The Islamic Thread 2

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour

Why this ?


And this ?

As a matter of point, don't post blogs for evidence. It is simply unprofessional and extremely biased.

How is that biased, or why does it matter if it is ?

There are links to facts in those blogs, so your point is vague.

What exactly are you trying to say with those two links?

I want answer why muslims are like that.

Can you explain ?

Look in America at the poor neighborhoods and you will find much higher numbers of all crimes including rape and child molestation *from all citizens.. whites .. blacks .. mexicans .. etc etc

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: dahunan
another thing... If I insult Mohammed or Allah.. WHY THE FVCK DO YOU PEOPLE GET VIOLENT ABOUT IT AND CAST FATWAS and shi1t...

Why do you people kill authors of books or movies that you don't agree with

I would guess that it ultimately stems from the apostasy laws and how it really leads to unquestioning and some brainwashed people.

I wonder what Islamic Law is like for someone to insult Mohammed. I imagine it is the same as the punishment for an apostate.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour
I want answer why muslims are like that.

Can you explain ?

There are people of every group in the entire world that has some members that do 'bad' things like what you have posted. In Europe, it's because the Muslims are generally discriminated against (which is kind of ironic I think in regards to my conversation with mo00eom) and poor.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: dahunan
another thing... If I insult Mohammed or Allah.. WHY THE FVCK DO YOU PEOPLE GET VIOLENT ABOUT IT AND CAST FATWAS and shi1t...

Why do you people kill authors of books or movies that you don't agree with

I would guess that it ultimately stems from the apostasy laws and how it really leads to unquestioning and some brainwashed people.

I wonder what Islamic Law is like for someone to insult Mohammed. I imagine it is the same as the punishment for an apostate.

It might only be rumor but I have heard that you get sent to jail if you sell a Bible in Saudi Arabia on the street. If you preach about Christianity you go to jail and if you insult Allah or their religion you also go to jail..

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: dahunan
another thing... If I insult Mohammed or Allah.. WHY THE FVCK DO YOU PEOPLE GET VIOLENT ABOUT IT AND CAST FATWAS and shi1t...

Why do you people kill authors of books or movies that you don't agree with

I would guess that it ultimately stems from the apostasy laws and how it really leads to unquestioning and some brainwashed people.

I wonder what Islamic Law is like for someone to insult Mohammed. I imagine it is the same as the punishment for an apostate.

It might only be rumor but I have heard that you get sent to jail if you sell a Bible in Saudi Arabia on the street. If you preach about Christianity you go to jail and if you insult Allah or their religion you also go to jail..

I have heard something like that...I suppose it is inspired from the apostasy laws.

 

[Sixtyfour]

Originally posted by: dahunan


Look in America at the poor neighborhoods and you will find much higher numbers of all crimes including rape and child molestation *from all citizens.. whites .. blacks .. mexicans .. etc etc

US has much higher crime rates than EU, but that does not explain why muslims are the problem in EU.
Problem is not fixed if others start to commit more crimes.

Europe, it's because the Muslims are generally discriminated against (which is kind of ironic I think in regards to my conversation with mo00eom) and poor.

What ? Are you really saying that Muslims rape and cast fatwas because they are discriminated ?
IT'S WHAT THEY DO THAT DISCRIMINATES THEM !

Is it ok if i rape when im out of money, and can i kill somebody that has different religion than i have ?
Remember what happened to jews in europe over 60 years ago.. it's a different religion..

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour
US has much higher crime rates than EU, but that does not explain why muslims are the problem in EU.
Problem is not fixed if others start to commit more crimes.

Why are Muslims not a problem in the US? It's because Muslims in Europe are generally more discriminated against and are poor while Muslims in the US are well off.

I'm also not sure if the US has less crime than the EU.

What ? Are you really saying that Muslims rape and cast fatwas because they are discriminated ?
IT'S WHAT THEY DO THAT DISCRIMINATES THEM !

Is it ok if i rape when im out of money, and can i kill somebody that has different religion than i have ?
Remember what happened to jews in europe over 60 years ago.. it's a different religion..

I'm saying that some people (and that includes some Muslims) will rape people or commit crimes because they are poor and discriminated against.

"IT'S WHAT THEY DO THAT DISCRIMINATES THEM !" - This is one of the things that generally separates Americans from Europeans, IMO. Europeans just don't understand. If you said that in the US as an attempt to justify your racism and/or discrimination against a group of people, then you would be instantly labelled as a racist and generally looked down upon. In Europe, it seems to be more accepted.

 

[Sixtyfour]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

"IT'S WHAT THEY DO THAT DISCRIMINATES THEM !" - This is one of the things that generally separates Americans from Europeans, IMO. Europeans just don't understand. If you said that in the US as an attempt to justify your racism and/or discrimination against a group of people, then you would be instantly labelled as a racist and generally looked down upon. In Europe, it seems to be more accepted.

That solves every problem muslims make, lets call non muslims rasists...


:roll:

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

"IT'S WHAT THEY DO THAT DISCRIMINATES THEM !" - This is one of the things that generally separates Americans from Europeans, IMO. Europeans just don't understand. If you said that in the US as an attempt to justify your racism and/or discrimination against a group of people, then you would be instantly labelled as a racist and generally looked down upon. In Europe, it seems to be more accepted.

That solves every problem muslims make, lets call non muslims rasists...


:roll:

I have no idea what you are trying to say. But I'm not a Muslim and non-Muslims are not necessarily racists. Maybe I read your statement wrong, but there is a fundamental difference between Americans and Europeans in regards to this issue, IMO.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: dahunan
another thing... If I insult Mohammed or Allah.. WHY THE FVCK DO YOU PEOPLE GET VIOLENT ABOUT IT AND CAST FATWAS and shi1t...

Why do you people kill authors of books or movies that you don't agree with

I would guess that it ultimately stems from the apostasy laws and how it really leads to unquestioning and some brainwashed people.

I wonder what Islamic Law is like for someone to insult Mohammed. I imagine it is the same as the punishment for an apostate.

It might only be rumor but I have heard that you get sent to jail if you sell a Bible in Saudi Arabia on the street. If you preach about Christianity you go to jail and if you insult Allah or their religion you also go to jail..

It is recommended that non-muslims should stay out of all muslim countries just for safety. These people are very intolerant and could pose a threat. Being gay is a major crime in many of these countries, and if caught, you could face execution.

Muslims in Europe are not integrated into the communities like they are here in America. They are left alone, in seclusion. There are very high tensions between the muslims and the Europeans, especially in England. Part of this is that muslims do not wish to become part of the country, many of them still want to follow the harsh rules of their home countries. The other reason is that Europeans look down upon them and have no intention to welcome them.

But Europe has always had a problem with dealing with people of different religions, such as the Jews, for example. This is nothing new for them. Whether it be racial, religious, some Europeans simply cannot except other people.

Then you have the muslim extremists preaching holy war and calling for suicide bombings across Europe from inside Europe! Free speech can only go so far, why don't these European countries arrest and deport these terrorists?

Just look at the race riots recently in England, shows you all you need.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Muslims are pushing the limit in England and the EU over issues like this:

Text

Making a pig's ear of defending democracy
By Mark Steyn
(Filed: 04/10/2005)

A year and a half ago, I mentioned in this space the Florentine Boar, a famous piece of porcine statuary in Derby that the council had decided not to have repaired on the grounds that it would offend Muslims. Having just seen Looney Tunes: Back in Action, in which Porky Pig mentions en passant that Warner Bros has advised him to lose the stammer, I wondered if for the British release it might be easier just to lose the pig.

Alas, the United Kingdom's descent into dhimmitude is beyond parody. Dudley Metropolitan Borough Council (Tory-controlled) has now announced that, following a complaint by a Muslim employee, all work pictures and knick-knacks of novelty pigs and "pig-related items" will be banned. Among the verboten items is one employee's box of tissues, because it features a representation of Winnie the Pooh and Piglet. And, as we know, Muslims regard pigs as "unclean", even an anthropomorphised cartoon pig wearing a scarf and a bright, colourful singlet.

Cllr Mahbubur Rahman is in favour of the blanket pig crackdown. "It is a good thing, it is a tolerance and acceptance of their beliefs and understanding," he said. That's all, folks, as Porky Pig used to stammer at the end of Looney Tunes. Just a little helpful proscription in the interests of tolerance and acceptance.

And where's the harm in that? As Pastor Niemöller said, first they came for Piglet and I did not speak out because I was not a Disney character and, if I was, I'm more of an Eeyore.

And aren't we all? When the Queen knights a Muslim "community leader" whose line on the Rushdie fatwa was that "death is perhaps too easy", and when the Prime Minister has a Muslim "adviser" who is a Holocaust-denier and thinks the Iraq war was cooked up by a conspiracy of Freemasons and Jews, and when the Prime Minister's wife leads the legal battle for a Talibanesque dress code in British schools, you don't need a pig to know which side's bringing home the bacon.

A couple of years ago, when an anxious-to-please head teacher in Batley was banning offensive "pig-centred books", Inayat Bunglawala of the Muslim Council of Britain commented that "there is absolutely no scriptural authority for this view. It is a misunderstanding of the Koranic instruction that Muslims may not eat pork." Mr Bunglawala is a typical "moderate" Muslim - he thinks the British media are "Zionist-controlled", etc - but on the pig thing he's surely right. It seems unlikely that even the exhaustive strictures of the Koran would have a line on Piglet.

So these little news items that pop up every week now are significant mostly as a gauge of the progressive liberal's urge to self-abase and Western Muslims' ever greater boldness in flexing their political muscle.

After all, how daffy does a Muslim's willingness to take offence have to be to get rejected out of court? Only the other day, Burger King withdrew its ice-cream cones from its British restaurants because Mr Rashad Akhtar of High Wycombe, after a trip to the Park Royal branch, complained that the creamy swirl on the lid resembled the word "Allah" in Arabic script.

It doesn't, not really, not except that in the sense any twirly motif looks vaguely Arabic. After all, Burger King isn't suicidal enough to launch Allah Ice-Cream. But, after Mr Akhtar urged Muslims to boycott the chain and claimed that "this is my jihad", Burger King yanked the ice-cream and announced that, design-wise, it was going back to the old drawing-board.

Offence is, by definition, in the eye of the beholder. I once toured the Freud Museum with the celebrated sex therapist Dr Ruth, who claimed to be able to see a penis in every artwork and piece of furniture in the joint. Yet, when I suggested one sculpture looked vaguely like the female genitalia, she scoffed mercilessly.

Likewise, Piglet is deeply offensive and so's your chocolate ice-cream, but if a West End play opens with a gay Jesus, Christians just need to stop being so doctrinaire and uptight. The Church of England bishops would probably agree with that if, in their own misguided attempt at Islamic outreach, they weren't so busy apologising for toppling Saddam.

When every act that a culture makes communicates weakness and loss of self-belief, eventually you'll be taken at your word. In the long term, these trivial concessions are more significant victories than blowing up infidels on the Tube or in Bali beach restaurants. An act of murder demands at least the pretence of moral seriousness, even from the dopiest appeasers. But small acts of cultural vandalism corrode the fabric of freedom all but unseen.

Is it really a victory for "tolerance" to say that a council worker cannot have a Piglet coffee mug on her desk? And isn't an ability to turn a blind eye to animated piglets the very least the West is entitled to expect from its Muslim citizens? If Islam cannot "co-exist" even with Pooh or the abstract swirl on a Burger King ice-cream, how likely is it that it can co-exist with the more basic principles of a pluralist society? As A A Milne almost said: "They're changing guard at Buckingham Palace/ Her Majesty's Law is replaced by Allah's."

By the way, isn't it grossly offensive to British Wahhabis to have a head of state who is female and uncovered?

I doubt whether the Post Office will be in any rush to issue another set of Pooh commemorative stamps, or the BBC to revive Pinky and Perky. Forty years ago, Britain's Islamic minority didn't have the numbers to ban Piglet and change the Burger King menu. Now they do. What will be deemed "unacceptable" in the interests of "tolerance" in 20 or even five years' time?

It has been clear since July 7 that the state has no real idea what to do to reconcile the more disaffected elements of its fastest-growing demographic. But at some point Britons have to ask themselves - while they're still permitted to discuss the question more or less freely - how much of their country they're willing to lose. The Hundred-Acre Wood is not the terrain on which one would choose to make one's stand, but from here on in it is only going to become more difficult.

 

[stimpsy]

interesting

 

[dahunan]

If they can't deal with Piglet I say FVCK EM... seriously.. get the hell OFF OF EARTH...

No religion should dictate something as simple as that..

 

[Sultan]

This thread has degenerated into nonsensical comments by the same 10 bigoted people that this forum is used to seeing regarding an issue about Islam/Muslim.

Thanks to all those who posted initially and asked questions. I hope some of the answers helped in providing you with answers about the religion.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: Sultan
This thread has degenerated into nonsensical comments by the same 10 bigoted people that this forum is used to seeing regarding an issue about Islam/Muslim.

Thanks to all those who posted initially and asked questions. I hope some of the answers helped in providing you with answers about the religion.

ANSWER THIS and tell us why WE have to change 4 U

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Muslims are pushing the limit in England and the EU over issues like this:

Text

Making a pig's ear of defending democracy
By Mark Steyn
(Filed: 04/10/2005)

A year and a half ago, I mentioned in this space the Florentine Boar, a famous piece of porcine statuary in Derby that the council had decided not to have repaired on the grounds that it would offend Muslims. Having just seen Looney Tunes: Back in Action, in which Porky Pig mentions en passant that Warner Bros has advised him to lose the stammer, I wondered if for the British release it might be easier just to lose the pig.

Alas, the United Kingdom's descent into dhimmitude is beyond parody. Dudley Metropolitan Borough Council (Tory-controlled) has now announced that, following a complaint by a Muslim employee, all work pictures and knick-knacks of novelty pigs and "pig-related items" will be banned. Among the verboten items is one employee's box of tissues, because it features a representation of Winnie the Pooh and Piglet. And, as we know, Muslims regard pigs as "unclean", even an anthropomorphised cartoon pig wearing a scarf and a bright, colourful singlet.

Cllr Mahbubur Rahman is in favour of the blanket pig crackdown. "It is a good thing, it is a tolerance and acceptance of their beliefs and understanding," he said. That's all, folks, as Porky Pig used to stammer at the end of Looney Tunes. Just a little helpful proscription in the interests of tolerance and acceptance.

And where's the harm in that? As Pastor Niemöller said, first they came for Piglet and I did not speak out because I was not a Disney character and, if I was, I'm more of an Eeyore.

And aren't we all? When the Queen knights a Muslim "community leader" whose line on the Rushdie fatwa was that "death is perhaps too easy", and when the Prime Minister has a Muslim "adviser" who is a Holocaust-denier and thinks the Iraq war was cooked up by a conspiracy of Freemasons and Jews, and when the Prime Minister's wife leads the legal battle for a Talibanesque dress code in British schools, you don't need a pig to know which side's bringing home the bacon.

A couple of years ago, when an anxious-to-please head teacher in Batley was banning offensive "pig-centred books", Inayat Bunglawala of the Muslim Council of Britain commented that "there is absolutely no scriptural authority for this view. It is a misunderstanding of the Koranic instruction that Muslims may not eat pork." Mr Bunglawala is a typical "moderate" Muslim - he thinks the British media are "Zionist-controlled", etc - but on the pig thing he's surely right. It seems unlikely that even the exhaustive strictures of the Koran would have a line on Piglet.

So these little news items that pop up every week now are significant mostly as a gauge of the progressive liberal's urge to self-abase and Western Muslims' ever greater boldness in flexing their political muscle.

After all, how daffy does a Muslim's willingness to take offence have to be to get rejected out of court? Only the other day, Burger King withdrew its ice-cream cones from its British restaurants because Mr Rashad Akhtar of High Wycombe, after a trip to the Park Royal branch, complained that the creamy swirl on the lid resembled the word "Allah" in Arabic script.

It doesn't, not really, not except that in the sense any twirly motif looks vaguely Arabic. After all, Burger King isn't suicidal enough to launch Allah Ice-Cream. But, after Mr Akhtar urged Muslims to boycott the chain and claimed that "this is my jihad", Burger King yanked the ice-cream and announced that, design-wise, it was going back to the old drawing-board.

Offence is, by definition, in the eye of the beholder. I once toured the Freud Museum with the celebrated sex therapist Dr Ruth, who claimed to be able to see a penis in every artwork and piece of furniture in the joint. Yet, when I suggested one sculpture looked vaguely like the female genitalia, she scoffed mercilessly.

Likewise, Piglet is deeply offensive and so's your chocolate ice-cream, but if a West End play opens with a gay Jesus, Christians just need to stop being so doctrinaire and uptight. The Church of England bishops would probably agree with that if, in their own misguided attempt at Islamic outreach, they weren't so busy apologising for toppling Saddam.

When every act that a culture makes communicates weakness and loss of self-belief, eventually you'll be taken at your word. In the long term, these trivial concessions are more significant victories than blowing up infidels on the Tube or in Bali beach restaurants. An act of murder demands at least the pretence of moral seriousness, even from the dopiest appeasers. But small acts of cultural vandalism corrode the fabric of freedom all but unseen.

Is it really a victory for "tolerance" to say that a council worker cannot have a Piglet coffee mug on her desk? And isn't an ability to turn a blind eye to animated piglets the very least the West is entitled to expect from its Muslim citizens? If Islam cannot "co-exist" even with Pooh or the abstract swirl on a Burger King ice-cream, how likely is it that it can co-exist with the more basic principles of a pluralist society? As A A Milne almost said: "They're changing guard at Buckingham Palace/ Her Majesty's Law is replaced by Allah's."

By the way, isn't it grossly offensive to British Wahhabis to have a head of state who is female and uncovered?

I doubt whether the Post Office will be in any rush to issue another set of Pooh commemorative stamps, or the BBC to revive Pinky and Perky. Forty years ago, Britain's Islamic minority didn't have the numbers to ban Piglet and change the Burger King menu. Now they do. What will be deemed "unacceptable" in the interests of "tolerance" in 20 or even five years' time?

It has been clear since July 7 that the state has no real idea what to do to reconcile the more disaffected elements of its fastest-growing demographic. But at some point Britons have to ask themselves - while they're still permitted to discuss the question more or less freely - how much of their country they're willing to lose. The Hundred-Acre Wood is not the terrain on which one would choose to make one's stand, but from here on in it is only going to become more difficult.

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Sultan
This thread has degenerated into nonsensical comments by the same 10 bigoted people that this forum is used to seeing regarding an issue about Islam/Muslim.

Thanks to all those who posted initially and asked questions. I hope some of the answers helped in providing you with answers about the religion.

ANSWER THIS and tell us why WE have to change 4 U

A pig is an unclean animal. As a Muslim, I am supposed to NOT eat it or keep it as pets or raise it. Meaning Muslims should have as far a contact from LIVE pigs as possible. Period.

What the article posted by a usual commentator of negative feelings about Islam serves to do is absolutely nothing. Some dude wrote an article about some minor event, which is in no way happening across the world, and riles your emotions up.

I dont have to answer xenophobes and Islamophobes. Have a nice day.

 

[Sultan]

And by the way, those who possess and portray such strong negative emotions about Islam and its people only serve to show their insecure feelings and their insignificant lives.

Islam is 1.5 billion strong; that is 1/5th of the world's population. And it is fast growing. 10 people on this forum who continue to spout the same garbage about barbarity, discrimination, blah blah blah are not going to change/influence the trend of Islam's growth.

And if you think there are more non-conformist Muslims in the figure of 1.5 billion, you cannot be more wrong. More and more Muslims are turning towards religion, or towards fundamentalism (a term I do not use with negative connotation).

The intent of this thread was to answer questions about the faith from those who were interested in learning. Unfortunately those with their own biases again hijacked the thread as they did in the first thread.

I hope I was able to serve those who sincerely were seeking answers.

 

[0marTheZealot]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: Sixtyfour

Why this ?


And this ?

As a matter of point, don't post blogs for evidence. It is simply unprofessional and extremely biased.

How is that biased, or why does it matter if it is ?

There are links to facts in those blogs, so your point is vague.

What exactly are you trying to say with those two links?

That they serve no real purpose other than inflammation. It is someone's opinion and distortion of facts.

 

[0marTheZealot]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Sultan
This thread has degenerated into nonsensical comments by the same 10 bigoted people that this forum is used to seeing regarding an issue about Islam/Muslim.

Thanks to all those who posted initially and asked questions. I hope some of the answers helped in providing you with answers about the religion.

ANSWER THIS and tell us why WE have to change 4 U

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Muslims are pushing the limit in England and the EU over issues like this:

Text

Making a pig's ear of defending democracy
By Mark Steyn
(Filed: 04/10/2005)

A year and a half ago, I mentioned in this space the Florentine Boar, a famous piece of porcine statuary in Derby that the council had decided not to have repaired on the grounds that it would offend Muslims. Having just seen Looney Tunes: Back in Action, in which Porky Pig mentions en passant that Warner Bros has advised him to lose the stammer, I wondered if for the British release it might be easier just to lose the pig.

Alas, the United Kingdom's descent into dhimmitude is beyond parody. Dudley Metropolitan Borough Council (Tory-controlled) has now announced that, following a complaint by a Muslim employee, all work pictures and knick-knacks of novelty pigs and "pig-related items" will be banned. Among the verboten items is one employee's box of tissues, because it features a representation of Winnie the Pooh and Piglet. And, as we know, Muslims regard pigs as "unclean", even an anthropomorphised cartoon pig wearing a scarf and a bright, colourful singlet.

Cllr Mahbubur Rahman is in favour of the blanket pig crackdown. "It is a good thing, it is a tolerance and acceptance of their beliefs and understanding," he said. That's all, folks, as Porky Pig used to stammer at the end of Looney Tunes. Just a little helpful proscription in the interests of tolerance and acceptance.

And where's the harm in that? As Pastor Niemöller said, first they came for Piglet and I did not speak out because I was not a Disney character and, if I was, I'm more of an Eeyore.

And aren't we all? When the Queen knights a Muslim "community leader" whose line on the Rushdie fatwa was that "death is perhaps too easy", and when the Prime Minister has a Muslim "adviser" who is a Holocaust-denier and thinks the Iraq war was cooked up by a conspiracy of Freemasons and Jews, and when the Prime Minister's wife leads the legal battle for a Talibanesque dress code in British schools, you don't need a pig to know which side's bringing home the bacon.

A couple of years ago, when an anxious-to-please head teacher in Batley was banning offensive "pig-centred books", Inayat Bunglawala of the Muslim Council of Britain commented that "there is absolutely no scriptural authority for this view. It is a misunderstanding of the Koranic instruction that Muslims may not eat pork." Mr Bunglawala is a typical "moderate" Muslim - he thinks the British media are "Zionist-controlled", etc - but on the pig thing he's surely right. It seems unlikely that even the exhaustive strictures of the Koran would have a line on Piglet.

So these little news items that pop up every week now are significant mostly as a gauge of the progressive liberal's urge to self-abase and Western Muslims' ever greater boldness in flexing their political muscle.

After all, how daffy does a Muslim's willingness to take offence have to be to get rejected out of court? Only the other day, Burger King withdrew its ice-cream cones from its British restaurants because Mr Rashad Akhtar of High Wycombe, after a trip to the Park Royal branch, complained that the creamy swirl on the lid resembled the word "Allah" in Arabic script.

It doesn't, not really, not except that in the sense any twirly motif looks vaguely Arabic. After all, Burger King isn't suicidal enough to launch Allah Ice-Cream. But, after Mr Akhtar urged Muslims to boycott the chain and claimed that "this is my jihad", Burger King yanked the ice-cream and announced that, design-wise, it was going back to the old drawing-board.

Offence is, by definition, in the eye of the beholder. I once toured the Freud Museum with the celebrated sex therapist Dr Ruth, who claimed to be able to see a penis in every artwork and piece of furniture in the joint. Yet, when I suggested one sculpture looked vaguely like the female genitalia, she scoffed mercilessly.

Likewise, Piglet is deeply offensive and so's your chocolate ice-cream, but if a West End play opens with a gay Jesus, Christians just need to stop being so doctrinaire and uptight. The Church of England bishops would probably agree with that if, in their own misguided attempt at Islamic outreach, they weren't so busy apologising for toppling Saddam.

When every act that a culture makes communicates weakness and loss of self-belief, eventually you'll be taken at your word. In the long term, these trivial concessions are more significant victories than blowing up infidels on the Tube or in Bali beach restaurants. An act of murder demands at least the pretence of moral seriousness, even from the dopiest appeasers. But small acts of cultural vandalism corrode the fabric of freedom all but unseen.

Is it really a victory for "tolerance" to say that a council worker cannot have a Piglet coffee mug on her desk? And isn't an ability to turn a blind eye to animated piglets the very least the West is entitled to expect from its Muslim citizens? If Islam cannot "co-exist" even with Pooh or the abstract swirl on a Burger King ice-cream, how likely is it that it can co-exist with the more basic principles of a pluralist society? As A A Milne almost said: "They're changing guard at Buckingham Palace/ Her Majesty's Law is replaced by Allah's."

By the way, isn't it grossly offensive to British Wahhabis to have a head of state who is female and uncovered?

I doubt whether the Post Office will be in any rush to issue another set of Pooh commemorative stamps, or the BBC to revive Pinky and Perky. Forty years ago, Britain's Islamic minority didn't have the numbers to ban Piglet and change the Burger King menu. Now they do. What will be deemed "unacceptable" in the interests of "tolerance" in 20 or even five years' time?

It has been clear since July 7 that the state has no real idea what to do to reconcile the more disaffected elements of its fastest-growing demographic. But at some point Britons have to ask themselves - while they're still permitted to discuss the question more or less freely - how much of their country they're willing to lose. The Hundred-Acre Wood is not the terrain on which one would choose to make one's stand, but from here on in it is only going to become more difficult.

Democracy in action. I hate it too, but that's the way the chips fall. Some of those objections are clearly non-sensical, even for devout Muslims.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Sultan
This thread has degenerated into nonsensical comments by the same 10 bigoted people that this forum is used to seeing regarding an issue about Islam/Muslim.

Thanks to all those who posted initially and asked questions. I hope some of the answers helped in providing you with answers about the religion.

ANSWER THIS and tell us why WE have to change 4 U

A pig is an unclean animal. As a Muslim, I am supposed to NOT eat it or keep it as pets or raise it. Meaning Muslims should have as far a contact from LIVE pigs as possible. Period.

What the article posted by a usual commentator of negative feelings about Islam serves to do is absolutely nothing. Some dude wrote an article about some minor event, which is in no way happening across the world, and riles your emotions up.

I dont have to answer xenophobes and Islamophobes. Have a nice day.

Oh get over yourself.

The article is an example of a growing problem in the EU and elsewhere. Muslims expect other cultures to accomodate them and accept their ways, but sure don't seem to feel obligated to respond in kind. Christians can't even be caught with a bible in SA for fear it will be confiscated. Could you imagine the uproar from Muslims if we here in the US banned anyone from possessing a quran or prohibited Muslims from meeting and practicing their religion?

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: Sultan
This thread has degenerated into nonsensical comments by the same 10 bigoted people that this forum is used to seeing regarding an issue about Islam/Muslim.

Thanks to all those who posted initially and asked questions. I hope some of the answers helped in providing you with answers about the religion.

ANSWER THIS and tell us why WE have to change 4 U

A pig is an unclean animal. As a Muslim, I am supposed to NOT eat it or keep it as pets or raise it. Meaning Muslims should have as far a contact from LIVE pigs as possible. Period.

What the article posted by a usual commentator of negative feelings about Islam serves to do is absolutely nothing. Some dude wrote an article about some minor event, which is in no way happening across the world, and riles your emotions up.

I dont have to answer xenophobes and Islamophobes. Have a nice day.

Oh get over yourself.

The article is an example of a growing problem in the EU and elsewhere. Muslims expect other cultures to accomodate them and accept their ways, but sure don't seem to feel obligated to respond in kind. Christians can't even be caught with a bible in SA for fear it will be confiscated. Could you imagine the uproar from Muslims if we here in the US banned anyone from possessing a quran or prohibited Muslims from meeting and practicing their religion?

It is not a growing problem for him.. In his eyes it = A GROWING SUCCESS ... as easily seen in his anwer.. Islam is about Domination and obviously you will convert or die

 

[raildogg]

Hey Sultan, you need to wake up and come to reality. By far, the followers of Islam are the most intolerant people in the world, its either convert or die or be tortured. Their way or no way at all.

Why can't gays live a happy life in Saudi Arabia? Why is it that gays live in constant fear that if they are caught they may face execution? Now you are giving pathetic excuses over these radical muslims trying to change laws in Europe so they could satisfy their radical muslim teachings.

So anyone who criticizes Islam is a bigot now?

Imagine if in a majority Christian or any other majority non-muslim country, gays and others were routinely arrested, tortured and executed, what would the outcry be. But since its the followers of Islam doing it, lets ignore it and move on.

 

[azazyel]

Originally posted by: raildogg
Hey Sultan, you need to wake up and come to reality. By far, the followers of Islam are the most intolerant people in the world, its either convert or die or be tortured. Their way or no way at all.

Why can't gays live a happy life in Saudi Arabia? Why is it that gays live in constant fear that if they are caught they may face execution? Now you are giving pathetic excuses over these radical muslims trying to change laws in Europe so they could satisfy their radical muslim teachings.

So anyone who criticizes Islam is a bigot now?

Imagine if in a majority Christian or any other majority non-muslim country, gays and others were routinely arrested, tortured and executed, what would the outcry be. But since its the followers of Islam doing it, lets ignore it and move on.

You're kidding right? In the US, gays have been persecuted just as much. We have gay rehabilitation camps for god's sake. Gay bashing has gone on the decline but mostly because of local citizens taking action. If you go to Capital Hill in Seattle, you will notice guys in a quasi uniform patrolling the streets. I can't remember what they're called but their purpose was/is to prevent gay bashing. Do gays have the same rights in America as other citizens, nope not all of them.

Not being able to have your bible? How about having excerpts from someone else bible pasted all over a court of law? You guys are really friggen unbelievable. Until one of you goes to a mosque and speaks with someone instead of just spouting rhetoric you should just STFU and GBTW.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: Sultan
And by the way, those who possess and portray such strong negative emotions about Islam and its people only serve to show their insecure feelings and their insignificant lives.

Islam is 1.5 billion strong; that is 1/5th of the world's population. And it is fast growing. 10 people on this forum who continue to spout the same garbage about barbarity, discrimination, blah blah blah are not going to change/influence the trend of Islam's growth.

And if you think there are more non-conformist Muslims in the figure of 1.5 billion, you cannot be more wrong. More and more Muslims are turning towards religion, or towards fundamentalism (a term I do not use with negative connotation).

The intent of this thread was to answer questions about the faith from those who were interested in learning. Unfortunately those with their own biases again hijacked the thread as they did in the first thread.

I hope I was able to serve those who sincerely were seeking answers.

You answered a question I didn't ask. That question was - Are Muslims intolerant of criticism of Islam and intolerant of those who criticize Islam?

You've clearly shown the answer to be "yes."

Apparently you are also completely intolerant of anything that doesn't subscribe to the tenets of Islam. It's why I don't agree with you and it's another "trend" of Islam I don't agree with either. That intolerance is going to come to a head eventually and there will be a major showdown in the future, if it already hasn't begun thanks to the actions of your pal, Osama bin Laden. It's unfortunate and ironic that the "religion of peace" will end up doing little more than bringing mass bloodshed to this world. Unfortunately, religions have a penchant for doing that.

 

[azazyel]

TLC, you should check out the CAIR website. You will probably be able to find the answer to your questions there.

http://www.cair-net.org/