'Straight pride' group removes Brad Pitt as mascot after actor complains

[WelshBloke]

Bigot.

I mean I'd love to be proved wrong there, I like a parade, but we all know its going to be a dozen badly dressed guys looking slightly sheepish hoping that no one recognises them.

 

[nakedfrog]

I think we've drifted away from the thrust of the discussion, but in a poignant way. We have Pride parades because of sentiments like being thought of as "mentally ill". They said literally the exact same thing about gays for quite some time.
No one says cisgender straight people are mentally ill for being straight and/or cisgender. It simply is who they are, and it's accepted.
People do still actively shame/degrade non-cisgender/non-straight people.

 

[Ichinisan]

But what do you mean by 'mentally ill'? What actually follows from putting someone in that category? If one put 'conservatives' in that category, would that be wrong?

I'm honestly not clear what the definition of 'mental illness' is. There seems to be disagreement as to whether personality disorders fall into that group, with some psychologists appearing to say, from what I've seen, that they can be considered an illness if they find a treatment for them. Which seems, if I've gotten it right, a little self-serving. If they define 'illness' as 'something we can treat' they can then boast that there's no mental illness they can't treat!

I mention PDs because, er, there's a prominent example of the difficulty in knowing how to judge that condition in the news a lot at the moment.

To me, as a complete layperson, 'mental illness' seems a very tricky concept to pin down and perfectly define, and it seems reasonable to be very careful about who you stick that label on (cf Soviet psychiatry).

...

To me, as a complete layperson, 'mental illness' seems a very tricky concept to pin down and perfectly define, and it seems reasonable to be very careful about who you stick that label on (cf Soviet psychiatry).

Exactly. Some people with Asperger's syndrome (if you can even call it that anymore) don't think of themselves as "impaired," just "different." They often have many advantages due to the differences in their brains. It can still be studied and recognized and classified on a comparative spectrum. It shouldn't be denied.

 

[TheVrolok]

Do nothing about the horrific suicide rates, even among post-op trans people? "There's no problem. Nothing to see here. Don't even speculate or think about the problem or how we can help. Let these people die. They're fine."

I care about them too.

Those rates remain high because of ignorant regressive folk like you, not because of their transgenderism. See Perk's post.

 

[nakedfrog]

Exactly. Some people with Asperger's syndrome (if you can even call it that anymore) don't think of themselves as "impaired," just "different." They often have many advantages due to the differences in their brains. It can still be studied and recognized and classified on a comparative spectrum. It shouldn't be denied.

Do people tend to refer to them as being mentally ill? Interestingly enough, there does seem to be a higher incidence of being on the autism spectrum for transgender individuals.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Didn't Milo also champion the rape of little boys or something? I recall even the insane right wingers dropped him a few years back because he said something about raping children wasn't really that bad or should be a right of passage for them or some other fucked up shit. Not surprised they're back to trying to use him for the bullshit "look we don't hate gay people we've got a gay friend!"

 

[darkswordsman17]

Also, why you guys taking the trollbait from the dipshit trolls on here?

 

[Commodus]

Didn't Milo also champion the rape of little boys or something? I recall even the insane right wingers dropped him a few years back because he said something about raping children wasn't really that bad or should be a right of passage for them or some other fucked up shit. Not surprised they're back to trying to use him for the bullshit "look we don't hate gay people we've got a gay friend!"

It wasn't championing so much as it was the latter part, that he didn't see much of a problem with them going through it as a rite of passage. Apparently no one taught him that it's still skeevy as hell and not considered consensual.

 

[glenn1]

It sure as hell does if he continues to ignore the scientific indications that they are not mentally ill.

We don’t prosecute thoughtcrime in the U.S. so as long as he doesn’t discriminate against them in an illegal way who cares? Whether believing in flat earth theory or believing “trans folk have a mental illness” it makes zero difference if it doesn’t result in legal discrimination.

 

[Greenman]

the guardian is not the onion.

It's not the news outlet I'm talking about.

 

[Perknose]

We don’t prosecute thoughtcrime in the U.S. so as long as he doesn’t discriminate against them in an illegal way who cares? Whether believing in flat earth theory or believing “trans folk have a mental illness” it makes zero difference if it doesn’t result in legal discrimination.

Who cares? Every civilized human being should care.

Waddling around with the erroneous and bigoted idea that all trans people are mentally ill is analogous to waddling around thinking all black people are mentally inferior. Sure, it's not a crime. But it's is an ugly and ignorant attitude, hurtful to the group that person is erroneously bigoted against. When you make an entire group the lesser, it encourages the ugliest amongst us to treat them in ugly and demeaning ways.

Why do you think oppressed heterosexuals, somehow seemingly mostly white and male, want to march in Boston, eh?

 

[glenn1]

Who cares? Every civilized human being should care.

Waddling around with the erroneous and bigoted idea that all trans people are mentally ill is analogous to waddling around thinking all black people are mentally inferior. Sure, it's not a crime. But it's is an ugly and ignorant attitude, hurtful to the group that person is erroneously bigoted against. When you make an entire group the lesser, it encourages the ugliest amongst us to treat them in ugly and demeaning ways.

Why do you think oppressed heterosexuals, somehow seemingly mostly white and male, want to march in Boston, eh?

If folks cared about every erroneous and bigoted idea we’d have no time for anything else. I don’t go out looking for monsters to slay when those monsters aren’t actively hurting someone. The trans folk I know are hearty and resilient sorts who won’t be phased by the periodic random neckbeard who says “hur dur mental illness.” Those types aren’t normally the ones killing trans folks.

 

[dawp]

It's not the news outlet I'm talking about.

they maybe trolling but sarcasm it is not.

 

[Paladin3]

I’m fine with trans people too, its not something that should be pushed onto kids though.

I agree that overzealous parents raising their child as transgendered while still a toddler is wrong. It's done by a sick parent who wants attention, similar to Munchhausen syndrome.

But that almost never happens and is used as an excuse to imply that sexuality and gender identity is a choice or that we somehow have to protect ourselves from the transgendered. Sexuality is as ingrained in someone on the DNA level as your own heterosexuality is. Just like some folks are left handed.

You've got to get over being weirded out by non-hetro sex. And stop using protecting children as an excuse for being so.

 

[Paladin3]

We don’t prosecute thoughtcrime in the U.S. so as long as he doesn’t discriminate against them in an illegal way who cares? Whether believing in flat earth theory or believing “trans folk have a mental illness” it makes zero difference if it doesn’t result in legal discrimination.

We may not be able to police thoughts, but we absolutely should not tolerate any expression of hate speech or discrimination. If you can't at least be decent to others then you better keep it to yourself.

Thousands of people read these forums who never participate. Condoning hateful, archaic ideas is tantamount to loading the gun for some wacko to take things to the next violent step.

 

[theeedude]

Milo was the straightest guy the right could field.

 

[Juiblex]

I'd go to a straight pride parade if one was within an hour of me.

 

[Greenman]

Who cares? Every civilized human being should care.

Waddling around with the erroneous and bigoted idea that all trans people are mentally ill is analogous to waddling around thinking all black people are mentally inferior. Sure, it's not a crime. But it's is an ugly and ignorant attitude, hurtful to the group that person is erroneously bigoted against. When you make an entire group the lesser, it encourages the ugliest amongst us to treat them in ugly and demeaning ways.

Why do you think oppressed heterosexuals, somehow seemingly mostly white and male, want to march in Boston, eh?

No one should be demeaned or treated badly because of a mental health issue. But that doesn't mean a mental health issue should be ignored because it's trendy.

 

[feralkid]

No one should be demeaned or treated badly because of a mental health issue. But that doesn't mean a mental health issue should be ignored because it's trendy.

You can't possibly be serious.


Oh, wait...

 

[UglyCasanova]

We may not be able to police thoughts, but we absolutely should not tolerate any expression of hate speech or discrimination. If you can't at least be decent to others then you better keep it to yourself.

Thousands of people read these forums who never participate. Condoning hateful, archaic ideas is tantamount to loading the gun for some wacko to take things to the next violent step.

Im not sure anyone on here has expressed hate, what post are you referring to?

 

[Paladin3]

Im not sure anyone on here has expressed hate, what post are you referring to?

I'm referring to the ignorant idea that casual discrimination should be tolerated so long as it doesn't escalate to illegal discrimination "because we're not thought-police." How do you think bigots are emboldened if not by good people keeping silent?

If we apply social pressure against discrimination before it rises to the level of illegality in an attempt to enlighten and change minds it's a win-win for us all. If we wait until someone is fired, housing denied or a trigger is pulled then we've all lost. And positive social change needs to start with us adjusting our collective mindset.

Don't get me wrong. I understand comedy and freedom of speech and the dangers of being overly politically correct. I can take a joke as well as anyone, but allowing the idea that trans folks are mentally ill and other such ignorance to stand is dangerous.

 

[UglyCasanova]

The idea that trans folk have a mental illness isn’t hateful any more than saying anyone else with a mental illness is mentally ill is hateful. I’m depressed, if you call me that it doesn’t mean you hate me.

 

[Commodus]

The idea that trans folk have a mental illness isn’t hateful any more than saying anyone else with a mental illness is mentally ill is hateful. I’m depressed, if you call me that it doesn’t mean you hate me.

Yes, it is.

It's saying that the very core of their identity is something broken. It also suggests that their identity is something they should try to overcome, not embrace. If you told this to a trans person, they would rightly kick your cowardly, clueless ass.

 

[Paladin3]

No one should be demeaned or treated badly because of a mental health issue. But that doesn't mean a mental health issue should be ignored because it's trendy.

And folks accuse me of using the strawman argument. It's not a mental illness! There is nothing wrong with being gay or trans except for the discrimination you will face from ignorant members of society.

Thick skull, meet the truth.

 

[brycejones]

The idea that trans folk have a mental illness isn’t hateful any more than saying anyone else with a mental illness is mentally ill is hateful. I’m depressed, if you call me that it doesn’t mean you hate me.

Well you know except for depression actually being defined as a mental illness and being trans is not defined as a mental illness. So either you're bigoted or just willfully ignorant. Choose 1.