The Never Ending Saga...Validate My Gaming Rig Take III

[Starbuck1975]

RAPTOR WD1500 150 GB!!!! WOOOH. This will be your ultimate component in your system . Available now on Ebay for $330 ish.

The HD will make your system faster than anybody else's, just because they have a slower HD, everything about the system slows down. For me, HD performance is usually top priority since it IS the slowest part of ANY system. (maybe not 80s systems but you get the point)

I've read reviews that state Raptors aren't all that...that the Seagate Barracuda or some of the new Western Digital drives nearly match its performance at a lower price point.

Ugh...as usual, my component mix is getting shaked and baked again.

Is the only advantage of going Opteron is that it is a stable overclocker??? At stock speeds, will I take a performance hit to a comperable X2 or 64?

Also, on the Opteron side of the house, which socket 939 tend to play most nice with it?

 

[t3h l337 n3wb]

Don't waste $330 on a Raptor. You would get much better performance by spending the money elsewhere. Current gen SATA drives with 16MB cache are almost as fast as the 74GB Raptor, so you shouldn't get that either. Raptors are just a waste of money unless you have like a $5000 budget and already have SLI'd 7800GTX's, Vapochill cooling, 2405FPW, $1000 sound system, etc. Don't waste your money on an excellent CPU and make it stay at stock speeds. Overclocking is very easy, and the Opteron 165 has double the cache of the 3800+ anyways, so it'll make up for its 200mhz less clock speed.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Overclocking is very easy, and the Opteron 165 has double the cache of the 3800+ anyways, so it'll make up for its 200mhz less clock speed.

Interesting points..I may have to do some research on overclocking...my understanding is that some MOBOs are better then others, or easier to overclock.

Could you recommend a board that has a solid reputation for overclocking stability, yet has a user friendly interface or bios that makes it easier to navigate such that I dont fry something out of the start gate.

I guess the next question would be...ignore everything I posted previously, and what build components would you use to meet the needs I initially posted.

Mainly, a future proofed gaming rig that will last me around 2 to 3 years, and can handle minor home office, video reproduction and photo editing tasks with ease...up until around the end of 2003, my current system was adequate for all three...I am at that threshold where games stutter, even on the lowest graphical settings, and other tasks take a bit longer then I would like.

 

[Bobthelost]

A8N32 is good for overclocking, anandtech loved it. I do too, i've gotten my 4400X2 stable at 2.6Ghz easily, and i think i might get it up to 2.7Ghz eventually.

The cache is overrated, check tomshardware out, the cache makes next to no difference for the majority of applications, clock speed is better. Despite this i'd go 165 anyway, you won't be sorry.

 

[CalamitySymphony]

Originally posted by: t3h l337 n3wb
Don't waste $330 on a Raptor. You would get much better performance by spending the money elsewhere. Current gen SATA drives with 16MB cache are almost as fast as the 74GB Raptor, so you shouldn't get that either. Raptors are just a waste of money unless you have like a $5000 budget and already have SLI'd 7800GTX's, Vapochill cooling, 2405FPW, $1000 sound system, etc. Don't waste your money on an excellent CPU and make it stay at stock speeds. Overclocking is very easy, and the Opteron 165 has double the cache of the 3800+ anyways, so it'll make up for its 200mhz less clock speed.

NOTHING MATCHES THE RAPTOR in the PRICE RANGE.

Once you get that through your head, we are talking about the NEW generation 150GB Raptor. Read some reviews before spewing.

The only thing that you can do better than the 150GB Raptor is Enterprise level SCSI. And that will cost you even more for less GBs.

Raptor is a must to any fast system. If you compare two systems side by side, the FASTER running system is the one with the FASTER HD. EVEN with other specs are lower. (assuming RAM is sufficient of course).

Anyway, its your money. HD performance should be high on everyone's list, (some people just don't understand that its probably the ONLY significant bottleneck is modern systems).

 

[Starbuck1975]

Another take at a build list:

ABIT AN8-ULTRA or MSI NEO4 Platinum
eVGA 7800GT
PC Power and Cooling 510W
Athlon X2 3800+ or Opteron 165
Corsair ValueSelect (2x1GB) dual channel kit (PC3200)
Western Digital Cavier SE16

What this build list does for me:
- The Abit or MSI are good overclocker Mobos from my understanding
- the 7800GT, while not a GTX, is still a strong video card for the forseeable future
- The PC Power and Cooling because many of you stressed the importance of a good PSU
- The Athlon X2 3800+ or Opteron...both are dual core solutions, for future proofing, the Opteron being the better choice if I decide to overclock
- Corsair ValueSelect...strong ValueRAM
- The WD Cavier gives me alot of capacity at a 16MB cache.

Thoughts? The price came in at $1200 total, still within budget.

 

[CalamitySymphony]

PC Power and Cooling is way overkill. There are strong and quality PSUs taht will drive that rig for $50. (Check around)

A large harddrive will work well if you need the storage, however, not the WD Caviar. I'm not an expert, but the general consensus is one of the large Seagate Drives if I remember correctly.

Everything you listed (and a different PSU) adds up only to around $900. Which makes room for a Raptor

 

[Bobthelost]

The WD4000KD is a great drive, very very fast and 400Gig should be enough for quite a while, pretty much the fastest 7,200 RPM drive there is if memory serves. The 7800Gt is excellent, especially eVGA, i'd have stuck with the Asus board but if you like the Abit better then who am i to argue.

 

[mc866]

For mobo go with the Epox EP-9NPA+Ultra, supposed to be second best OC'ing board for non-SLI socet 939

For the PSU, pick a OCZ or Seasonic for a bit less, as long as you arent running SLI they should do the trick

For the hard drive take a look at the Seagate 7200.9 series, maybe get a small primary and a larger one for storage

 

[Bobthelost]

Seagate drives are slower than WD drives, fact.

Look on www.storagereview.com. Tthe 400Gig WD beats the 500Gig 7200.9 everytime for every single benchmark they have (except a slightly higher power draw, a whole .4W!)

 

[mc866]

Well either way on the drives, you also realize they are compairing a 400gig and a 500gig drive.

 

[Bobthelost]

Yes, the bigger the faster is the rule in HDs. Higher density means faster throughput, (but marginally slower seek times), more platters increases the throughput figures even more. But feel free to show me how the 400Gig 7200.9 is faster than the 500Gig 7200.9, i'd love to see it.

If speed with large storage space is what you're after get the WD4000KD, if you want lots and lots of space and some speed then get the seagate, if you want speed at the cost of everything then get a raptor 150.

 

[Starbuck1975]

For mobo go with the Epox EP-9NPA+Ultra, supposed to be second best OC'ing board for non-SLI socet 939

What's the first best...I have heard mixed reviews on the Epox in terms of quality.

For the hard drive take a look at the Seagate 7200.9 series, maybe get a small primary and a larger one for storage

I already have two large IDE legacy Maxtor drives I can salvage for backup storage...the only things I will put on the primary drive is my program files...I always use backup drives for storage of everything else.

i'd have stuck with the Asus board but if you like the Abit better then who am i to argue.

I am considering the Asus A8N-E, as I probably dont need an SLI board at this point...I tend to lean towards Abit only because I have built a few systems with their boards in the past, and like their softbios features.

PC Power and Cooling is way overkill. There are strong and quality PSUs taht will drive that rig for $50. (Check around)

Depending on what Mobo I choose, their compatibility list may drive this decision.

 

[t3h l337 n3wb]

Don't worry about compatability lists. Just go with a nice PSU from a quality manufacturer. I vote Seasonic S12-500 for reasons mentioned above. And it doesn't matter that the hard drive is the bottleneck, because once you wait a couple more seconds for the game to load, everything else will be as smooth as butter. I'd rather get a 15 FPS performance boost than a couple seconds shaved off my loading time in Doom 3 or whatever. The huge price difference you have to pay to get a Raptor isn't worth it. I mean, would you rather have an X1800XT and a 160GB 7200RPM drive, or a 7800GT and a 150GB Raptor? The money would be much better spent elsewhere.

Oh, and about the motherboard. The EPoX 9nPA+ Ultra is a great board that overclocks very well. It's interface is pretty easy to use, and it's pretty cheap too. It overclocks almost as good as the DFI Lanparty Ultra-D, but it's a lot more user-friendly. I recommend it. I have the Neo4 Platinum myself, and it's a great board. However, it's not that good for overclocking, so get the EPoX instead. I bought it because of the RAID 5 support, clear CMOS button, and other small goodies.

 

[Bobthelost]

The difference between the best and the second best is not worth crying tears of blood over on the motherboard side. Look at the feature set of the ones you like, they will both overclock well, the difference won't be much on that side so pick one that has the features you want/need.

PSUs and motherboards are almost all compatible, there are exceptions, but they are very rare (the only one i know of is the neo HE PSU's fault).

 

[Starbuck1975]

Still havent decided what I am going to do about the motherboard. I actually like the feature list and layout of the MSI NEO4, but I have read through all the user forums for that board, and it seems to be a bit quirky.

Oh, and about the motherboard. The EPoX 9nPA+ Ultra is a great board that overclocks very well. It's interface is pretty easy to use, and it's pretty cheap too. It overclocks almost as good as the DFI Lanparty Ultra-D, but it's a lot more user-friendly. I recommend it. I have the Neo4 Platinum myself, and it's a great board. However, it's not that good for overclocking, so get the EPoX instead. I bought it because of the RAID 5 support, clear CMOS button, and other small goodies.

How do you like the Neo4 Platinum...was it easy to setup and install...I have read there are some driver issues with it straight out of the box. As I dont really plan on overclocking, I may just go back to the Neo4, which was my original choice during my first attempt at coming up with a build.

That makes my build list:

ABIT AN8-ULTRA or MSI NEO4 Platinum
eVGA 7800GT
Seasonic 500W
Athlon X2 3800+ or Opteron 165
Corsair ValueSelect (2x1GB) dual channel kit (PC3200)
Western Digital Cavier SE16

I am probably going to stick with the Cavier over the Raptor...the Cavier is getting some stellar reviews...if we are talking about a 1ms load time gain from the Raptor to the Cavier, I am not too concerned. Given the relative power of the system as it stands right now, it should be able to handle most gaming functions, at high resolutions and with all the goodie settings maxed out, for at least a year or two.

 

[A5]

I have a Neo4 Platinum - I haven't had any problems with it. (Running a 3200+ at 2.55GHz - only problem is my crappy RAM, so I have to use a divider)

For this kind of money, you may want to consider buying a sound card - since you mostly game, I'd go for the cheapest X-Fi or get a used Audigy2 from eBay or FS/T.

 

[Starbuck1975]

I actually already have an Audigy 2 I can salvage from my current rig...as I play with headphones only, this should be a sufficient upgrade from the onboard audio anyway...that and it will give me a second firewire port.

 

[A5]

Ah...then I think that setup will be fine. Just go ahead and get it over with

 

[Starbuck1975]

Ok kids, I think I finally have a build list. What I am salvaging from my current rig:

KINGWIN KT-436WM
Soundblaster Audigy 2
Plextor PX-504A DVD Burner
Kenwood 72x CD-ROM
2x40GB Maxtor IDE drives

Now for the new components:
Abit AN8 Ultra MOBO
eVGA 7800GT
Antec TruePower II 550V
AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ Manchester
2x1GB OCZ PC 3200 Platinum Series Dual Channel Kit
Saitek Eclipse Keyboard
Logitech G5 Laser Mouse
6xCooler Master 80mm R4-L8S-18SB Case Fans
PLEXTOR PX-TV402U-NA ConvertX PVR Device
SONY IDE DVD-ROM Drive Model DDU1615/B2s - OEM


Total cost of new components: $1376

 

[Starbuck1975]

shameless bump

 

[Starbuck1975]

Ugh...have discovered a few internet rumors that suggest Abit may be going kaplunk. Build changes as follows:

Ok kids, I think I finally have a build list. What I am salvaging from my current rig:

KINGWIN KT-436WM
Soundblaster Audigy 2
Plextor PX-504A DVD Burner
Kenwood 72x CD-ROM
2x40GB Maxtor IDE drives

Now for the new components:
DFI LANPARTY UT nF4 Ultra-D/MSI NEO4 Platinum/Epox EP-9NPA+Ultra
eVGA 7800GT
Antec TruePower II 550V
AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ Manchester
2x1GB OCZ PC 3200 Platinum Series Dual Channel Kit
Saitek Eclipse Keyboard
Logitech G5 Laser Mouse
6xCooler Master 80mm R4-L8S-18SB Case Fans
PLEXTOR PX-TV402U-NA ConvertX PVR Device
SONY IDE DVD-ROM Drive Model DDU1615/B2s - OEM

Just need help deciding on a MOBO...yet again.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: CalamitySymphony
PC Power and Cooling is way overkill. There are strong and quality PSUs taht will drive that rig for $50. (Check around)

A large harddrive will work well if you need the storage, however, not the WD Caviar. I'm not an expert, but the general consensus is one of the large Seagate Drives if I remember correctly.

Everything you listed (and a different PSU) adds up only to around $900. Which makes room for a Raptor

PC Power & Cooling is only over kill if you can`t afford one or have no clue what a quality PSU is.....
In the PSU market you truly do get what you pay for...
The only PSU I would even look at in the $50 range is the Fortron...


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817104954
FSP Group (Fortron Source) AX450-PN 450W Power Supply - Retail

 

[t3h l337 n3wb]

Antec's quality really isn't as good as people think. It's still among the "good" brands, but there are much better options for the price. The $50 Fortron 450W is excellent, but if you want a bit more juice, there's a really powerful 550W Sparkle for about $105 on Newegg. It has 36A on a single +12V rail, which is more flexible than dual +12V rails. Enermax also makes some excellent PSU's in the $70-$100 price range.

And about the Neo4 Platinum. I used it straight out of the box. It was my first build, and it went very smoothly with no problems at all. Overclocking was very easy on it, and I love the RAID 5 support.

 

[alimoalem]

don't get the SLI board if you won't be using it immediately. you'll save a bit right there....how much is the ePower? if it's $50ish, get a fortron