Stunning article about rash of violence in St. Louis

TechBoyJK

Lifer
Oct 17, 2002
16,699
60
91
About an hour ago 4 people were shot to death at a business. That's just today. This past week has had upwards of 20 shootings.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_b3c62c32-6a07-5a46-a8ed-ca6865934b52.html

ST. LOUIS • Police Major Joseph Spiess was among department brass who hit the streets after a particularly violent night this week, to help look for trouble.
He found some, and it almost killed him.

Spiess was among about a dozen top commanders helping supplement patrols Tuesday night after 19 people were wounded in eight incidents the night before.
By the time the shift ended, there would be two close calls for officers and one embarrassing mistake.

Spiess, 52, was alone, in uniform, driving an unmarked Chevrolet Impala about 9:22 p.m. when he spotted a suspicious-looking black Pontiac Bonneville with temporary license tags on Evans Avenue, heading west near Vandeventer Avenue.

He said he made a U-turn to follow, and the Pontiac’s driver would not stop for his lights and siren. The circumstances did not qualify under rules limiting pursuits, so he gave up at Evans and Sarah Street.

As Spiess continued along Evans, a man jogged slowly toward him and stopped between parked cars about 12 feet away.

“He looks me dead in the eye, lifts his pistol and starts shooting at me,” Spiess said Wednesday. “The first round sounded like a shotgun went off in my car. Then I heard a high-pitched whine go through the (open) driver’s side window and out the passenger window.

“He looked at me square in the face, I’m in an Impala, wearing a police shirt, and he was looking me right in the eye. He knew who he was shooting at. He absolutely knew I was a policeman.”

Spiess said that as he sped off, he watched in the mirror as the gunman stepped to the middle of the street and continued firing.

About a block away, Spiess pulled over to check himself for wounds. “I remember thinking, ‘I have to be hit,’ ” he said. “I could not believe I wasn’t hit.”

His call for help triggered more trouble.

About the same time, a white Volkswagen, which fit the description from a robbery, fled from an attempted stop by a SWAT team sergeant at Natural Bridge and North Florissant avenues. Again, the officer did not pursue.

Yet another police car, responding to Spiess’ emergency, collided with the VW at Compton Avenue and Washington Boulevard. A male passenger fled on foot. The driver, a man, and a female passenger were taken to a hospital in serious condition. The officer, 35, was treated for injuries and released.

Police learned the vehicle was stolen, and contained a pistol and stolen possessions from a series of car break-ins, officials said.

About 4:10 a.m. Wednesday, the driver of the vehicle walked out of St. Louis University Hospital. Police have been searching for the man, 27, ever since, said Lt. Col. Lawrence O’Toole.

He said officers had put a “hold” on the man with the hospital but not a guard because they believed he was too badly hurt to flee.

“He fooled the police and he fooled the hospital and walked out on his own against medical advice,” O’Toole explained. “We think he walked out without anybody knowing.”

“I’m not particularly happy,” O’Toole said, noting that an internal investigation is under way.
Meanwhile, police arrested three people found hiding in a home near the ambush on Spiess, and seized handguns. They were believed to have been in the Pontiac, which was found abandoned in the area.

Two of them were later charged. Robert O. Simmons, 19, of the 4500 block of St. Ferdinand Avenue in St. Louis, was charged with first-degree assault of a law enforcement officer and armed criminal action. Demetrius J. Vanarsdale, 24, of the 4300 block of West Belle Place in St. Louis, was charged with unlawful possession of a firearm and resisting arrest.

Spiess said investigation showed that 16 shots had been fired at him from a 9-millimeter weapon with a 30-round extended magazine. He said he found two bullet holes in the driver’s side door of his car. The windows were down, so he’s not sure how many other rounds might have passed through.

He said he was not sure if more than one man had fired at him.

“These guys parked their car, got out of their car with their guns and set up positions of ambush as I came slowly down the street,” he said.

Spiess said he had been shot at before in his 24-year career but had never experienced an ambush.

He arrived home about 2:30 a.m. Wednesday to find his two young children awake. “I got a nice little homecoming last night, gave them a hug and put them to bed,” he said.

O’Toole said he was “very confident” of solving Monday night’s series of attacks, and lamented the attack on Spiess. “But that’s part of our job,” he said. “That’s what we do.”
O’Toole provided updates on several of the Monday overnight cases:

• Davonta Coleman, 21, of the 4800 block of Margaretta Avenue, faces multiple charges of first-degree assault, armed criminal action and discharging a firearm from a motor vehicle in the wounding of six people about 10:30 p.m. Monday in the 4700 block of Highland Avenue. The injuries were relatively minor. Bail was set at $200,000.

• Police are looking for a particular suspect in the wounding of a man, 28, about 9:08 p.m. Monday in the 3000 block of North Florissant Avenue.

• Police have what O’Toole called “very good information” and some video evidence in the wounding of five people about 1:05 a.m. Tuesday by a man with an AK-47 rifle in the 1900 block of Warren Street.

• Officials plan to seek condemnation of a club called Daddy’s Money, at 5300 North Broadway. A man, 19, was shot in the leg as he left there about 2 a.m. Tuesday.
 

PokerGuy

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
13,650
201
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I know there has to be some common thread to all these ultra violent cities (St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, Camden etc). They probably have loose gun laws that allow all the criminals to get armed. I'm sure they are all full of tea party supporters and run by evil GOP'ers ;)
 

busydude

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2010
8,793
5
76
I know there has to be some common thread to all these ultra violent cities (St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, Camden etc). They probably have loose gun laws that allow all the criminals to get armed. I'm sure they are all full of tea party supporters and run by evil GOP'ers ;)

Yay to partisanship.
 

Proprioceptive

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2006
1,630
10
81
Growing up in St. Louis, I have plenty of things to say about the "circumstances" surrounding these incidents. I even went to a high school which bussed in a lot of inner city kids for better education opportunities. Like I said, the "circumstances" surrounding most of the violence in this town are well... yeah. Anyone who didn't grow up around this or witness the areas first hand really has no clue. Certain "communities" and/or "groups" really have no one to blame but themselves.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,599
90
91
www.bing.com
Growing up in St. Louis, I have plenty of things to say about the "circumstances" surrounding these incidents. I even went to a high school which bussed in a lot of inner city kids for better education opportunities. Like I said, the "circumstances" surrounding most of the violence in this town are well... yeah. Anyone who didn't grow up around this or witness the areas first hand really has no clue. Certain "communities" and/or "groups" really have no one to blame but themselves.

But that's not politically correct, so we will ignore the problem and let it fester.
 

Puppies04

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2011
5,909
17
76
But that's not politically correct, so we will ignore the problem and let it fester.

That's the spirit. heaven forbid we point out a problem and come across as bigoted. Just throw a few million $ at the problem and pretend it went away for a while.
 

AustinInDallas

Golden Member
Jun 5, 2012
1,127
0
76
www.amitelerad.com
Growing up in St. Louis, I have plenty of things to say about the "circumstances" surrounding these incidents. I even went to a high school which bussed in a lot of inner city kids for better education opportunities. Like I said, the "circumstances" surrounding most of the violence in this town are well... yeah. Anyone who didn't grow up around this or witness the areas first hand really has no clue. Certain "communities" and/or "groups" really have no one to blame but themselves.

Are you talking about Nelly?
 

Proprioceptive

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2006
1,630
10
81
But that's not politically correct, so we will ignore the problem and let it fester.

I dabble in the field of GIS, and in college, a lot of students tried to tackle some of these issues, relating them to politics, income, education etc... every freaking time a student would reveal a study, particularly dealing with ethno-geographic concerns, it was like a collective facepalm throughout the audience. I've seen and grown up on both sides of the argument. I've seen enough to be realistic and not PC.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
66,704
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aao.gif
 

Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,986
1,388
126
Growing up in St. Louis, I have plenty of things to say about the "circumstances" surrounding these incidents. I even went to a high school which bussed in a lot of inner city kids for better education opportunities. Like I said, the "circumstances" surrounding most of the violence in this town are well... yeah. Anyone who didn't grow up around this or witness the areas first hand really has no clue. Certain "communities" and/or "groups" really have no one to blame but themselves.

Agree totally with the last statement. Self-inflicted problems =! caused by racism/racist(s).

Edit: Four more are dead due to murder-sucide today = http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/13/us/missouri-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
 
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BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
26,376
1,885
126
I know there has to be some common thread to all these ultra violent cities (St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, Camden etc). They probably have loose gun laws that allow all the criminals to get armed. I'm sure they are all full of tea party supporters and run by evil GOP'ers ;)

They are all cities with a disproportionate number of poor people. This is because many of the industries which grew, and caused the cities to grow with them abandoned the US and relocated off shore due to cost savings.

The end result is huge unemployed populations who feel as though their economic situation is hopeless and they turn to crime initially to survive and then make a lifestyle of it.

It is very sad.

Detroit, Chicago, and St Louis at least, were all huge manufacturing centers for durable and consumer goods. Now, most of the consumer goods manufacturing is gone, and that what remains doesn't pay as well as in the 50s and 60s when these cities were growing to accommodate the industries.
 

Proprioceptive

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2006
1,630
10
81
Agree totally with the last statement. Self-inflicted problems =! caused by racism/racist(s).

Countless students would be bussed in to our high school for a better education and our faculty did a great job teaching them personal responsibility and taking pride in your accomplishments. They would be encouraged to bring this attitude home with them, but inevitably the rest of their community would look down on them. They would regularly come to school with stories of ridicule, hate, and we even had a few that were shot because of this. It's ridiculous and a self-inflicted way of life. It's sad, really.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,599
90
91
www.bing.com
I dabble in the field of GIS, and in college, a lot of students tried to tackle some of these issues, relating them to politics, income, education etc... every freaking time a student would reveal a study, particularly dealing with ethno-geographic concerns, it was like a collective facepalm throughout the audience. I've seen and grown up on both sides of the argument. I've seen enough to be realistic and not PC.

I dated a girl in college who was working on a masters thesis about educational opportunities for kids. She wanted to point the finger at some systemic problem or a lack of funding. She did some pretty awesome research. The problem is her research kept leading her to conclusions that were not going to be received well. She kept changing her approach, but kept disliking where it as going. She eventually changed her topic to avoid ruffling any feathers. I truly believe talented and passionate people like her could really fix some issues, were they not encumbered with the near certain career suicide once they crossed the PC line.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,599
90
91
www.bing.com
They are all cities with a disproportionate number of poor people. This is because many of the industries which grew, and caused the cities to grow with them abandoned the US and relocated off shore due to cost savings.

The end result is huge unemployed populations who feel as though their economic situation is hopeless and they turn to crime initially to survive and then make a lifestyle of it.

It is very sad.

Detroit, Chicago, and St Louis at least, were all huge manufacturing centers for durable and consumer goods. Now, most of the consumer goods manufacturing is gone, and that what remains doesn't pay as well as in the 50s and 60s when these cities were growing to accommodate the industries.

^^ This is a PC answer.

Detroit was a festering shit hole of crime and dysfunction before the plants closed, so was Flint.
 

Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,986
1,388
126
Countless students would be bussed in to our high school for a better education and our faculty did a great job teaching them personal responsibility and taking pride in your accomplishments. They would be encouraged to bring this attitude home with them, but inevitably the rest of their community would look down on them. They would regularly come to school with stories of ridicule, hate, and we even had a few that were shot because of this. It's ridiculous and a self-inflicted way of life. It's sad, really.

Those students would be labeled as "uncle Tom, acting white, sold out, cornball, not keep it real, <fill in the blank nasty words/descriptions>. Then they wonder why certain group sucked horrible in school. :rolleyes:
 

JMapleton

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 2008
4,179
2
81
They are all cities with a disproportionate number of poor people. This is because many of the industries which grew, and caused the cities to grow with them abandoned the US and relocated off shore due to cost savings.

The end result is huge unemployed populations who feel as though their economic situation is hopeless and they turn to crime initially to survive and then make a lifestyle of it.

It is very sad.

Detroit, Chicago, and St Louis at least, were all huge manufacturing centers for durable and consumer goods. Now, most of the consumer goods manufacturing is gone, and that what remains doesn't pay as well as in the 50s and 60s when these cities were growing to accommodate the industries.

To an extent you are correct. But crime was a problem in these communities long before the manufacturing base collapsed. It's a cultural issue. There is a culture of ignorance, rebellion, apathy, and an adoration of criminals.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
17,082
136
I dated a girl in college who was working on a masters thesis about educational opportunities for kids. She wanted to point the finger at some systemic problem or a lack of funding. She did some pretty awesome research. The problem is her research kept leading her to conclusions that were not going to be received well. She kept changing her approach, but kept disliking where it as going. She eventually changed her topic to avoid ruffling any feathers. I truly believe talented and passionate people like her could really fix some issues, were they not encumbered with the near certain career suicide once they crossed the PC line.

Is her work published?

Seriously I wanna see it.
 

Murloc

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2008
5,382
65
91
maybe the problem is the racism against whites. So anything that is linked to crackas is to be avoided, so getting an education is bad and the cycle of poverty and crime continues (they started out poor and uneducated and force themselves to stay that way, culturally).
 
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