The Official iPhone 5 Thread (Liveblog links inside!)

[MrX8503]

If the A6 is successful, we'll see Apple designing their own chips from here on out. This benefits Apple in that they're able to design a chip for their own specific needs in a timely manner. I can't wait to see Anand's review of the A6.

 

[bearxor]

That's an average score for the international GS3. If you turn off power-saving and a few other things, you can get it up to 1750 or so.

A6 is definitely fast.

Considering thats slightly faster being optimized for the test and a 40% increase in clock speed, its definitely a speedy chip. I saw some 1800mhz s3's hitting over 2100.

Wondering if Apple will bump clock speeds in the iPad (2013) faster than 1ghz. Would be nice to see a 1.5ghz A6.

Does anyone think the 8" iPad will be getting this chip instead of some variant of the A5?

 

[Aikouka]

It would be interesting to see efficiency numbers. For example, would the SG3 be much worse if you left it at those higher clocks? Would the iPhone 5 be an even better competitor if you raised its clock speed up, and then how would its battery fare?

 

[Puddle Jumper]

If the 1600 score is true, then this puts the iPhone 5 above even the quad core Android devices. I think people get too hung up on "moar cores!". Overall people should care about real world performance.

Win or lose in benchmarks, the iPhone 5 will be speedy in real world use.

Only the quad core A9 devices which isn't saying much since Krait beats them too. Since this phone will be Apples flagship for a year it's real competition is the upcoming Krait Pro devices.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

If the 1600 score is true, then this puts the iPhone 5 above even the quad core Android devices. I think people get too hung up on "moar cores!". Overall people should care about real world performance.

Win or lose in benchmarks, the iPhone 5 will be speedy in real world use.

This IS what matters. It's like people arguing about shaders, memory, bandwidth in graphics cards, but at the end of the day a lot of enthusiasts will look at the benchmarks and be done with it all.

Arguing about cores and crap is utterly useless when both OSes are vastly different in terms of efficiency and in terms of hardware requirements. I think that's one thing Microsoft was trying to show off in the smoked by a Windows phone challenge. It's about getting shit done the fastest. Now granted, it's somewhat skewed in Windows Phone's favor simply because they chose tasks WP was more suited for, but I think you can list a bunch of tasks that would favor Android or iOS too.

 

[Puddle Jumper]

This IS what matters. It's like people arguing about shaders, memory, bandwidth in graphics cards, but at the end of the day a lot of enthusiasts will look at the benchmarks and be done with it all.

Arguing about cores and crap is utterly useless when both OSes are vastly different in terms of efficiency and in terms of hardware requirements. I think that's one thing Microsoft was trying to show off in the smoked by a Windows phone challenge. It's about getting shit done the fastest. Now granted, it's somewhat skewed in Windows Phone's favor simply because they chose tasks WP was more suited for, but I think you can list a bunch of tasks that would favor Android or iOS too.

That's fine if you don't care about the specifics of a SoC but some of us do. SoC was one of the primary factors in my last two phone purchases.

 

[jpeyton]

Considering thats slightly faster being optimized for the test and a 40% increase in clock speed, its definitely a speedy chip. I saw some 1800mhz s3's hitting over 2100.

Remember that Exynos Quad was out almost 6 months ahead of the A6, and it's a Cortex-A9 design.

Apple will always beat Android for raw efficiency clock-for-clock, because they have top-to-bottom control of every piece of hardware and software for their phone. Non-optimized software is where Android's clock-speed advantage would show itself.

 

[MrX8503]

Only the quad core A9 devices which isn't saying much since Krait beats them too. Since this phone will be Apples flagship for a year it's real competition is the upcoming Krait Pro devices.

You don't think a dual core beating a quad core isn't saying much? I'm willing to bet the A6 has the most performance clock for clock. Its all speculation for now until Anand gets his hands on an iPhone a week from now.

 

[Puddle Jumper]

You don't think a dual core beating a quad core isn't saying much? I'm willing to bet the A6 has the most performance clock for clock. Its all speculation for now until Anand gets his hands on an iPhone a week from now.

No I don't, heck in some cases a single core (Medfield) beats Cortex A9 quads too. Besides we have already seen Krait, another A15 like dual core beat Cortex A9 quads so this really isn't anything special.

At the moment you're probably right about clock for clock performance as well, Quallcomm has always seemed to go after clock speed instead of clock per clock performance so it would naturally be better then Krait in that regard.

 

[grkM3]

You don't think a dual core beating a quad core isn't saying much? I'm willing to bet the A6 has the most performance clock for clock. Its all speculation for now until Anand gets his hands on an iPhone a week from now.

Just wait and see when official jelly bean drops on the gs3 with proper kernels and drivers.I picked up 1000 points in quadrant using a jellybean touchwiz leak and broke 6k on a stock gs3(no over clocking)

IOS 6 can't be benched up against ICS and to be fair.this a6 stands no chance against the s4 in the gs3 and the s4 pro will beat the crap out of it.heck even in GPU benchmarks its right up there with apples quad GPU iPad 3 using 1 gpu

 

[Fingolfin269]

This IS what matters. It's like people arguing about shaders, memory, bandwidth in graphics cards, but at the end of the day a lot of enthusiasts will look at the benchmarks and be done with it all.

Arguing about cores and crap is utterly useless when both OSes are vastly different in terms of efficiency and in terms of hardware requirements. I think that's one thing Microsoft was trying to show off in the smoked by a Windows phone challenge. It's about getting shit done the fastest. Now granted, it's somewhat skewed in Windows Phone's favor simply because they chose tasks WP was more suited for, but I think you can list a bunch of tasks that would favor Android or iOS too.

I agree with all of this. At the end of the day it doesn't matter what the hardware is on the inside if the user experience doesn't live up to it.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

That's fine if you don't care about the specifics of a SoC but some of us do. SoC was one of the primary factors in my last two phone purchases.

Why do paper specs matter? In the end it HAS to translate into real world performance. Typically the two do have direct correlation, but in the case of different OSes, it can result in vastly different performance.

It's pretty much if the phone does what you need to do in a reasonable time, it's good enough.

It's like debating about Tegra 3 on the HTC One X versus Exynos Quad on SGS3. If the difference between those SoCs is your main concern, I think you're putting your priorities in the wrong place. Things such as pentile vs full RGB matrix and removable storage/battery and battery life matter.

Paper specs only mean so much because you can see some companies like Motorola delivering long 3G talk times on their phones while other companies have craptastic times. Not sure why, but on similar capacity batteries. Apple has never used huge batteries, yet delivers excellent talk times and excellent 3G web surfing times. I think there's a lot more beyond specs alone.

 

[BenSkywalker]

Arguing about cores and crap is utterly useless when both OSes are vastly different in terms of efficiency and in terms of hardware requirements.

If you are worried about running the OS as you primary factor when looking at a SoC, then you have *staggering* issues for the platform altogether. Open a large pdf on the latest iPad and compare it to one of those pesky 'paper spec' devices and watch the iPad get brutally throttled. Hopefully the A6 is a massive performance improvement for actual tasks that a portable device is useful for besides scrolling through row after row of icons really fast.

If you use your phone as a PMP, then yeah, you can argue the 'paper specs' line. If you actually try to do anything with your device, you know that the fastest SoC out now is not remotely close to being 'good enough' for a portable computing device.

Paper specs only mean so much because you can see some companies like Motorola delivering long 3G talk times on their phones while other companies have craptastic times. Not sure why, but on similar capacity batteries. Apple has never used huge batteries, yet delivers excellent talk times and excellent 3G web surfing times. I think there's a lot more beyond specs alone.

Browsing time sure, but talk time? If by excellent you mean the 4S would be the sixth best phone..... in HTCs lineup then you have a point. Another one of those pesky 'paper spec' things- the iPhone 5 may make a huge leap, but as of right now Apple is *terrible* at talk time on their devices-

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6118/motorola-atrix-hd-review-fast-sharp-bargain/6

As stated, the iP4S does really well on web surf times, it is flat out terrible for talk time.

 

[Eug]

If you use your phone as a PMP, then yeah, you can argue the 'paper specs' line. If you actually try to do anything with your device, you know that the fastest SoC out now is not remotely close to being 'good enough' for a portable computing device.

Hmmm... I use my phone as a phone, a portable media player, surfing and email machine, and an organizer. I use a tablet the same way, minus the phone part.

I don't use either for a true portable productivity computing device. Just the lack of a physical keyboard alone makes it extremely difficult. In fact, I'd say that holds me back way more than CPU speed, but that's fine, because I'm not about to carry around a full-sized keyboard.

 

[MrX8503]

As stated, the iP4S does really well on web surf times, it is flat out terrible for talk time.

Talk time? Lol who talks on their smartphones? The talk time on the iPhone is fine. Talk time isn't something phone manufacturers need fixing. It's Lte and general data usage.

That's how you know a smartphone is doing something right, when someone complains about talk time.

 

[bearxor]

Apple's announced >2m preorders. This would be in addition to whatever Verizon, AT&T and Sprint have preordered. More stock that the 4S at least.

I have a feeling more people are on the 3G/4/5 upgrade cycle than the 3GS/4S, but don't really have any numbers or anything to back that up.

 

[WelshBloke]

That's an average score for the international GS3. If you turn off power-saving and a few other things, you can get it up to 1750 or so.

A6 is definitely fast.

That seems low.

This is my stock S3 (rooted). No overclocks, no tweaks.

 

[jpeyton]

Apple's announced >2m preorders. This would be in addition to whatever Verizon, AT&T and Sprint have preordered. More stock that the 4S at least.

I have a feeling more people are on the 3G/4/5 upgrade cycle than the 3GS/4S, but don't really have any numbers or anything to back that up.

The smartphone market is growing. I can predict the unannounced/unreleased iPhone 5S will break the iPhone 5 sales records simply on that premise alone.

Just like I can predict the SGS4 will outsell the SGS3.

 

[CZroe]

The smartphone market is growing. I can predict the unannounced/unreleased iPhone 5S will break the iPhone 5 sales records simply on that premise alone.

Just like I can predict the SGS4 will outsell the SGS3.

I can predict that it will have a touch-sensitive back and that the only reason the iPhone 5 has a two-tone back is so that the "S" version will not look any different when it is released.

 

[MrX8503]

The smartphone market is growing. I can predict the unannounced/unreleased iPhone 5S will break the iPhone 5 sales records simply on that premise alone.

Just like I can predict the SGS4 will outsell the SGS3.

I think that's obvious. What's not obvious is if it'll sell more than its competitors.

My prediction is that the iPhone 5 is going to smash records, including the SGS3 sales.

 

[bearxor]

Remember that Exynos Quad was out almost 6 months ahead of the A6, and it's a Cortex-A9 design.

Apple will always beat Android for raw efficiency clock-for-clock, because they have top-to-bottom control of every piece of hardware and software for their phone. Non-optimized software is where Android's clock-speed advantage would show itself.

I'm far more interested in SoC specs and improvements at this point. Understanding that the Quad Exynos is older, I would expect a newer generation architecture SoC to either outperform it or come close, like the S4 DC.

The more interesting results, to me, are the S4+ results. We have a 1.5ghz topping out at around 1600 on GB. A 1ghz A6 result hitting 1600. So these results are roughly equivalent, except that the HTC One S has a 50% clock speed advantage. The fastest/easiest way I can think of to level this out to get clock v clock performance is to take the 1600 score, divide it by 3 (533.33) and then add two of those together. So that a 1ghz S4 would equal roughly 1066 in the test.

The best I could find is this:
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/987369

But it's a score of 709 on 4.0.4 @ 918mhz, which just doesn't feel right to me.

Now, I know these things aren't totally equally comparable, but it looks like Apple is squeezing roughly 50% more performance clock for clock than Qualcomm on what seemingly should be fairly identical designs. And it doesn't look like the S4 Pro really adds anything, cpu-wise. Looks like just a GPU upgrade. Just from my understaning of these numbers, a 1.5ghz A6 looks like it should pretty competitive with a 1.5-1.7 S4 Pro. I don't see any S4 Pro results currently in the database.

It would be really nice to see a S4 running iOS and a A6 running Android but that will never happen, haha. Of course, the A6 results could also be fake, but at least we're not going to have to wait months to find that out.

 

[Eug]

A lot of the boost likely has to do with the improved memory subsystem, and probably iOS 6 has been designed to maximize that improvement as well.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

Browsing time sure, but talk time? If by excellent you mean the 4S would be the sixth best phone..... in HTCs lineup then you have a point. Another one of those pesky 'paper spec' things- the iPhone 5 may make a huge leap, but as of right now Apple is *terrible* at talk time on their devices-

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6118/motorola-atrix-hd-review-fast-sharp-bargain/6

As stated, the iP4S does really well on web surf times, it is flat out terrible for talk time.

Well you do bring up a good point, but I think many phones in that pile are:

1) Newer than the 4s
2) Use larger batteries

Thus I can imagine them being better. When the 4s first came out, I would say it was pretty damn good in talk time:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4971/apple-iphone-4s-review-att-verizon/15

Besides Motorola who has always somehow held the talk time leadership, only the SGS2 scored above. If you compare the two articles we referenced, yeah they're different. The targets have moved. We'll see how the iPhone 5 performs.

Edit: I also see in your article that if you look at normalized talk time, the iPhone 4S scores #2. Pretty solid. Now of course this doesn't translate into real world performance, but if Apple manages to increase battery capacity or improves efficiency yet again, you can see the total talk time bump up pretty easily.

 

[BenSkywalker]

Edit: I also see in your article that if you look at normalized talk time, the iPhone 4S scores #2. Pretty solid. Now of course this doesn't translate into real world performance, but if Apple manages to increase battery capacity or improves efficiency yet again, you can see the total talk time bump up pretty easily.

The iPhone5 could come out and spank the Maxx for talk time(not likely, but it could), I was just commenting on the iPhone getting good talk time. In today's world it really doesn't.

My prediction is that the iPhone 5 is going to smash records, including the SGS3 sales.

Saw one industry insider who predicted the iPhone 5 was going to sell zero units. He made the call a while back, but it seemed like one the Apple camp normally respected a great deal.

 

[Oyeve]

I think that's obvious. What's not obvious is if it'll sell more than its competitors.

My prediction is that the iPhone 5 is going to smash records, including the SGS3 sales.

Of course it will. Iphones always break records. Hell, people have been lining up since last week. Its an event. Its stupid, but hey, it aint me.