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The #1 North Korea 2013 tension thread [with rolling updates!]

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davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,514
24
76
Not sure if incredibly gullible or just trolling...
I think he is quite serious. Afterall, he mourned the death of Kim Jong Il, saying the world had lost a great man. Or leader. Can't forget which, maybe DCAL30 can refresh us? It's in someones sig.

DCAL30, have you ever read any of the reports from defectors about what life is like in one of their prison camps? Torture, forced marriages to breed slaves, death if you get caught eating a piece of found corn on the ground, .etc.

And those 'defectors' were probably spies who had their families held hostage while they were in the South collecting money from the South Korean government. At least that is what several Korean comments are saying.
 
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Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,136
37
91
I think he is quite serious. Afterall, he mourned the death of Kim Jong Il, saying the world had lost a great man. Or leader. Can't forget which, maybe DCAL30 can refresh us? It's in someones sig.

DCAL30, have you ever read any of the reports from defectors about what life is like in one of their prison camps? Torture, forced marriages to breed slaves, death if you get caught eating a piece of found corn on the ground, .etc.

And those 'defectors' were probably spies who had their families held hostage while they were in the South collecting money from the South Korean government. At least that is what several Korean comments are saying.
You may be right but N. Koreans aren't exactly welcomed in S. Korea. They are about as welcomed as a homeless man in a ritzy part of town...
 

davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,514
24
76
You may be right but N. Koreans aren't exactly welcomed in S. Korea. They are about as welcomed as a homeless man in a ritzy part of town...
Don't you mean a homeless man in.... Gangam? :sneaky:
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
20,148
617
126
I think he is quite serious. Afterall, he mourned the death of Kim Jong Il, saying the world had lost a great man. Or leader. Can't forget which, maybe DCAL30 can refresh us? It's in someones sig.

DCAL30, have you ever read any of the reports from defectors about what life is like in one of their prison camps? Torture, forced marriages to breed slaves, death if you get caught eating a piece of found corn on the ground, .etc.

And those 'defectors' were probably spies who had their families held hostage while they were in the South collecting money from the South Korean government. At least that is what several Korean comments are saying.
davmat: If youre interested theres a very good book written by such a defector called Escape from Camp 14. Its very eye opening.
 

Demo24

Diamond Member
Aug 5, 2004
8,357
9
81
davmat: If youre interested theres a very good book written by such a defector called Escape from Camp 14. Its very eye opening.
Technically by someone interviewing him, but yes it was very interesting and I just finished it. Although from above it sounds like he may have already read it. Reading books like that makes one realize that unification is going to be a lot more difficult and involved than just the monetary expense of putting the infrastructure in place.

Also I think it was in this thread about 'nothing to envy', that was a good book! Thanks for the recommendation! I went out and bought her other book as well, she's a very good writer and does a good job humanizing these tragic stories so that people that may have no frame of reference can understand. Highly recommended!
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,136
37
91
At least the Chinese are good for something. It seems like massive pressure may have resulted in N. Korea scrapping the launch of a missile over Japan in celebration of their sun-god.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,876
460
126
your analysis is correct. See above a link to an article at Nautilus that somebody posted. NK cannot flatten Seoul in any definition of the word.

China wants NK to not have a nuke: http://www.foxnews.mobi/quickPage.html?page=22995&external=2082916.proteus.fma#quickPage_html_page_22995_content_91913386_pageNum_1

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Prodigy I think you are misinterpreting much of this thread. Speaking for myself I feel NK offers no risk to the US and is 99% bark. Their regime is entertainment only--at least as far as their threats are concerned. From a human rights perspective it is not entertaining obviously.
North Korea's tube and rocket artillery was designed specifically to bombard Seoul. Their M1978 gun (thought to be a dismounted shore battery) has the range, at least with rocket-propelled shells if not with conventional. They may also have larger repurposed guns we've not yet seen becaue they are too big to take out of the caves and parade them.
http://www.military-today.com/artillery/m1978_koksan.htm
Their rockets are similarly designed.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/weapons/north-korea-conflict-weapons-available

Note that having the range and hitting some may be two very different things. I think they may also overestimate the value of hardened bunkers if one cannot control the air. Once we remove North Korea's thick but old air defense system we would be free to stack cab-ranked strike aircraft over the DMZ. Modern fire-finding radar can very quickly plot points of origin, meaning a very short window to fire on Seoul before a modern thermobaric warhead can be flown into the cave opening. Even if the gun can shoot and scoot the gunners still have to breathe, and nothing that big is NBC protected.

At least the Chinese are good for something. It seems like massive pressure may have resulted in N. Korea scrapping the launch of a missile over Japan in celebration of their sun-god.
Agreed. This is a very good thing as eventually one of those missiles is going to strike Japan.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
103,500
18,063
136
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
103,500
18,063
136
If anyone here has a Netflix account, there's a National Geographic documentary on North Korea from 2006, where a journalist team accompanied a Nepalese surgeon on an "aid mission."

Needless to say the situation is fucked, but it's amazing how truly brainwashed these people are. The surgeon is there to treat cataracts, and they went to the home of one of the blind ladies he's working on. She, of course, wanted her blindness cured so she could look upon Dear Leader. When asked why she wanted to see the dear leader so badly, she said it was because her family lived well due to dear leader, and she wanted to see him to thank him.

This was a really moving scene because as she spoke she and everyone else in the room, even the party officials with them, started crying. Legitimately, or so it appeared. At least the tears were visible. And apparently it's all because they were just so moved by her words.

Granted this was a "privileged" family living in Pyong-yang, but still...

also watch State of Mind if it is still available. It's my current favorite NK doc, next to the one about the US defectors form the Korean War that have/had been living in Pyongyang for all these decades.

There is also a short Vice Guide to travel where they go into DPRK--not sure if Vice Guide is still available on NFLX, though (now owned by HBO, I believe).

btw, Vice are the ones responsible for sending Dennis Rodman and the Globetrotters into NK recently. :D
 

rommelrommel

Platinum Member
Dec 7, 2002
2,742
337
136
North Korea's tube and rocket artillery was designed specifically to bombard Seoul. Their M1978 gun (thought to be a dismounted shore battery) has the range, at least with rocket-propelled shells if not with conventional. They may also have larger repurposed guns we've not yet seen becaue they are too big to take out of the caves and parade them.
http://www.military-today.com/artillery/m1978_koksan.htm
Their rockets are similarly designed.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/weapons/north-korea-conflict-weapons-available

Note that having the range and hitting some may be two very different things. I think they may also overestimate the value of hardened bunkers if one cannot control the air. Once we remove North Korea's thick but old air defense system we would be free to stack cab-ranked strike aircraft over the DMZ. Modern fire-finding radar can very quickly plot points of origin, meaning a very short window to fire on Seoul before a modern thermobaric warhead can be flown into the cave opening. Even if the gun can shoot and scoot the gunners still have to breathe, and nothing that big is NBC protected.


Agreed. This is a very good thing as eventually one of those missiles is going to strike Japan.
Sure, but they only have so many 170mm koksan's and 240mm rockets with range to hit any part of Seoul... sure that's been part of their deterrence strategy but the majority of their artillery tubes cannot reach Seoul.

It's not going to take long for counterbattery fire, cruise missiles, air sorties, and just their old as shit artillery breaking to add up. You're also correct that once they lose their air defense network they'll be much more vulnerable to air attack. And, if they have to shoot and scoot repeatedly that will drastically lower their fire rate.

Basically, the threat to civilians is greatly overstated... yes a surprise attack on Seoul would be terrible but it's not a likely scenario. The city would sustain massive damage but it would hardly be flattened.
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,136
37
91
With China's rumored pressure on N. Korea and yesterday's Boston Marathon bombing, I can assume that this latest histrionics by N. Korea is over. lil Kim/Kim the minor will not want to push us now.
 

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