The greatest threat to freedom of speech, the belief in the right not to be offended

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
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Warning: The Literary Canon Could Make Students Squirm
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/18/us/warning-the-literary-canon-could-make-students-squirm.html
SANTA BARBARA, Calif. — Should students about to read “The Great Gatsby” be forewarned about “a variety of scenes that reference gory, abusive and misogynistic violence,” as one Rutgers student proposed? Would any book that addresses racism — like “The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn” or “Things Fall Apart” — have to be preceded by a note of caution? Do sexual images from Greek mythology need to come with a viewer-beware label?


Colleges across the country this spring have been wrestling with student requests for what are known as “trigger warnings,” explicit alerts that the material they are about to read or see in a classroom might upset them or, as some students assert, cause symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder in victims of rape or in war veterans.


The warnings, which have their ideological roots in feminist thought, have gained the most traction at the University of California, Santa Barbara, where the student government formally called for them. But there have been similar requests from students at Oberlin College, Rutgers University, the University of Michigan, George Washington University and other schools.
My, my, the phony liberals political correctness/tolerance chickens are coming home to roost in the very liberal institutions that originally promoted the controversial practice in the 1960's and 1970's of the questioning and criticizing of dogma's and beliefs considered sacrosanct without worrying if someone might be offended which is what made this country great,

(remember when real liberals would fight book bans and censorship like certain music that was deemed offensive by some groups)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ISil7IHzxc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2h6v01FlU4


real liberals better set these phony misguided neo liberals straight in that freedom of speech does not mean freedom from being offended and controversial, provocative ideas and speech while uncomfortable at first is the very exercise the mind needs in order to stay sharp and alert,

because using the war veterans, sexual abuse victims, and others considered by some to be triggered or easily offended as a need for some form of soft censorship is tantamount to walking on a slippery slope next to a cliff.

this comment says it best

Sometimes people, including college students, need to be confronted with ideas, images, stories, and arguments that trigger intense emotions in them. In my own experience, I would cite the Civil Rights Era news clips of Alabama police beating and turning fire hoses on peaceful protesters, Vietnam War photos of the napalmed young girl and the South Vietnamese general executing a Viet Cong prisoner in Saigon, and the Iraq occupation photos of tortured and abused prisoners in the Abu Ghraib.

These are terrifying, traumatic images which every college student should see and think about and learn from. Ironically, it's usually political authorities who desperately want to keep people from viewing such things because they know that people who begin to understand the full horrors of oppression and war are less likely to consent to such things in their name.
Rest of article below

The debate has left many academics fuming, saying that professors should be trusted to use common sense and that being provocative is part of their mandate. Trigger warnings, they say, suggest a certain fragility of mind that higher learning is meant to challenge, not embrace. The warnings have been widely debated in intellectual circles and largely criticized in opinion magazines, newspaper editorials and academic email lists.


“Any kind of blanket trigger policy is inimical to academic freedom,” said Lisa Hajjar, a sociology professor at the university here, who often uses graphic depictions of torture in her courses about war. “Any student can request some sort of individual accommodation, but to say we need some kind of one-size-fits-all approach is totally wrong. The presumption there is that students should not be forced to deal with something that makes them uncomfortable is absurd or even dangerous.”


Bailey Loverin, a sophomore at Santa Barbara, said the idea for campuswide trigger warnings came to her in February after a professor showed a graphic film depicting rape. She said that she herself had been a victim of sexual abuse, and that although she had not felt threatened by the film, she had approached the professor to suggest that students should have been warned.


Ms. Loverin draws a distinction between alerting students to material that might truly tap into memories of trauma — such as war and torture, since many students at Santa Barbara are veterans — and slapping warning labels on famous literary works, as other advocates of trigger warnings have proposed.


“We’re not talking about someone turning away from something they don’t want to see,” Ms. Loverin said in a recent interview. “People suddenly feel a very real threat to their safety — even if it is perceived. They are stuck in a classroom where they can’t get out, or if they do try to leave, it is suddenly going to be very public.”


The most vociferous criticism has focused on trigger warnings for materials that have an established place on syllabuses across the country. Among the suggestions for books that would benefit from trigger warnings are Shakespeare’s “The Merchant of Venice” (contains anti-Semitism) and Virginia Woolf’s “Mrs. Dalloway” (addresses suicide).


“Frankly it seems this is sort of an inevitable movement toward people increasingly expecting physical comfort and intellectual comfort in their lives,” said Greg Lukianoff, president of the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education, a nonprofit group that advocates free speech. “It is only going to get harder to teach people that there is a real important and serious value to being offended. Part of that is talking about deadly serious and uncomfortable subjects.”


The term “trigger warning” has its genesis on the Internet. Feminist blogs and forums have used the term for more than a decade to signal that readers, particularly victims of sexual abuse, might want to avoid certain articles or pictures online.
Photo
SUB-SUB-JP-TRIGGER-3-articleLarge.jpg


An excerpt from a draft guide on "trigger warnings" from Oberlin College in Ohio. On college campuses, proponents say similar language should be used in class syllabuses or before lectures. The issue arose at Wellesley College this year after the school installed a lifelike statue of a man in his underwear, and hundreds of students signed a petition to have it removed. Writing in The Huffington Post, one Wellesley student called it a “potentially triggering sculpture,” and petition signers cited “concerns that it has triggered memories of sexual assault amongst some students.”


Here at the University of California, Santa Barbara, in March there was a confrontation when a group of anti-abortion protesters held up graphic pictures of aborted fetuses and a pregnant professor of feminist studies tried to destroy the posters, saying they triggered a sense of fear in her. After she was arrested on vandalism, battery and robbery charges, more than 1,000 students signed a petition of support for her, saying the university should impose greater restrictions on potentially trigger-inducing content. (So far, the faculty senate has promised to address the concerns raised by the petition and the student government but has not made any policy changes.)


At Oberlin College in Ohio, a draft guide was circulated that would have asked professors to put trigger warnings in their syllabuses. The guide said they should flag anything that might “disrupt a student’s learning” and “cause trauma,” including anything that would suggest the inferiority of anyone who is transgender (a form of discrimination known as cissexism) or who uses a wheelchair (or ableism).


“Be aware of racism, classism, sexism, heterosexism, cissexism, ableism, and other issues of privilege and oppression,” the guide said. “Realize that all forms of violence are traumatic, and that your students have lives before and outside your classroom, experiences you may not expect or understand.” For example, it said, while “Things Fall Apart” by Chinua Achebe — a novel set in colonial-era Nigeria — is a “triumph of literature that everyone in the world should read,” it could “trigger readers who have experienced racism, colonialism, religious persecution, violence, suicide and more.”


After several professors complained, the draft was removed from a campus website, pending a more thorough review by a faculty-and-student task force. Professors and campus administrators are expected to meet with students next fall to come up with a more comprehensive guide.


Meredith Raimondo, Oberlin’s associate dean of the College of Arts and Sciences, said the guide was meant to provide suggestions, not to dictate to professors. An associate professor of comparative American studies and a co-chairwoman of the task force, Ms. Raimondo said providing students with warnings would simply be “responsible pedagogical practice.”


“I quite object to the argument of ‘Kids today need to toughen up,’ ” she said. “That absolutely misses the reality that we’re dealing with. We have students coming to us with serious issues, and we need to deal with that respectfully and seriously.”


But Marc Blecher, a professor of politics and East Asian studies at Oberlin and a major critic of trigger warnings at Oberlin, said such a policy would have a chilling effect on faculty members, particularly those without the job security of tenure.


“If I were a junior faculty member looking at this while putting my syllabus together, I’d be terrified,” Mr. Blecher said. “Any student who felt triggered by something that happened in class could file a complaint with the various procedures and judicial boards, and create a very tortuous process for anyone.”

 
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MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
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Are you related to Stewox ?

J/K, he's no where near that lucid.

:)
 
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Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
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Reference Donald Sterling, the president of Mozilla, the Oatmeal place in New York that got attacked by fatties, etc.
 

CPA

Elite Member
Nov 19, 2001
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Since When were liberals fighting against censorship of certain music? It was Al's wife, Tipper that led the fight against rap and ultimately led to the PMRC and age labeling all music.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,709
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I didn't read all the articles, but did read the first quoted bit. With that, how do Warnings of Content equate to Censorship?
 

shira

Diamond Member
Jan 12, 2005
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As long as the works being studied aren't censored in any way, why would anyone object to providing an advance warning about the nature of the content?
 

drebo

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Feb 24, 2006
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The biggest problem with this country right now (particularly its youth and its liberals) is that they get offended WAY too easily.

Shit that shouldn't even raise an eyebrow gets national news attention.

The first step is a warning. The second step is allowing parents to opt their students out of assignments. The third step is teachers scrapping the classics (Brave New World, 1984, Farenheit 451, Native Son, Great Gatsby, All Quiet on the Western Front, Huck Finn, Yellow Raft in Blue Water, etc, are all too offensive!) because they don't want to have to teach two sets of books. It's censorship by ignorance.

People need to grow up and grow thicker skins. Unless they do, western civilization is doomed.
 

shira

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Jan 12, 2005
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The biggest problem with this country right now (particularly its youth and its liberals) is that they get offended WAY too easily.

Shit that shouldn't even raise an eyebrow gets national news attention.

The first step is a warning. The second step is allowing parents to opt their students out of assignments. The third step is teachers scrapping the classics (Brave New World, 1984, Farenheit 451, Native Son, Great Gatsby, All Quiet on the Western Front, Huck Finn, Yellow Raft in Blue Water, etc, are all too offensive!) because they don't want to have to teach two sets of books. It's censorship by ignorance.

People need to grow up and grow thicker skins. Unless they do, western civilization is doomed.

I'm guessing that it would be conservative parents, not liberals, who would want to opt their children out of sex education, science classes that don't include Intelligent Design as an "alternative theory" to Evolution, and any novel that frankly portrays human sexuality.

I would be sympathetic to allowing students to "opt out" of particular curricula if they're specifically diagnosed with a related PTSD. But I wouldn't be inclined to allow opting out simply because a person is "uncomfortable' with a particular topic or because it offends their values.

In other words, accommodate disabilities but don't accommodate the propagation of ignorance.
 

drebo

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Feb 24, 2006
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I'm guessing that it would be conservative parents, not liberals, who would want to opt their children out of sex education, science classes that don't include Intelligent Design as an "alternative theory" to Evolution, and any novel that frankly portrays human sexuality.

I would be sympathetic to allowing students to "opt out" of particular curricula if they're specifically diagnosed with a related PTSD. But I wouldn't be inclined to allow opting out simply because a person is "uncomfortable' with a particular topic or because it offends their values.

In other words, accommodate disabilities but don't accommodate the propagation of ignorance.

You could guess, but you would be wrong. Outside of a minority religious fringe (specifically Jehova's Witnesses) the largest body of complainers are liberals who think they know better.

There should be no "opt-out" of any subject in school. You don't like it? Go to a different school or be home schooled. As a society, we hand-hold way, way too much. It's just aweful in California, a liberal education stronghold. Administerred by morons, taught by teachers with no passion and no constructive input into the curriculum...it's no wonder why the last 10 years has bred people incapable of performing hard work.

Adversity builds character and forces critical thought. Kids need to be exposed to it without kit gloves and without the fall back of mommy and daddy running to the principal every time they have to read the word "******" or "beloved patriot."

To mask our past so as to not hurt a third party's feelings is to do a disservice not just to those persecuted in the past, but also to future generations who will be doomed to repeat the mistakes they were never allowed to learn about.
 

shira

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Jan 12, 2005
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You could guess, but you would be wrong. Outside of a minority religious fringe (specifically Jehova's Witnesses) the largest body of complainers are liberals who think they know better.

There should be no "opt-out" of any subject in school. You don't like it? Go to a different school or be home schooled. As a society, we hand-hold way, way too much. It's just aweful in California, a liberal education stronghold. Administerred by morons, taught by teachers with no passion and no constructive input into the curriculum...it's no wonder why the last 10 years has bred people incapable of performing hard work.

Adversity builds character and forces critical thought. Kids need to be exposed to it without kit gloves and without the fall back of mommy and daddy running to the principal every time they have to read the word "******" or "beloved patriot."

To mask our past so as to not hurt a third party's feelings is to do a disservice not just to those persecuted in the past, but also to future generations who will be doomed to repeat the mistakes they were never allowed to learn about.


Ah, I see. So "toughing it out" is your recommended approach to those with PTSD. I'm sure the psychiatric community will welcome your clinical insights in dealing with victims of rape and physical/mental abuse.
 

infoiltrator

Senior member
Feb 9, 2011
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It is not a perfect world. Exposure and discussion of issues from the non threatening pages of a book should not be defined by labels.
If we must, start with the bible and other religious texts.
Totally unsuitable content.
 

TROLLERCAUST

Member
Mar 17, 2014
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Good read thanks. I've never met this phenomenon. Sounds completely alien to me. Reading the article I just wanted to pound my head to the wall and scream it made me so _frustrated_. <--- Frustrated. It made me feel emotion and made me think. That's the whole point of writing! That's the fucking point! Don't read if you don't want to think or feel emotion. With the warning label you're telling people what they're _supposed_ to think about the book or what some people feel about the book. Fuck that. Think for yourselves. That's the beauty of writing that we can interpret and feel differently about it. These warning labels are a disgusting insult on intellectual wealth. Think!
 

Harabec

Golden Member
Oct 15, 2005
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Stop being offended by life. Shocked about something? Good, perhaps it would mean you will not repeat history again.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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Ah, I see. So "toughing it out" is your recommended approach to those with PTSD. I'm sure the psychiatric community will welcome your clinical insights in dealing with victims of rape and physical/mental abuse.

You just lost the argument.
 

PokerGuy

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
13,650
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The insidious cancer that is political correctness continues to spread and destroy the country, this is just one particular symptom of it. A whole new generation that thinks they have the right to never be offended, and that every opinion that is not the currently popular one should be censored. Sad really.
 

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
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Here at the University of California, Santa Barbara, in March there was a confrontation when a group of anti-abortion protesters held up graphic pictures of aborted fetuses and a pregnant professor of feminist studies tried to destroy the posters, saying they triggered a sense of fear in her.

lol.

How does seeing pictures of dead fetuses trigger a sense of fear in you? Was she afraid that her prior aborted fetuses were going to rise from the dead and start the zombie apocalypse? o_O
 

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
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At Oberlin College in Ohio, a draft guide was circulated that would have asked professors to put trigger warnings in their syllabuses. The guide said they should flag anything that might &#8220;disrupt a student&#8217;s learning&#8221; and &#8220;cause trauma,&#8221; including anything that would suggest the inferiority of anyone who is transgender (a form of discrimination known as cissexism) or who uses a wheelchair (or ableism).

Shouldn't it be cisgenderism?
 

Newell Steamer

Diamond Member
Jan 27, 2014
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Wait - you are pushing for freedom of speech,.. but, are pissed off when someone speaks out against what you just said....

:confused:

OK, then don't say anything at all, if you are going to whine about someone whining over what you just said.
 

drebo

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2006
7,034
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Wait - you are pushing for freedom of speech,.. but, are pissed off when someone speaks out against what you just said....

:confused:

OK, then don't say anything at all, if you are going to whine about someone whining over what you just said.

No, the problem here is the misinterpretation of "freedom of speech" to mean "freedom from speech."

People believe that because they can say something, they should also have freedom whenever someone else says something. That is the real threat.

It's the same mentality of the people who believe they have the right to never have to see a Nativity or hear the word "God." They have it backwards all the same.

Of != From.

Sure, they can protest, but that doesn't mean we have to care.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,001
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The more colleges can prepare young adults for real life experiences, the better human beings they will be. Coddling young adults will only stunt their maturity.