Speculation: Ryzen 4000 series/Zen 3

[Thibsie]

Duron was such an iconic name back in the day. Do you remember people jokingly calling it Durex?

I certainly do. But then once used to, they moved to Sempron which is even worse IMO.

 

[Thibsie]

so if I tried to boot the system with a Zen 3 CPU with an older BIOS what would happen?...I wouldn't even be able to access the BIOS?

Maybe not on screen but then it should find the stick and upgrade AFAICT

 

[A///]

I certainly do. But then once used to, they moved to Sempron which is even worse IMO.

I remember one person on IRC calling it Sempai (cringe) back in the day. What else was it called?

 

[Thibsie]

In French it would be something like "Sempron pas bon", in short: stinks.

 

[RTX2080]

(PR) MSI releases Combo PI V2 1.1.0.0 Beta BIOS with AMD Zen3 (Vermeer) support

https://twitter.com/x/status/1311190866980212737

*rumor* about the release date.*rumor*

https://twitter.com/x/status/1311196944811921410

https://twitter.com/1usmus/status/1311194911841157120

 

[therealmongo]

AMD is not in the same league with Intel when it comes to overclocking.

Is this going to be the new Intel mantra

 

[Nereus77]

AMD is not in the same league with Intel when it comes to overclocking.

Oh man October 8 will not be a good day for you 😔

 

[soresu]

I remember one person on IRC calling it Sempai (cringe) back in the day.

Makes me think of the film Rising Sun.

Though the context is the wrong way around, Sempron should be Kohai.

 

[inf64]

I'm ready for 8C/16T part, cannot wait! Next upgrade after that will be most likely a Zen5 part, so I should be all set for next 2-3 years.

 

[moinmoin]

*rumor* about the release date.*rumor*

https://twitter.com/x/status/1311196944811921410

Hm, AMD stated before that Navi 2 would launch before the consoles. XSX/XSS launches on 10th, PS5 on 12th/19th. I guess it's all close enough to matter little in the end. *shrugs*

 

[Zucker2k]

Oh man October 8 will not be a good day for you 😔

Are you a reviewer? I'm waiting to be surprised. My answer is based on data, let's hope yours is too.

 

[Gideon]

Are you a reviewer? I'm waiting to be surprised. My answer is based on data, let's hope yours is too.

And what data is that?
10900K and 10700K can be overclocked to 5.0-5.1 Ghz all-core, no higher than MCE would really do. I wouldn't say this is significantly different from AMD XT processors and their PBO counterpart.

We also DO know that:

1. Zen 3 has per-core voltage regulation as Intel does (finally)
2. Engineering samples have reached 4.9 GHz

source

So how exactly is this not similar?

 

[ModEl4]

Probably AMD will not have the kind of gaming perfornance some people suggest. Even if Zen3 has around +15% IPC & 6% more clock speed, it doesn't mean +22% more performance in games, at 720p testing, 10900K is around 16% faster than a 3900XT) If I wanted to speculate, I would expect tested with 3090 or Big Navi vs 10900K at 720p, $549 12core model +2%, $449 10core model +1%, $399 8core TOP model same perf, all the way down to $199 6core model same perf as $237 10600KF which is good (this way Intel for the next 4 months at least, is dead at +$200). lol, i see AMD trying an Nvidia with this and launching the first month only the higher tier SKUs and gradually the others (♥️$$$)

 

[Makaveli]

hmm oct 8 is going to have alot of people eating their own words.

 

[uzzi38]

hmm oct 8 is either going to have alot of people eating their own words.

Sit back and get the popcorn ready

I don't mind either way, both October 8th and the 28th will be funny days. And I have no complaints how either turn out regardless of how they turn out, it'll be funny all the same hahaha

 

[Zucker2k]

And what data is that?
10900K and 10700K can be overclocked to 5.0-5.1 Ghz all-core, no higher than MCE would really do.

You already answered your own question

I wouldn't say this is significantly different from AMD XT processors and their PBO counterpart.

Really? Show me a 3900XT at 5.1GHz+ that's not being cooled by liquid nitrogen or anything non-exotic

We also DO know that:

1. Zen 3 has per-core voltage regulation as Intel does (finally)
2. Engineering samples have reached 4.9 GHz

source

I can't believe you even tried this. First of all @Markfw couldn't have made that statement with a yet to be released chip with rumored boost clocks of 4.9GHz. If he did, he's wrong. He's the first to ask for reviews so I doubt that he'll readily swallow that rumor. Finally, 4.9GHz is the single boost clock, and if Zen 2 is any indication of the all-core clocking potential of Zen 3, then even 4.9GHz would be unattainable on all cores.

Intel, on the other hand, has been hitting 5GHz on air since Sandy Bridge. This is really one of the worst posts I've seen from you. Not even close, mate.

So how exactly is this not similar?

I'm sure even you realized this is a stretch while you were typing?

Let's see what independent reviewers say come launch day

Even if Zen 3 manages to do 5GHz all clock overclocks, which I strongly doubt, it has no bearing on the statement @Markfw made.

 

[Nereus77]

Are you a reviewer? I'm waiting to be surprised. My answer is based on data, let's hope yours is too.

Let's see what independent reviewers say come launch day

 

[Panino Manino]

Oh man October 8 will not be a good day for you 😔

Obligatory JC:

I expect better clocks, an improvement in this area is mandatory. But if so, why would AMD not clock the skus as high as possible? With the allowed and possible overclock being a lone core that may go 100MHz higher?

I can't think of any reason why would AMD leave performance on the table requiring the consumers to reach for themselves.

 

[Gideon]

You already answered your own question

Really? Show me a 3900XT at 5.1GHz+ that's not being cooled by liquid nitrogen or anything non-exotic

I can't believe you even tried this. First of all @Markfw couldn't have made that statement with a yet to be released chip with rumored boost clocks of 4.9GHz. If he did, he's wrong. He's the first to ask for reviews so I doubt that he'll readily swallow that rumor. Finally, 4.9GHz is the single boost clock, and if Zen 2 is any indication of the all-core clocking potential of Zen 3, then even 4.9GHz would be unattainable on all cores.

Intel, on the other hand, has been hitting 5GHz on air since Sandy Bridge. This is really one of the worst posts I've seen from you. Not even close, mate.


I'm sure even you realized this is a stretch while you were typing?


Even if Zen 3 manages to do 5GHz all clock overclocks, which I strongly doubt, it has no bearing on the statement @Markfw made.

I'm well aware that Intel can reach higher clocks than AMD, I've never argued that. My point (and it seems that Mark's as well) was that unlike previous gens, 10XXX series doesn't really have any overclocking room left and is quite similar to Latest Ryzen in that regard (which is good, no perf left on the table).

I'm also quite certain AMD can't reach 5ghz all-core (though single core will be in the ballpark) but that stat alone is meaningless. Bulldozer did 5Ghz and was still crap.

Zen 2's gaming perfomance deficit is 90% memory interface related (latency) not clock speed. Its perfomance even in lightly threaded apps (other than games) is still often neck and neck with 5.2GHz Intel CPUs, Zen 3 should be all out faster.

 

[Abwx]

AMD is not in the same league with Intel when it comes to overclocking.

Whatever, Zen 3 is rumoured to have exceeded the 15% IPC improvement target, and that s for Integer code, usually IPC improvement are an average of FP and INT with the former providing generaly most of the improvement, so given the current ST IPC advantage of Zen 2 (7%) Intel will need 20% higher frequency with the SKL uarch.

 

[soresu]

Whatever, Zen 3 is rumoured to have exceeded the 15% IPC improvement target, and that s for Integer code, usually IPC improvement are an average of FP and INT with the former providing generaly most of the improvement, so given the current ST IPC advantage of Zen 2 (7%) Intel will need 20% higher frequency with the SKL uarch.

Yeah, I'm still on a Zen1 1700 so I'm holding off for a 12 or 16 core Zen3 CPU to upgrade to.

Should be a really nice bump for emulation, and even more so for rendering and video encoding.

 

[CastleBravo]

Can't beat the old Celeron 300A overclocking and teaming dual CPU on dedicated Abit motherboard. So were the times...

The first PC I built had that CPU, but I didn't even know what overclocking was back then. It still ran Half-Life just fine on the software renderer at 320x240 though! My first big overclocking setup was a T-bred 1700+ DLT3C running ~2.4ghz in an Abit NF7-S, some BH5 DDR, and a Radeon 9500 unlocked to a 9700.

 

[RTX2080]

Really? Show me a 3900XT at 5.1GHz+ that's not being cooled by liquid nitrogen or anything non-exotic

I'm not interested in any debate about older gen CPUs, but well if you all wanted to know......
one month ago in a chinese forum there's a crazy guy doing 5Ghz all core with 3900XT and with chilled water(ice-cooled):

旧帖归档 - Chiphell - 分享与交流用户体验

旧帖归档Chiphell - 分享与交流用户体验 ,Chiphell - 分享与交流用户体验

translate.google.com

it seems that he sucessfully benched cinebench with that. Reason I didn't post this before it's just because it is not a normal cooling and not be realistic to do daily productivity with this.....so I thought it's not even worth mentioning. But if you guys wanted to know how XT OC then here's an example, and is also an example to speculate how Zen3 OC headroom would be.

 

[Zucker2k]

I'm well aware that Intel can reach higher clocks than AMD, I've never argued that. My point (and it seems that Mark's as well) was that unlike previous gens, 10XXX series doesn't really have any overclocking room left and is quite similar to Latest Ryzen in that regard (which is good, no perf left on the table).

Mainstream overclocking is all about whatever you can achieve above base frequency using mainstream cooling solutions, ie. air and water. It is not whatever you can get on top of turbo boosting:

Base clock + 1400Mhz = 5,000MHz for the 9900k below is a 38% overclock, and some even go higher. (See screenshot below).

Usually, the pro-AMD members like you argue that MCE is not an Intel feature (and are turned off in reviews), and is in fact, overclocking. So, isn't this akin to eating your cake and wanting to have it too? A 125w 10900k runs around 3.9-4.1GHz in heavy, all core scenarios depending on code. They can be overclocked 1GHz+ on top of that by mainstream gamers and overclockers.

 

[Thibsie]

I'm not interested in any debate about older gen CPUs, but well if you all wanted to know......
one month ago in a chinese forum there's a crazy guy doing 5Ghz all core with 3900XT and with chilled water(ice-cooled):

旧帖归档 - Chiphell - 分享与交流用户体验

旧帖归档Chiphell - 分享与交流用户体验 ,Chiphell - 分享与交流用户体验

translate.google.com

View attachment 30692

it seems that he sucessfully benched cinebench with that. Reason I didn't post this before it's just because it is not a normal cooling and not be realistic to do daily productivity with this.....so I thought it's not even worth mentioning. But if you guys wanted to know how XT OC then here's an example, and is also an example to speculate how Zen3 OC headroom would be.

It is worth mentioning. For what it is. But there's no reason not to mention it IMO, in its category 'esoteric cooling or something like that.