So you don't have free speech if you are a professor in Florida's states university system

[hal2kilo]

Looks like free speech is a no go in Florida these days for professors. Desantis really is looking like a Trump alternative.

Florida blocks professors from testifying against voting law pushed by DeSantisPOLITICOSearchSearchClose

Top University of Florida officials asserted that it was a conflict of interest for professors to testify in the lawsuit because they’re state employees. It’s a notable turnaround in university policy, which for years allowed professors to testify in lawsuits against the state — including one that unsuccessfully challenged the state law that restricted voting rights for convicted felons.


The decision comes at a time when Gov. Ron DeSantis and other Florida Republicans have asserted that big tech companies, universities and the Biden administration are trying to squelch and intimidate the free speech rights of conservatives online, on campus and at school board meetings.

"As Americans, we have a First Amendment right to exercise our free speech on our own time. We will not back down from the University of Florida's decision," said Michael McDonald, a UF political science professor who was one of the three blocked from testifying in the suit.

 

[SmCaudata]

Free speech is only for Republicans, preferably the white male variety. This is clear per the constitution.

(that was sarcasm)

 

[blackangst1]

Free speech is only for Republicans, preferably the white male variety. This is clear per the constitution.

(that was sarcasm)

Yuore right though. I believe in unabashed, unrestricted free speech. So theres that.

 

[Moonbeam]

Humans have emotional needs. They need each other for protection and for love and to breed. All of us have had our self worth put into doubt in the competitive race for satisfactions the fears those putdowns to our self respect generating loss we strive ever after to retain and greedily horde. Among our greatest treasures are group solidarity, belonging to a worthy cause along with all the work that goes into maintaining it's sanctity. Poor DeSantis has filled the vacuum at the center of his being with the belief in a deeply authoritarian conservative ideology and defends it mightily to prevent experiencing ins inner shame. And, of course the reason he is such a disgusting and mentally ill being is because we create what we fear. No mask can fully cover the raw aching inner need. He will die having known little of the joys of real being. Such a pity.

 

[HomerJS]

Easy solution. Any professor who wants to testify just have a back channel conversation and ask to be subpoenaed.

They will have to testify and cannot suffer job repercussions

 

[Moonbeam]

Yuore right though. I believe in unabashed, unrestricted free speech. So theres that.

No you don't.

 

[brycejones]

Yuore right though. I believe in unabashed, unrestricted free speech. So theres that.

You support yelling fire in a crowded theater when there is no fire?

 

[blackangst1]

No you don't.

?

 

[blackangst1]

You support yelling fire in a crowded theater when there is no fire?

Yep

 

[brycejones]

Yep

Well that’s dumb.

 

[blackangst1]

Well that’s dumb.

Of course it is. Dont you guys think everything say is dumb?

 

[blackangst1]

Here is a good news story about free speech:

Behind the GOP plot to overturn MLK's free-speech ruling (msn.com) MSNBC

 

[allisolm]

Of course it is. Dont you guys think everything say is dumb?

Only the dumb things... oh, wait...

 

[brycejones]

Only the dumb things... oh, wait...

Unfortunately for blackangst that is most of his posts.

 

[MichaelMay]

Looks like free speech is a no go in Florida these days for professors. Desantis really is looking like a Trump alternative.

Florida blocks professors from testifying against voting law pushed by DeSantisPOLITICOSearchSearchClose

Top University of Florida officials asserted that it was a conflict of interest for professors to testify in the lawsuit because they’re state employees. It’s a notable turnaround in university policy, which for years allowed professors to testify in lawsuits against the state — including one that unsuccessfully challenged the state law that restricted voting rights for convicted felons.


The decision comes at a time when Gov. Ron DeSantis and other Florida Republicans have asserted that big tech companies, universities and the Biden administration are trying to squelch and intimidate the free speech rights of conservatives online, on campus and at school board meetings.

"As Americans, we have a First Amendment right to exercise our free speech on our own time. We will not back down from the University of Florida's decision," said Michael McDonald, a UF political science professor who was one of the three blocked from testifying in the suit.

Correct me if I'm wrong but this is a state university, right? So the government is prohibiting people from exercising their free speech?

I know the fascists like to wipe their ass with your constitution but isn't this a bit too ... in your face ...

 

[Moonbeam]

?

You do not believe in unrestricted free speech. I thought that you saying something you believed and me saying, you don't really believe it as described in the previous sentence, would have been the obvious implication.

 

[brycejones]

Correct me if I'm wrong but this is a state university, right? So the government is prohibiting people from exercising their free speech?

I know the fascists like to wipe their ass with your constitution but isn't this a bit too ... in your face ...

Florida is the hold my beer state.

 

[MichaelMay]

Florida is the hold my beer state.

Yeah, I kinda gathered that but still... Pissing all over the first amendment by making a government entity ban people from speech in a court of law is a bit ... too fucking obvious?

 

[TheVrolok]

Yeah, I kinda gathered that but still... Pissing all over the first amendment by making a government entity ban people from speech in a court of law is a bit ... too fucking obvious?

Thing is, Trump has proven that "wait out the clock" is an entirely viable strategy. They don't need to be right, they just need to tie up the judicial system long enough to get away with whatever the con of the day is.

 

[brycejones]

Yeah, I kinda gathered that but still... Pissing all over the first amendment by making a government entity ban people from speech in a court of law is a bit ... too fucking obvious?

The fact they are so blatant about it screams they think they can get away with anything at this point.

 

[HurleyBird]

Things like this, and especially the anti-BDS laws, are the reasons I'm so skeptical of conservatives who say they're on the side of free speech now. They're for free speech when they're being censored, but seem to jump at any opportunity to censor their political enemies, and, hypocritically, will keep shouting "I support free speech" from the rooftops while doing so.

Everyone says they are for free speech when they feel their speech is being discriminated against, but that's easy. If you don't support the free speech rights of your enemies, you aren't pro-free speech, you're authoritarian, and you shouldn't be in a position of power. Abbot and DeSantis are textbook.

 

[pmv]

Free speech is only for Republicans, preferably the white male variety. This is clear per the constitution.

(that was sarcasm)

It seems to work in a similar way over here. The Tories made a big song-and-dance about passing a law to oblige universities to 'protect free speech' and to resist an alleged 'cancel culture'. Mostly it seemed to be about the endless, tediously unproductive, row over "trans" issues.

Yet shortly afterwards Manchester University had an exhibit on Israeli treatment of Palestinians removed from an exhibition under it's control, and, funnily enough, the law didn't seem to apply to that case.

Quite aside from arguing the factual rights-and-wrongs of the topic of Israel and Palestine (and where anti-Zionism ends and anti-Semitism begins), what gets me is how often the same people who are furiously opposed to 'cancel culture', and who supported the government's recent passing of a specific law to 'protect free speech in universities' suddenly transition to being huge supporters of that "cancel culture" when the topic involves criticism of Israel.

Or, for that matter, if it involves anything redolent of 'extremist' Islamism. I'm waiting for a case where the Tories' "anti-extremism" "Prevent" program and their "Free speech in universities" law clash head-on - the principles behind the two things are clearly directly opposed to each other.



Either of those laws could be defended on its own, but having both is just incoherent.

I'm not entirely convinced there's any such thing as 'free speech' - when people pose as heroic defenders of it, it invariably turns out to be a case of "free speech for me, but not for thee".




(that "Prevent" program seems particularly farcical - it saw a very young child being referred to the police because they wrote at school that they lived in a "terrorist house" because they couldn't spell "terraced house", and another one because the teacher thought they said they wanted to give "arms to the oppressed" when they actually said "alms...")

Seems to me there's some sort of cognitative dissonance involved when a government can push this...

Universities to comply with free speech duties or face sanctions

Landmark Bill will require universities to promote freedom of speech on campus and legal duties will also be extended to students' unions

www.gov.uk

while simultaneously promoting this...

Boy, 11, referred to Prevent for wanting to give ‘alms to the oppressed’

Teachers contact counter-radicalisation programme after mistakenly believing he said ‘arms’

www.theguardian.com

'Terrorist House' Spelling Mistake Sees Boy, 10, Interviewed By Police

'Terrorist House' Spelling Mistake Sees Boy, 10, Interviewed By Police

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk

Student accused of being a terrorist for reading book on terrorism

Staffordshire University apologises after counter-terrorism student Mohammed Umar Farooq was questioned under Prevent anti-extremism initiative

www.theguardian.com

 

[mikeymikec]

Of course it is. Dont you guys think everything say is dumb?

Instead of playing the victim, how about you put forward your most logical and considered argument as to why there should be no exceptions to 1A.

This may help you:

United States free speech exceptions - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[blackangst1]

Things like this, and especially the anti-BDS laws, are the reasons I'm so skeptical of conservatives who say they're on the side of free speech now. They're for free speech when they're being censored, but seem to jump at any opportunity to censor their political enemies, and, hypocritically, will keep shouting "I support free speech" from the rooftops while doing so.

Everyone says they are for free speech when they feel their speech is being discriminated against, but that's easy. If you don't support the free speech rights of your enemies, you aren't pro-free speech, you're authoritarian, and you shouldn't be in a position of power. Abbot and DeSantis are textbook.

+1 Its been that way for decades.

 

[blackangst1]

Instead of playing the victim, how about you put forward your most logical and considered argument as to why there should be no exceptions to 1A.

This may help you:

United States free speech exceptions - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Im not going into a full diatribe here, as no one here wants to read it. But one point: Censorship does not necessarily undermine the pursuit of truth. We could trust the censor to filter out the untruths, and allow only the true ones to get through.

But

This assumed an infallible censor.

If youre truly interested, I suggest you read John Stuart Mill’s essay On Liberty. He succinctly words it better than I do.