The Obama administration said Tuesday it could continue to imprison non-U.S. citizens indefinitely

SAWYER

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,742
42
91
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124699680303307309.html


He is staying the course with W, that should make W supporters happy and Libs furious

WASHINGTON -- The Obama administration said Tuesday it could continue to imprison non-U.S. citizens indefinitely even if they have been acquitted of terrorism charges by a U.S. military commission.

Jeh Johnson, the Defense Department's chief lawyer, told the Senate Armed Services Committee that releasing a detainee who has been tried and found not guilty was a policy decision that officials would make based on their estimate of whether the prisoner posed a future threat.

Like the Bush administration, the Obama administration argues that the legal basis for indefinite detention of aliens it considers dangerous is separate from war-crimes prosecutions. Officials say that the laws of war allow indefinite detention to prevent aliens from committing warlike acts in future, while prosecution by military commission aims to punish them for war crimes committed in the past.

Mr. Johnson said such prisoners held without trial would receive "some form of periodic review" that could lead to their release.
From the Archive

* New Rift Opens Over Rights of Detainees
06/29/09

Sen. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, a leading Republican on detainee policy, approved. "Some of them will be able to get out of jail because they've rehabilitated themselves and some of them may in fact die in jail," Mr. Graham said. But "I don't want to put people in a dark hole forever" simply "because somebody like Dick Cheney, or you fill in the blank with a politician, said so."

Also at the hearing, Obama administration officials differed with the Navy's senior uniformed lawyer over whether coerced statements should be used to convict Guantanamo defendants.

David Kris, head of the Justice Department's National Security Division, warned that federal courts might reverse convictions in military commissions if they were based on coerced statements.

Vice Adm. Bruce MacDonald, giving his independent opinion as the Navy's judge advocate general, testified that the standard should be whether a statement was "reliable," rather than whether it was coerced.

The question could be central to whether military-commission convictions stand up. Military prosecutors have said that involuntary statements make up the lion's share of evidence against detainees.

Congress is considering several proposals for trying Guantanamo detainees. The issue is one of several administration officials are struggling to resolve so they can meet President Barack Obama's commitment to close the Guantanamo prison by January.

While Mr. Obama wants to continue in modified form the commissions conceived under former President George W. Bush, officials said the administration favors an expiration date for the experiment unless reauthorized by Congress.

After some trials are held, "a fresh look" could be useful, Mr. Kris said.

The offshore prison holds about 229 detainees. The administration plans to release some prisoners, while others could be tried in federal court, by military commission or held indefinitely without trial.

Some House Democrats say the limited number of additional protections for defendants the administration has proposed don't go far enough.

Rep. Jerrold Nadler (D., N.Y.), who has scheduled a Wednesday hearing on military commissions before the House Judiciary subcommittee he heads, questioned the administration's plan to allot prisoners to federal courts, military commissions or indefinite detention.

"What bothers me is that they seem to be saying, 'Some people we have good enough evidence against, so we'll give them a fair trial. Some people the evidence is not so good, so we'll give them a less fair trial. We'll give them just enough due process to ensure a conviction because we know they're guilty. That's not a fair trial, that's a show trial," Mr. Nadler said.
 

RyanPaulShaffer

Diamond Member
Jul 13, 2005
3,434
1
0
New boss, same as the old boss.

Of course, the lefties that blasted Bush for this policy will now say it's no big deal since it is Obama doing it now.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
This is no surprise to me. I knew his campaign rhetoric was just that and once he got into office he would have a change of heart. I bet Gitmo stays open or at the very least does in some other form. Half the problem with getting rid of Gitmo is they are housing people who should be set free but no other nation will take them, including their former home countries.

 

SAWYER

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,742
42
91
BAMA AND HIS CRIMINAL CABAL ARE SHREDDING THE CONSTITUTION!!:brokenheart::disgust::frown::|:roll:
rose.gif
:(


*edited for authenticity
 

MotF Bane

No Lifer
Dec 22, 2006
60,801
10
0
Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
New boss, same as the old boss.

Of course, the lefties that blasted Bush for this policy will now say it's no big deal since it is Obama doing it now.

Not all of them.
 

RyanPaulShaffer

Diamond Member
Jul 13, 2005
3,434
1
0
Originally posted by: Sawyer
Bama and his criminal cabal are shredding the constitution!:brokenheart::disgust::frown::|:roll:
rose.gif
:(

:laugh:

Beat me to it.

You need to make it all caps and bold though to be truly authentic. ;)
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
Originally posted by: MotF Bane
Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
New boss, same as the old boss.

Of course, the lefties that blasted Bush for this policy will now say it's no big deal since it is Obama doing it now.

Not all of them.

No, but the usual suspects will. No need for names, they'll expose themselves.
 

Sinsear

Diamond Member
Jan 13, 2007
6,439
80
91
Originally posted by: Sawyer
BAMA AND HIS CRIMINAL CABAL ARE SHREDDING THE CONSTITUTION!!:brokenheart::disgust::frown::|:roll:
rose.gif
:(


*edited for authenticity

:laugh:
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
It's becoming very clear that once he got in the white house with access to all the information Bush had Obama had a "holy shit, Bush was right" moment. That was his moment.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,964
51,456
136
I love how this thread is nothing but ATPN's ultra right faction predicting and wishing for defenses of this, rationalizations, etc from Obama supporters, none of which have been posted.

Not to interrupt the right wing circle jerk or anything, but here's a tip for you guys: THIS is the sort of thing you should be attacking Obama over. All these other threads shrieking about how he went on a date to New York, don't they seem sort of stupid now?

Indefinite detention strikes at the heart of any free society, it is a position that I do not believe can ever be defended. This isn't the only part of Obama's civil liberties record that has been awful since he has gotten into office. I for one am simply floored that a constitutional law professor would believe the president has the right to hold people indefinitely without trial.

Of those of ATPN's right wing that are up in arms with this, if you voted in any recent elections (and voted for a Republican) it is quite likely that they enthusiastically support this position as well, by the way.
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
10
81
Originally posted by: eskimospy
I love how this thread is nothing but ATPN's ultra right faction predicting and wishing for defenses of this, rationalizations, etc from Obama supporters, none of which have been posted.

Not to interrupt the right wing circle jerk or anything, but here's a tip for you guys: THIS is the sort of thing you should be attacking Obama over. All these other threads shrieking about how he went on a date to New York, don't they seem sort of stupid now?

Indefinite detention strikes at the heart of any free society, it is a position that I do not believe can ever be defended. This isn't the only part of Obama's civil liberties record that has been awful since he has gotten into office. I for one am simply floored that a constitutional law professor would believe the president has the right to hold people indefinitely without trial.

Of those of ATPN's right wing that are up in arms with this, if you voted in any recent elections (and voted for a Republican) it is quite likely that they enthusiastically support this position as well, by the way.

i agree. i never cared about the "date night" good for him in keeping his marriage a prioity.

THIS on the other hand seems like something to complain about. should be entersting on seeing those that just toe the party line instead of the issues.

Originally posted by: spidey07
It's becoming very clear that once he got in the white house with access to all the information Bush had Obama had a "holy shit, Bush was right" moment. That was his moment.

lol yeap.

should be intersting on what the hard core obama supporters will say about this.

* for the record i think he is wrong on this
 

dphantom

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2005
4,763
327
126
Originally posted by: Sawyer
Will his fan club(the media) call him out? When will the lovefest wear off?

Well, there is nothing at the democraticunderground or dailykos that I can see so maybe their talking points haven't been published yet.

:)
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: spidey07
It's becoming very clear that once he got in the white house with access to all the information Bush had Obama had a "holy shit, Bush was right" moment. That was his moment.

lol yeap.

should be intersting on what the hard core obama supporters will say about this.

* for the record i think he is wrong on this

It seems like at least once a week some news comes out supporting this notion.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,964
51,456
136
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: spidey07
It's becoming very clear that once he got in the white house with access to all the information Bush had Obama had a "holy shit, Bush was right" moment. That was his moment.

lol yeap.

should be intersting on what the hard core obama supporters will say about this.

* for the record i think he is wrong on this

It seems like at least once a week some news comes out supporting this notion.

No, it doesn't. By all means supply us with information you think does however.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: spidey07
It's becoming very clear that once he got in the white house with access to all the information Bush had Obama had a "holy shit, Bush was right" moment. That was his moment.

lol yeap.

should be intersting on what the hard core obama supporters will say about this.

* for the record i think he is wrong on this

It seems like at least once a week some news comes out supporting this notion.

No, it doesn't. By all means supply us with information you think does however.

You're here often enough, you've seen the threads/news about Obama maintaining Bush policy regarding security/defense, etc.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,964
51,456
136
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: spidey07
It's becoming very clear that once he got in the white house with access to all the information Bush had Obama had a "holy shit, Bush was right" moment. That was his moment.

lol yeap.

should be intersting on what the hard core obama supporters will say about this.

* for the record i think he is wrong on this

It seems like at least once a week some news comes out supporting this notion.

No, it doesn't. By all means supply us with information you think does however.

You're hear often enough, you've seen the threads/news about Obama maintaining Bush policy regarding security/defense, etc.

Oh, so you mean supporting the notion that Obama now supports Bush's assertion of these powers, not that these powers were ever justified to begin with. On that I would agree.