Teacher pulls chair out from under student?

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DJFuji

Diamond Member
Oct 18, 1999
3,643
1
76
I take the same stance Chris Rock took on OJ murders:
"You got to think about O.J.'s situation: $25,000 a month [in alimony], another man driving around in his car, fvcking his wife, in a house he's still paying the mortgage on! Now, I'm not saying he should have killed her. But I understand."
 

bluslice

Member
Jan 3, 2005
158
0
0
the teacher definitely had no right to pull the chair from underneath the student. He could have simply written him up or punished him in some other fashion that is acceptable to the school. But I don't agree with the student's way of exposing the teacher's recklessly strict behavior. He should not have "set him up". There are more intelligent ways of exposing the teacher. This was not one of them.
 

Siddhartha

Lifer
Oct 17, 1999
12,505
3
81
Originally posted by: DainBramaged
Originally posted by: Nik
Good for the teacher. The nation's youth gets more and more complacent, apathetic, chaotic, and disrespectful every day. :|

I wholeheartedly agree.

This has been a constant theme in some posts in this thread. That kids need to be forced to learn "respect" and pretty much anything a teacher does is okay.

Lets look at this situation in terms of was this teacher being effective?

By his behavor, did he encourage the students to respect the pledge, or to "respect" the flag, or whatever patriotic fascism he was pushing?

No.

Is verbal and physical abuse the most effective methods to teach people or help them learn?
I have had assh0les like this teacher when I was in school. Verbal and physical abuse only pissed me off at the teacher, the school system, and structured learning situations.

Oh yeah, the student did not have to stand and say the pledge. This teacher was completely out of line. He needs to lose his job. The teacher and the school adminstration need to be pulled into court to be made an example for other fascists.
 

gwarbot

Senior member
Nov 18, 2004
508
0
0
Bah,I tried to not stand during the pledge of allegance before my tacher hit me in the face with an eraser. It sucked. I have mixed feeling about this kind of stuff. It sucks to be 17.But hey what can you do?
 

Nightfall

Golden Member
Nov 16, 1999
1,769
0
0
140 said yes he had a right to do this
285 say no he didn't

I voted no. The teacher had no right to be an ass to the students. However, I will admit that the students should treat the teacher with respect. It is a 2 way street here. The problem exists with parenting today. My parents brought me up to be respectful. Even into adulthood, you wouldn't believe how many good things have happened to me just by being respectful.

Whats the solution? Well, the teacher being an ass isn't a solution.
 

Jeff7181

Lifer
Aug 21, 2002
18,368
11
81
I don't think it's as much an issue of the students right to stand as it is the student disobeying his teacher. Should he have stood up? Yes. Should the teacher have pulled his chair out from under him? No. The student should have been written up for insubordination. But since the teacher resorted to physical means, which is against the law, the teacher should be dealt with appropriately according to the laws in that state.
 

Mugg2000

Junior Member
Feb 26, 2005
19
0
0
WOW movie and all, we have a little bit of Patriotism thrown in, and lots of "Rights". Sorry old school here. The teacher said "Stand-up". What I am hearing long before the anthem played in that movie was a teacher stating with out a doubt in anyones mind what it was he expected for the "Morning Exercises". I imagine there are other things imparted to these students other than the National Anthem. So what I am hearing said in this Topic it is Ok to out and out defy a teacher that says "Pay Attention" ..

Well now on the rights to bear arms. If the teacher said place your weapons on the shelf till the bell rings, you all would agree thay have the right to keep those guns.

Ok there is something to start this going again, bring it on !!!
 

Mugg2000

Junior Member
Feb 26, 2005
19
0
0
Originally posted by: Jeff7181
Should the teacher have pulled his chair out from under him? No.

Has anyone bothered to look at the movie. The chair was removed after he stood up. The teacher is a big guy but he dd not even "wince" <----- I have no idea what that word is.

The teacher simply slid the chair back. It is his classroom. I would think slapping the lil sh17 with the chair would have been closer to an issue than this one was
 

Vee

Senior member
Jun 18, 2004
689
0
0
Originally posted by: Vic
Has the student not stood for actual political reasons, I would have respected that. In this case, however, the student didn't stand because he wanted to throw a little rebellious tantrum. Not acceptable. Nor is it behavior that can be allowed to continue.

Nice to see someone making that analysis here.
Not standing for ANY national antheme is a socially offensive act. It's an outspoken, public statement of disregard, contempt or hostility. It must always be assumed to be intentionally so. Because that's how the social interaction works. That's the established language. Just as sticking up a finger or spitting in front of someones shoes. Or refering to some people by some terms or names.

Sure it's in anyones full right to not stand for a national antheme. So what? It's not an act that takes place in a cultural and traditional social vacuum.

But oh no! This idiot brat "didn't do it for political reasons". He was exercicing "his rights". And his fellow idiot brat just happened to be videotaping it all.

Just kick them both out.
 

jamesuass

Junior Member
Mar 1, 2005
2
0
0
When I was in grade school I was paddled a number of times by the principle for misconduct,I'm not saying the kids should be physically abused,but it gets aggrevating to watch the inmates taking over the penatentary. < That was a metaphor.
 

Andres3605

Senior member
Nov 14, 2004
927
0
71
As far as I can see both acted wrong, I don?t see why so much drama he didn?t even felt and in my personal opinion he is the typical jackass trying to look cool, im a foreign yet I used to stand in the national anthem and the pledge of alliance, I did it just to show respect for this country and its history, that the teacher acted exaggerated no doubt but this kids attitude is just stupid.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
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Originally posted by: Gilby
It seems to me that student was doing more than simply remaining seated. He was making a statement, not in any way regarding his personal patriotism, but directly against the teacher's authority in the classroom. And that is disruptive. Pure and simple.
Sorry, but wrong. His statement was about the teacher's authority, true, but it was about the teacher's authority to force him to salute/respect/what-have-you some symbol. That is an authority that the teacher, the school, does not have, and hasn't had since the supreme court decision.

And it doesn't matter what reason the kid does or doesn't give. He does have a right not to be coerced into saluting the flag, reciting the pledge, or standing in silent respect during the national anthem. That's the issue. Yes, the kid took his stand, so to speak, because it annoyed the teacher, and probably would never have been protesting if it wasn't for the teacher who thought it was his duty to make sure everyone is properly coereced into patriotism. Doesn't matter.
I hope you people will forgive me for jumping in to this thread, as I don't normally frequent ATOT, but I thought that the above point was a very salient one.

I guess the core question is, was the student conducting his actions, for the sole purpose of undermining the teacher's authority (and it should be an authority, limited only by respect for the basic rights of the students, but the teacher should be "in charge" at all times), and the actual subject of the "protest action" by the student was totally irrelevant to the situation, or was this specifically about the teacher's apparent strongly-held belief in the forced adherence to obediently participate in a public statement of allegance to some symbol, and what it represents?

Here's what I wanted to throw in - assuming that the second scenario is the correct one - what if the "symbol" of allegance, was that of what German schoolchildren were "forced" to pledge allegiance to in the 1940s? Hmm...

And if we are forcing our students to do the same thing (even though the literal symbol might be different), then what does that say about us, as a country, and where we are headed? Hmm...
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
Originally posted by: Gilby
No. He's not kidding. Read his other posts in this thread. Nonconformity is enough reason for physical violence.
Hey, why not? Just send 'em to the gas chambers, if they "don't conform", right? Or perhaps "re-education camps" would be more appropriate in this case?


 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
Originally posted by: Landroval
I would consider it assault to have someone pull a chair out from under me. That student had every right to sit during the anthem if he so desired.

What if he had a medical problem, weak knees or something, and that action caused him further permanent injury, that could cripple for life? I smell the opportunity for a nice, fat, juicy lawsuit here.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
Originally posted by: Gerbil333
Originally posted by: Nik
Good for the teacher. The nation's youth gets more and more complacent, apathetic, chaotic, and disrespectful every day. :|
I agree with you, however, look at history, and see if you can honestly say our culture isn't on a pathway of corruption.

Frankly, I'm disgusted with the US, just as the other nations in the world are. If the kid doesn't want to say the pledge, that's really a shame. But, I don't blame him, given the sad state of our world affairs (particularly the USA).
Perhaps if our leaders would choose to lead by example, instead of an iron fist and a do-as-I-say-not-as-I-do policy, then things would be better. ("I didn't inhale", "I did not have sex with that woman", etc., not picking on Clinton particularly, but those are simply good examples of the hypocrasy exhibited by those in power in this country.)

Is there really any wonder that the youth of today are disillusioned with the future that this country apparently presents to them?

Realistically, this isn't a joke - our country really is going down the tubes. The youth are largely the symptom, they are not the problem. The actions of those in power today are the problem, by and large.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
I support the rights of those who don't support America. I may not agree with them, but they have just as much right to believe what they believe as anyone else. You can't make someone respect or believe in something.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,548
10,171
126
Originally posted by: Stumps
According to the police report it was suicide, but everybody knew that the local police had done it, they just got transfers instead, the teacher was very popular, but these silly sluts figured they weren't going to take any "crap" from him and when he layed out the law to them, bam dead teacher, for the remainin two years that I was a Temora High school the teacher were sh*t scared to discipline students, I know I was one of the rougher students and could get away with almost anything, a few of my friend were caught smoking pot in th toilets and weren't even suspended because one of them had a copper for a father. as far as I'm concerned these dickheads in the thread title deserve everything they got, there is no respect in society these days, everybody has "rights", half the laws in my country don't even hold up in court when challaneged these days...the world is a *cked up place

Wow. That's truely... messed up.

Btw, of all of the people here expressing their different views on classroom behavior (and trust me, I had it pretty rough too, and I have long hair, so I was harassed by cops walking home from HS in broad daylight a few times, just because).. but anyways. If you like Anime at all, I've been watching a few DVDs from a series recently called "G.T.O." - Great Teacher Onizaku. It's a really colorful look at teaching, but a lot of it rings true, too. My mom was a teacher for a number of years, and well.. let's just say that although I kind of "hassled" my teachers at times... kids these days really don't have much respect at all. But it's kind of like a mutual-disrespect arms race, really. I'm not really sure what the perfect solution is, but there needs to be at least some respect all the way around, and as far as the kids go, that starts with the parents of the kids, who these days, seem to think of school as a Surrogate Parenting Service, conveniently keeping their kids out of their hair during the day. Anyways, if you feel the notion, pick up a few eps of that anime, it's really quite good.
 

GoingUp

Lifer
Jul 31, 2002
16,720
1
71
I dont see anything wrong with it. He didn't topple the kid to the ground. He also told the students to stand before the anthem was even on.

The kid was even a punk. I support the teacher in this situation even though he seems like kind of a hardass.