The Fed loans half trillion dollars to foreign banks

[First]

Loonies want to ban the Fed, that's why they're laughed at in academia and mocked in Congress.

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: bamacre
Moonbeam calling other people wackos always makes me smile.

You belong to this weird Fed cult. You are a member of one of the most discredited fringe groups in America. You even link to your Bible and have suckered another poor deluded fellow to infect himself with it. I'm already having trouble keeping him from riding off in the night thinking he's Paul Revere.

Opposition to central banking is nothing new, and no conspiracy theory. We've already rid ourselves of two, just looking to knock off the 3rd.

you can get rid of toilet paper too but it will come back.

Yet people still continue to flush.

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: Evan
Loonies want to ban the Fed, that's why they're laughed at in academia and mocked in Congress.

Actually, Evan, there are a number of Austrian/Libertarian economists in academia. Inside and outside the USA.

As for Congress, well, you just make yourself look dumber than you probably are. Congress loves it's Fed as much as a pimp loves his whores.

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: Evan
Loonies want to ban the Fed, that's why they're laughed at in academia and mocked in Congress.

There problem is there are more and more loonies out there because of the way economy is. Understandably people are pissed at the bad economy, and they want someone to blame, idealy someone who can't defend themselves and someone who do things most people don't understand. (so most people don't know the blame is totlly misplaced) Fed is in the business of regulating money supply, 2/3 of American people don't have a clue what money supply is, not to mention the mechanism to control it. Fed becomes an easy target as they don't have a PR department and they don't get to become the guest on popular TV show to defend themselves. The only time they get to talk is when they are grilled by congress/senate (yeah, those politicians trying to find everyone's fault but theirs)

Seriuosly, this year so far the politicians created a 1+TRILLION budget deficit and who is asked to "print" the dollar for all those spending? yeah Fed. And you blame the machine/institution that just do the printing and don't look at the people that made the decision?

 

[First]

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Evan
Loonies want to ban the Fed, that's why they're laughed at in academia and mocked in Congress.

Actually, Evan, there are a number of Austrian/Libertarian economists in academia. Inside and outside the USA.

They make up an infinitesimal amount of academia and aren't well accepted or respected. That's because their research goes nowhere, since every industrialized nation has a central bank, which is why they aren't well respected because their theories are loony.

As for Congress, well, you just make yourself look dumber than you probably are. Congress loves it's Fed as much as a pimp loves his whores.

What? :laugh:

 

[First]

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: Evan
Loonies want to ban the Fed, that's why they're laughed at in academia and mocked in Congress.

There problem is there are more and more loonies out there because of the way economy is. Understandably people are pissed at the bad economy, and they want someone to blame, idealy someone who can't defend themselves and someone who do things most people don't understand. (so most people don't know the blame is totlly misplaced) Fed is in the business of regulating money supply, 2/3 of American people don't have a clue what money supply is, not to mention the mechanism to control it. Fed becomes an easy target as they don't have a PR department and they don't get to become the guest on popular TV show to defend themselves. The only time they get to talk is when they are grilled by congress/senate (yeah, those politicians trying to find everyone's fault but theirs)

Seriuosly, this year so far the politicians created a 1+TRILLION budget deficit and who is asked to "print" the dollar for all those spending? yeah Fed. And you blame the machine/institution that just do the printing and don't look at the people that made the decision?

Fed doesn't print any of it, Treasury does, but of course they don't have to actually "print" money, that's the beauty of the type of treasuries being bought and the type of swaps being done with foreign central banks; you can control both supply and velocity and keep inflation non-existent the way it has been the last 25 years. So in the end, when inflation isn't a major concern for any extended period of time and when the economy recovers, you'll see the same Fed/right-wing/fringe groups repeat the same tired lines ad nauseum until the next recession. Luckily broadcast commentator journalism usually ends up nowhere and is respected by few people of consequence.

 

[VChuck]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
VC: Now,I 'm officially a wackjob,Right Moonbeam?!

It wouldn't surprise but I like you anyway. Most real fanatics haven't any sense of humor. My guess is you're a fine person who is just deluded. Maybe Lunar Ray can help you with that.

He has a bad pedigree, sadly, being of Irish blood, and he totally sucks as an egotist. But using water boarding I was able to get him to confess to having about 5 degrees, and to being a professor of economics where he has a PhD and is a CFO of a company. He's also a pretty good tank and healer in WOW.

OMG:laugh: Paul Revere,I laughed so hard when I woke up this morning when I saw that.
The Feds are coming, The Feds are coming.... Oh wait, they have been here a long time.
made my day thanks!

Thanks Moonbeam,I am enjoying this and like you too.as far as being delusional you should let Bamacre,and LunarRay school you.Heh! and you need to pay attention,no fidgeting and backtalking in class young man.

There is nothing wrong with having a Irish background,pretty commendable actually
(I'm not 100%Engrish either)pretty neat having a Phd, in economics and 5 degree's.
Shoot I'll listen to this man ,sounds like he knows what He's talking about.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Evan
Fed doesn't print any of it, Treasury does, but of course they don't have to actually "print" money, that's the beauty of the type of treasuries being bought and the type of swaps being done with foreign central banks; you can control both supply and velocity and keep inflation non-existent the way it has been the last 25 years. So in the end, when inflation isn't a major concern for any extended period of time and when the economy recovers, you'll see the same Fed/right-wing/fringe groups repeat the same tired lines ad nauseum until the next recession. Luckily broadcast commentator journalism usually ends up nowhere and is respected by few people of consequence.

/agree that there are many Fed groups that overreact but you have to admit the Fed does need to be audited more. Luckily the Audit the Fed bill will be going through shortly with almost a veto-proof majority (282/290) in the House backing it.

 

[First]

^ If the audit is done right and doesn't affect their ability to quickly respond to recessions, then everyone is for it. But no one respected is for banning them, of course.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: Evan

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: Evan
Loonies want to ban the Fed, that's why they're laughed at in academia and mocked in Congress.

There problem is there are more and more loonies out there because of the way economy is. Understandably people are pissed at the bad economy, and they want someone to blame, idealy someone who can't defend themselves and someone who do things most people don't understand. (so most people don't know the blame is totlly misplaced) Fed is in the business of regulating money supply, 2/3 of American people don't have a clue what money supply is, not to mention the mechanism to control it. Fed becomes an easy target as they don't have a PR department and they don't get to become the guest on popular TV show to defend themselves. The only time they get to talk is when they are grilled by congress/senate (yeah, those politicians trying to find everyone's fault but theirs)

Seriuosly, this year so far the politicians created a 1+TRILLION budget deficit and who is asked to "print" the dollar for all those spending? yeah Fed. And you blame the machine/institution that just do the printing and don't look at the people that made the decision?

Fed doesn't print any of it, Treasury does, but of course they don't have to actually "print" money, that's the beauty of the type of treasuries being bought and the type of swaps being done with foreign central banks; you can control both supply and velocity and keep inflation non-existent the way it has been the last 25 years. So in the end, when inflation isn't a major concern for any extended period of time and when the economy recovers, you'll see the same Fed/right-wing/fringe groups repeat the same tired lines ad nauseum until the next recession. Luckily broadcast commentator journalism usually ends up nowhere and is respected by few people of consequence.

Huh, where have you been for the last 25 years. A house in 1984 cost less then 70k now it is over 150k. where is your zero inflation.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: smack Down

Huh, i don't know what you are doing in your basement but most people are not printing money.

Lets say I lend you 20 dollars. For me to lend you 20 dollars I must have 20 dollars otherwise I can't give you 20 dollars. Now when the Fed lends half a trillion dollars it does not have half a trillion dollars so it prints half a trillion dollars. Now that the fed has the money it can then lend it.

See the difference? Or do you need an animated version.

So what part of foreign central bank have to deposit their currency at Fed with a contract to buy it back with the same exchange rate before Fed send them the money don't you understand.

Before Fed swap let's say 1million USD, they will get 1million USD worth of Yen for example. So fed already got 1million dollar worth of currency in their deposit when they send 1million USD to other central bank. So that's like your having 20 dollar first before you can lend it out, except it's better cause that's not your own 20 dollar, other people give you something worth 20 dollar for you to give them that 20 dollar.

This is not loan, this is not give a way, this is swap of equal value commodity. Nothing is create, only transaction done is exchange of stuff and a contract of exchange it back in a future date. (a contract backed by the credit worthiness of entire country)

Get a f'ing clue mang.

Except that the fed doesn't have the money until after they printed.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: smack Down

Huh, i don't know what you are doing in your basement but most people are not printing money.

Lets say I lend you 20 dollars. For me to lend you 20 dollars I must have 20 dollars otherwise I can't give you 20 dollars. Now when the Fed lends half a trillion dollars it does not have half a trillion dollars so it prints half a trillion dollars. Now that the fed has the money it can then lend it.

See the difference? Or do you need an animated version.

So what part of foreign central bank have to deposit their currency at Fed with a contract to buy it back with the same exchange rate before Fed send them the money don't you understand.

Before Fed swap let's say 1million USD, they will get 1million USD worth of Yen for example. So fed already got 1million dollar worth of currency in their deposit when they send 1million USD to other central bank. So that's like your having 20 dollar first before you can lend it out, except it's better cause that's not your own 20 dollar, other people give you something worth 20 dollar for you to give them that 20 dollar.

This is not loan, this is not give a way, this is swap of equal value commodity. Nothing is create, only transaction done is exchange of stuff and a contract of exchange it back in a future date. (a contract backed by the credit worthiness of entire country)

Get a f'ing clue mang.

Except that the fed doesn't have the money until after they printed.

What the fuck are you talking about? The banks deposit their money with the Fed. The money is there.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Evan
^ If the audit is done right and doesn't affect their ability to quickly respond to recessions, then everyone is for it. But no one respected is for banning them, of course.

Well...

The 'audit' some are in favor of is not the type most think about when they hear that word. It would be quite simple to Audit the Financials and with some confidence level proclaim.. "Yep, the results of operations are reasonably depicted." Well... assuming you can actually go touch the assets etc. But, like our OP issue... the initial 'booked' situation might look like this [Dr on FED books in foreign central bank X quantity of Country X's Currency and Cr on FED books Owed to Country X USD (based on the value at date of action] Then Country X draws down on their Dollar account and the FED moves that to the Country X Dollar account in Country X's Central Bank and eventually the initial action is 'unwound' - Country X must provide these mysterious electronic dollars back to the FED as the 'deal' demands and pay interest to the FED... So..... what we have at the end of the day is Interest income from a Liquidity Swap and nothing 'tangible' went anywhere. So the auditor asks the FED folks who actioned this... "Why, pray tell, did you engage in this swap(s)?" FED response might be; "It seemed reasonable at the time".... "We always do that kinda thing when we have International issues that could affect our (The USA) best interest... AS WE SEE IT." And so back to Congress go the Auditors and explain how a $500 Billion liquidity swap resulted in $interest but we don't know why other than the proffered "Cuz"... "Well... hell" cries a Congressman... "there's only 900 or so billion USD currency in circulation... that can't be..." "Who got the $500 billion... I mean I want to know which bank in that dang country got how much and who did they give it to...."... "But sir, we cant audit the Central Bank of Switzerland (as an example)" "Well... Congress needs to run this dam show... We can't have some group of Economists sending money god knows where... THAT is what Congress is for"....
And then I woke up from the Nightmare and realized Many Economists are really Mathematicians while the rest who can actually take their head out of the Micro hole and peek in the Macro hole or visa versa, can see the same event and for any number of reasons see good, bad or ugly or all three and actually persuade others that what they say is The Only Reasonable Interpretation... or Philosophy. Ceteris Paribus allows them to be right... Oh.. My...

Edit: upon reflection I should add.... It seems to me the end result gives some indication as to the entire event and the motive(s) involved...

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: smack Down

Huh, where have you been for the last 25 years. A house in 1984 cost less then 70k now it is over 150k. where is your zero inflation.

Heh, maybe you've heard this thing called supply and demand that can also change the price/cost of things outside of inflation?

 

[First]

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: Evan

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: Evan
Loonies want to ban the Fed, that's why they're laughed at in academia and mocked in Congress.

There problem is there are more and more loonies out there because of the way economy is. Understandably people are pissed at the bad economy, and they want someone to blame, idealy someone who can't defend themselves and someone who do things most people don't understand. (so most people don't know the blame is totlly misplaced) Fed is in the business of regulating money supply, 2/3 of American people don't have a clue what money supply is, not to mention the mechanism to control it. Fed becomes an easy target as they don't have a PR department and they don't get to become the guest on popular TV show to defend themselves. The only time they get to talk is when they are grilled by congress/senate (yeah, those politicians trying to find everyone's fault but theirs)

Seriuosly, this year so far the politicians created a 1+TRILLION budget deficit and who is asked to "print" the dollar for all those spending? yeah Fed. And you blame the machine/institution that just do the printing and don't look at the people that made the decision?

Fed doesn't print any of it, Treasury does, but of course they don't have to actually "print" money, that's the beauty of the type of treasuries being bought and the type of swaps being done with foreign central banks; you can control both supply and velocity and keep inflation non-existent the way it has been the last 25 years. So in the end, when inflation isn't a major concern for any extended period of time and when the economy recovers, you'll see the same Fed/right-wing/fringe groups repeat the same tired lines ad nauseum until the next recession. Luckily broadcast commentator journalism usually ends up nowhere and is respected by few people of consequence.

Huh, where have you been for the last 25 years. A house in 1984 cost less then 70k now it is over 150k. where is your zero inflation.

I didn't mean literally 0%, and have said so a zillion times here before. Annual inflation has been 2.9% on average over the past 25 years, not including this year which is looking more and more like last year's 0.1% inflation. That's non-existent, as in businesses aren't hurt by inflation the way they were by oil supply shocks in the 70's.

 

[LunarRay]

I heard just the other day that W. J. Bryan was heard bellowing... "There is only 270 odd million ounces of gold in the vault... and 950 odd billion $ currency world wide... Gold would have to be valued at ... hmmmmm $3500 or so dollars an ounce...
This is nutty... I'm going to go see bout Darwin and Monkeys."

"What ever became of my Democratic party"

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: LunarRay
I heard just the other day that W. J. Bryan was heard bellowing... "There is only 270 odd million ounces of gold in the vault... and 950 odd billion $ currency world wide... Gold would have to be valued at ... hmmmmm $3500 or so dollars an ounce...
This is nutty... I'm going to go see bout Darwin and Monkeys."

"What ever became of my Democratic party"

Heh, not to mention people could easily hoard gold, and all these derivative traders can add huge artificial demand/supply using leverage.

You think few percent dollar value fluctuation is bad in terms of creating inflation? Try few hundred percent we've seen with oil, and see what thats gonna do to prices of stuff using gold standard.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: LunarRay
I heard just the other day that W. J. Bryan was heard bellowing... "There is only 270 odd million ounces of gold in the vault... and 950 odd billion $ currency world wide... Gold would have to be valued at ... hmmmmm $3500 or so dollars an ounce...
This is nutty... I'm going to go see bout Darwin and Monkeys."

"What ever became of my Democratic party"

Heh, not to mention people could easily hoard gold, and all these derivative traders can add huge artificial demand/supply using leverage.

You think few percent dollar value fluctuation is bad in terms of creating inflation? Try few hundred percent we've seen with oil, and see what thats gonna do to prices of stuff using gold standard.

IF say Gold as apposed to Frozen Orange Juice was the standard AND our currency was allowed to float vis a vis the gold AND all the other nations followed suit... AND ownership of gold was verbotten... You'd eliminate part of your concern. It is the currency float that gets in the way... It was fixed at $35 per ounce back when (as well as ownership restrictions)... AND, it seems to me there is NO difference under that situation (floating) than what we have now... It is much more fluid now... EXCEPT: What does Full Faith and Credit really mean...? That we'd use our taxing power to repay debt and interest or that the holder of a dollar today can request some other commodity or just a dollar. FF&C means to me, at least, that we'd give a dollar for a dollar... Under a standard we'd give the Orange juice or Gold as the case may be... I don't really much like that Idea... What would I have for breakfast... hehehehehehe
Edit: FR note vs Gold or OJ certificate...

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: VChuck

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
VC: Now,I 'm officially a wackjob,Right Moonbeam?!

It wouldn't surprise but I like you anyway. Most real fanatics haven't any sense of humor. My guess is you're a fine person who is just deluded. Maybe Lunar Ray can help you with that.

He has a bad pedigree, sadly, being of Irish blood, and he totally sucks as an egotist. But using water boarding I was able to get him to confess to having about 5 degrees, and to being a professor of economics where he has a PhD and is a CFO of a company. He's also a pretty good tank and healer in WOW.

OMG:laugh: Paul Revere,I laughed so hard when I woke up this morning when I saw that.
The Feds are coming, The Feds are coming.... Oh wait, they have been here a long time.
made my day thanks!

Thanks Moonbeam,I am enjoying this and like you too.as far as being delusional you should let Bamacre,and LunarRay school you.Heh! and you need to pay attention,no fidgeting and backtalking in class young man.

There is nothing wrong with having a Irish background,pretty commendable actually
(I'm not 100%Engrish either)pretty neat having a Phd, in economics and 5 degree's.
Shoot I'll listen to this man ,sounds like he knows what He's talking about.

Wall Street Journal economics editor David Wessel's new book, In Fed We Trust: Ben Bernanke's War on the Great Panic, examines the expanding powers of the Federal Reserve in the face of the current economic crisis, and is a non kook book you might be interested in.

 

[Moonbeam]

I spent the day slaughtering chickens and reading their guts to figure out where all the Fed lunatics come from. By the hundredth chicken it became quite clear that the reason the Fed is despised is just what I said earlier. People hate themselves and don't know that the thing under their bed that's out to get them IS them. And Money is the substitute people use for value, what people try to amass in lieu of real self respect. That is to say they become fixated on the notion that somebody is out to get their money and they don't trust bankers. Bankers have hooves and horns. And thus it is that the people try to eat their bankers but when they do they have a depression and after that we get a central bank again. Good old Bernake, he saved the nation from Depression 2.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I spent the day slaughtering chickens and reading their guts to figure out where all the Fed lunatics come from. By the hundredth chicken it became quite clear that the reason the Fed is despised is just what I said earlier. People hate themselves and don't know that the thing under their bed that's out to get them IS them. And Money is the substitute people use for value, what people try to amass in lieu of real self respect. That is to say they become fixated on the notion that somebody is out to get their money and they don't trust bankers. Bankers have hooves and horns. And thus it is that the people try to eat their bankers but when they do they have a depression and after that we get a central bank again. Good old Bernake, he saved the nation from Depression 2.

Well... the chicken that was in my garage, thanks to you, told me that the three pronged approach (Rescue, Recovery, and Reinvestment) to the 'Recession' was, in large part, the doing of Congress. Bernanke and the Ex NY Fed Bank chair and Current Sec Treas Giethner simply effected their part of the plan.
In Haiti it may be reasonable to ascertain reality from dead birds but here in the good Ole US of A we have more subtle ways of deducing the tree from the seed. When folks see their assets being consumed by the greed of a few they invoke the emotion best fitting that condition. It don't mean they hate themselves and, ergo, others but, rather, they find anger to be appropriate to the event. I love me... but if you step on my toe I'm likely to kick you in the shin. It is un Christian for me to keep for my self the pain of the toe stomp with out sharing with you a like amount of joy.

 

[brandonbull]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: smack Down
Huh, i don't know what you are doing in your basement but most people are not printing money.

Lets say I lend you 20 dollars. For me to lend you 20 dollars I must have 20 dollars otherwise I can't give you 20 dollars. Now when the Fed lends half a trillion dollars it does not have half a trillion dollars so it prints half a trillion dollars. Now that the fed has the money it can then lend it.

See the difference? Or do you need an animated version.

I know this is a hard concept so read carefully. When you lend me $20, you created $20. You are now owed $20, and I now have $20, for a total money supply of $40.

All the banks in the US deposit their money with the federal reserve. So yes, they have half a trillion dollars when they lend it out.

I guess that is a way to look at it, but It's still $20.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: JS80

What the fuck are you talking about? The banks deposit their money with the Fed. The money is there.

The banks? They are borrowing money from the fed. Ever hear of a program called TRAP

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I spent the day slaughtering chickens and reading their guts to figure out where all the Fed lunatics come from. By the hundredth chicken it became quite clear that the reason the Fed is despised is just what I said earlier. People hate themselves and don't know that the thing under their bed that's out to get them IS them. And Money is the substitute people use for value, what people try to amass in lieu of real self respect. That is to say they become fixated on the notion that somebody is out to get their money and they don't trust bankers. Bankers have hooves and horns. And thus it is that the people try to eat their bankers but when they do they have a depression and after that we get a central bank again. Good old Bernake, he saved the nation from Depression 2.

Well... the chicken that was in my garage, thanks to you, told me that the three pronged approach (Rescue, Recovery, and Reinvestment) to the 'Recession' was, in large part, the doing of Congress. Bernanke and the Ex NY Fed Bank chair and Current Sec Treas Giethner simply effected their part of the plan.
In Haiti it may be reasonable to ascertain reality from dead birds but here in the good Ole US of A we have more subtle ways of deducing the tree from the seed. When folks see their assets being consumed by the greed of a few they invoke the emotion best fitting that condition. It don't mean they hate themselves and, ergo, others but, rather, they find anger to be appropriate to the event. I love me... but if you step on my toe I'm likely to kick you in the shin. It is un Christian for me to keep for my self the pain of the toe stomp with out sharing with you a like amount of joy.

You think you love yourself and may imagine I stepped on YOUR toe but what actually happened is that it was your oxygen bottle that fell on your toe and you kicked through the window. And that, My Dear Sir, is why you should have learned to suffer on the cross like you were told to. Your oxygen bottle fell because it had a loose regulator. You know perfectly well they always do.

 

[VChuck]

http://www.heritech.com/home/heritech_home.htm
Like I said seems as I am in good company (loonies,kooks ,etc etc..)
I will be objective in looking at the book you refered me to,however.
Probably leave with more questions and answers

But I have also have come to the conclusion that the emerging NWO (no matter what we do) will come to pass.One world religion,One world government.

There's only one book I really need to be versed in and adhere to
Thats the" Holy Bible" most importantly have a "relationship in the "Lord Jesus Christ" Psalms 37,Psalms 91.
Really have been guilty by neglecting to read it daily as I should.
:light: