Question Speculation: RDNA2 + CDNA Architectures thread

[uzzi38]

All die sizes are within 5mm^2. The poster here has been right on some things in the past afaik, and to his credit was the first to saying 505mm^2 for Navi21, which other people have backed up. Even still though, take the following with a pich of salt.

Navi21 - 505mm^2

Navi22 - 340mm^2

Navi23 - 240mm^2

Source is the following post: https://www.ptt.cc/bbs/PC_Shopping/M.1588075782.A.C1E.html

 

[JasonLD]

How do you (and others) come to this conclusion? AMD has a history keeping the best product for last. Even in this video AMD first went with 3900X, then showed the lower CPUs, and only last showed 3950X. But as a tease for an upcoming event they would show the best possible numbers of the top card? I don't believe that.

Lisa probably would have said "This isn't even our top performing GPU" if that wasn't their best card. If they had a better card, then there is absolutely no reason to not show that instead.

 

[moinmoin]

Lisa probably would have said "This isn't even our top performing GPU" if that wasn't their best card. If they had a better card, then there is absolutely no reason to not show that instead.

Of course there is: It a tease, not a replacement of an event that is still 20 days off.

 

[DeathReborn]

I did find it slightly interesting that none of the 3 games teased appeared on the 5900X vs 10900K slide so no clues there as to how much the CPU influenced the scores over the 10900K most reviewers used for the 3080.

 

[JasonLD]

Of course there is: It a tease, not a replacement of an event that is still 20 days off.

Of course they won't show everything, but if they are going to bring a tease, then I am sure they brought out the best numbers they can bring out. I am very sure if they had better than 3080 numbers to show, they would have done it.

 

[moinmoin]

Of course they won't show everything, but if they are going to bring a tease, then I am sure they brought out the best numbers they can bring out. I am very sure if they had better than 3080 numbers to show, they would have done it.

And turn the upcoming event into a lame boring showcase of everything that isn't as good as the best numbers they already handpicked as a tease for it? Please.

 

[Konan]

How do you (and others) come to this conclusion? AMD has a history keeping the best product for last. Even in this video AMD first went with 3900X, then showed the lower CPUs, and only last showed 3950X. But as a tease for an upcoming event they would show the best possible numbers of the top card? I don't believe that.

Seriously, when was the last time AMD didn't show their best case?

 

[JasonLD]

And turn the upcoming event into a lame boring showcase of everything that isn't as good as the best numbers they already handpicked as a tease for it? Please.

I am sure they wanted to avoid another Vega situation.

 

[moinmoin]

Seriously, when was the last time AMD didn't show their best case?

I still see plenty sandbagging. I guess it's in the eye of the beholder.

 

[swilli89]

View attachment 31363
DX12 instead of DX11 results

https://twitter.com/x/status/1314258183444140032

Hexus's 3080 FE number is 76 fps, not 81. 81 is an overclocked AIB version. Also as I linked above, Hardware Unboxed who is extremely reliable has the 3080 at 72 fps.

So for Gears 5, according to Hexus it would be RX 6000 is 96% of 3080 and according to HU it would be RX 6000 is 101%.

We are at the point of extremely splitting hairs if people actually think 5% performance in a game means anything.

What's amazing is, yes we are seeing AMD put out a card that can compete with Ampere and even provides a solid upgrade option to 2080 Ti owners. Weren't many people saying AMD would be lucky to even match the 2080 Ti? AMD just showed a pre-production card that looks to be trading blows with the 3080! AMD was at a 30-40% deficit with 5700xt vs 2080 Ti. Now it looks like they've completely closed the gap. Again, IF their top end card ends up 5% slower does that even matter? At that point price and power/thermals matters much more.

NVIDIA has already said Ampere supply issues will run into 2021. Everyone should be pulling for RX 6000 to do well and be widely available.

 

[Tup3x]

Lisa said just that it's the fastest card from AMD. Nothing about absolute leadership and all that yada which make me believe that it's not going to wipe the floor with NVIDIA's top offerings. Honestly, it's really weird to even except it to do that when they have been so much behind while NVIDIA made solid performance increase with Ampere.

 

[Timorous]

Seriously, when was the last time AMD didn't show their best case?

Today. They didnt show zen3 threadripper in cinebench mt.

 

[Konan]

I still see plenty sandbagging. I guess it's in the eye of the beholder.

Lisa Su -
"I want to give you a small preview of that today"
"Now affectionally called Big Navi"
"Request from fans on social.....Want to see Zen 3 and Big Navi in action"
"So today I will show you a preview"

The sentences are all linked. It was made out to be clear after saying the words "Big Navi" and then leading on to show a preview of that. I think it was pretty clear.
To be clear I really hope it isn't / wasn't the "Biggest Navi"

AMD’s Radeon RX 6000 ‘Big Navi’ performance tease reveals an RTX 3080 rival

During AMD's Ryzen 5000 launch even, the company provided a performance preview of its upcoming Radeon RX 6000 graphics cards, and they look ready to go toe-to-toe with Nvidia's beastly RTX 3080.

www.pcworld.com

In a call before the Zen 3 event, Radeon chief Scott Herkelman told me that AMD decided to tease Big Navi’s performance due to community demand for more information. It certainly was an eye-opening reveal.

Most importantly, Herkelman stressed that AMD didn’t state which Radeon RX 6000 graphics card ran these benchmarks. We don’t know whether these results come from the biggest Big Navi GPU, or a more modest offering. (Herkelman also said there’s still fine-tuning left to do before launch.)

 

[Heartbreaker]

Today. They didnt show zen3 threadripper in cinebench mt.

Either they are sandbagging, with the RX 6000 tease, or they aren't. There isn't a lot of evidence either way.

My guess says this is the top chip, but they may squeeze out a bit more performance before they final details come out.

I seriously doubt there is another bigger chip beyond what they showed.

 

[Timorous]

Either they are sandbagging, with the RX 6000 tease, or they aren't. There isn't a lot of evidence either way.

My guess says this is the top chip, but they may squeeze out a bit more performance before they final details come out.

I seriously doubt there is another bigger chip beyond what they showed.

It could be the big navi die in a 72CU config rather than 80CU.

 

[exquisitechar]

My guess says this is the top chip

Scott Herkelman hinted otherwise. I think this is the 72CU card.

 

[Paul98]

After looking a bit more they are quite close on performance with what was shown, so depending on more broad performance, and depending on die size, power consumption, vram, it could turnout to be quite a good card.

 

[insertcarehere]

I still see plenty sandbagging. I guess it's in the eye of the beholder.

Showing worse numbers deliberately in that sneak preview for Big Navi would also makes the $800 5950X paired up with it look bad by association, and this coming from an event where AMD have taken great pains to emphasize how good Zen 3 is at gaming...

 

[swilli89]

What no one has mentioned that could be very interesting from a technical perspective is that these Big Navi chips are rumored to have a 256-bit memory bus with normal GDDR6. I'm very eager to read about the large on-chip cache.

 

[Glo.]

Lisa Su -
"I want to give you a small preview of that today"
"Now affectionally called Big Navi"
"Request from fans on social.....Want to see Zen 3 and Big Navi in action"
"So today I will show you a preview"

The sentences are all linked. It was made out to be clear after saying the words "Big Navi" and then leading on to show a preview of that. I think it was pretty clear.
To be clear I really hope it isn't / wasn't the "Biggest Navi"

AMD’s Radeon RX 6000 ‘Big Navi’ performance tease reveals an RTX 3080 rival

During AMD's Ryzen 5000 launch even, the company provided a performance preview of its upcoming Radeon RX 6000 graphics cards, and they look ready to go toe-to-toe with Nvidia's beastly RTX 3080.

www.pcworld.com

Any SKU based on Big Navi's die, will refer to Big Navi performance.

If that N21 die is used from 6800 to 6900 SKUs, they could used ANY of those 4 SKUs.

Especially, when Scott Herkelmann said so, that they do not specify which specific SKU was demoed here.

 

[Konan]

@Paul98 It is competition which is awesome to see. It'll all come down to pricing and profit margins.

 

[moinmoin]

The sentences are all linked. It was made out to be clear after saying the words "Big Navi" and then leading on to show a preview of that. I think it was pretty clear.

Even in Nvidia's case the biggest Ampere chip GA102 still nets you two different SKUs. For Navi 2 there are three known chips in Navi21, Navi22 and Navi23 (with a Navi24 rumored but not confirmed), and depending on who you ask of Navi21 there are possibly half a dozen different SKUs of it (lol, VideoCardz seriously has been dropping the ball with its rumors as of late...).

 

[Konan]

Corrected numbers - from last page

https://twitter.com/x/status/1314266139631943681

 

[eek2121]

Seriously, when was the last time AMD didn't show their best case?

They did today with Ryzen. One of the games showed a tie, and another showed a performance regression. They compared against the 10900K instead of the 3900X/3950X. AMD isn't NVIDIA or Intel.

EDIT: Oh and assuming AMD follows the strategy they did with Ryzen, their cards will be probably around $100 less than the NVIDIA equivalents...more in some cases. If they have a 3090 competitor (I think they do, based on all the information I've seen and what information I have) it will likely be under $1,000. They will absolutely kick NVIDIA in the balls.

 

[Glo.]

They did today with Ryzen. One of the games showed a tie, and another showed a performance regression. They compared against the 10900K instead of the 3900X/3950X. AMD isn't NVIDIA or Intel.

Yeah. AMD is not like Nvidia or Intel, so they contrary to Nvidia or Intel do not jack up prices on their CPUs by 50$ using their dominant position, because they have no competition?

 

[swilli89]

Corrected numbers - from last page

https://twitter.com/x/status/1314266139631943681

Its STILL not corrected! Hexus number for the stock 3080 is 77 frames! The 81 frames is overclocked AIB models.....

Moving from 77 fps to 81 fps is actually doubling the difference which seems unfair to say the least.