The real derangement syndrome, AOCDS

[blackangst1]

This 93 trillion number, is that a per-year value?

Over 10 years

edit: HERE is the full breakdown

 

[zinfamous]

This 93 trillion number, is that a per-year value?

of course it isn't, but that doesn't matter when you have a well-honed tactic of being fluid with the use of the same numbers, depending on the angle of your argument.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

The fact is, the New Green Deal is estimated to cost 93TRILLION. If we taxed ALL income over 1M at 100% it would bring in only just under 700M. Wheres the rest gonna come from?

Taxes on shit that pollutes, maybe we all have to keep our cars and phones another 2 years before replacing them, maybe more taxes on everyone else, smart planning and use the savings to pay down the debt that is generated.
For example if we modernize the power grid and gain 20-30% more energy from it because so much less power is lost, tax power a little more and put the extra into paying down the debt.
Climate is changing, we can all see it changing. We’ve been putting off doing something for a long time. We will have to spend more to make up for last sins.

 

[blackangst1]

Taxes on shit that pollutes, maybe we all have to keep our cars and phones another 2 years before replacing them, maybe more taxes on everyone else, smart planning and use the savings to pay down the debt that is generated.
For example if we modernize the power grid and gain 20-30% more energy from it because so much less power is lost, tax power a little more and put the extra into paying down the debt.
Climate is changing, we can all see it changing. We’ve been putting off doing something for a long time. We will have to spend more to make up for last sins.

The IRS collected 3.3 Trillion from all sources in 2016. Tell us how AOC's 93 Trillion over 10 years will be paid for.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Over 10 years

edit: HERE is the full breakdown

And here's Senator Markeys reply.

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-e...s-ocasio-cortezs-green-new-deal-could-cost-93

 

[nakedfrog]

The IRS collected 3.3 Trillion from all sources in 2016. Tell us how AOC's 93 Trillion over 10 years will be paid for.

No, you tell us how a plan that doesn't have specific measures and details can have a precise dollar amount attached.
Or don't, honestly, I mostly wanted to point out your disingenuous data. I'll go back to just dodging the spittle flying from your frothy mouth.

 

[nakedfrog]

Taxes on shit that pollutes, maybe we all have to keep our cars and phones another 2 years before replacing them, maybe more taxes on everyone else, smart planning and use the savings to pay down the debt that is generated.
For example if we modernize the power grid and gain 20-30% more energy from it because so much less power is lost, tax power a little more and put the extra into paying down the debt.
Climate is changing, we can all see it changing. We’ve been putting off doing something for a long time. We will have to spend more to make up for last sins.

Dammit, I was led to believe some guy had already died for those

 

[blackangst1]

No, you tell us how a plan that doesn't have specific measures and details can have a precise dollar amount attached.
Or don't, honestly, I mostly wanted to point out your disingenuous data. I'll go back to just dodging the spittle flying from your frothy mouth.

Read the fucking link I posted asshat. Its detailed. If you have a problem with it, I look forward to your detailed analysis in detail.

 

[nakedfrog]

Read the fucking link I posted asshat. Its detailed. If you have a problem with it, I look forward to your detailed analysis in detail.

I'm just going to ignore it, because it's based on speculation versus any actual concrete legislation that's been written. But you have fun with your rage, Frothy.

 

[blackangst1]

And here's Senator Markeys reply.

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-e...s-ocasio-cortezs-green-new-deal-could-cost-93

Ah yes. A detailed analysis of the cost breakdown is refuted with a tweet. ROFL. Good answer. We all know how accurate tweets are, dont we? Im sure Markey read the whole thing and I anxiously await his detailed rebuttal.

 

[blackangst1]

I'm just going to ignore it, because it's based on speculation versus any actual concrete legislation that's been written. But you have fun with your rage, Frothy.

Of course you are.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Ah yes. A detailed analysis of the cost breakdown is refuted with a tweet. ROFL. Good answer. We all know how accurate tweets are, dont we? Im sure Markey read the whole thing and I anxiously await his detailed rebuttal.

*Shrug*, refute what he said.

 

[blackangst1]

*Shrug*, refute what he said.

Which part?

This quote?

Any so-called "analysis" of the #GreenNewDeal that includes artificially inflated numbers that rely on lazy assumptions, incl. about policies that aren’t even in the resolution is bogus. Putting a price on a resolution of principles, not policies, is just Big Oil misinformation.

He's asserting the analysis done was based on assumptions and policies, when in fact if you read the analysis is based on legislation and law already in the books. If Markey is calling out the analysis the burdenis on him to prove it. All he did is tweet.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

The IRS collected 3.3 Trillion from all sources in 2016. Tell us how AOC's 93 Trillion over 10 years will be paid for.

Let’s wait for a concrete plan instead of an outline.
I’m just saying we all need to pay extra because we have been dodging it for so long. Let’s wait for the concrete plan before figuring out how to pay for it all at once.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Which part?

It's just a tweet, not much to it.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Let’s wait for a concrete plan instead of an outline.
I’m just saying we all need to pay extra because we have been dodging it for so long. Let’s wait for the concrete plan before figuring out how to pay for it all at once.

No, let's fear monger based on a conservative think tanks speculation, and we'll pick the highest amount they said too.

 

[nakedfrog]

No, let's fear monger based on a conservative think tanks speculation, and we'll pick the highest amount they said too.

It sure is easier than actually thinking about it.

 

[ewdotson]

Two observations on their breakdown:

1) Even taking their numbers at face value, I think it shows just how hard it would be to pin meaningful numbers on the GND. They do *not* estimate it's cost at $93T. They estimate it at somewhere between $51 and $93T. That's ... quite the range. And seriously - the GND is not a set of concrete proposals. One would assume that there'd be a whole lot of negotiation if there were a serious push to turn it into real policy.

2) Holy crap, can we really promise food security for every American for only $1.5B? Why on earth aren't we already doing that then? (I assume the answer is "greed".)

 

[blackangst1]

It sure is easier than actually thinking about it.

Modus operandi of a keyboard warrior.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

No, let's fear monger based on a conservative think tanks speculation, and we'll pick the highest amount they said too.

That’s my point, how about breaking up a big job into smaller chunks and handling it over decades.
How about we study what needs to be done first and how to do it in a cost effective manner.
The Green Deal is simply an outline it is not a plan.

 

[blackangst1]

Two observations on their breakdown:

1) Even taking their numbers at face value, I think it shows just how hard it would be to pin meaningful numbers on the GND. They do *not* estimate it's cost at $93T. They estimate it at somewhere between $51 and $93T. That's ... quite the range. And seriously - the GND is not a set of concrete proposals. One would assume that there'd be a whole lot of negotiation if there were a serious push to turn it into real policy.

2) Holy crap, can we really promise food security for every American for only $1.5B? Why on earth aren't we already doing that then? (I assume the answer is "greed".)

OK lets take the low end 51Trillion over 10 years. At current levels, the IRS will take in 33.33 Trillion in 10 years. Wheres the extra 18Trillion going to come from?

 

[ch33zw1z]

That’s my point, how about breaking up a big job into smaller chunks and handling it over decades.
How about we study what needs to be done first and how to do it in a cost effective manner.
The Green Deal is simply an outline it is not a plan.

You're not watching enough fox news.

How about we just continue to butt fuck the planet and run in circles screaming in 20 years.

Those crazy tree huggers wanna ruin the fun.

 

[Greenman]

Has AOC ever said that she has a plan other than the bullet points she produced? That's what I'm waiting for.
I think the 9.3 trillion a year number is every bit as nebulous as the outline.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Has AOC ever said that she has a plan other than the bullet points she produced? That's what I'm waiting for.
I think the 9.3 trillion a year number is every bit as nebulous as the outline.

To my understanding it’s all a set of goals or principles it is meant to be something to talk about.
Obviously it’s going to cost money to clean, pickup and filter all the shit that’s been churning around.

 

[nakedfrog]

Modus operandi of a keyboard warrior.

Hm...

Noun. keyboard warrior (plural keyboard warriors) (informal, derogatory) A person who behaves aggressively and/or in an inflammatory manner in online text-based discussion media, but at the same time does not behave similarly in real life, potentially due to cowardice, introversion or shyness.

I daresay that describes one of us here in our interactions today rather better than the other. Food for thought.