The Obama administration said Tuesday it could continue to imprison non-U.S. citizens indefinitely

[n yusef]

Every leftist I know, myself included, is against Obama's maintenance of Bush's policies. And I live in Cambridge, MA, with no shortage of leftists to poll.

His marketing campaign that was "Change" notwithstanding, Obama has been and is almost as much of a hawk as the neocons. Partisan liberals see this (and other issues where he finds himself on the wrong side, like marriage equality) as an attempt at bipartisanship and the maintenance of political capital. That is, the Democratic President cannot appear to be "soft on terror" if he wishes to pass his agenda. The righties and "independents" are likely correct: the Democrats aren't much different from Republicans. Both must pander to the millions afraid that suspected enemy combatants will be detained in maximum security prisons in their neighborhoods, or whatever the current narrative is.

Here, I sympathize with the liberals: I bet Bush policy is popular, and that popularity in-part motivates Obama's support of it. But I can only sympathize so much; I will not pretend that President Obama is reluctant in his desire for executive power.

 

[JSt0rm]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
New boss, same as the old boss.

Of course, the lefties that blasted Bush for this policy will now say it's no big deal since it is Obama doing it now.

no. Only you neocon fascists pulled the party line no matter what.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
New boss, same as the old boss.

Of course, the lefties that blasted Bush for this policy will now say it's no big deal since it is Obama doing it now.

no. Only you neocon fascists pulled the party line no matter what.

Exactly!!
That line New Boss same as old boss; is all they bhave to hold onto while they wait the next 20 years for a Republican candidate to surface who even has a snowballs chance in hello of winning!!

 

[Budmantom]

Originally posted by: lupi
Who would have ever guessed that he would lie/deceive/change his mind on so many platform promises/campaign statements/debate rhetoric once he was elected.

Nope, never saw that one coming from your traitor in chief.

He's consistant.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: eleison

The "left" drank the koolaid and gave the messiah a massive oral. Only now are they noticing 1) they are on their knee's 2) they are holding with their right hand some strange black man's scrotum 3) there's white stuff all over their faces...

Like a farm girl from Midwest looking to become an actress in the big city, only time will tell if they will finally realize how naive and stupid they really are... realities a biatch.. don't do coke, drink the koolaid or whatever the strange African American man is offering to you. You may think you know this stranger.. but you don't...

Oh, where's Jon stewart? Wheres the rest of those people who where heckling Bush about gitmo? Silly "leftist".... stupid lefties..

First of all you're stupid, vulgar, and childish.

Second of all, yet again you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Jon Stewart has attacked Obama several times for replicating offensive Bush policies, and I already linked to several leftist sites that are attacking Obama for doing this. I'm not sure if you've realized this yet, but not everyone is as poorly informed and as ideologically blinded as you.

very well said!!! We don`t agree very much but one thing we agree on is there is no call for idiots nlike that person to say such things!!

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
New boss, same as the old boss.

Of course, the lefties that blasted Bush for this policy will now say it's no big deal since it is Obama doing it now.

no. Only you neocon fascists pulled the party line no matter what.

So let us see you bash Obama.

 

[JSt0rm]

Originally posted by: OCguy

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
New boss, same as the old boss.

Of course, the lefties that blasted Bush for this policy will now say it's no big deal since it is Obama doing it now.

no. Only you neocon fascists pulled the party line no matter what.

So let us see you bash Obama.

fuck obama on this human rights issue. anyways I actually work so peace.

 

[TheSkinsFan]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan
:thumbsdown:

This isn't the "change" I voted for. It sickens me to see Obama repeating some of Bush's biggest mistakes. :|

LOL you believed in Obama's change! The majority of the people who voted on the 4th of November last year believed in "change", which merely affirms the fact that the majority of people are just stupid.

Yes, even as a generally conservative individual, I thought long and hard regarding Obama's character, and ultimately decided to give a Presidential candidate the benefit of the doubt one time in my life -- I closed my eyes, cast my vote, and prayed that he would live up to his promises of "change." But, above all, I judged his character and ability to make educated decisions to be better than any other politician I had ever seen.

But, only five months into his reign, I've already decided that I won't ever make the same mistake again.

Obama has begun to prove to me that he is no better than any other sleezy politican before him. Because of that... no, because of him, I may never even vote again.

Every national-level member of both major political parties is a scumbag. Period.

This decision to continue shitting on human rights is just the icing on the turd-filled cake...

 

[alphatarget1]

Originally posted by: n yusef
*snip*

Leftists like you should go form your own socialist utopia somewhere else. Leave America alone.

 

[alphatarget1]

Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan

Yes, even as a generally conservative individual, I thought long and hard regarding Obama's character, and ultimately decided to give a Presidential candidate the benefit of the doubt one time in my life -- I closed my eyes, cast my vote, and prayed that he would live up to his promises of "change."

Obama (or any politician for that matter) has no character. His campaign and promise was a manufactured lie that was repeated time and again by the MSM. No one else could've pulled it off but him.

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: alphatarget1

Originally posted by: n yusef
*snip*

Leftists like you should go form your own socialist utopia somewhere else. Leave America alone.

I love you too.

 

[RightIsWrong]

Originally posted by: NaughtyGeek

Good luck with that. Read through a majority of the threads in here, it all reads R talking point, D counter. D talking point, R counter. There are a few people in here who think for themselves, but the majority don't do much more than regurgitate the agenda of the week from there preferred political affiliation.

Sadly, I have to agree with this point. If most of us took the time to actually see what was going on around us and how it directly or even indirectly affected us, we would have a complete shamble of a Congress next session. There would be 15 different parties that had representatives because the two leading us now are complete fvcktards.

 

[SAWYER]

^sad but true

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
One could dig back through all the revelations of Bush wrong doings that the P&N Left posted and see how quickly the sharks start to circle.

The time frame for Republican blood is a matter of minutes on any day of the week.

Obama and his supporters are finding out that it is easy to throw stones at the glass house when you are on the outside looking in. Once you own the house, the maintenance costs are much more than expected to replace the broken windows

Hell, the Palin thread was beset by the liberal e-thugs around here in under an hour. And it's still getting bumped regularly with requests for Palin porn, etc.

Stay classy, Democrats.

 

[SAWYER]

If Palin was a Black or other minority the bashing wouldn't be occuring

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: lupi
Who would have ever guessed that he would lie/deceive/change his mind on so many platform promises/campaign statements/debate rhetoric once he was elected.

Nope, never saw that one coming from your traitor in chief.

i said it before the election and a bunch of times after. He is a politician and one from IL at that. why people trust him just amazes me.

he lied to get into office. well duh. no shit sherlock. now he faces WHY bush did some of the things he did and has no choice but to continue them.


Anyone who thought he was really going to be different is a fool (and seems like some are starting to figure that out). I just HOPE he is a better president then Bush was. though not happy with all the spending..


in the future i hope people think about the decision of who should be president instead of fallowing the herd. ..espially when it comes to a politician from IL. we are stuck with him and we all better hope he gets his shit together and pulls nation up. he is the only chance we have and the next 4 years are going to be vital.

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: Sawyer
If Palin was a Black or other minority the bashing wouldn't be occuring

Did you think about that at all before you clicked "Reply to Topic?"

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: lupi
Who would have ever guessed that he would lie/deceive/change his mind on so many platform promises/campaign statements/debate rhetoric once he was elected.

Nope, never saw that one coming from your traitor in chief.

i said it before the election and a bunch of times after. He is a politician and one from IL at that. why people trust him just amazes me.

he lied to get into office. well duh. no shit sherlock. now he faces WHY bush did some of the things he did and has no choice but to continue them.


Anyone who thought he was really going to be different is a fool (and seems like some are starting to figure that out). I just HOPE he is a better president then Bush was. though not happy with all the spending..


in the future i hope people think about the decision of who should be president instead of fallowing the herd. ..espially when it comes to a politician from IL. we are stuck with him and we all better hope he gets his shit together and pulls nation up. he is the only chance we have and the next 4 years are going to be vital.

Well this I'll never get. Half the time we hear 'HE'S JUST LIKE BUSH, LOLCHANGE', and the other half of the time he's described as turning America into a communist/socialist fagtopia. He's either changing things, or he isn't. Which one is it?

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: lupi
Who would have ever guessed that he would lie/deceive/change his mind on so many platform promises/campaign statements/debate rhetoric once he was elected.

Nope, never saw that one coming from your traitor in chief.

i said it before the election and a bunch of times after. He is a politician and one from IL at that. why people trust him just amazes me.

he lied to get into office. well duh. no shit sherlock. now he faces WHY bush did some of the things he did and has no choice but to continue them.


Anyone who thought he was really going to be different is a fool (and seems like some are starting to figure that out). I just HOPE he is a better president then Bush was. though not happy with all the spending..


in the future i hope people think about the decision of who should be president instead of fallowing the herd. ..espially when it comes to a politician from IL. we are stuck with him and we all better hope he gets his shit together and pulls nation up. he is the only chance we have and the next 4 years are going to be vital.

Well this I'll never get. Half the time we hear 'HE'S JUST LIKE BUSH, LOLCHANGE', and the other half of the time he's described as turning America into a communist/socialist fagtopia. He's either changing things, or he isn't. Which one is it?

the reason you will never get it is because you think this is a IF OR situation and its not.

He is morel ike bush then many think. Bush took huge steps to increase his power and the power government. Obama is no diffrent.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: waggy

the reason you will never get it is because you think this is a IF OR situation and its not.

He is morel ike bush then many think. Bush took huge steps to increase his power and the power government. Obama is no diffrent.

No it really is, you can't simultaneously be changing things and keeping them the same.

In some ways he most certainly does carry on the policies of Bush, but Obama never pledged to change everything, just some things. He doesn't need to wear shoes on his hands just because Bush wore them on his feet. This is one of those areas where I believe he spoke about changing things and is not, and it really pisses me off. I would never think for a second however that it doesn't mean he hasn't changed anything.

It just seems to vary with the thread title as to whether or not he is a Bush clone or a commie and it would be nice to see a little more self awareness.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Sadly this isn't unexpected at least by me. Obama is much like his predecessor in some ways. A thing is right or wrong independent of who does it.

I think that when this is said and done, from a moral perspective there may not be such a great improvement. For example I just about guarantee that there won't be investigations into the last administration. It isn't going to happen because Obama won't open a can of worms someone may dish out to him at a later date.

Welcome to the real world.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: waggy

the reason you will never get it is because you think this is a IF OR situation and its not.

He is morel ike bush then many think. Bush took huge steps to increase his power and the power government. Obama is no diffrent.

No it really is, you can't simultaneously be changing things and keeping them the same.

In some ways he most certainly does carry on the policies of Bush, but Obama never pledged to change everything, just some things. He doesn't need to wear shoes on his hands just because Bush wore them on his feet. This is one of those areas where I believe he spoke about changing things and is not, and it really pisses me off. I would never think for a second however that it doesn't mean he hasn't changed anything.

It just seems to vary with the thread title as to whether or not he is a Bush clone or a commie and it would be nice to see a little more self awareness.

and this is a big problem with some. they can't see that its not just one problem but a set.

you sit and say he cant change th ings and keep thing sthe same. says who? who says they are the same thing.

is he going to turn us into a comunist society? nope. but he sure is pushing that direction. Is he keeping some of Bush's policys? hell yes. part of that is again goes back to keeping his power and gaining more (and the fact that they have to be kept).

 

[Craig234]

Glenn Greenwald as usual has the progressive response to this policy, disapproving.

 

[dali71]

Originally posted by: Craig234
Glenn Greenwald as usual has the progressive response to this policy, disapproving.

Already posted on page 2 of this thread. The question is, how do you feel about this?

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: dali71

Originally posted by: Craig234
Glenn Greenwald as usual has the progressive response to this policy, disapproving.

Already posted on page 2 of this thread. The question is, how do you feel about this?

If I wasn't clear, I'm not posting Greenwald because I disagree with him - I agree with his article, and I said in the other thread, I'm in disagreement with Obama on this.

I could say more, but I think it'd be repeating things said earlier - I think we have a bi problem with a lack of fairness to many foreign detainees out of political convenience.

It's a travesty, an assault on our stated principles. That's the important thing - though at times it's even counter-productive, creating enemies for good reason, as well.

It's a real indication of the corruption of our own people for this to be tolerated, not that that's anything new, or unique to the uS (others are often less corrupted simply for lack of power).

I'm not saying it's completely safe to not detain some people believed to be threats; I'm saying that there's a trade-off between safety and liberty. Either we're willing to have some people do bad things and have more liberty with fewer innocent people wronged, or we're going to choose to have less liberty in the world and harm more innocents and likely prevent some attacks. The question isn't, 'is there any risk', it's 'do we value liberty'?

While in our domestic system we take the imprisonment of innocents somewhat more seriously and choose more liberty and pay the price of more crime, with oversees people they are not so much valued, they are more dehumanized, and there's more willingness to tolerate injustice for them, making us guilty as citizens for the wrongs.