The NRA answer to an assault weapons ban.

[dmens]

But Engineer, you argument really collapses when we talk about assault rifles, useless for hunting, being useful for inner residents who never intend to use their assault rifles for legitimate hunting purposes. As well healed NRA gun nuts will buy assault weapons and a thousand rounds of ammunition, that will often end up in the hands of criminals or those that are totally psychotic.

Not sure what "inner residents" are, but the vast majority of street crimes are committed with handguns, not rifles.

Also rifles are plenty useful, they're good for ventilating government footpads. Just ask Randy Weaver. 🙂

 

[dmens]

My my, I will feel much better when you are lobotomized. The membership rolls at the Natal Rampage Association would be a good place to start. I have a thing against folk who care more for things than they do for children.

Gotta admit, I lol'ed at Natal Rampage. It should be a video game.

Anyways, not a member, never will be. Gun Owners of America is the only 2A association worth the membership fee.

 

[Engineer]

**SNIP**

LL...my comment was more to see if people who are for the assault weapons (I am not) and the NRA would be OK with taxes raised on the guns/ammo to pay for the security and armed guards in the school. I was expecting a backlash on taxes, not the guns. Just like everything else, people want the services and don't want to pay for them (and I'm not saying that I want the services either....)

 

[StinkyPinky]

Well, what's new. The NRA is just a bunch of redneck idiots.

Trust me, when their new idiotic proposal fails they will next suggest arming teachers. When that fails, they will suggest arming trained students.

They wont be happy until everyone is walking around strapped and there are gunfights every day.

 

[Brovane]

Well since Obama's children go to school with armed guards. Then it should be ok for the rest of the schools to also have armed guards right?

 

[Engineer]

Well since Obama's children go to school with armed guards. Then it should be ok for the rest of the schools to also have armed guards right?

Obama also has government healthcare for life. Then it should be ok for the rest of us to have government healthcare for life, right?

(see how that works).

 

[Brovane]

Obama also has government healthcare for life. Then it should be ok for the rest of us to have government healthcare for life, right?

(see how that works).

Well we do once you turn 65. See how that works......

 

[Engineer]

Well we do once you turn 65. See how that works......

Obama could quit now and get it for life, why shouldn't we all have it now?

OK, enough of that. Just showing the slippery slope that you can fall into depending on what you are FOR or AGAINST.

Back to the gun debate, already in progress....

 

[Number1]

Everybody knew that the NRA statement would be a pile of shit.

Not only a pile of shit, a parody, I could not believe how so incredibly stupid their proposal was, a joke on itself.
Allow me this article from a right wing newspaper in Canada:


GLOBE EDITORIAL
NRA's solutions show Americans the true face of gun culture

 

[Lemon law]

As the other fact to mention, is the fact that the USA has no more or no less of fraction defective psychotics. Who will somehow kill their fellow country men and women for only psychotic reasons.

Yet when the USA leads the entire world in terms of psychotic gun violence as the psychotic weapon of choice, its hardly time to say yippee the USA is number one again. terms of gun violence being used against school age children. Simply because assault rifles access in the USA is the easiest way for US psychotics express their psychosis.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Not only a pile of shit, a parody, I could not believe how so incredibly stupid their proposal was, a joke on itself.
Allow me this article from a right wing newspaper in Canada:


GLOBE EDITORIAL
NRA's solutions show Americans the true face of gun culture

Funny but gun-grabbing California Democrat Senator Barbra Boxer (D) is proposing we have national guard troops literally stationed in our schools. On the face of it when compared to what the NRA is suggesting (having trained officers on campuses) their proposal is not as terrible compared to what the fringe left wing gun-grabbers in D.C. would like to see, even though its still bad IMHO.

The National Rifle Association clearly is desperate. This morning, as AP reported, “The nation’s largest gun-rights lobby called Friday for armed police officers to be posted in every American school to stop the next killer ‘waiting in the wings.’”

Now you know that an idea is either very bad or very good when the fringes of the left and right agree. As it turns out, Sen. Barbara Boxer, D-CA., has introduced legislation that would allow governors to put National Guard Troops in public schools. She calls it the Save Our Students Act. (Here’s her press release on the NRA presser.)

I would hate to be a kid these days. There’s way too much security and too many politicians who want to turn schools into armed camps.

I understand that some will watch this video and see compassion, but others cannot help but watch and listen to Boxer and see rank opportunism.

http://blog.sfgate.com/djsaunders/2012/12/21/where-boxer-and-the-nra-embrace/

 

[Brovane]

As the other fact to mention, is the fact that the USA has no more or no less of fraction defective psychotics. Who will somehow kill their fellow country men and women for only psychotic reasons.

Yet when the USA leads the entire world in terms of psychotic gun violence as the psychotic weapon of choice, its hardly time to say yippee the USA is number one again. terms of gun violence being used against school age children. Simply because assault rifles access in the USA is the easiest way for US psychotics express their psychosis.

I didn't realize the shooter used a select-fire weapon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_rifle

An assault rifle is a select-fire (either fully automatic or burst capable) rifle that uses an intermediate cartridge and a detachable magazine. It is not to be confused with assault weapons.[1] Assault rifles are the standard service rifles in most modern armies. Assault rifles are categorized in between light machine guns, which are intended more for sustained automatic fire in a light support role, and submachine guns, which fire a pistol cartridge rather than a rifle cartridge.

 

[Engineer]

I didn't realize the shooter used a select-fire weapon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_rifle

He was using an assault rifle, just as the person that you quoted had stated.


http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/assault+rifle?s=t

1.
a military rifle capable of both automatic and semiautomatic fire, utilizing an intermediate-power cartridge.
2.
a nonmilitary weapon modeled on the military assault rifle, usually modified to allow only semiautomatic fire.

 

[OlafSicky]

Is the constitution evil too? 😛

The constitution is not evil just antiquated. Back then the only form of protection were armed citizen militias there was no police and no army just ordinary citizens. So if you wanted any type of law and order you had to organize leave the fields take your gun and go with your neighbors kill the shit out of some Indians.
What do you think Thomas Jefferson would say now? He would be WTF all these people with guns !!! They have the courts police, army they don't need guns.
We need a total ban on all weapons just like in the UK.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

He was using an assault rifle, just as the person that you quoted had stated.


http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/assault+rifle?s=t

You don't really understand what you are talking about it seems. All legal firearms (which include handguns and shotguns) sold today are semi-automatic in that they fire off one round as fast as you can pull the trigger and prepare the next round to be fired off with another trigger pull.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-automatic_firearm

A semi-automatic, or self-loading, firearm is a weapon that performs all steps necessary to prepare the weapon to fire again after firing—assuming cartridges remain in the weapon's feed device or magazine. Typically, this includes extracting and ejecting the spent cartridge case from the weapon's firing chamber, re-cocking the firing mechanism, and loading a new cartridge into the firing chamber. Although automatic weapons and selective fire firearms do the same tasks, semi-automatic firearms do not automatically fire an additional round until the trigger is released and re-pressed by the person firing the weapon.

 

[RightIsWrong]

The NRA is a bunch of self serving idiots who are only looking out for themselves with every single move that they make.

With that said, their suggestion isn't necessarily a bad one, just not the best one.

The Democrats suggestion to legislate the problem away is stupid and only being thrown out there for two reasons:

1. So that they can use this tragedy as a campaign talking point next election cycle
2. It isn't addressing the real problem -- keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill and securing schools

There is no real way to stop the first item b/c both parties do it way more frequently than they try to pass legislation that will benefit their constituents or the country as a whole.

As for the second issue, my suggestion would be to put bars on all 1st floor school windows and have a buffer zone where someone can be rung into a foyer of the school without gaining entrance to the school. Basically, put them inside of a gas station clerk area where they are in a 4x6 area surrounded by bullet proof glass with a sliding tray that they can pass their ID through without actually entering the school.

It's a whole lot cheaper than arming someone in every single school in the country and training them to be responsible with any weapon.

 

[1prophet]

[Funny but gun-grabbing California Democrat Senator Barbra Boxer (D) is proposing we have national guard troops literally stationed in our schools. On the face of it when compared to what the NRA is suggesting (having trained officers on campuses) their proposal is not as terrible compared to what the fringe left wing gun-grabbers in D.C. would like to see, even though its still bad IMHO.



http://blog.sfgate.com/djsaunders/2012/12/21/where-boxer-and-the-nra-embrace/

Like in Kent State, just in case the students get a little uppity the National Guard will be there to put them back in their place, for their own protection of course.:hmm:

 

[sportage]

Any parent that would drive their kid(s) to school, give a kiss on the forehead and have a good day, then let that child out of the car, walking up to the door with a Barney Fife sitting on a stool wearing some badge and holding an assault weapon (because only an armed assault weapon would suffice any assault), any parent that would feel secure watching their kid go through that process to enter their school, is a patent as deranged as the crazed wacko that killed all those children in that school last week.

And God help that child...

 

[shira]

You obviously didn't read the NRA's statement.

They offered to pay for and train the security guards.

No one is suggesting arming security guards with assault rifles.

An armed security guard would do more to prevent mass shootings than ridiculous assault weapons bans.

There are approximately 130,000 primary and secondary schools in the U.S. If the average security guard makes even $15 an hour (including benefits), that's $30,000 a year per guard. If each school has one guard, the NRA would have to pay almost $4 billion a year for those security guards, yet the NRA annual budget is somewhere around $220 million.

Somehow, the number don't work. What a surprise.

The NRA's math is a good as its arguments.

 

[RampantAndroid]

Like in Kent State, just in case the students get a little uppity the National Guard will be there to put them back in their place, for their own protection of course.:hmm:

Not going to read up on kent state, but they had rocks thrown at them, right? If true, they fired in defense.

I suggest you look up the boston massacre (such as who defended the british soldiers - and won.) What they teach in grade school, and what the famous painting shows, is not correct.

 

[Engineer]

You don't really understand what you are talking about it seems. All legal firearms (which include handguns and shotguns) sold today are semi-automatic in that they fire off one round as fast as you can pull the trigger and prepare the next round to be fired off with another trigger pull.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-automatic_firearm

I didn't comment on any of what you posted. One poster stated it was an assault rifle and another quoted and stated that he didn't know it was a select fire weapon because wikipedia defines assault rifles as select fire. Websters defines an assault rifle as either a select fire or one modeled after it that is usually semiautomatic.

You guys want to try to convince the world that the gun that that guy used wasn't classified as an assault rifle. It's simply a play on semantics.

 

[Lemon law]

Where does this crapola come from that a assault weapon can only defined as a fully automatic weapon. Rather than its civilian semi-legitimate counter part in a semi-automatic that fires only one round per press of the Trigger?

As the real danger and lethality of an assault rifle ( 0r even a pistol ) comes from its huge magazine that can keep firing and firing from 10-30 or more times.

Even in US military use, and other militarizes in the world, the use of a fully automatic shoulder fired weapon is discouraged. Simply because the recoil of such weapons make the accurate aim of such shoulder fired weapons impossible after the first or second shot. And its why most militaries in the world have dropped their former standards of arming their soldiers with larger caliber weapons in the 6.5 mm to 8 mm class that have far longer range and lethality. In favor of 5.5 mm weapons with shorter ranges that can at least be accurately hand held and fire 2 round bursts. As that is the way most US soldiers are trained to use their fully automatic AR-15 rifles in combat situations. By turning their selector switch to 2 round bursts.

Prior to VietNam when the standard shoulder fired weapon was a 7.62 Nato round, it was proved, after the first round, any accurate aim was lost after the first round in any fully automatic mode. As the other criteria becomes, when a fully automatic weapon is used, they usually have a rate of fire of some 500 rounds per minute. Or round numbers 10 shots per second. Which means you could empty a 30 round clip in 3 seconds, with 28 or 29 of those shots coming out in an a un aimed spray and more likely to hit the ceiling or the floor.

Which is not to say there is no legitimate military use of a heavy machine gun, mounted on a tripod, water cooled, and weighing over 70 pounds. Maybe the dream of every nutty gun using psychotic, but at least those heavy machine guns are heavily regulated and not sold on the streets to any legitimate or illegitimate guns users like candy on the streets of America. As not even the NRA is that nutty. But the NRA stand four square for putting automatic or semi-automatic weapons with 30 round clips into the hands the every Psychotic without even a background check.

 

[Gerle]

This is the best idea from the NRA in a long time. How about a $50 tax on each gun sold and $1 for each bullet sold to pay for all of these security guards?

Tax Internet users.

 

[xj0hnx]

As for the second issue, my suggestion would be to put bars on all 1st floor school windows and have a buffer zone where someone can be rung into a foyer of the school without gaining entrance to the school. Basically, put them inside of a gas station clerk area where they are in a 4x6 area surrounded by bullet proof glass with a sliding tray that they can pass their ID through without actually entering the school.

It's a whole lot cheaper than arming someone in every single school in the country and training them to be responsible with any weapon.

The last thing I want is my son going to school in a prison. That said, there's other issues with this. I know a lot of schools are like my son's in that they have many doors, and even though they are supposed to be locked, and they normally are, BUT all you've got to do is knock on the little window, and ransom kid walking down the hall comes and opens the door.

I think people need to accept that no matter the precautions, there are going to be killers, and they are going to kill. Now, I don't think that we should just forget any protective measures, but there is a point of diminishing returns, and then all we are doing in inconveniencing ourselves, and wasting time, and money. Turning schools into prisons, the ridiculousness of air travel, being "safe" is not worth the cost of infringing on our rights.

 

[JulesMaximus]

You obviously didn't read the NRA's statement.

They offered to pay for and train the security guards.

No one is suggesting arming security guards with assault rifles.

An armed security guard would do more to prevent mass shootings than ridiculous assault weapons bans.

I'm sure that's what every school teacher, child, and parent wants... an NRA security squad patrolling every elementary school hall in the country.😱

The NRA is completely out of touch with society.