Star Citizen: Chris Robert`s new space sim (the Wing Commander guy)

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SLU Aequitas

Golden Member
Jul 13, 2007
1,252
26
91
So...what does that leaper jump engine do? Smexy thang, buying the super since I already had the Colonel package.

EDIT: Oh, so we basically get a ship that comes with a jump engine pre-fitted for us. Cool beans.
 
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Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,039
431
126
I think all ships have a jump engine. They simply are pretty certain that the Super Hornet has that specific one.
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
So...what does that leaper jump engine do? Smexy thang, buying the super since I already had the Colonel package.

EDIT: Oh, so we basically get a ship that comes with a jump engine pre-fitted for us. Cool beans.

Note that if you are upgrading from Colonel package, you won't see the super-hornet in your hanger yet. You have to wait for some sort of upgrade-recognition patch.
 

IEC

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Jun 10, 2004
14,330
4,918
136
Super Hornet is the one to get with LTI:
1) Beefy stock weapons loadout that will be replaced for free under LTI if you get blown up
2) Max powerplant size 4 vs 3 for all other hornet variants
3) Includes jump drive
4) Includes slightly better stock weapons
5) Includes turret module
6) Better TR3 thruster than other Hornets
7) Second seat for turret gunner/commander/radar guy/holding cell for bounty targets/etc

Cons:
At $165 (Digital Colonel LTI $110 + Super Hornet Upgrade $55) you are getting close to the cost of a Constellation, which is more versatile. Still, the Super Hornet with LTI will be hard to beat for those of us expecting to be heavily involved in warfare...
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
I currently have an Aurora LN, Retaliator, and Freelancer.

I'm thinking about melting the Aurora and getting a Superhornet. That way I have a Trader/Explorer (Freelancer), Dogfighter (Superhornet), and Heavy Gunboad (Retalitor). That should cover all bases.

Not sure if I should keep the LN though just to have an inexpensive craft to do thing in (particularly when I first start the game and am learning).
 

Nintendesert

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2010
7,761
5
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I'm still really debating melting my Aurora LN for a Freelancer... I wish we could walk around the ships in the hangar before we bought them.
 

SithSolo1

Diamond Member
Mar 19, 2001
7,740
11
81
Cons:
At $165 (Digital Colonel LTI $110 + Super Hornet Upgrade $55) you are getting close to the cost of a Constellation, which is more versatile. Still, the Super Hornet with LTI will be hard to beat for those of us expecting to be heavily involved in warfare...

The Constellation may be more versatile but it requires more people(human/npc) to fully function and costs around $100 more which isn't a small amount for most people.

I really want a Super-hornet but I don't want to spend much more on this outside of variants for my current ships. I'm already pushing $500. :eek:
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,039
431
126
I have to say, if you have a hornet already or if you have the 325, you need to really consider the super hornet. As was said above, it's stock loadout is really good. Meaning that out of the box, the ship is by far the best stock fighter available. This means that if you lose it, you are not out of any in-game cash, and you don't need to even repurchase insurance (assuming you get the LTI now). It will probably be the one ship used for all those suicide missions or the "lets just go blow crap up" type things that people will do.

It also will be one of the best fighters outside of military hardware if you decide to upgrade it.
 

AHamick

Senior member
Nov 3, 2008
252
3
81
Hmm.... melt my Aurora LN and buy the Super Hornet, or purchase a quality Joystick/throttle for this game.... I hate being poor
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,039
431
126
I was debating the joystick thing myself until I noticed in one of the Wingman's Hanger updates that there were lots of Xbox PC controllers around in the background, which means they are all testing using those. It lacks a good throttle, but they may have used one set of the triggers to do it.

The other thing to consider is that they were also working with that kickstarted motion controller (I forget the name, but it is essentially a bar that you hold in your hand).
 

Kev

Lifer
Dec 17, 2001
16,367
4
81
I read that CGI is partnering with a hardware vendor to build a HOTAS specific for Star Citizen. The spaceflight in this game is going to be different from most flight sims, so a standard throttle and stick isn't going to be ideal.
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,039
431
126
I read that CGI is partnering with a hardware vendor to build a HOTAS specific for Star Citizen. The spaceflight in this game is going to be different from most flight sims, so a standard throttle and stick isn't going to be ideal.

I do agree to a point. I think the ideal config is an Oculus type device for the display (since it will simply track head movement very well, at least in cockpit). I know for the FPS parts, I don't think anything will top keyboard/mouse, but for flying, some kind of joystick/control pad will be best.
 

vshah

Lifer
Sep 20, 2003
19,003
24
81
I read that CGI is partnering with a hardware vendor to build a HOTAS specific for Star Citizen. The spaceflight in this game is going to be different from most flight sims, so a standard throttle and stick isn't going to be ideal.

different how? proper physics/inertia?
 

callaway86

Member
Jun 19, 2010
53
0
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I read that CGI is partnering with a hardware vendor to build a HOTAS specific for Star Citizen. The spaceflight in this game is going to be different from most flight sims, so a standard throttle and stick isn't going to be ideal.

Based on CR's explanation of the flight computer and the fact that he personally uses a 360 controller, I doubt SC will require anything unusual. I've successfully flown in the Ilium level in a hornet with the 360 controller and it works great.

I wouldn't doubt that they are making friends with some of the peripheral companies however. I except to see SC branded versions of HOTAS, etc.
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,039
431
126
From my understanding they are attempting a partial proper physics approach. But it will still retain a lot of atmospheric flight-like style. I believe they were experimenting with the possibility of performing rotation/spin outside of your movement vector, allowing a ship to change orientation and firing arks while still maintaining their previous heading. But we are not talking Kerbal Space Program style orbits or things like that.
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,039
431
126
Based on CR's explanation of the flight computer and the fact that he personally uses a 360 controller, I doubt SC will require anything unusual. I've successfully flown in the Ilium level in a hornet with the 360 controller and it works great.

This all jives with what I stated above that if you watch some of the Wingman's Hanger updates you will see 360 controllers popping up all over the place in backgrounds, on tables, near computers, under monitors, etc... Don't think I have seen someone actually using one, but the anecdotal evidence that they simply exist and are there says something about it.
 

Nintendesert

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2010
7,761
5
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Plenty of quality walkthroughs on youtube from people who've bought them.



Yeah, I may have watched them all. There's still nothing like walking in yourself on your own hangar module and seeing if it fits. :biggrin:


As for the controls, I'm sure the game will support many types and support them well. There's plenty of experience with joysticks and I think Freelancer showed us that Roberts can do a space game with very good mouse/keyboard controls.
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
21,568
3
0
From my understanding they are attempting a partial proper physics approach. But it will still retain a lot of atmospheric flight-like style. I believe they were experimenting with the possibility of performing rotation/spin outside of your movement vector, allowing a ship to change orientation and firing arks while still maintaining their previous heading. But we are not talking Kerbal Space Program style orbits or things like that.

Uh, they aren't merely experimenting, it's a declared feature. Check out the post from the man himself dated August 16:
https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/comment/618968/#Comment_618968

Nothing short of PvE vs PvP gets everyone riled up like the flight model!

Here's some succinct answers to help put / remove my many "umms" and "ahhs" from the Forum Feedback section of Wing Man's Hangar.

1) The physics simulation is Newtonian

2) There is no drag.

3) The IFCS (Intelligent Flight Control system) generally handles taking the pilot's inputs (desired pitch, yaw, roll and speed) and translates them into actions for the thrusters and ship to take to adjust the ship's velocity vector in the direction the pilot wishes to go. This system will do it within human acceptable tolerances (it will not change your velocity vector in such a way as it could cause harm to the pilot)

4) Slowing down is caused by the pilot telling his IFCS that he wants to be traveling at a lower speed. The IFCS then communicates with the ships thrusters to adjust the ship's velocity accordingly.

5) If you turn you engines and IFCS off you will continue to coast at the same velocity.

6) Fuel is consumed by using your thrusters or main engines. If you coast you will not be using fuel, but making velocity vector changes will consume fuel.

7) More advanced IFCS systems will allow you to turn of parts of its overrides or allow it to interpret you inputs differently - for instance you could tell it you want to go into an "orientation" not "vectoring" mode where it will take your joystick inputs as solely ship orientation inputs and not try to correct your ship's velocity vector to be aligned in the direction your ship is pointing (the famous Battlestar Galactica maneuver).

8) We will limit the top speed of ships you can fly for technical issues (physics engines have problems when the numbers get too big) and fun - figuring out an intercept course for an opponent traveling at 0.2 speed of light (which is our fictional max for practical spaceflight in 2943) maybe be challenging if you're a mathematician or physicist but not what I call fun gameplay.

9) This top speed will be less than the top speed of weapons.

10) Top speed will probably be dependent on ship class but we haven't balanced this so it may be a matter of all ships having the same cap but the smaller faster ones can reach that limit much quicker (and therefore put some distance between them and their pursuers even if they go to max). This needs to be tuned so that people with the right kind of ships can run from a fight. The idea is that once you get enough separation between you and a hostile you can make the jump to autopilot / warp speed (using the Star Trek term), which is how you cover big distances in-system (essentially at that 0.2 lightspeed (c) number I mentioned). Just at these speeds you're not maneuvering - you're just accelerating and decelerating in a straight line. Think of it as human (player) controlled flight for the lower combat / docking speeds and then when wanting to warp to a destination (say a planet or a jump point) you hand control over to your ship's flight computer which handles plotting the trajectory and accelerating you to the 0.2 c speed that a RSI quantum drive can achieve.

11) I do know what G-Force is :) I use the term as a measure of acceleration on the human body as its good short hand for people to grasp the concept of forces acting on a body when accelerating and decelerating. You may be interested to know that "..The accelerations that are not produced by gravity are termed proper accelerations, and it is only these that are measured in g-force units. They cause stresses and strains on objects. Because of these strains, large g-forces may be destructive..." Occasionally people think it is only to do with gravity and earth bound flight but that's actually incorrect - its just that's the case we're most familiar with. And yes these forces come into play when accelerating and decelerating in space and until we develop some system to increase our tolerances to the effects of this acceleration they will be the limiting factor on how aggressively we could change the velocity vector of a ship, irregardless of whether we are in the atmosphere or not. Its also interesting to note that we're built to withstand much greater accelerations in certain directions - modern day pilots can withstand 9 G but much less negative Gs. Its why you see pilots rolling and pulling back on the stick when attempting aggressive maneuvers rather than pushing forward or yawing with a rudder. The same will be true in space. We're going to factor in G-Force in the simulation, and allow pilots to push the boundaries (or switch the IFCS safety off) in search for a little advantage, but beware if you back (or red) out in a dogfight you may come to floating in space next to the smoking wreck of your ship!

-Chris


So yeah, completely newtonian flight is possible with any ship; within technical limitations.
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,039
431
126
Nice to know that (I thought I had heard something but didn't see it official).

I also just scrapped by Lt. Cornell package + super hornet upgrade and picked up the weekend warrior package. I didn't need the physical stuff (as I had the Rear Admiral package as well). So the addition of the pistol in the "Weekend Warrior" package made more sense for me to do this since they are only sending 1 copy of physical items anyway (to my knowledge).

The added bonus is I get to see my Super Hornet now :D
 

vshah

Lifer
Sep 20, 2003
19,003
24
81
Nice to know that (I thought I had heard something but didn't see it official).

I also just scrapped by Lt. Cornell package + super hornet upgrade and picked up the weekend warrior package. I didn't need the physical stuff (as I had the Rear Admiral package as well). So the addition of the pistol in the "Weekend Warrior" package made more sense for me to do this since they are only sending 1 copy of physical items anyway (to my knowledge).

The added bonus is I get to see my Super Hornet now :D

yeah i'm considering doing this. but...spaceship USB key? can't decide!