phone from early 2010, is successfully running Android 4.0 at this point. In all of Microsoft's ability to extract great performance out of minimal hardware, you expect me to believe a 1.5 GHz CPU can't run something less bloated than ICS?

WP8 isn't WP7, it will be based on the NT kernel like Windows 7 and 8 instead of Windows CE so it's not going to be less bloated than ICS. Considering that all of the Windows 8 ARM devices will be Tegra 3 or better MS is likely going to use similar hardware for WP8.

Basically WP7 is looking like KIN 2.0, a one off system that Ms will abandon in favor of their next attempt at competing in the mobile market.

 

[shabby]

Hopefully, with WP8 they will have a clear vision and direction they want to head in.

Hmm could of swore that's what wp7 was.

 

[zerocool84]

Hmm could of swore that's what wp7 was.

I'm laughing at the new Lumia 900 commercials that says that every smartphone before it was a beta test phone. Obviously WP7 was a beta test since none are going to be upgradeable to WP8.

 

[Zivic]

I'm laughing at the new Lumia 900 commercials that says that every smartphone before it was a beta test phone. Obviously WP7 was a beta test since none are going to be upgradeable to WP8.

without official word, you are making an assumption.

 

[deathBOB]

It kinda reinforces the idea that Microsoft have been flailing around madly in the mobile area since WM6.1.
Hopefully, with WP8 they will have a clear vision and direction they want to head in.
I think there's definitely space in the mobile sector for another big player and I'd quite like to go back to Microsoft smartphones one day.

That's MS's MO outside of the enterprise realm.

 

[darkewaffle]

Aside from the fact it's still all speculation, I don't really see the big deal even if it is true. If you buy a WP7 phone you should be buying it because WP7 is good for you, not because you want WP8. Kind of like people don't buy new Android phones because they think they'll get "Chocolate Mousse" or whatever they decide to call version 5; they buy it because they're happy with the experience now.

 

[preslove]

WP8 isn't WP7, it will be based on the NT kernel like Windows 7 and 8 instead of Windows CE so it's not going to be less bloated than ICS. Considering that all of the Windows 8 ARM devices will be Tegra 3 or better MS is likely going to use similar hardware for WP8.

Basically WP7 is looking like KIN 2.0, a one off system that Ms will abandon in favor of their next attempt at competing in the mobile market.

yep

 

[WelshBloke]

Aside from the fact it's still all speculation, I don't really see the big deal even if it is true. If you buy a WP7 phone you should be buying it because WP7 is good for you, not because you want WP8. Kind of like people don't buy new Android phones because they think they'll get "Chocolate Mousse" or whatever they decide to call version 5; they buy it because they're happy with the experience now.

I think its more of a general hint to Microsoft's thinking and planning.

On the one hand you've got the Nokia CEO saying that no phones need dual cores and jokes about beta OSs and on the other the fact (assuming its true) that single core phones dont have the hardware to run WP8 and that WP7 is about to be retired with no upgrade path (short of buying a new phone) for existing users.

It looks like either Nokia dont have a clue what MS have in the works or that they are prepared to bullshit their customers to a ridiculous degree.

(this is again assuming that the rumours of no upgrade are true)

 

[MrX8503]

I'm laughing at the new Lumia 900 commercials that says that every smartphone before it was a beta test phone. Obviously WP7 was a beta test since none are going to be upgradeable to WP8.

lol so true. Everything from MS has been a "beta test" since the death of WinMo.

If WP7 devices don't get WP8, thats gonna be a big hit for MS. They're basically cutting their losses and starting over. Smartphones aren't cheap, they're a luxury item and consumers should demand every update that is possible on their mobile device.

If you're stuck in a contract for 2 years, you should get at least 2 years of updates.

 

[Eug]

Aside from the fact it's still all speculation, I don't really see the big deal even if it is true. If you buy a WP7 phone you should be buying it because WP7 is good for you, not because you want WP8. Kind of like people don't buy new Android phones because they think they'll get "Chocolate Mousse" or whatever they decide to call version 5; they buy it because they're happy with the experience now.

I see it as a pretty big deal myself. If I was a Lumia 900 owner, and got confirmation that I'd be stuck in Win 7 forever, I'd be totally pissed.

BTW, I would never buy a current Android device if it was not upgradable to 4.

 

[smartpatrol]

Aside from the fact it's still all speculation, I don't really see the big deal even if it is true. If you buy a WP7 phone you should be buying it because WP7 is good for you, not because you want WP8. Kind of like people don't buy new Android phones because they think they'll get "Chocolate Mousse" or whatever they decide to call version 5; they buy it because they're happy with the experience now.

I disagree with this sentiment. Software is a living, evolving thing that is changing constantly. New features, performance enhancements, bug fixes, security updates etc. are coming all the time, especially with a rapidly-maturing and highly competitive smartphone OS market.

IMO smartphone users should demand that their software be kept up-to-date, especially if they bought a flagship device like the Lumia 900. I would be incredibly pissed off if I bought an Android smartphone 6 months ago and found out it will never be upgraded to ICS. In the future, I will only buy Nexus devices or iPhones for this reason.

Another thing is, I thought "less fragmentation" was supposed to be one of the advantages of having a closed OS with strict hardware requirements. I really thought that MS were taking the high ground with Windows Phone. The fact that all their Lumia 900, Titan 2 etc. owners will be left with an outdated OS 6 months after they bought it really makes me question the value of MS's approach.

 

[darkewaffle]

I disagree with this sentiment. Software is a living, evolving thing that is changing constantly. New features, performance enhancements, bug fixes, security updates etc. are coming all the time, especially with a rapidly-maturing and highly competitive smartphone OS market.

IMO smartphone users should demand that their software be kept up-to-date, especially if they bought a flagship device like the Lumia 900. I would be incredibly pissed off if I bought an Android smartphone 6 months ago and found out it will never be upgraded to ICS. In the future, I will only buy Nexus devices or iPhones for this reason.

But the same can be said for many industries. Each year your CPU is upstaged, your car's engine is outdone, better lightbulbs are released, and even the movies you have on DVD are updated for Blu-ray. Yet you don't see people fussing over whether or not the new motor will fit in their 'old' car or complaining that their brand new DVD player won't play blu-rays or that their 'old' CPU won't fit in the new socket (well, you do around here a bit lol).

And I think ICS is in somewhat of a different boat because it (so I hear) brings much needed updates to Android. Whereas I think WP7, as it is, is already a fairly 'complete' platform. So coming from Gingerbread, you would already have this defined idea of what you're missing because of it's flaws. WP7 is not flawless by any stretch of the imagination but it does already present such a good user experience that I don't think WP8 will drastically change it. After all, WP7 itself has been very influential on WP8's "Metro" design.

Another thing is, I thought "less fragmentation" was supposed to be one of the advantages of having a closed OS with strict hardware requirements. I really thought that MS were taking the high ground with Windows Phone. The fact that all their Lumia 900, Titan 2 etc. owners will be left with an outdated OS 6 months after they bought it really makes me question the value of MS's approach.

While I don't necessarily agree that 'fragmentation' is much more than a buzzword, I also don't see what's fragmented about it. Whether the rumor is true or false, either 'all' or 'none' of the current Windows phones will get WP8. Seems pretty unified to me.

Outdated is kind of a literal interpretation of the word; just because there's something newer doesn't mean the older item is obsolete. While I'm sure WP7 won't get all the bells and whistles that WP8 gets, I would imagine it will still receive security and some functionality patches. WinMo6, in spite of it's turbulent history, still received updates for three years from 2007-2010.

I think MS is taking the 'high ground' by trying to ensure that WP8 is the modern, flexible, and hopefully durable platform they need it to be. WP7, for all the progress it's made, is still based off fundamentals that were released 16 years ago. One of the longest standing complaints against Windows has been 'bloat', but it's also that bloat that gave users so much leeway with regards to backwards compatibility and interoperability. You can't have your cake and eat it too though, with the kernel change you get a leaner and faster platform but you end up losing some other pieces in that process.

Personally if I could get a good WP7 phone on Verizon right now, I'd want to because I like the WP7 experience already. Not because I want it to be a WP8 experience eventually.