Star Citizen: Chris Robert`s new space sim (the Wing Commander guy)

[Sabrewings]

True they have the same amount of thrusters, but the SH and Sabre have TR2 MAVs while the Gladius has only TR1s. So, the SH and Sabre have similar maneuvering power, but the Sabre is 22% lighter than the SH.

 

[Stringjam]

Are there many ships faster than the Avenger? It seems pretty quick. 1450mps at cruise.

Cruise speeds are a little wacky right now, and I expect the Avenger to be pulled back here quite a bit.

Right now it's faster at cruise than both the M50 and 350R.

 

[Stringjam]

True they have the same amount of thrusters, but the SH and Sabre have TR2 MAVs while the Gladius has only TR1s. So, the SH and Sabre have similar maneuvering power, but the Sabre is 22% lighter than the SH.

That's true. But I also feel like the mass is off on the Gladius. The Mustang Delta is only 13,000 kg - so that almost makes it sound like the Gladius is a bit overweight given its size. We know it doesn't have a lot of armor, so that shouldn't account for it.

The Sabre will also be carrying the extra weight of 4 big guns compared to the little S2s on the Gladius.

It will be interesting to see where they all end up. I would just like to see ships retain the strengths they were sold with.

If the Sabre obsoletes the Gladius, then that's sad for all the work that went into modeling, designing, and building a role for that ship. Right now, the Sabre destroys its DPS, and will likely be just as fast. The only leg the Gladius has left to stand on is its handling. It needs to be able to move again.

 

[Sabrewings]

If the Sabre obsoletes the Gladius, then that's sad for all the work that went into modeling, designing, and building a role for that ship. Right now, the Sabre destroys its DPS, and will likely be just as fast. The only leg the Gladius has left to stand on is its handling. It needs to be able to move again.

I don't think the Sabre could obsolete the Gladius. The Gladius has one thing going for it that the Sabre doesn't have. Cost. The Gladius is an older design that is much cheaper to produce and the Sabre is a state of the art next gen fighter with advanced materials and hardware. Their PU costs will be very dissimilar, and in the grand scale of the universe the Gladius will stay quite common.

 

[Stringjam]

I don't think the Sabre could obsolete the Gladius. The Gladius has one thing going for it that the Sabre doesn't have. Cost. The Gladius is an older design that is much cheaper to produce and the Sabre is a state of the art next gen fighter with advanced materials and hardware. Their PU costs will be very dissimilar, and in the grand scale of the universe the Gladius will stay quite common.

That could definitely factor into it.

I think one advantage that the Gladius will retain is its size. It's definitely not an easy ship to hit when it's moving.

The Sabre, based on what I've seen in my hangar, has a lot of surface area to target top and bottom. This is what makes Hornets so easy to hit, and I have a feeling the same will be said for the Sabre.

We'll soon find out as soon as the Sabre hits BR and gets run through the mill, because I have a feeling a LOT of guys will be flying it.

 

[Worthington]

Anyone following this thread that isn't already a member of the AT Ballers Org? Just making sure we haven't missed anyone.

 

[TechBoyJK]

True they have the same amount of thrusters, but the SH and Sabre have TR2 MAVs while the Gladius has only TR1s. So, the SH and Sabre have similar maneuvering power, but the Sabre is 22% lighter than the SH.

Showing some ignorance here, but are these thrusters based on anything in real life? Or are the names (TR2 MAV and TR1, etc) just straight fiction?

 

[rivethead]

We'll soon find out as soon as the Sabre hits BR and gets run through the mill, because I have a feeling a LOT of guys will be flying it.

BR doesn't really allow the Sabre to be good at what it's supposed to be designed for: stealth alpha strike.

A bunch of players are going to use it in BR because it's the new toy but BR isn't really the best test bed for balancing that ship.

I hope CIG keep that in mind.

 

[Sabrewings]

Showing some ignorance here, but are these thrusters based on anything in real life? Or are the names (TR2 MAV and TR1, etc) just straight fiction?

TR1, TR2, etc stands for "thrust rating" or how powerful it is. Actually, instead of power it's more of a size measurement for the port it fills. You can find higher quality thrusters that fit the same port but offer more thrust, they're just going to be more expensive.

MAV is short for maneuvering thrusters.

 

[TechBoyJK]

TR1, TR2, etc stands for "thrust rating" or how powerful it is. Actually, instead of power it's more of a size measurement for the port it fills. You can find higher quality thrusters that fit the same port but offer more thrust, they're just going to be more expensive.

MAV is short for maneuvering thrusters.

Thanks! Makes perfect sense.

 

[Stringjam]

BR doesn't really allow the Sabre to be good at what it's supposed to be designed for: stealth alpha strike.

A bunch of players are going to use it in BR because it's the new toy but BR isn't really the best test bed for balancing that ship.

I hope CIG keep that in mind.

You're right, it's not the best test bed. I think certain things could be done to make BR a much better place. And since stealth isn't a thing yet, the benefits of that can't be judged at the moment.

That said, I still see value in the testing that will happen there, because it will be flown by a variety of different pilots (stick / mouse / gimblers / locked guns / boom 'n zoomers / knife fighters, etc). The strengths and weaknesses of the ship will start to show when used a certain way. As long as that information is evaluated in the context of the fish bowl, I think CIG will still benefit from the testing.

I would like to see some improvement to BR, mainly in the form of a larger map - - I would love a bigger Dying Star. I would also be totally fine if they dropped the public leaderboard. More people would experiment instead of meta-loading, which is the the whole point of testing right now.

I would also like to have an open-play mode instead of timed matches. The competitive public match environment of BR right now is too intimidating for new players -- some sort of matchmaking option to allow newer pilots to fly on servers without ace pilots shredding them for points every 5 seconds would be very helpful, and would encourage more people to play.

 

[TechBoyJK]

BR?

 

[Stringjam]

BR?

"Battle Royale."

Basically a dogfighting deathmatch mode in Arena Commander.

 

[rivethead]

You're right, it's not the best test bed. I think certain things could be done to make BR a much better place. And since stealth isn't a thing yet, the benefits of that can't be judged at the moment.

That said, I still see value in the testing that will happen there, because it will be flown by a variety of different pilots (stick / mouse / gimblers / locked guns / boom 'n zoomers / knife fighters, etc). The strengths and weaknesses of the ship will start to show when used a certain way. As long as that information is evaluated in the context of the fish bowl, I think CIG will still benefit from the testing.

I would like to see some improvement to BR, mainly in the form of a larger map - - I would love a bigger Dying Star. I would also be totally fine if they dropped the public leaderboard. More people would experiment instead of meta-loading, which is the the whole point of testing right now.

I would also like to have an open-play mode instead of timed matches. The competitive public match environment of BR right now is too intimidating for new players -- some sort of matchmaking option to allow newer pilots to fly on servers without ace pilots shredding them for points every 5 seconds would be very helpful, and would encourage more people to play.

Completely agree. The fact you can opt out of leaderboards pretty much makes leaderboards worthless (it's not a complete data set!). But people are still enamored with them and their position on them.

 

[Sabrewings]

I would also like to have an open-play mode instead of timed matches. The competitive public match environment of BR right now is too intimidating for new players -- some sort of matchmaking option to allow newer pilots to fly on servers without ace pilots shredding them for points every 5 seconds would be very helpful, and would encourage more people to play.

A better match making system based off an Elo rating is in work. Sean Tracy talked about it briefly on RtV, though he didn't have much info on it as it's not really under his scope.

 

[Stringjam]

Completely agree. The fact you can opt out of leaderboards pretty much makes leaderboards worthless (it's not a complete data set!). But people are still enamored with them and their position on them.

Exactly. I think public leaderboards are detrimental to getting good testing out of these alpha builds. They discourage new players and encourage top players to play in a way that only accomplishes high scoring and rank increases (playing the board).

CIG can still get any data and trends they want from the matches without them.

I still think the AC modules are worth keeping and improving. The PU is what this game is all about, but it isn't the kind of place where you can engage in fun competitive matches. When this goes release you're going to play in a way that preserves your life and your ship.

AC (and eventually Star Marine) will give us a place to go where we can jump straight into dogfighting, racing, or FPS action without fear of equipment and life loss. You can experiment, practice, and learn new approaches, and when they fail, you spawn right back into the action.

 

[Stringjam]

So for those into the SC lore, just ran across this fan-made site that timelines and links to the various Time Capsule, Galactic Guides, and Spectrum Dispatch articles on the RSI site, all in a nice, organized chronological timeline (nice interface, btw).


http://citizen-history.com/#0

 

[Sabrewings]

Watch AtV yet, String? Good discussion with the flight model team. Sounds like they're quite aware of the nerf that happened with IFCS 2.0. I was really hoping to hear something that alludes to why the Connie is so slow, but nothing that stood out to me.

 

[Stringjam]

Watch AtV yet, String? Good discussion with the flight model team. Sounds like they're quite aware of the nerf that happened with IFCS 2.0. I was really hoping to hear something that alludes to why the Connie is so slow, but nothing that stood out to me.

Just got done watching. I'm optimistic after hearing the conversation that maneuverability is going to make a return. Calix made several comments about taking another pass at acceleration and thruster jerk values.

Hopefully the next pass will do a lot to fix some of the more maligned ships. Not sure about the Connie though, since they didn't mention any specific ships. I know it was a lot better in the first 2.0 than it is now!

 

[Sabrewings]

Yeah, it was a pretty positive exchange. I wish it could be a RtV style event where questions are asked, but still good info.

 

[Stringjam]

So, I've played almost no BR since 1.3. Had a baby, got busy, whatnot.

Decided to jump back in again tonight and give it a shot. Started out great...had a few beers and loaded up the M50. 🙂

Then the aces showed up and took me to school. 😀

Ah well, I had a blast getting blown up. This game is so much fun, and it offers you so many different ways to have it.

There's going to be dogfighting and FPS, and then there's going to be non-combat roles like mining and cargo hauling. Whether you want to fight or just carve out your stake in a mineral-rich asteroid, I think this game is going to have something for everyone.

In the end, I'm hoping the exploration mechanic is really fleshed out. I want to look for dangerous anomalies, undiscovered species, and take a crew out into deep-space, looking for whatever unknown might be out there.

It's that stuff that I'm really looking forward to the most. As much as I love darting around in a dogfight, what I'm really looking forward to is loading up the Freelancer with a full hold, putting her on cruise control, and kicking back with a drink to enjoy the ride to the next system. Land on the dock and maybe slip into the local bar to drop some dancing emotes. 😉

No doubt CIG has a lot of work ahead of them to make all this happen. If I have to wait a year, two years, that's fine. I think it will be worth the wait.

 

[rivethead]

Well it's official now: Star Citizen and Squadron 42 are splitting into separate products on 2/14 (I swear CIG have a twisted sense of humor...splitting on Valentines Day, fish in our hangars on 4/1 last year......)

It'll be interesting to see how this changes their approach to fundraising.

For anyone remotely interested in this project, I think now is the time to back. The cost of entry could double on 2/14.

 

[rivethead]

Stringjam - first congrats on the baby! Second - congrats on the first round victory!

Looking at the scoreboard for the second round....how in the heck does someone earn 672 REC for not a single kill (nor getting killed themselves)? Did they immediately go hide in an asteroid or something? Not a single point. Seems like a way to farm REC......

Coincidentally, I also hadn't done a Spectrum match since 1.3 but raced a few times in Old Vanderval two nights ago. I was in an Aurora so expectations were to come in last. I did. In fact, I never cleanly cleared the second ring. There is just too much drift and not enough boost in the Aurora. I was/am shocked at how much. In 1.3 racing was all about pedal to the metal and using boost and rolls through turns. Not any more.

 

[Stringjam]

Stringjam - first congrats on the baby! Second - congrats on the first round victory!

Looking at the scoreboard for the second round....how in the heck does someone earn 672 REC for not a single kill (nor getting killed themselves)? Did they immediately go hide in an asteroid or something? Not a single point. Seems like a way to farm REC......

Coincidentally, I also hadn't done a Spectrum match since 1.3 but raced a few times in Old Vanderval two nights ago. I was in an Aurora so expectations were to come in last. I did. In fact, I never cleanly cleared the second ring. There is just too much drift and not enough boost in the Aurora. I was/am shocked at how much. In 1.3 racing was all about pedal to the metal and using boost and rolls through turns. Not any more.

Thanks. The baby has kept me pretty busy the past few months, so my SC time has been a bit limited (she's a lot of fun though - - likes to watch me kill Vanduuls. 😉 )

I think what happened with that guy is that he dropped into the match right at the very end. This has happened to me a few times as well. It would probably be helpful if they would block match joins during the last 2 minutes so you don't waste all that time joining a match that's just going to end immediately.

A lot of ships are drifting like mad right now (as you noticed). I'm hoping the next big patch release (2.2) takes care of a lot of the flight issues. I think a lot of it has to do with the thruster ramp-up / ramp-down. There's just too much delay right now on certain ships, and it makes it feel like you're flying with a bunch of lag.

 

[rivethead]

This is from Z7...one of the best racers in SC:

"Racing in its current state is pretty broken. There are a whole bunch of bugs going around and the ships themselves are quite hard to control. I've been racing for the past 9 months and I've enjoyed it all even though it might get a little monotonous with the same 3 tracks. I've seen the flight model change multiple times and this is, without a doubt, one of the hardest ones. The ships drift a whole lot more than they used to (which is good to a degree but some of the ships drift to an extreme). "

So it wasn't just me being bad/rusty...... 🙂