synthetic oils?

[JeffreyLebowski]

Well for all you Nissan fan boys the nissan OEM filters have been rated as one of the best, and it's only $9 to boot.

 

[stonecold3169]

Originally posted by: alkemyst
keep in mind adding a synthetic to a high mileage engine may clean out deposits or flow through them that are now keeping your engine leak free.

Many also notice a large increase in oil usage on a higher mileage vehicle + synthetic.

These are not a fault for the synthetic, but problems nonetheless.

Bingo. Some engines have actually clogged holes with deposites. This synthetic stuff can cause it to come free and might cause a bit of leaking.

Don't get me wrong, synthetic is great stuff, and I'm all for it as it's not only more efficient and convinient, it also helps the enviroment. However, if you have a car which has always used the good old stuff, it's wise not to change from what I've heard.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Mobil 1 is a stripped down synthetic IMHO.

Mobil 1 is the synthetic. Mobil 1 was the first synthetic, and Mobil remains the industry leader because of continued product development. AMSOIL is a very good product too, but a person would have to be completely insane to go more than 10,000 miles between oil changes, and I highly dislike AMSOIL's claims that longer intervals are acceptable. I don't know a single mechanic who goes more than 7,500 miles even if they use high-end synthetics and baby the car. I don't go past 3,000 miles on any oil change, and after 215,000 miles my car still doesn't smoke or lose any measurable amount of oil between changes.

Synthetic oil's not the only thing to consider though. You'll need to make sure that you use a good oil filter, I would recommend Purolator or Wix/Dana (also sold as the Napa brand). Do not, under any circumstances, use a Fram oil filter. Fram's quality since Allied Signal bought them out has seriously declined. I wouldn't put a Fram filter on a rental car.

ZV

Mobil1 was not the first synthetic, unless AMSOil is lying through their teeth.

Company Information

It's fully warranted. The oil drain interval standard in Europe is 9,000 miles, I believe.. and they are considering double that.

Very few oil companies have extended drain interval recomendations. Think about it. They thrive on the 3,000 mile oil change. They're not going to tell people they need to change their oil every 25,000 miles. It's a conflict of interest.

While it is true that changing your oil sooner, rather than later, isn't going to hurt anything.. What's the point if the oil is still functional? You're just throwing money away. Like I said, the only way to tell the condition of an oil is to have it analyzed in a lab.

You do make a very good point though.. The best oil in the world isn't going to do any good if your air and oil filters aren't up to par.

If you really care about your engine, I would suggest a bypass oil filter.. I am sure there are others out there, but I only know of the AMSOil one. They claim that 60% of engine wear is caused by particles in the 5 - 20 micron range, which seems logical. Their bypass filter removes particles down to 0.1 microns, they claim it virtually eliminates engine wear caused by particulates. It produces analytically clean oil.

Also make sure you have a high quality air filter. Paper filters are less than best, and you should at least get a foam-pre filter. Make sure your filter gaskets aren't worn out, etc.

BTW, all the stuff about leaky seals and removing engine desposits is a myth. They have long solved all of the compatibility problems the first generation of synthetics had with the materials we were using for gasketing. They've also found that synthetic oil has little, of any effect, on already made deposits. Think about it. If synthetic oil removed the deposits, so would a fresh infusion of clean dino juice.

 

[tcsenter]

I'm still not sure about the AMSOil - I put it in my TL1000R after using Mobil 1 previously and all the time on my last bike (YZF600). I instantly noted a much clunkier shifter feel and more effort (still nothing, but noticeable) to shift gears.

Your complaint is not an uncommon one when using synthetic lubricants in gear boxes, especially after switching to synthetic ATF. But you have to leave it in there a few hundred miles and avoid aggressively shifting during that time. It may smooth back out, it may not. You may try another brand such as Redline. Many people have experienced this problem after using Amsoil, and reported that it stopped after switching to Redline, or vice versa.

Nonsense. Everybody knows AMSOil was the first company to explore synthetic lubricants. As they say, AMSOil was the first in synthetics.

Amsoil was the first to formulate and market an API classified synthetic motor oil for passenger vehicles (and trucks). Amsoil did not pioneer synthetics.

AMSOil's extended drain interval is 25,000 miles.. fully guarenteed. The 3,000 mile oil change is a myth.

Well neither Redline nor Amsoil guarantee you will receive those intervals using their products. They only guarantee that using their products up to these extended drain intervals will not cause harm to your engine PROVIDED that you follow their extended drain interval requirements to the letter. What seems to be missing is that you must also perform an oil analysis every 7,500 miles or Amsoil doesn't guarantee squat. So while I'm under the car, trying to get a sample of oil, so that I can send it off and wait for the results to see if my oil needs changing, I could have, in the same amount of time, changed the oil and filter anyway, and been done with it (and had fresh oil to boot). The oil analysis kits are an added expense, and the oil analysis service is, IIRC, between $15 - $20 (not including the cost of the kits).

As for the synthetic v. conventional issue, synthetic oils are clearly superior to conventional oils. Among synthetic lubricants, Amsoil is one of the best available at any price. This is the 'no brainer' part, and why people find synthetics attractive, Amsoil especially, because its rather easy to prove that synthetics like Amsoil (but even Mobil 1) are superior to conventional oils in every category of performance.

And so if you pay attention only to the test data, its an easy sell. As a former Amsoil dealer (i.e. a salesman), my job was to get people to focus entirely on this test data, and build a case for synthetics in such a way that the merits of using synthetics would logically flow from the test data.

However, things aren't that simple, as I am also a savvy consumer, and I've never been able to fully separate the consumer from the salesman, as profitable as it would be if I could. If I wouldn't use the product as a consumer, I could never convincingly sell it. So as an exercise, I decided to pit the synthetic sales pitch against one of the most skeptical consumers I know - me.

As an Amsoil dealer, I not only had to convince people of the merits of synthetic vs. conventional, but the merits of expensive 'premium' synthetics like Amsoil (at $6-$7 per quart) vs. shelf synthetics like Mobil 1 (at $3.50 per quart). Mobil 1, BTW, is a good product.

However, there is only so much benefit that is to be had from oil under any given circumstance.

This is a very oversimplified analogy, but it works just as well as any other:

Let us suppose you have two watches; one is water-resistant to 10m and the other to 20m, all other things being equal. The latter is clearly "superior" in terms of the water-resistance depth, right? But, what if your watch falls into water no deeper than 5m the entire time you own it? Now which watch is superior?

Neither, unless the latter watch costs twice as much, then the first is superior because it not only costs less but its water resistance is more than adequate for the depths of water it will ever be exposed to. The same idea is directly applicable to the synthetic v. conventional issue.

The fact is, conventional motor oils are SO GOOD today that they provide more than adequate protection for the demands that will be placed upon them by a modern passenger vehicle engine in good working order, given that the oil and filter are changed at prudent intervals.

There is only so much 'benefit' that can be had from an oil and conventional oils are more than adequate enough to meet the demands that will be placed upon them under normal circumstances. This may not be as true for ususually demanding conditions such as diesel engines, high performance engines, engines that are driven very hard, or engines that must shoulder a greater working load such as when towing.

And so while it is very easy to show that synthetic oils provide more protection in four ball wear test, NO INDEPENDENT TEST HAS PROVEN THAT REGULAR PASSENGER VEHICLE ENGINES WEAR LESS OR LAST LONGER WHEN SYNTHETIC OIL IS USED. Not a single one. Why? For the reasons I stated above. Regular passenger vehicle engines in good working order under normal 'real world' operating conditions will never demand more of conventional oil than it is capable of providing or push conventional oil beyond its protective limits. Yet, many independent tests have shown that synthetic oil is a waste of money because there was no evidence that the engine had less wear or lasted longer then those using conventional oil (Consumer Reports being just one of many).

To borrow from my previous analogy: watch A (conventional oil) is capable of providing the SAME protection at 10m that watch B (synthetic oil) is capable of providing at 20m, while the depths to which both watches will be exposed will never exceed 5m, so the added expense of watch B is just that, added expense.

For this reason, I could no longer justify the synthetic sales pitch to the average person, nor to myself, and I allowed my Amsoil dealer's license to lapse. Myself, a former Amsoil dealer, I use whatever branded oil is on sale by the case, and change the oil/filter every 4-5K miles.

Of course, having said that, using synthetics can certainly do no harm to anything except your wallet, so if you have money to burn, then by all means...its your money.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: tcsenter

I'm still not sure about the AMSOil - I put it in my TL1000R after using Mobil 1 previously and all the time on my last bike (YZF600). I instantly noted a much clunkier shifter feel and more effort (still nothing, but noticeable) to shift gears.

Your complaint is not an uncommon one when using synthetic lubricants in gear boxes, especially after switching to synthetic ATF. But you have to leave it in there a few hundred miles and avoid aggressively shifting during that time. It may smooth back out, it may not. You may try another brand such as Redline. Many people have experienced this problem after using Amsoil, and reported that it stopped after switching to Redline, or vice versa.

Nonsense. Everybody knows AMSOil was the first company to explore synthetic lubricants. As they say, AMSOil was the first in synthetics.

Amsoil was the first to formulate and market an API classified synthetic motor oil for passenger vehicles (and trucks). Amsoil did not pioneer synthetics.

AMSOil's extended drain interval is 25,000 miles.. fully guarenteed. The 3,000 mile oil change is a myth.

Well neither Redline nor Amsoil guarantee you will receive those intervals using their products. They only guarantee that using their products up to these extended drain intervals will not cause harm to your engine PROVIDED that you follow their extended drain interval requirements to the letter. What seems to be missing is that you must also perform an oil analysis every 7,500 miles or Amsoil doesn't guarantee squat. So while I'm under the car, trying to get a sample of oil, so that I can send it off and wait for the results to see if my oil needs changing, I could have, in the same amount of time, changed the oil and filter anyway, and been done with it (and had fresh oil to boot). The oil analysis kits are an added expense, and the oil analysis service is, IIRC, between $15 - $20 (not including the cost of the kits).

As for the synthetic v. conventional issue, synthetic oils are clearly superior to conventional oils. Among synthetic lubricants, Amsoil is one of the best available at any price. This is the 'no brainer' part, and why people find synthetics attractive, Amsoil especially, because its rather easy to prove that synthetics like Amsoil (but even Mobil 1) are superior to conventional oils in every category of performance.

And so if you pay attention only to the test data, its an easy sell. As a former Amsoil dealer (i.e. a salesman), my job was to get people to focus entirely on this test data, and build a case for synthetics in such a way that the merits of using synthetics would logically flow from the test data.

However, things aren't that simple, as I am also a savvy consumer, and I've never been able to fully separate the consumer from the salesman, as profitable as it would be if I could. If I wouldn't use the product as a consumer, I could never convincingly sell it. So as an exercise, I decided to pit the synthetic sales pitch against one of the most skeptical consumers I know - me.

As an Amsoil dealer, I not only had to convince people of the merits of synthetic vs. conventional, but the merits of expensive 'premium' synthetics like Amsoil (at $6-$7 per quart) vs. shelf synthetics like Mobil 1 (at $3.50 per quart). Mobil 1, BTW, is a good product.

However, there is only so much benefit that is to be had from oil under any given circumstance.

This is a very oversimplified analogy, but it works just as well as any other:

Let us suppose you have two watches; one is water-resistant to 10m and the other to 20m, all other things being equal. The latter is clearly "superior" in terms of the water-resistance depth, right? But, what if your watch falls into water no deeper than 5m the entire time you own it? Now which watch is superior?

Neither, unless the latter watch costs twice as much, then the first is superior because it not only costs less but its water resistance is more than adequate for the depths of water it will ever be exposed to. The same idea is directly applicable to the synthetic v. conventional issue.

The fact is, conventional motor oils are SO GOOD today that they provide more than adequate protection for the demands that will be placed upon them by a modern passenger vehicle engine in good working order, given that the oil and filter are changed at prudent intervals.

There is only so much 'benefit' that can be had from an oil and conventional oils are more than adequate enough to meet the demands that will be placed upon them under normal circumstances. This may not be as true for ususually demanding conditions such as diesel engines, high performance engines, engines that are driven very hard, or engines that must shoulder a greater working load such as when towing.

And so while it is very easy to show that synthetic oils provide more protection in four ball wear test, NO INDEPENDENT TEST HAS PROVEN THAT REGULAR PASSENGER VEHICLE ENGINES WEAR LESS OR LAST LONGER WHEN SYNTHETIC OIL IS USED. Not a single one. Why? For the reasons I stated above. Regular passenger vehicle engines in good working order under normal 'real world' operating conditions will never demand more of conventional oil than it is capable of providing or push conventional oil beyond its protective limits. Yet, many independent tests have shown that synthetic oil is a waste of money because there was no evidence that the engine had less wear or lasted longer then those using conventional oil (Consumer Reports being just one of many).

To borrow from my previous analogy: watch A (conventional oil) is capable of providing the SAME protection at 10m that watch B (synthetic oil) is capable of providing at 20m, while the depths to which both watches will be exposed will never exceed 5m, so the added expense of watch B is just that, added expense.

For this reason, I could no longer justify the synthetic sales pitch to the average person, nor to myself, and I allowed my Amsoil dealer's license to lapse. Myself, a former Amsoil dealer, I use whatever branded oil is on sale by the case, and change the oil/filter every 4-5K miles.

Of course, having said that, using synthetics can certainly do no harm to anything except your wallet, so if you have money to burn, then by all means...its your money.

Good post.. I am curious though.. if AMSOil didn't pioneer synthetics, who did? The world of engine oil is a strange and confusing place.. I'm just as willing to learn as anybody.

The watch analogy is pretty good I guess. Hmm.. I dunno. Like you said, it certainly isn't going to hurt anything .. And if it makes you feel better, and you're willing to spend the money.. shrug.

About the AMSOil warranty, hmm.. I don't see anything about having to check the oil every 7.5k miles.. I dunno. They do say you need to provide a sample if you're going to claim something with them, though.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Mobil1 was not the first synthetic, unless AMSOil is lying through their teeth.

AMSOIL's not lying, but they are (as usual) not telling the whole truth. AMSOIL's synthetic was launched in 1972. Mobil 1 was launched to consumers in 1973 (Europe/Japan), but Mobil had been producing commercial synthetics since the late 1960's. AMSOIL was first to the consumer market, but Mobil was the first to come out with a synthetic oil, and it was Mobil synthetic lubricants which are refered to on the AMSOIL page as, "the superb performance of synthetic lubricants in jet engines".

As to the debate on Synthetics vs. Conventional oils, I'm in complete agreement with tcsenter. My Honda runs on conventional oil, and has for 215,000 miles. However, in my motorcycle and the 914 I use synthetic because both the cycle and the 914 are air-cooled and I want the extra thermal protection of synthetic when I run those engines hard on 90+ degree days. The 914 and the cycle are highly sensitive to ambient temperature, and unless it's 70 degrees or less they both tend to run hot, the 914 moreso than the cycle. Switching to Mobil 1 made a significant difference in oil temperatures.

ZV

 

[tcsenter]

Good post.. I am curious though.. if AMSOil didn't pioneer synthetics, who did? The world of engine oil is a strange and confusing place.. I'm just as willing to learn as anybody.

If my memory serves me correctly, and that is a big if, engineers and scientists in Nazi Germany pioneered synthetics, since they were doing a lot of R & D with the first jet turbine engines. But, at any rate, the founder of Amsoil was a fighter pilot in the US Air Force and his first exposure to synthetic lubricants was in that capacity because the US military was working on them, also.

About the AMSOil warranty, hmm.. I don't see anything about having to check the oil every 7.5k miles.. I dunno. They do say you need to provide a sample if you're going to claim something with them, though.

Trust me, if you attempt to file a warranty claim with Amsoil, claiming their products caused harm to your engine, the FIRST thing they are going to request is all of your documentation that you performed the oil analysis as recommended.

 

[StageLeft]

tcsenter brings up a valid point or points. You can get conventional oil for about $1.60/quart, whereas synthetic may cost 2-3X or more than that per quart. Some would say that since oil is so cheap it's worth paying this small amount of extra money to ensure that the very expensive critical part of the car (engine) is properly lubricated, but those prices can add up, and add up uselessly if they are not posing much of a benefit.

I know that most new cars are still being sold with conventional oil in the engine, and their extended warranties never specify that you have to be using synthetic to make the best of it.

Then there is another thing: How many people here have ever had engine wear problems in their car that needed fixing that could possibly have been reduced by a different oil? In all the thousands of dollars I've ever spent on car repairs in my current vehicle and the one before that never has a single one been caused by engine wear (both very high mileage cars). Engines do go of course, but chances are that if your engine goes it's not due to excess engine wear as a direct result of inadequate or unoptimal lubrication.

 

[CraigRT]

mobil1 is about the best brand you can get right off the shelf for a reasonable price.. Amsoil is the best synthetic but i dont really think it matters alot in a normal car situation.. race car, perhaps.. mobi1 is great though, dont get me wrong.. thats what i use in my car. every 5,000 kms. = every 3,000 miles or so.

 

[thedarkwolf]

I love listening to people talking about how much extra life they will get out of their car's engine by running synthetic and then turn around a year or two later and sell the car . Whats the point of spending all that extra cash on synthetic unless you plan to drive the car for 500k + miles? I can understand it under special situations like high performance cars, turbos, and air cooled ones but not in regular cars. How many people on here even keep cars for 100k? Hell how many keep them 50k miles? If your cars engine blows up at 100k miles there was something other than they type of oil you used that was wrong with it.

 

[yoyo25]

Is there any truth in getting better gas mileage out of synthetics?

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: yoyo25
Is there any truth in getting better gas mileage out of synthetics?

I won't deny the potential for a small increase, but I seriously doubt that there is a significat difference. The main benefits of synthetic are better flow when cold, and less thermal breakdown when hot.

ZV

EDIT:

How many people on here even keep cars for 100k?

*raises hand* Actually, double that number and add 15,000. The longer I drive the car, the more the cost per mile decreases.

 

[MrPhelps]

If it is not still true a couple of years ago the Corvette would have it's warranty voided if you didn't use Mobil oil.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: MrPhelps
If it is not still true a couple of years ago the Corvette would have it's warranty voided if you didn't use Mobil oil.

The Corvette never had anything like that. Yes it did come with Mobil1 from the factory, but you can use any oil that meets the current standards.

There is a law that says if the car company says you must use XXX(oil, filter, etc..) or it will void the warrenty they must supply it for free. That is why they alwasy say "WE RECOMMAND, YOU USE xxx"

Look under the hoof of a older GM car and you will see GM's slogan ,Keep your GM car with GM parts, well something like that

 

[Zenmervolt]

There is a law that says if the car company says you must use XXX(oil, filter, etc..) or it will void the warrenty they must supply it for free.

Close, but not quite. If the company publishes certain standards (even above and beyond industry standards) then a filter/oil that does not meet those standards can void the warranty. If there is only one brand that meets the requirements, then buying another will void the warranty and the company doesn't have to provide the filter/oil for free. However, if the company does not publish standards which other manufacturers can meet then they are required to provide the oil/filter for free.

Basically, a company can only publish standards that must be met for the warranty to be honored, they cannot specify a brand if other brands meet those standards.

ZV

 

[thedarkwolf]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: yoyo25
Is there any truth in getting better gas mileage out of synthetics?

I won't deny the potential for a small increase, but I seriously doubt that there is a significat difference. The main benefits of synthetic are better flow when cold, and less thermal breakdown when hot.

ZV

EDIT:

How many people on here even keep cars for 100k?

*raises hand* Actually, double that number and add 15,000. The longer I drive the car, the more the cost per mile decreases.

Yeah I am sure there are a few people on here that keep cars a long time but I bet its a real small minority. My dad's 96 t-bird has 270k miles on it and all on dino juice.

 

[KMurphy]

Originally posted by: Eli
Synthetic oils are superior to petroleum oils in every aspect. Every aspect.

Synthetic oil is a petroleum byproduct just as regular motor oil. The difference is that the molecular chains in synthetic oils are engineered to enhance the desired attributes of oil.

Water also does get into oil as long as it's exposed to external atmosphere; which it is due to the positive crankcase ventilation valve. The oil mixes with the moisture in the atmosphere to form an emulsion due to the detergents added to all motor oil. This doesn't happen very fast, but at 25,000 miles I would have to assume the worst.

 

[Citation]

Truth of the matter is, while synthetics might be better in "every aspect" as some choose to think, it?s really a matter of what is needed. It would never hurt to use synthetic, but your car will be perfectly ok with just the regular stuff too provided it matches what the manufacturer calls for. And no matter how many miles the advertisements say you can go on their "super oils" change it every 3000k be it the regular stuff or synthetic. Who is going to know more about what is better for your car? General Motors who has how much money that is put into testing and says every 3000k or some of these other companies that say they can go 7000k miles before a change or some other ridiculous #. If you believe those then you might as well buy every Ensure and other nutrient drink that you see because you're not healthy with out them!!!!!! Give me a break.

 

[Citation]

Truth of the matter is, while synthetics might be better in "every aspect" as some choose to think, it?s really a matter of what is needed. It would never hurt to use synthetic, but your car will be perfectly ok with just the regular stuff too provided it matches what the manufacturer calls for. And no matter how many miles the advertisements say you can go on their "super oils" change it every 3000k be it the regular stuff or synthetic. Who is going to know more about what is better for your car? General Motors who has how much money that is put into testing and says every 3000k or some of these other companies that say they can go 7000k miles before a change or some other ridiculous #. If you believe those then you might as well buy every Ensure and other nutrient drink that you see because you're not healthy with out them!!!!!! Give me a break.

 

[MrPhelps]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: MrPhelps
If it is not still true a couple of years ago the Corvette would have it's warranty voided if you didn't use Mobil oil.

The Corvette never had anything like that. Yes it did come with Mobil1 from the factory, but you can use any oil that meets the current standards.

There is a law that says if the car company says you must use XXX(oil, filter, etc..) or it will void the warrenty they must supply it for free. That is why they alwasy say "WE RECOMMAND, YOU USE xxx"

Look under the hoof of a older GM car and you will see GM's slogan ,Keep your GM car with GM parts, well something like that

I sit corrected kind sir, I did a bit more research and found that some came filled with Mobil 1.
I would stand corrected but I am lazy. I rated you a 10 for the correction. thanks

 

[Zenmervolt]

General Motors who has how much money that is put into testing and says every 3000k or some of these other companies that say they can go 7000k miles before a change or some other ridiculous #.

Actually, automotive manufacturers have been recommending 7,000+ mile oil change intervals since the 1980's. The sticker under the hood of my 1988 Accord recommends 7,500 mile oil changes. The 3,000 mile change interval is largely a product of the oil companies and mechanics. That said, I run a 3,000 mile change interval in my own car because I don't trust any oil much longer than that.

your car will be perfectly ok with just the regular stuff too provided it matches what the manufacturer calls for.

Then why did oil temps drop significantly when I switched to Mobil 1 in my Porsche? The factory recommended conventional 10w30 (1976 model, well before new Porsches came with Mobil 1). In most cases I'll grant you that conventional oil is perfectly adequate to do the job, but when one stresses an engine (such as lots of towing or driving in high heat, or running the engine at high RPMs) then the superiorities of synthetic oils become of more use. Personally, I would not run any air-cooled 4-cycle engine with anything other than synthetic oil.

ZV

 

[Flaredair]

In hotter areas of the country, syn oil is much better.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

General Motors who has how much money that is put into testing and says every 3000k or some of these other companies that say they can go 7000k miles before a change or some other ridiculous #.

Actually, automotive manufacturers have been recommending 7,000+ mile oil change intervals since the 1980's. The sticker under the hood of my 1988 Accord recommends 7,500 mile oil changes. The 3,000 mile change interval is largely a product of the oil companies and mechanics. That said, I run a 3,000 mile change interval in my own car because I don't trust any oil much longer than that.

your car will be perfectly ok with just the regular stuff too provided it matches what the manufacturer calls for.

Then why did oil temps drop significantly when I switched to Mobil 1 in my Porsche? The factory recommended conventional 10w30 (1976 model, well before new Porsches came with Mobil 1). In most cases I'll grant you that conventional oil is perfectly adequate to do the job, but when one stresses an engine (such as lots of towing or driving in high heat, or running the engine at high RPMs) then the superiorities of synthetic oils become of more use. Personally, I would not run any air-cooled 4-cycle engine with anything other than synthetic oil.

ZV

I agree 100%. I wouldn't use anything but synthetic in the air cooled 4-cycle Honda GXH50 on my scooter that routinly sees 8000+ rpm.

Of course, we're not really debating which synthetic to use... Just discussing them in general. I think we can all agree that synthetics are better than regular dino oil.. even if we are talking about the store brands of synthetics. I just prefer AMSOil, is all. I am not a dealer or anything.

It's always cool when all us engine enthusiasts get into a debate, because it nearly always ends peacefully.

 

[Muadib]

Originally posted by: BigDaddyPig
In hotter areas of the country, syn oil is much better.

Wouldn't the same apply for cold places too?

 

[IGBT]

I get my synth.mobil 1 at costco 5-30 I think it is..seems ok.