Stop Blaming Bush for Enron

[Mrburns2007]

I see that the Democrats are making a sad attempt at blaming Bush for the Enron failure. It's a really lame attempt and so far there's nothing that will implict the President in any wrong doing.

Ken Lay talk to some people at the treasury to try and fix there credit rating or something but that was turned down and rightly so.

I would probably blame both bad management and lying about there losses. Ken Lay and company were selling a billion in the stocks that they owned while the workers couldn't sell theirs. That doesn't seem right to me but from what I've heard you shouldn't invest more then 10-15% in your own company to ensure that you don't lose your nest egg if it collaspes.

It would appear that there accounting firm did some illegal things though by destroying important documents. I bet those guys are sweating bullets right now.

BTW: did anybody see Joseph Biden on Meet the Press ?

 

[Lucky]

that the democrats, namely lieberman, are attacking the administration by saying that they should have "bailed out" enron when they learned of its impending failure is BS. The democrats are trying to get the "good guy" image to the folks that got screwed, trying to make the bush admin. seem heartless that they didnt do anything

bullsh*t. Its capitalism, just as the treasure (?) secretary said to CNN. The gov't should not bail out every company that fails, nor should it even try and set that precedent for other companies to follow.

goddamm democrats and their partisan crap. :| Im all for an independent and strict investigation of everyone, including the white house, but we should NOT have bailed them out.


BTW, I wouldnt be surprised if anderson didnt come out of this scandal alive. Their internal memos directed the destruction of key documents, and thats just not good for an audit company. Im looking forward to seeing who is arrested.

 

[flavio]

There's some definate sleaze that needs looked into...you think everyone should just close their eyes?

I'd say a serious investigation is in order.

 

[Mrburns2007]

If Enron was serious about a bail out they should have made a formal request like chysler did to get a loan from the government. They didn't and wouldn't because of all the possibly illegal things that they were doing.

They opened there golden parachutes and jumped ship leaving all the workers lock in steerage.

But that's still not Bush's fault....

 

[xyyz]

agreed... the management of Enron did this... not the president.

 

[tcsenter]

Ah, this cuts both ways. If its too early to be blaming Bush or members of his administration for anything, then its too early to be defending Bush or any member of his administration. Let's allow Congress, the Justice Department, the SEC, and the Labor Department do their investigations, and let the chips fall where they may.

It is a bit disturbing that the Bush family seems to have ties, whether indirect or not, to virtually every major financial, banking or utilities scandal in the last quarter century. You name it, they have ties to it; Keating's savings and loan, BCCI, junk bond fraud, utility or power misdealings, etc.

Its not enough for such a prominent and influencial political family to avoid the actuality of impropriety, its also important to avoid the appearance of impropriety. If the Bush family cannot avoid becoming good friends or business associates with scoundrels and liars whose frauds and schemes have cost the tax-payers BILLIONS (with a capital B), maybe they should just stay home and keep to themselves?

On Edit: I do hope to see the investigation headed-up by someone with the ferocious attack-dog investigatory character of Ken Starr. If a freaking blow-job deserves that kind of investigation, then surely a scandal that cost thousands of Americans their life-savings deserves one ten times as vigorous.

 

[flavio]

<< If its too early to be blaming Bush or members of his administration for anything, then its too early to be defending Bush or any member of his administration. >>



Exactly

 

[SuperTool]

We need to get to the bottom of this.

 

[Mrburns2007]

<< It is a bit disturbing that the Bush family seems to have ties, whether indirect or not, to virtually every major financial, banking or utilities scandal in the last quarter century. You name it, they have ties to it; Keating's savings and loan, BCCI, junk bond fraud, utility or power misdealings, etc. >>



Clinton new allot of crooks as well, most of the people around Clinton went to prison for one scheme or another. The fact that the Bush and his father knew people with financial dealings is not a big deal. There's always some crime when power and money meet.

 

[Jejunum]

hes to stuipd to be responsible anyways

i wont blame bush for anything just cauze hes so dumb...i blame his corrupt helperz

 

[Random Variable]

The Clinton administration received money from Enron, too.

 

[Czar]

I cant see any link from Enron to Bush, the only links are to Cheney(sp?) and two other members of the cabinet who knew about it months before the fiasco started. But I´m not sure how they are guilty because of that

I also read on the local teletext that Enron had been giving money to about 3/4 members of US congress. Is that true?

 

[UltraQuiet]

<< I also read on the local teletext that Enron had been giving money to about 3/4 members of US congress. Is that true? >>


It appears to be true. Nothing unusual about it, though. Like most big companies, they gave a lot of money to different politicians to hedge their bets, so to speak. Just another argument for the campaign finance reform that is needed in this country, IMHO. Hoperfully this thing can be investigated without it turning into a big fiasco. I personally think I have a better chance of seeing God than that happening though.

 

[Czar]

<<

<< I also read on the local teletext that Enron had been giving money to about 3/4 members of US congress. Is that true? >>


It appears to be true. Nothing unusual about it, though. Like most big companies, they gave a lot of money to different politicians to hedge their bets, so to speak. Just another argument for the campaign finance reform that is needed in this country, IMHO. Hoperfully this thing can be investigated without it turning into a big fiasco. I personally think I have a better chance of seeing God than that happening though. >>


Then it sucks to be a congress member now, a big paycheck is missing

 

[charrison]

czar,

it is shame cheney sold most of hist stock before entering office.....

 

[UltraQuiet]

<< it is shame cheney sold most of hist stock before entering office..... >>


Aren't the elected officials and some of the appointed ones required to set up blind trusts before they take office? I thought I had read that somewhere or heard it from someone but I haven't been able to find it. I'm sure the media wouldn't report it, it wouldn't make for nearly as much news.

 

[ToBeMe]

I was reading a bit on this yesterday.............I think it's funny that at first some Dem. Congressmen were pointing the finger at Bush and saying this would be much worse than Whitewater and much more damning, and now, since more info has come forward about Enron's "gifts" they've all changed their tunes to "You should've come to us, we would have helped you out!".

So basicly, by reports, we've got Enron getting the "cold shoulder" from Bush and the Rep. Whitehouse.........and the Dem.'s saying we would have helped you!:Q Dem.'s wanting to help "Big Business" and Rep.'s turning a cold shoulder to them..........strange times these are...........

 

[UltraQuiet]

<< strange times these are >>


It's called "election year".

 

[jjones]

<<
I think it's funny that at first some Dem. Congressmen were pointing the finger at Bush and saying this would be much worse than Whitewater and much more damning, and now, since more info has come forward about Enron's "gifts" they've all changed their tunes to "You should've come to us, we would have helped you out!".
>>


Politicos changing direction on a dime. I wish my car handled like that.

 

[2minkey]

why not investigate the hell out of enron? is ken starr looking for a job these days, or is he too busy modeling spring wear for neo-nazi groups in idaho?

 

[shazbot]

The bailout woulda saved the employees of enron from losing their entirement retirement fund. Just some food for thought. If I were them, I'd be asking to stone the ceo. As far as the whole incident goes, it kinda puts a big dent into bush's laissez-faire approach to big business.

 

[etech]

Consider this, Enron grew to a large and apparently corrupt corporation under the Clinton administration, that corrupt business failed under the Bush administration.

At which time would wrong doing have been more likely to occur?

 

[shazbot]

<< Consider this, Enron grew to a large and apparently corrupt corporation under the Clinton administration, that corrupt business failed under the Bush administration.

At which time would wrong doing have been more likely to occur? >>



I wasn't aware that an administration had control/oversight over a large corporation. If you want to blame someone, blame enron management & the auditing firm Anderson. Either Anderson & co. were _really_ stupid, or they just turned a blind eye. I'm leaning towards the latter =\

 

[glenn1]

Blaming Bush for the failure of Enron because he has financial ties to and used to be executive in the petroleum industry, makes about as much sense as blaming Al Gore for a dot.com company going belly up because he owns shares of stock in Cisco and, as we all know, created the internet.

Let the Enron debacle be investigated, and the chips fall where they may. I doubt that President Bush (or any other political figure for that matter) will be shown to have committed wrongdoing. I think there will be enough of that to go around for Enron executives and the CPA firm who was supposed to be auditing them.

 

[Akaz1976]

I think most politicians are doing the american public a disservice by trying to make this into a partisian political issue (it has political links but i doubt they are any deeper than any other big business out there).

The real issue here is lack of regulation/laws governing conflict of interest among big businesses top management. The big 5 auditing firms not only audit (to check valitdity and integrity) the financial statements of the big corporations but they also get lucrative consulting contracts (this is where the real money is made). One can only imagine how 'deligent' the big 5 are when they know they will be bidding to get contracts from the same client.

3 biggest conflict of interests in the current business world are:

1. Allowing auditing firms to do other business with the same client.
2. Allowing banks (with corporate and investment depts) to own brokerage houses (or vice versa)
3. Allowing people with conflict of interest on board of big businesses.

I believe 2 of the above 3 were an issue in Enron failure. (dont remember which members of Enron's board had conflict of interest but i remember reading an article about it a while back)

Akaz