Texas Public Schools now *required* to teach the bible

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: AyashiKaibutsu

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

I pose the same question to you. Where is your faux outrage over expressly pushing one "religious" viewpoint in schools (Evolution/Secularism) and expressly banning another (Intelligent Design/Christianity)? Why aren't you for equal rights and opportunity in this case? Schools should be able to teach both, if they choose, but instead, they are forced to teach one and banned from teaching another.

Hypocrisy much?

ID has 0 evidence supporting it. It's introduction requires a redefining of what science is to make it fit into a science class. It's creators have admitted to coming up with and pushing it with the agenda of using it as a stepping stone towards bringing religion into schools. How it's been treated has no sympathy from me. 404 hypocrisy not found.

Link?

 

[Ichigo]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
Yet you have no problem with schools almost exclusively teaching Evolution, while many expressly ban the teaching of Intelligent Design.

Where is your cry for fairness in that case?

Because one is based on Scientific theory and the other is based on hoodoo voodoo bullshit.

In your opinion.

For many, it takes more faith to believe that everything just BOOM randomly appeared out of nothing than believe in Intelligent Design.

But my point wasn't to start an Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate, it was to show the hypocrisy where one "religious" viewpoint is exclusively taught in schools and another is banned.

10/10 trolling post. This is an excellent post to infuriate the atheist liberal schmucks. Do approve.

 

[Moonbeam]

To RPS, do not worry about anybody reading your mind. You don't have one.

To the thread, I see no violation of the Constitution or much else nor can I see how knowing something about the Bible or biblical times could hurt anybody's education. Some knowledge of a major religion that influences ones culture, I should say, would be an essential of a liberal education.

Sadly, because the asshole party is composed of a bunch of religious nut cases, a large body of Americans have gone off the deep end in the opposite direction and become lunatic haters of anything connected with religion. So here we are, caught in a lunatic discussion between a bunch of brain dead God haters and religious freaks. Allow me to raise both my right and my left middle finger to both groups and hail you all with a hardy Fuck You.

 

[RyanPaulShaffer]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

But my point wasn't to start an Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate, it was to show the hypocrisy where one "religious" viewpoint is exclusively taught in schools and another is banned.

Evolution isn't a religious viewpoint.

I suggest you read up some more on Charles Darwin.

From Wikipedia (which I normally don't like using but this entry has a ton of citations):

"To Darwin, natural selection produced the good of adaptation but removed the need for design, and he could not see the work of an omnipotent deity in all the pain and suffering such as the ichneumon wasp paralysing caterpillars as live food for its eggs."

Link

Reading that, one could see that one (maybe not all, but one) of the reasons that Darwin designed Natural Selection was because he was unable to cope with seeing pain and suffering in the world, and thus had to remove any sort of "intelligent design" from the equation.

Evolution is at least somewhat religiously (or anti-religiously) motivated, at the very least.

Be that as it may, I'm not going to get into the whole Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate. Like I said, that was not my main point. Evolution is taught in all public schools, while Intelligent Design is explicitly banned in most (if not all). They are both religiously motivated theories (one removes the need for a creator and the other acknowledges a creator). My point is the hypocrisy when folks scream that the "fundies" are trying to ram religion down our throats (as the OP was trying to do), yet they have no problem telling schools that they absolutely cannot teach the theory of Intelligent Design, yet expressly allow the theory of Evolution.

 

[Turin39789]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

But my point wasn't to start an Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate, it was to show the hypocrisy where one "religious" viewpoint is exclusively taught in schools and another is banned.

Evolution isn't a religious viewpoint.

I suggest you read up some more on Charles Darwin.

From Wikipedia (which I normally don't like using but this entry has a ton of citations):

"To Darwin, natural selection produced the good of adaptation but removed the need for design, and he could not see the work of an omnipotent deity in all the pain and suffering such as the ichneumon wasp paralysing caterpillars as live food for its eggs."

Link

Reading that, one could see that one (maybe not all, but one) of the reasons that Darwin designed Natural Selection was because he was unable to cope with seeing pain and suffering in the world, and thus had to remove any sort of "intelligent design" from the equation.

Evolution is at least somewhat religiously (or anti-religiously) motivated, at the very least.

Be that as it may, I'm not going to get into the whole Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate. Like I said, that was not my main point. Evolution is taught in all public schools, while Intelligent Design is explicitly banned in most (if not all). They are both religiously motivated theories (one removes the need for a creator and the other acknowledges a creator). My point is the hypocrisy when folks scream that the "fundies" are trying to ram religion down our throats (as the OP was trying to do), yet they have no problem telling schools that they absolutely cannot teach the theory of Intelligent Design, yet expressly allow the theory of Evolution.

Darwin is neither the ultimate authority on evolution nor were his thoughts the final word on the developing science.

 

[RyanPaulShaffer]

Originally posted by: AyashiKaibutsu

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: AyashiKaibutsu

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

I pose the same question to you. Where is your faux outrage over expressly pushing one "religious" viewpoint in schools (Evolution/Secularism) and expressly banning another (Intelligent Design/Christianity)? Why aren't you for equal rights and opportunity in this case? Schools should be able to teach both, if they choose, but instead, they are forced to teach one and banned from teaching another.

Hypocrisy much?

ID has 0 evidence supporting it. It's introduction requires a redefining of what science is to make it fit into a science class. It's creators have admitted to coming up with and pushing it with the agenda of using it as a stepping stone towards bringing religion into schools. How it's been treated has no sympathy from me. 404 hypocrisy not found.

No evidence, eh? So, if I Google up "Intelligent Design", I will find zero results?

Also, links to back up your claims that the creators have admitted that it was just a Trojan Horse to get religion in schools?

Please note: actual quotes from the creators saying this, not liberal blogs where they try and read the minds and intent of people.

"Advocates of intelligent design argue that it is a scientific theory,[11] and seek to fundamentally redefine science to accept supernatural explanations.[12] The unequivocal consensus in the scientific community is that intelligent design is not science.[13][14][15][16] The U.S. National Academy of Sciences has stated that "creationism, intelligent design, and other claims of supernatural intervention in the origin of life or of species are not science because they are not testable by the methods of science."[17] The U.S. National Science Teachers Association and the American Association for the Advancement of Science have termed it pseudoscience.[18] Others in the scientific community have concurred, and some have called it junk science.[19][20]"

U.S. District Judge John E. Jones III ruled that intelligent design is not science, that it "cannot uncouple itself from its creationist, and thus religious, antecedents", and that the school district's promotion of it therefore violated the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.[23]

-from wikipedia (you can go there to find the original sources if you want. all of the points are sourced)

Sure you can google up a bunch of fake science evidence from google if you want.

"Phillip E. Johnson has stated that cultivating ambiguity by employing secular language in arguments that are carefully crafted to avoid overtones of theistic creationism is a necessary first step for ultimately reintroducing the Christian concept of God as the designer. Johnson explicitly calls for intelligent design proponents to obfuscate their religious motivations so as to avoid having intelligent design identified "as just another way of packaging the Christian evangelical message"

^ Phillip Johnson (April 1999). "'Keeping the Darwinists Honest' an interview with Phillip Johnson". Citizen Magazine. "Intelligent Design is an intellectual movement, and the Wedge strategy stops working when we are seen as just another way of packaging the Christian evangelical message. [...] The evangelists do what they do very well, and I hope our work opens up for them some doors that have been closed".

Yea...

"Advocates"...

Judges being scientists...

And a quote about opening doors being interpreted as an explicit Trojan Horse for ramming religion in schools!

Oh my!

 

[Moonbeam]

RPS: They are both religiously motivated theories (one removes the need for a creator and the other acknowledges a creator).

You make these absurd statements, of course, because your capacity for logical thinking is neither evolved nor intelligently designed.

 

[Darwin333]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
Yet you have no problem with schools almost exclusively teaching Evolution, while many expressly ban the teaching of Intelligent Design.

Where is your cry for fairness in that case?

Because one is based on Scientific theory and the other is based on hoodoo voodoo bullshit.

In your opinion.

For many, it takes more faith to believe that everything just BOOM randomly appeared out of nothing than believe in Intelligent Design.

But my point wasn't to start an Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate, it was to show the hypocrisy where one "religious" viewpoint is exclusively taught in schools and another is banned.

I find it extremely ironic that my daughter goes to a Catholic school, google about the schools in the NO area if you want to know why, and they teach evolution in science class (no bullshit stickers on the books or anything) and the bible in religion class. Not once have they even mentioned the "theory" of ID. The freaking Vatican's scientists agree with evolution so wth is wrong with some of you guys with your "evolution is religion" BS?

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Originally posted by: jonks

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: guyver01

Originally posted by: JD50
PUBLIC schools SHOULD be teaching classes on religion. Not pushing a certain religion, obviously, but they should teach about religion.

i agree, partially..

the should offer elective classes, if students want... on ALL religions, as a generic overview..

however the Texas law states they MUST OFFER a class on the bible. ONLY the bible. nothing else.

that.. IMO .. is bullshit.

I disagree with the law, but I see nothing wrong with focusing more on Christianity than other religions. Our country is comprised of mostly Christians, there's nothing wrong with focusing on that.

Actually, focusing on christianity is exactly what's wrong with it. If the law required that elective classes on the history and impact of religion in general be taught, that'd be fine. By singling out christianity, specifically because as you said it is the majority religion in our country, the effect is one of government endorsement, saying "this is normal, this is the state sanctioned religion", regardless of the claim to attempt to teach it without indoctrinating. There's very little chance this will survive federal court review.

Yet you have no problem with schools almost exclusively teaching Evolution, while many expressly ban the teaching of Intelligent Design.

Where is your cry for fairness in that case?

I can't detect whether or not you are being sarcastic, but it doesn't appear you are. In which case I will not be engaging you in debate.

ED: having read your subsequent posts, I'll just say this. Oh, you're one of those. And by that I mean sadly misinformed and underinformed. Science is not religion, and evolution makes no claims about the big bang. But we have enough of those threads and you people can't have knowledge beaten into you so I'm not going to try.

 

[AyashiKaibutsu]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

Be that as it may, I'm not going to get into the whole Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate. Like I said, that was not my main point. Evolution is taught in all public schools, while Intelligent Design is explicitly banned in most (if not all). They are both religiously motivated theories (one removes the need for a creator and the other acknowledges a creator). My point is the hypocrisy when folks scream that the "fundies" are trying to ram religion down our throats (as the OP was trying to do), yet they have no problem telling schools that they absolutely cannot teach the theory of Intelligent Design, yet expressly allow the theory of Evolution.

One is science the other is not that's why the courts ruled to ban ID. I'm done putting any further effort into it; it's all been written down elsewhere.

FSMism is just as valid in the kind of "science" class ID would be taught in, but I don't see you whining about it not being taught? Hypocrisy much?

 

[TheSlamma]

Originally posted by: Darwin333
I find it extremely ironic that my daughter goes to a Catholic school, google about the schools in the NO area if you want to know why, and they teach evolution in science class (no bullshit stickers on the books or anything) and the bible in religion class. Not once have they even mentioned the "theory" of ID. The freaking Vatican's scientists agree with evolution so wth is wrong with some of you guys with your "evolution is religion" BS?

I've tried to get that answer for years.. you won't get it

Born Agains and the like don't see your denomination as valid.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: guyver01

Originally posted by: sciwizam
Key word.

doesn't matter if it's elective.

SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE


PUBLIC Schools should not be teaching or OFFERING classes that have anything to do with Religion.

That absolutely ridiculous. There's nothing wrong with teaching about religion.

there isn't. There is something wrong with teaching *just* christianity

 

[Atreus21]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Actually it's kind of cool that Texas would allow a class on a book full of incest, adultery and beastiality.

I guess you're cool with them learning Greek Mythology then?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Atreus21

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Actually it's kind of cool that Texas would allow a class on a book full of incest, adultery and beastiality.

I guess you're cool with them learning Greek Mythology then?

Yep Greek Mythology, Roman Mythology, Norse Mythology and Christian Mythology.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

For a nation that was founded on Judeo-Christian principles and has "In God We Trust" printed on their dollar bills, having an elective school course on teaching the literature and the history of the Bible is not a big deal. They also expressly allow the teaching of other religious texts if the school chooses to do so.

america is not founded on judeo-christian values. Looking at our system of government and coming to that conclusion is ludicrus. To preempt the next argument, no the fact that some of our founders were christian does not make us a judeo-christian inspired country either, nor does that fact that a majority of our citizens our christian.

 

[Atreus21]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Atreus21

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Actually it's kind of cool that Texas would allow a class on a book full of incest, adultery and beastiality.

I guess you're cool with them learning Greek Mythology then?

Yep Greek Mythology, Roman Mythology, Norse Mythology and Christian Mythology.

The point being, Greek Mythology has more incest and bestiality than it has normal sex. I'd be surprised if Hercules wasn't conceived out of a threesome with only one human involved.

 

[RyanPaulShaffer]

Wait, why are liberals so upset about what Texas is teaching in its schools? I thought Texas was just a "redneck hole in the ground" that you could care less about?

You can relax; this isn't happening in California or Massachusetts.

 

[Atreus21]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

For a nation that was founded on Judeo-Christian principles and has "In God We Trust" printed on their dollar bills, having an elective school course on teaching the literature and the history of the Bible is not a big deal. They also expressly allow the teaching of other religious texts if the school chooses to do so.

america is not founded on judeo-christian values. Looking at our system of government and coming to that conclusion is ludicrus. To preempt the next argument, no the fact that some of our founders were christian does not make us a judeo-christian inspired country either, nor does that fact that a majority of our citizens our christian.

It certainly comes damned close. Look at the Declaration of Independence.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
RPS: They are both religiously motivated theories (one removes the need for a creator and the other acknowledges a creator).

Unfortunately true...many wrongly think that evolution precludes the existence of a Creator and many others wrongly think a Creator precludes the existence of evolution....and therein lies the rub.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Ichigo

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
In your opinion.

For many, it takes more faith to believe that everything just BOOM randomly appeared out of nothing than believe in Intelligent Design.

But my point wasn't to start an Evolution VS Intelligent Design debate, it was to show the hypocrisy where one "religious" viewpoint is exclusively taught in schools and another is banned.

10/10 trolling post. This is an excellent post to infuriate people with functioning brain stems. Do approve.

corrected your post

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: guyver01

Originally posted by: sciwizam
Key word.

doesn't matter if it's elective.

SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE


PUBLIC Schools should not be teaching or OFFERING classes that have anything to do with Religion.

That absolutely ridiculous. There's nothing wrong with teaching about religion.

there isn't. There is something wrong with teaching *just* christianity

Like what? Is it better to know almost nothing about a lot of things or much more about something? Don't businesses hire people who specialize is something, like English Literature, not because they want people who know that subject, but because they have demonstrated a capacity to master subject matter reflecting both discipline and a capacity to learn?

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Atreus21

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

For a nation that was founded on Judeo-Christian principles and has "In God We Trust" printed on their dollar bills, having an elective school course on teaching the literature and the history of the Bible is not a big deal. They also expressly allow the teaching of other religious texts if the school chooses to do so.

america is not founded on judeo-christian values. Looking at our system of government and coming to that conclusion is ludicrus. To preempt the next argument, no the fact that some of our founders were christian does not make us a judeo-christian inspired country either, nor does that fact that a majority of our citizens our christian.

It certainly comes damned close. Look at the Declaration of Independence.

rhetorically mentioning a nameless 'God' once and then going into 3 pages of un-christianity isn't much of an argument either.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: guyver01

Originally posted by: sciwizam
Key word.

doesn't matter if it's elective.

SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE


PUBLIC Schools should not be teaching or OFFERING classes that have anything to do with Religion.

That absolutely ridiculous. There's nothing wrong with teaching about religion.

there isn't. There is something wrong with teaching *just* christianity

Like what? Is it better to know almost nothing about a lot of things or much more about something? Don't businesses hire people who specialize is something, like English Literature, not because they want people who know that subject, but because they have demonstrated a capacity to master subject matter reflecting both discipline and a capacity to learn?

i personally believe that highschool should be hitting just the basics. math, science, language(s), the arts, history and civics

 

[Atreus21]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Atreus21

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer

For a nation that was founded on Judeo-Christian principles and has "In God We Trust" printed on their dollar bills, having an elective school course on teaching the literature and the history of the Bible is not a big deal. They also expressly allow the teaching of other religious texts if the school chooses to do so.

america is not founded on judeo-christian values. Looking at our system of government and coming to that conclusion is ludicrus. To preempt the next argument, no the fact that some of our founders were christian does not make us a judeo-christian inspired country either, nor does that fact that a majority of our citizens our christian.

It certainly comes damned close. Look at the Declaration of Independence.

rhetorically mentioning a nameless 'God' once and then going into 3 pages of un-christianity isn't much of an argument either.

Really? In 1776, what was the dominant religion in the vast majority of the western world? You think "endowed by our Creator" and "with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence" are there just on accident, and with no reference to anything?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Atreus21

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Atreus21

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Actually it's kind of cool that Texas would allow a class on a book full of incest, adultery and beastiality.

I guess you're cool with them learning Greek Mythology then?

Yep Greek Mythology, Roman Mythology, Norse Mythology and Christian Mythology.

The point being, Greek Mythology has more incest and bestiality than it has normal sex. I'd be surprised if Hercules wasn't conceived out of a threesome with only one human involved.

Yeah I know, those Greeks were some lusty Mofos but the Hebrews weren't any slouches themselves.