The honeymoon

[zsdersw]

How long until the honeymoon is over? How long do you believe it will be until the Republican party starts ignoring the Tea Party and their fiscal demands?

I, personally, believe it will start a few months after January.. perhaps summer 2011.

It would be nice if the Republicans would remain fiscally hawkish, but there's just too much history of them being the opposite for me to believe the election in November changed anything.

 

[fskimospy]

The tea party's demands are for the most part incoherent, I don't know how you could follow them even if you wanted to.

 

[zsdersw]

The tea party's demands are for the most part incoherent, I don't know how you could follow them even if you wanted to.

No group turns incoherence and disarray into action better than political parties.

 

[PokerGuy]

No group turns incoherence and disarray into action better than political parties.

:biggrin: Very true!

The tea party's demands are for the most part incoherent, I don't know how you could follow them even if you wanted to.

True dat. The Tea Party is a conglomeration of people that share a few things but also disagree on many others, so I don't see how they could have any coherent demands as a group. Their influence is already being felt though, especially on the republican side.

 

[boomerang]

They already have ignored the Tea Party. But their ideologies are not the same, so there is no surprise there - at least to me.

To me, the message of the Tea Party is one of fiscal responsibility. I should clarify because that can be interpreted a number of ways. It means spending below your means. It means making sure tax dollars are spent wisely. It entails remembering that every tax dollar was received because someone had to toil and labor for it. It doesn't mean take the easy way out and increase taxes so you don't have to make those hard decisions.

 

[IronWing]

The tea party is just just a Republican sock puppet used to rev up the party base while giving the party bosses cover when its members look particularly stupid or offensive on camera. The rules of the Senate and House by nature marginalize freshman members so these "tea party candidates" who won will have very little clout when the new Congress convenes.

 

[FerrelGeek]

They already have ignored the Tea Party. But their ideologies are not the same, so there is no surprise there - at least to me.

To me, the message of the Tea Party is one of fiscal responsibility. I should clarify because that can be interpreted a number of ways. It means spending below your means. It means making sure tax dollars are spent wisely. It entails remembering that every tax dollar was received because someone had to toil and labor for it. It doesn't mean take the easy way out and increase taxes so you don't have to make those hard decisions.

The other message from the tea party is that people would actually like their representatives to listen to them, not just do what they bloody well want or what their party machine tells them to do.

 

[zsdersw]

They already have ignored the Tea Party. But their ideologies are not the same, so there is no surprise there - at least to me.

To me, the message of the Tea Party is one of fiscal responsibility. I should clarify because that can be interpreted a number of ways. It means spending below your means. It means making sure tax dollars are spent wisely. It entails remembering that every tax dollar was received because someone had to toil and labor for it. It doesn't mean take the easy way out and increase taxes so you don't have to make those hard decisions.

Spending below your means and wise use of taxpayer dollars are concepts foreign to the federal government, and I doubt the Tea Party will end up doing much if anything to change that.

 

[boomerang]

Spending below your means and wise use of taxpayer dollars are concepts foreign to the federal government, and I doubt the Tea Party will end up doing much if anything to change that.

I don't disagree in the slightest. I think we're headed off a cliff. Even if the Tea Party were to become strong enough to influence what happens in DC, they would soon become as corrupt as the rest of them.

One bad apple spoils the bunch and all that.

 

[Mursilis]

Spending below your means and wise use of taxpayer dollars are concepts foreign to the federal government, and I doubt the Tea Party will end up doing much if anything to change that.

No, those are concepts foreign to most Americans, which is why we've elected a gov't which truly reflects our inner selves - spend now, to heck with tomorrow. Did anyone see that Well Fargo annual survey on the state of the typical American's finances which came out a week or so ago? The average person had, by age 50, something like $39K save for retirement! That's absurd - that won't last a year! The whole housing bubble shows, if you weren't certain before, that the average person is a financial idiot who spends too much and constantly chooses the short term over the long term. And our chosen gov't reflects that.

 

[DesiPower]

you poll is fail, they have already started.

 

[zsdersw]

you poll is fail, they have already started.

.. say most sane and rational people. There are plenty on P&N who are drunk on the Tea Party koolaid, though.. and I wanted to see what they'd say.

 

[thraashman]

Well the problem of the Tea Party from what I've seen is that they want a bunch of conflicting things. They want smaller government, but most seem to want bigger government control socially. They want fiscal responsibility and lower taxes, but don't wanna give up any programs that benefit them or government funded infrastructure. They make a big deal about fiscal responsibility, then did their best to vote in people who weren't fiscally responsible but were extremely socially liberal or even downright looney tunes.

Basically the tea party is the group largely made up of the most crazy of the crazy on the far right. Now, I'm sure that there are some who joined up with the intent of fiscal responsibility. But the party itself was never anything but a socially far right wing of the republican party that has no idea what it actually wants.

 

[Thump553]

What honeymoon? The Pauls will be given a pass but every other nationally elected GOP has GOT to toe the party line on every vote or face effectively being ejected from the party.

 

[Mursilis]

Well the problem of the electorate from what I've seen is that they want a bunch of conflicting things.

Fixed that right up for you.

 

[CrackRabbit]

The other message from the tea party is that people would actually like their representatives to listen to them, not just do what they bloody well want or what their party machine tells them to do.

That would be all good and well, but the Tea Party doesn't know what it wants. As others have pointed out when you have that many angry voices it is hard to distinguish between those who think the president is a secret mooslim terrist and those who actually have an idea on what could be done to change the government for the better.

 

[FerrelGeek]

That would be all good and well, but the Tea Party doesn't know what it wants. As others have pointed out when you have that many angry voices it is hard to distinguish between those who think the president is a secret mooslim terrist and those who actually have an idea on what could be done to change the government for the better.

I agree. The tea party isn't a 'party' at all, but a conglomeration of people dissatisfied with the political status quo. I agree with many of the comments in the posts above. I think we're too far gone in this country; I've said this in other threads as well. The electorate is too addicted to voting themselves money from the public treasurey and being generous with other people's money.

 

[MovingTarget]

Even if the TEA party had a coherent and consistent message, the election is already over. The teabaggers have already been discarded having served their purpose as useful idiots.

 

[thraashman]

Fixed that right up for you.

... I actually don't have any argument against your correction ... you win this round.

 

[her209]

Even if the TEA party had a coherent and consistent message, the election is already over. The teabaggers have already been discarded having served their purpose as useful idiots.

The TEA Party was a money making scam. The biggest winner was Glenn Beck with Sarah Palin taking a close second.

 

[theeedude]

They just passed stimulus 2.0, so honeymoon is over already. Sorry teabaggers, back under the bus you go.

 

[Craig234]

The tea party's demands are for the most part incoherent, I don't know how you could follow them even if you wanted to.

No they're not! Yes they are! Argurrrrglergurrrrrgle!

 

[Craig234]

The TEA Party was a money making scam. The biggest winner was Glenn Beck with Sarah Palin taking a close second.

The tea party is a lot of things.

First, it's a media distortion. The Tea Party gets FAR more coverage than numbers call for.

The Progressive wing of Democrats is far larger but gets a small fraction of the coverage.

Second, it's a predictable offshoot of the Republican party, with some others - it's the catchall 'we're pissed over something, maybe big government' citizen.

Where do Republicans go after 'their side' gets power and might be the worst in history?

Thirdly, it's an attempt by fringe interests to build their base by catching this falloff. Opportunists, interests like the Koch brothers, try to weasel in and get voters.

Fourthly, it's a lost opportunity for the backlash against bad government being more productive, when we really can use protest against a lot of the abuses.

For example, part of the Tea Party is anti-corporatist, even while the corporatist agenda seems to do better (e.g., polluters wanting to gut the EPA).

As so often in politics, it's a naive faction likely to cause harm and the opposite of what many of its members want. The spending they'll cut is the spending good for the public.

Its catchall role can't last - eventually the mutually exclusive interests in the party will battle, and 'just pissed off' won't be the dominant message if it's going to do anything.

The low-hanging fruit is 'change' on some things - throw a monkey wrench in the works, oppose earmarks, oppose a lot of traditional spending - and they're already falling apart over that as Republicans who wanted the benefit of the affiliation don't want some of the costs.

A main danger they pose is diluting the reform movement, and/or having their agenda co-opted by opportunist interests, with demagogues for leaders.

Unfortunately, it's a recipe for cynicism as its members lose faith in the American system - though some of that might be useful when the system is so corporatized.

It'd be nice if they split Republican votes enough to help elect Democrats.

 

[werepossum]

No group turns incoherence and disarray into action better than political parties.

LOL Sig worthy.

The GOP attacked the Tea Party even during the election, the GOP establishment preferring to remain the minority in the Senate rather than to gain the majority while possibly losing control of the Republicans in Congress. Yet even had the Tea Party clearly carried the day and seized control of both chambers, as many have mentioned the disparity of desires and demands ensures that it will fracture into factions. I think that's a good thing. We need Congress to form and disband different factions on different issues, not to be two monoliths each controlled by a relatively small number of party elites. The only thing the Tea Party can really add is to change the nature of compromise. Right now, compromises are largely a matter of buying votes with pork or by simply combining both sides' preferred spending: Give me my mega death star nuclear-powered bomber project and I'll give you your welfare moms in space program. If the Tea Party can change the nature of compromise to include neither side's spending extremes, they will have done something great. Considering that most Republicans effectively become Democrats (except during the election cycle!) after four to six years in D.C. the odds are not good.

 

[Carmen813]

How long until the honeymoon is over? How long do you believe it will be until the Republican party starts ignoring the Tea Party and their fiscal demands?

I, personally, believe it will start a few months after January.. perhaps summer 2011.

It would be nice if the Republicans would remain fiscally hawkish, but there's just too much history of them being the opposite for me to believe the election in November changed anything.

They already started...see: tax plan.