SUVs justified...

[exdeath]

A) Do you want it?

B) Can you afford it?

That's all that matters, who cares what everyone else thinks.

 

[JulesMaximus]

The Explorer really made me scratch my head. I remember looking at them with a buddy back in the '90s., and we looked at them back to back with the Ranger. Aside from the rear enclosure and rear doors, the thing was just a Ranger at double the price. What a bargain, lol.

That's EXACTLY what it is. A pickup truck with some extra sheet metal, more glass, more carpet and two bench seats. They were the biggest profit makers for the big three for nearly 2 decades.

<--Do not need/Do not want.

 

[vi edit]

Actually no, not even with that. My GTI would easily hold a stroller, 3 people, and a large dog. It is a 3-door hatchback. Would it be cramped? Yeah. Would it get ~30mpg highway? Absolutely. I'd much rather spend half the price on gas and be slightly discomforted.

Uh, I own a Mazda5 which is vastly larger in interior room than a GTI(I used to own one) and I regularly haul two adults, a child in a car seat, and an 80 pound dog. And that thing is completely loaded at that point. Would all of that fit in a GTI? Maybe. But not any of us are going to be happy. "Easily fit" is quite a stretch.

 

[DVad3r]

So there is kind of a general anti-SUV feeling on this forum. Here is my attempt to start a movement towards fewer haters. Why? because I love them and have had them for years now and want others to see the light.

1. "You don't need an SUV for just one person."
SUV is the jack of all trades car, you don't need a daily driver and a weekend car, or a truck, or ever have to rent Uhauls. What do people with little cars do when they buy a TV or outdoor furniture? They call those of us with trucks or SUVs to bail them out. Plus try putting a family of three, a stroller, a german shepherd and a dachsund in a Prius.

2. "They burn so much gas! It's bad for the environment!"
Instead of commuting 2 hours a day and sitting in traffic developing high blood pressure, we (SUVers) are forced by lower mileage to live closer to work and spend less time driving ie less miles/fuel etc. We probably burn less gas overall. Plus less sitting in traffic leaves us more time to exersize and spend with family. Which is healthier.

Prius drivers and hypermilers can afford to commute for hours thus leading to obesity, bloodclots and become an unfair drain on our medical system.

3. "SUV drivers are all terrible drivers."
What's that quote? "Ever notice how anyone going slower than you is an idiot and everyone going faster is a jerk?" Everyone else you see on the road all day is thinking the same thing about you. So now who's the bad driver buddy?

4. "They are dangerous."
They are actually very safe, though much like Death Proof, you have to be on the inside to really see the full benefit of that. I say that as a rule SUV drivers are far safer than say drunks or tired people. That's about 80% of all drivers out there. Where do you want to be sitting during the ensuing collision? I'll go with the Land Cruiser any day of the week.

A few of my arguments...anyone got any more? We won't convince the economasses, but if we can reach just one kid

1. Station Wagon

2. Umm no

3. They are, only an idiot would buy a car they don't need

4. They are dangerous. Combine this with bad drivers and you have roll overs/people who have no clue what their car is capable of.

 

[rh71]

Why on God's green earth would someone freely find & choose a station wagon in this day and age when there are SUVs and minivans? Go backwards more. Spend $30k+ of your own money and minimalize - yeah, that's fricken brilliant. Fvck the haters. I've lost count how many times I've explained "need" on this forum - in one ear and out the other. Ipods, smartphones, 350hp+, fast computers, large screens, FUCK YOU ALL about need.

Life's too short to give a sh!t what others think about your possessions. You work to make money so you can enjoy what you like.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Why on God's green earth would someone freely find & choose a station wagon in this day and age when there are SUVs and minivans? Go backwards more. Spend $30k+ of your own money and minimalize - yeah, that's fricken brilliant. Fvck the haters. I've lost count how many times I've explained "need" on this forum - in one ear and out the other. Ipods, smartphones, 350hp+, fast computers, large screens, FUCK YOU ALL about need.

Life's too short to give a sh!t what others think about your possessions. You work to make money so you can enjoy what you like.

Calm down SUV boy.

 

[MovingTarget]

I'm not anti-SUV by any means, but ownership of an SUV should not be a status/image thing. If you aren't the type who can/will use the utility that a real SUV offers, then you shouldn't bother. Same goes for pickups. Think about it this way - if SUVs were more true to thier truck origin, produced without all the bells/whistles/creature comforts as they were twenty or so years ago, would many SUV buyers still consider one? Think no radio, no floor carpeting, no butwarmers, no dvd/nav systems, harsh suspension, and an interior designed to be cleaned out with a garden hose and/or pressure washer. I think not.

 

[brblx]

Why on God's green earth would someone freely find & choose a station wagon in this day and age when there are SUVs and minivans? Go backwards more. Spend $30k+ of your own money and minimalize - yeah, that's fricken brilliant. Fvck the haters. I've lost count how many times I've explained "need" on this forum - in one ear and out the other. Ipods, smartphones, 350hp+, fast computers, large screens, FUCK YOU ALL about need.

Life's too short to give a sh!t what others think about your possessions. You work to make money so you can enjoy what you like.

you work to make money so you can show off your status symbol and be a douche towards others.

if your SUV literally gives you joy, your dick must be absolutely tiny.

 

[rh71]

you work to make money so you can show off your status symbol and be a douche towards others.

if your SUV literally gives you joy, your dick must be absolutely tiny.

This needs to be understood. SUVs do not cost more than regular cars or trucks. It is other people's perception of that that is YOUR problem, not mine.

That douche comment - because of your perception of a brand name? Again, not my problem, it's yours. It definitely gives me great joy, as does everything else I CHOOSE to buy with my money. I've put a lot of effort into mods because it continues to make me happy. I was two steps away from buying a Mazda 5 during clunker trade-ins and doing the same thing. So what's your point? Is that a status thing? I was also 2 steps from closing on an Odyssey minivan [but the salesguy wouldn't give us invoice] - is that a status thing?

If you have never been in such a position to do things for yourself then I suggest you get out of the house some time. Because clearly judging others with generalizations from behind a computer is all you're capable of.

 

[brblx]

has nothing to do with brands, has to do with the general SUV mentality of 'the road is mine to do with as i please and fuck those losers who can't afford to drive a big car like me.'

 

[ElFenix]

S

2. "They burn so much gas! It's bad for the environment!"
Instead of commuting 2 hours a day and sitting in traffic developing high blood pressure, we (SUVers) are forced by lower mileage to live closer to work and spend less time driving ie less miles/fuel etc. We probably burn less gas overall. Plus less sitting in traffic leaves us more time to exersize and spend with family. Which is healthier.

Prius drivers and hypermilers can afford to commute for hours thus leading to obesity, bloodclots and become an unfair drain on our medical system.

i very much doubt that SUVs are on average driven any less or more than any other type of car, on average, except maybe garaged sports cars/convertibles in the northeast that don't get take out in the winter.

4. "They are dangerous."
They are actually very safe, though much like Death Proof, you have to be on the inside to really see the full benefit of that. I say that as a rule SUV drivers are far safer than say drunks or tired people. That's about 80% of all drivers out there. Where do you want to be sitting during the ensuing collision? I'll go with the Land Cruiser any day of the week.

i'm fairly certain the death rate per million vehicle miles doesn't bear that out.

 

[MovingTarget]

Why on God's green earth would someone freely find & choose a station wagon in this day and age when there are SUVs and minivans?

For one, real station wagons as we used to know them no longer exist. Modern wagons are much more comparable to sedans when it comes to fuel economy and handling than any SUV and/or minivan, but with the cargo room that a conventional sedan couldn't hope for. They have their advantages over SUVs, minivans, and regular cars.

 

[rh71]

Calm down SUV boy.

I wrote that "need" part just for you. Go ahead, debunk it, hypocrite.

 

[rh71]

For one, real station wagons as we used to know them no longer exist. Modern wagons are much more comparable to sedans when it comes to fuel economy and handling than any SUV and/or minivan, but with the cargo room that a conventional sedan couldn't hope for. They have their advantages over SUVs, minivans, and regular cars.

yes yes, buy a Subaru wagon with all its AWD capabilities instead of buying one of 30 SUVs. How many modern wagons are out there? How many minivans or SUVs? Why don't we just tell people exactly what they should buy with their money? It's the "in" thing to come up with the 1 or 2 alternatives vs. the 50 obvious options.

One other thing, the jack-of-all trades and potential/capability is the biggest point here. Not need. Do you people go out and buy a 30GB ipod if you already have 30GB of music on your harddrive?

 

[rh71]

dp

 

[rh71]

has nothing to do with brands, has to do with the general SUV mentality of 'the road is mine to do with as i please and fuck those losers who can't afford to drive a big car like me.'

and you know that's my attitude on the road?

LOL @ afford a big car. I don't know what to tell you if it still hasn't gotten through yet. Stop embarrassing the rest of the haters by coming up with stupid arguments.

 

[brblx]

sorry that 40k+ cars are such pocketchange to you, oh great one.

could you possibly prove my point any better?

 

[rh71]

sorry that 40k+ cars are such pocketchange to you, oh great one.

could you possibly prove my point any better?

I've got 2 mid-size SUVs. They are not Expeditions or Navigators or Excursions. Why don't you go look up how inexpensive a mid-size SUV can be.

 

[DVad3r]

yes yes, buy a Subaru wagon with all its AWD capabilities instead of buying one of 30 SUVs. How many modern wagons are out there? How many minivans or SUVs? Why don't we just tell people exactly what they should buy with their money? It's the "in" thing to come up with the 1 or 2 alternatives vs. the 50 obvious options.

One other thing, the jack-of-all trades and potential/capability is the biggest point here. Not need. Do you people go out and buy a 30GB ipod if you already have 30GB of music on your harddrive?

The more you post the dumber your comments get.

Station wagons aren't produced anymore in the numbers they once were due to the consumer. If people wanted station wagons, they would make them. Instead people want minivans and SUV's, which for me are an impractical choice.

With a station wagon you have similar cargo room, low to the ground which makes for better handling/safety, and good fuel economy.

If you look at who makes station wagons now, it's higher end makers like BMW, Mercedes, Volvo. Why? Because an educated/intelligent person would clearly choose that over an SUV.

Just because people find something popular and good doesn't mean it is, look at food for example, everyone eats corn fed shit most of the time, but is it good? No, it's not.

If you want to break it down even further, everyone likes the suburbs with big houses, huge winding streets, and the need of a vehical just to get to the corner store. Is that good though? Not really, but people find it popular because they can (for now).

I look at my dad's 1992 Toyota Camry wagon with the I4 engine. It's got 470,000 km on it and runs like a tank. We've transported entire groups of people with it, x-mas tree's, refridgerators, 40 inch tube TV's, and more. It get's around 700 km from a 60 liter tank which is awesome. It drives just like a car, not a fat slob tank SUV. From a practicallity standpoint, what better car can you buy for the money?

 

[MovingTarget]

yes yes, buy a Subaru wagon with all its AWD capabilities instead of buying one of 30 SUVs. How many modern wagons are out there? How many minivans or SUVs? Why don't we just tell people exactly what they should buy with their money? It's the "in" thing to come up with the 1 or 2 alternatives vs. the 50 obvious options.

One other thing, the jack-of-all trades and potential/capability is the biggest point here. Not need. Do you people go out and buy a 30GB ipod if you already have 30GB of music on your harddrive?

You seem to have missed the point of that post. It was in response to you asking why people would buy a wagon instead of an suv and/or minivan. It wasn't to say that people should buy wagons instead of minivans/suvs because they won't fully utilize their capabilities, but that wagons have advantages that suvs/minivans simply do not have. For many uses, they are superior to both minivans and suvs.

There aren't many real wagons out there now - you are right about that - but that doesn't negate the fact that wagons have their place. If anything, I wish auto manufacturers would start making more of them again. And no, those fifty other suv 'options' aren't the obvious option by any means...only the most currently available. Potential capability/versatility is important, but the question is which set of potential capabilities and performance do you need? For most people, the SUV isn't the logical choice, merely the trendy/popular one.

 

[IronWing]

I own an SUV and a Brady wagon. Do I win? The SUV can get into the sticks a bit farther than the wagon. The wagon can carry a full sheet of plywood. The SUV does maybe one mpg better than the wagon. The wagon has spokey hubcaps.

 

[MovingTarget]

I own an SUV and a Brady wagon. Do I win? The SUV can get into the sticks a bit farther than the wagon. The wagon can carry a full sheet of plywood. The SUV does maybe one mpg better than the wagon. The wagon has spokey hubcaps.

I suppose you do. Didn't you also own a Chrysler Turbovan at one point too?

The FJ cruiser you linked makes me feel like I need earplugs to look at it. The station wagon looks alright, but only because I know someone who has fully restored one (faux outside wood paneling and all). Older station wagons are very nice/comfy/useful vehicles if taken care of...

 

[IronWing]

I suppose you do. Didn't you also own a Chrysler Turbovan at one point too?

The FJ cruiser you linked makes me feel like I need earplugs to look at it. The station wagon looks alright, but only because I know someone who has fully restored one (faux outside wood paneling and all). Older station wagons are very nice/comfy/useful vehicles if taken care of...

If you squint real hard at the FJ you might detect some photochopping. The Olds wagon runs great and is well maintained despite losing its wood. It is very comfortable. There is a lot to be said for being able to lie down and sleep in back while taking turns driving on long trips.

I've never owned a minivan. The few times I've rented them, I had no complaints, they serve a useful purpose.

 

[exdeath]

but the question is which set of potential capabilities and performance do you need? For most people, the SUV isn't the logical choice, merely the trendy/popular one.

No, the question is, why do you care what other people need or want?

People do not have to buy things because they need them, or because they are the most economical or practical choice, or because you think they should. That is YOUR criteria, and not necessarily everyone else's.

To answer OPs original post, the answer is that it has nothing to do with SUVs so much as the fact that this forum is heavily left slanted. We have a bunch of closet commies on this forum who can't accept that people in the US are free to earn and spend their money however they want, who feel that only absolute need and practicality, "useful purpose", efficiency, fairness, equality, and environmental friendliness are the only reasons anyone should have anything, and only then if the government approves of course (as long as the things banned are the things they want banned and not things they want).

All the people who want SUVs banned would throw a shit fit if the same standard of "usefulness" was applied to Ferraris, BMWs, Mercedes, etc that get 8 mpg.

Now if you'll excuse me I have a 500+ HP non SUV gas guzzling earth destroyer to go wash and wax.

 

[MovingTarget]

No, the question is, why do you care what other people need or want?

People do not have to buy things because they need them, or because they are the most economical or practical choice, or because you think they should. That is YOUR criteria, and not necessarily everyone else's.

Bunch of closet commies on this forum.

Why do I care? Because other people's excess affects ME. People who buy vehicles that eat gas not only affect their own pocketbook in fuel costs, but drive up fuel consumption overall - thus raising prices for the fuel I buy. When someone buys a large SUV/truck with no intention of actually using the capability - then my tax dollars will be going to fix the roads/bridges that their heavier vehicles incur, which is a waste. Then there is also the pollution issue - especially important if you live near a city. Larger, higher up vehicles take up more room on the highways, do not handle as well, and have blind spots which increase the probability of accidents. One person's decisions may not have a large statistical effect, but when you multiply that by the large number of people who make similar decisions, it adds up. People's decisions - even vehicular ones - are not insulated from the rest of society. That is why I care.

You may also note that even though I do care, nowhere do I advocate that people should be forced to only buy a vehicle that fits their needs. I don't think anyone in this thread has advocated that. Some vehicles are a better, more practical choice than others depending on how they are used. Pointing that out does not a commie make. Please learn what Communism really is before spouting that line.