some of my political positions

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Tab

Lifer
Sep 15, 2002
12,145
0
71
Originally posted by: JS80
Originally posted by: Tab
Fiscally Conservative and Socially Liberal. Obama is the closest canadiate to this and I'll be voting for him in the upcoming election.

Is this really what Obamabots believe?

Labeling him has a fiscal conservative is incorrect - he's a bit of a socialist I'll admit. On the otherhand McCain is more interested in war even if it means bankrupting the country.

Obamabots, in my opinion are probably those whom are more fiscally liberal and support things like public healthcare, college grants, farm subsides, etc. McSame supporters are Neo-Conservatives and Christian Fundamentalists/Fascists.
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,914
2,359
126
Originally posted by: seemingly random
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Originally posted by: seemingly random
Originally posted by: blackangst1
Originally posted by: seemingly random
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I believe that the right and the left are two sides of a coin that can be seen as such with higher understanding. All opposites are integrated within real knowledge. There is only love. Everything else is a delusion. Understanding is not the addition of political or other information, but the subtraction of false beliefs. To be filled you have to be empty.

The ego is a clown on a stage playing make believe. Everything you believe is a lie and any attempt to let go of it is just more games. The ego is the cage. The world is perfect and any attempt to make it so ruins it. The need to change is self hate.
Sounds fine and dandy but you know, if we humans are left unchecked, we start killing each other. I also believe some people have an inherent need to be controlled.

And some people pay handsomely to be so!
Alright, let's not get kinky...

(kinky in p&n - now that would be icky kinky...)

It's not much worse than the mental masturbation Moonbeam tangents on sometimes :p

/poke fun
mb can be interestingly enigmatic.

Hey wait a minute here. We're not supposed to be having normal conversations in p&n - we're supposed to be arguing and knifing each other in the back. Come on, shape up...

Agree. I love MB although he prolly hates me, because afterall, we all hate when we look in the mirror (or something like that).

And youre right. We cant be "getting along" in here. You better look out!
 

seemingly random

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 2007
5,281
0
0
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: JS80
Originally posted by: Tab
Fiscally Conservative and Socially Liberal. Obama is the closest canadiate to this and I'll be voting for him in the upcoming election.

Is this really what Obamabots believe?

Labeling him has a fiscal conservative is incorrect - he's a bit of a socialist I'll admit. On the otherhand McCain is more interested in war even if it means bankrupting the country.
By this phrasing, it is assumed that we aren't bankrupt now. This brings up an interesting point: when is a country considered bankrupt (insolvent)? How would we know? Sure we could keep borrowing (selling bonds) and printing money but even this must have some limit.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
I believe in small govt, nativism, balanced budget, protectionism, and non-interventionism.

I'd probably stop govt handouts at the New Deal level.

I believe in virtually unlimited personal freedoms even drugs and gay marriage but not abortion.

Don't like capital punishment as some innocent have died.

Don't have a problem with Affirmative Action or any Equality measures as long as same qualifications are upheld for all parties. It's proven best way to integrate military first and America.

I believe the second amendment Guarantees the other 9.;)

there really isnt a party for me...:(

 

Tab

Lifer
Sep 15, 2002
12,145
0
71
Originally posted by: seemingly random
Originally posted by: Tab
Originally posted by: JS80
Originally posted by: Tab
Fiscally Conservative and Socially Liberal. Obama is the closest canadiate to this and I'll be voting for him in the upcoming election.

Is this really what Obamabots believe?

Labeling him has a fiscal conservative is incorrect - he's a bit of a socialist I'll admit. On the otherhand McCain is more interested in war even if it means bankrupting the country.
By this phrasing, it is assumed that we aren't bankrupt now. This brings up an interesting point: when is a country considered bankrupt (insolvent)? How would we know? Sure we could keep borrowing (selling bonds) and printing money but even this must have some limit.

Depression.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
126
Originally posted by: JS80

How do you measure/standardize your definition of "morals"?

I don't. I think to do so makes it less close to what I want it to be. I use many means for determining my opinion on an issue, and I don't use 'measurements' to do so.

Perhaps that's why I tend to explain my positions in the larger context rather than say 'because this ideology says it's the policy'.

Ultimately, I think morals are the foundation of our political positions, or should be - but I also think that some have better judgement than others. Some abuse the word 'moral'.

People who oppose the equal rights of gays to marry will use the word 'moral' for their position, as I do for mine that's the opposite.

The right answer on the political role of morals is to recognize their key role, not to try to say morals should be excluded because you don't like the morals even a majority hold.

Then the battle is where it should be, convincing the people who you disagree with on the issues, not preventing them from voting their conscience.

It's a hard road early on, imagine the loneliness of abolitionists when the constitution was created, or in the south a century later. Yet also look at how the protection of civil rights today rests more solidly on the conscience of the nation (following the leadership of JFK, King, and LBJ in particular) than it would on some other basis not requiring moral views.

And morals are what lead me to my views on the concentration of wealth that cripples the well-being of the majority of our nation, my views on the abuse of violence for gains, etc.

And morals are what lead me to the basic desire of my politics wanting freedom - political, and economic meaning the prosperity that is practical - for as many as possible.

In my thousands of posts you will consistently see them towards that goal, and away from the propaganda of those who unwittingly are fighting against such freedom.

I think such freedom is moral for the human race, while societal structure tends to allow a few to concentrate wealth and power and in effect dehumanize many others.

It's a spectrum, not a boolean issue, and gains and losses occur one small issue at a time.

When things are working as they should, we have unequal wealth in society, because unequal wealth *in the appropriate, moderate amount* increases the prosperity of society.

It's when the inequality serves not the society's need for productivity, but rather the needs of the few by exploiting their power as it has in most societies, that there's a problem.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
126
Originally posted by: blackangst1

It's not much worse than the mental masturbation Moonbeam tangents on sometimes :p

/poke fun

There are worse bodily fluids some deposit here.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,640
2,034
126
Originally posted by: Zebo
I believe in small govt, nativism, balanced budget, protectionism, and non-interventionism.

I'd probably stop govt handouts at the New Deal level.

I believe in virtually unlimited personal freedoms even drugs and gay marriage but not abortion.

Don't like capital punishment as some innocent have died.

Don't have a problem with Affirmative Action or any Equality measures as long as same qualifications are upheld for all parties. It's proven best way to integrate military first and America.

I believe the second amendment Guarantees the other 9.;)

there really isnt a party for me...:(

:thumbsup:

Although I have no problem with 1st trimester abortions and I completely disagree with affirmative action in this day and age. Otherwise, :thumbsup:
 

miketheidiot

Lifer
Sep 3, 2004
11,062
1
0
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Originally posted by: mxyzptlk
Sounds good to me. Now figure out how to dumb it down for the fly-over states. Some tips: Include a lot of phrases like "get r dun" and "god bless"

^ Reason why Dems always blow it... posterchild here for leftwing dickery.

pretty much :disgust:
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
126
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Originally posted by: mxyzptlk
Sounds good to me. Now figure out how to dumb it down for the fly-over states. Some tips: Include a lot of phrases like "get r dun" and "god bless"

^ Reason why Dems always blow it... posterchild here for leftwing dickery.

pretty much :disgust:

Reason why some voters always blow it, falling for right-wing phony attacks on dems.

Not commenting on this incident one way or the other, but a general comment.

The way it works is, political marketing people determine what would turn off voters to a democrat, like 'elitism', and then they manufacture the attack to fit.

Then voters see the attack, and say 'there go those darned dems again', falling for it hook, line and sinker while the political marketers get another sheep in the herd.
 

miketheidiot

Lifer
Sep 3, 2004
11,062
1
0
The Role of Government
Government, from its most basic, is a communal solution to market failure, and provides for its citizens solutions to these failures as the citizens see fit. Among others things, the government helps solve property rights (physical and intellectual), provides law and civil structure and the preservation of civil rights, common defense from foreign and domestic dangers, safety services such as the fire department.

Health Care
While the government should not be able to force anyone to undergo any procedure when that person, or their guardian in the case of minors, unless it can be proven that a person is not of sound mind or in control and aware of their own actions.

The said, it should be government to encourage a program of optional free annual screenings as well as a system of free or subsidized immunizations, and encourage healthier lifestyles through government programs such as walking/bike paths, sporting leagues, etc which is already mostly provided by local and state governments. Additionally, in my opinion and with my support, the government should regulate the use of chemicals that are harmful to the general welfare, such and mercury, smoking, asbestos, etc.

Government Regulation of Business
Since the government provides the framework under which business works, it should be clear that government has a fundamental right to regulate business that operates under its domain. That said, the government should minimize its involvement unless there is a clear need for its intervention in the case of a market failure or in the national interest.

Foreign Policy
Pursue the interests of its citizens, protect its citizens from foreign threat, while respecting the rights of foreign citizens whenever possible.


Death Penalty
The government has absolutely no business terminating its citizens, and the basic rights of its citizens should be fully extended to all civilians, citizen or not.


Investing in Our Future
A high speed national electric rail system would be awesome, more spending for research and more emphasis on math and science (as well and English, history, and foreign language).

 

cwjerome

Diamond Member
Sep 30, 2004
4,346
26
81
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Originally posted by: mxyzptlk
Sounds good to me. Now figure out how to dumb it down for the fly-over states. Some tips: Include a lot of phrases like "get r dun" and "god bless"

^ Reason why Dems always blow it... posterchild here for leftwing dickery.

pretty much :disgust:

Reason why some voters always blow it, falling for right-wing phony attacks on dems.

Not commenting on this incident one way or the other, but a general comment.

The way it works is, political marketing people determine what would turn off voters to a democrat, like 'elitism', and then they manufacture the attack to fit.

Then voters see the attack, and say 'there go those darned dems again', falling for it hook, line and sinker while the political marketers get another sheep in the herd.

Crap... you sound like Hillary.

There doesn't have to be some conspiratorial media marketing for average people in middle-America to see, hear, and feel the derision. Most of these self-important snobs are more concerned with tearing down and looking clever than good governance.

Much of Obama's popularity stems from his inclusive, positive outlook, and some of you retards still can't resist the urge to insult 10s of millions of everyday Americans. Get a clue.