QFT. If you'd just buy a small filing cabinet (and use it) this really wouldn't ever be an issue. There is always room for a small filling cabinet SOMEWHERE.
QFT. If you'd just buy a small filing cabinet (and use it) this really wouldn't ever be an issue. There is always room for a small filling cabinet SOMEWHERE.
- Oct 10, 2006
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The operative word in your post is "loan". I know people who have student loans and debt up the ass after graduation, and I have no desire to endure that crap when I can avoid it.
I'm pissed at my parents, and I have right to be, but I'm extremely grateful for what they give me (yes they are paying for 90% of my college costs). All I want is the same respect they'd give anyone else. I'm not asking for a car, or a new TV, or a new computer, or anything remotely frivolous here. I never have.
Hell, what I'm asking for doesn't even cost money, and actually saves them time.
Edit: If I can't have it, then I'll bear it. It'll be worth it in the long run. Doesn't mean I have to grin while I do it, and it doesn't negate my right to bitch/be annoyed/be human about it.
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Fine, I will. I suppose I can block my vent and shove a small one underneath my desk. We'll see how long it lasts before I need to buy another one, and then we'll see how long that one lasts... etc
I still use my AP Physics notes from High School, and go over old tests for practice problems. If anything could be remotely useful, I keep it, or at least a record of it.
Maximilian
Lifer
- Feb 8, 2004
- 12,604
- 15
- 81
Yeah you could roll over and give in to the masses of ATOT or you could lay down the law! tell you mom no! You aint touching my stuff no more! Respect my authority! Try that, see how it goes down.
- Oct 10, 2006
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She does it when I'm out of the house. I can "lay down" the law all day, but I can't enforce it 24/7. Any retaliatory action after the fact would solve nothing and cause a small war.
As others have said, if you aren't willing to take on the financial burden required to move out (i.e., secure education loans and/or work more hours), then it's something you are essentially agreeing to live with in exchange for rent-free lodging. You might be a college student, but in the end, it's still her house, and therefore her rules.
The locking file cabinet could be an easy fix, though. Keeps you happy in that it prevents her from reorganizing your papers, and keeps her happy by having said papers out of view.
As for being pissed, I'd say that I can understand why you'd be irked, but I still wouldn't agree that you have a "right" to it.
Ever heard of roomates? Ever heard of getting something better than a MCJOB? Try getting one and stop relying on your parents to foot the bills. I had just turned 19 when I moved out - I moved into a 3BR apt and had roommates. I worked full time and went to school part-time, around my schedule. Was it difficult? At times. Did I get help from my mom? Occasionally - such as a loan here and there, or she would surprise me by taking me out for groceries, but overall I was on my own.
So...I'm back to my previous suggestion: Move out and STFU. Once you are on your own, you then have the ability to obtain student loans, grants, etc. You mention that you don't WANT to graduate with student loans and debt up the ass, but that just proves that it is not that you CAN'T afford to move out but that YOU CHOOSE NOT TO.
I'm not asking you to flash your credentials, and my opinion really doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. But the fact is, YOU came to ATOT whining about how your mommy doesn't respect your privacy and moves your stuff. I bluntly told you to grow a pair and move out on your own, and I stick to that advice. If you get a locking file cabinet, you'll find another reason to whine in a few weeks, months, whatever. Putting a lock on the door might work, but in MY house, you'd come home and find no door on the room at all. So the best answer is still: get your own place and pay your own way so it isn't an issue.
And this is why you need to become an adult and move out.
Until then you are not an adult and just a kid. As others have pointed out you are not "stuck", you have chosen the situation you are in. It may suck, but that's what you chose. There is no expectation of privacy, you are living under their house and everything you do, say, own is theirs until you do otherwise.
If you were my kid and you put in a locked file cabinet I would demand a key or force you to move out. You'll understand all of this when you become an adult.
- Oct 10, 2006
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Alright, mutual insults and immaturity accusations not withstanding:
1. I have never denied that I choose to stay. It'll be worth it in the long run. Doesn't mean I have to like it or be silent about it. If I see something I don't think is right, I'll do what I can to stop it unless I'm convinced otherwise. I'm no one's willing bitch, regardless of how much power they may have. I don't care if it's my parents, Vladimir Putin, the President, or God himself. I'm open-minded, but I stand with my values. Period.
2. What my mom did was/is wrong. It would be equally wrong for me to "reorganize" her crap because I wanted to clear the kitchen table for no reason other than to have it clear. Right and wrong are not defined by who owns what or who has the money. That simply defines a form of power, and some of you guys sound fricken draconian and/or power drunk.
3. Her "reorganization" solved nothing. The stacks are twice as tall, randomized, and fewer in number. In fact, I had to move one to open a drawer, so it actually made things worse, practically speaking. And it cost me several hours of time I needed for other stuff.
4. I expect respect as a person, I expect others to respect my possessions, especially from my family of all people. How is this unreasonable?
1. I have never denied that I choose to stay. It'll be worth it in the long run. Doesn't mean I have to like it or be silent about it. If I see something I don't think is right, I'll do what I can to stop it unless I'm convinced otherwise. I'm no one's willing bitch, regardless of how much power they may have. I don't care if it's my parents, Vladimir Putin, the President, or God himself. I'm open-minded, but I stand with my values. Period.
2. What my mom did was/is wrong. It would be equally wrong for me to "reorganize" her crap because I wanted to clear the kitchen table for no reason other than to have it clear. Right and wrong are not defined by who owns what or who has the money. That simply defines a form of power, and some of you guys sound fricken draconian and/or power drunk.
3. Her "reorganization" solved nothing. The stacks are twice as tall, randomized, and fewer in number. In fact, I had to move one to open a drawer, so it actually made things worse, practically speaking. And it cost me several hours of time I needed for other stuff.
4. I expect respect as a person, I expect others to respect my possessions, especially from my family of all people. How is this unreasonable?
LOL!
Dude, congrats on "trying" to be an adult. You're trying to think like one and act like one, that's the first step. Except you aren't thinking like one or acting like one.
1. Yes you do have to be silent about it. You are living under their house, you are their willing bitch until you do otherwise. You aren't entitled to think for yourself yet because you can't even take care of your own self. Dependent, child, kid.
2. It would NOT be equally wrong to touch her crap, that would be much worse. That's her crap, your crap is still hers until you become an adult.
3. LOL, so move out. problem solved.
4. You can't expect respect, you have to earn it. You are living off of them, you are dependant, you are not an adult yet, therefor you get ZERO respect from those taking care of you.
I hate to chuckle and laugh, but seriously give it a few years and you'll maybe come back to this thread and say "gee, I was just another dumbass kid...I understand now that I'm an adult. Thanks for trying to help me." Because that is all I'm honestly trying to do.
BoomerD
No Lifer
- Feb 26, 2006
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WHY do you have "stacks" of stuff in the room anyway? Get some cardboard filing boxes and organize your fucking mess. Once you do that, odds are, she'll leave your junk alone. Since it's HER house, SHE has the rights to demand your room is clean and organized to HER satisfaction. You say:
WRONG! It's still HER house... You need to quit acting like you're 15 and she still has some "obligation" to provide for you and to house you. Yet, by your admission, they're paying 90% of your college expenses and such, and you're whining that she wants you to keep your room clean to her standards...
It's time for you to decide which is more important...the support of your parents, or your independence. You're not likely to get both.
WRONG! It's still HER house... You need to quit acting like you're 15 and she still has some "obligation" to provide for you and to house you. Yet, by your admission, they're paying 90% of your college expenses and such, and you're whining that she wants you to keep your room clean to her standards...
It's time for you to decide which is more important...the support of your parents, or your independence. You're not likely to get both.
Huh, my mom never touches my stuff, ever, though she reminds me occasionally that I need to clean up (I just finished school so my stuff is all back at their place in the basement, along with me, and it's all electronics so she has no idea what any of it is 
)
)Originally posted by: bobsmith1492
Huh, my mom never touches my stuff, ever, though she reminds me occasionally that I need to clean up (I just finished school so my stuff is all back at their place in the basement, along with me, and it's all electronics so she has no idea what any of it is
And you know what? That's cool. I don't think ANY of us would be saying the OP should move out if he weren't ranting about his mom touching his stuff. In fact, I think many of us would be aggravated by it, too, if placed in that same situation. HOWEVER, the OP's mom certainly DOES have the right to do it since it is her house. That is the premise we have argued against.
- Oct 10, 2006
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Originally posted by: altonb1
Originally posted by: bobsmith1492
Huh, my mom never touches my stuff, ever, though she reminds me occasionally that I need to clean up (I just finished school so my stuff is all back at their place in the basement, along with me, and it's all electronics so she has no idea what any of it is
And you know what? That's cool. I don't think ANY of us would be saying the OP should move out if he weren't ranting about his mom touching his stuff. In fact, I think many of us would be aggravated by it, too, if placed in that same situation. HOWEVER, the OP's mom certainly DOES have the right to do it since it is her house. That is the premise we have argued against.
A technical right and a moral right are not the same thing. Call me an idealist, but what she did was simply morally wrong. Everyone has the "right" to free speech, but it's still illegal to scream "fire" in a theater when there's no reason to.
Edit: Yes, it's an analogy, and all analogies are somewhat inaccurate. You get my point, don't nitpick.
Originally posted by: irishScott
Originally posted by: altonb1
Originally posted by: bobsmith1492
Huh, my mom never touches my stuff, ever, though she reminds me occasionally that I need to clean up (I just finished school so my stuff is all back at their place in the basement, along with me, and it's all electronics so she has no idea what any of it is
And you know what? That's cool. I don't think ANY of us would be saying the OP should move out if he weren't ranting about his mom touching his stuff. In fact, I think many of us would be aggravated by it, too, if placed in that same situation. HOWEVER, the OP's mom certainly DOES have the right to do it since it is her house. That is the premise we have argued against.
A technical right and a moral right are not the same thing. Call me an idealist, but what she did was simply morally wrong. Everyone has the "right" to free speech, but it's still illegal to scream "fire" in a theater when there's no reason to.
Edit: Yes, it's an analogy, and all analogies are somewhat inaccurate. You get my point, don't nitpick.
I don't necessarily agree it is wrong in either sense, though. I think you are saying it is a moral wrong to go through your stuff at all, and I disagree.
Remove yourself from the situation from a minute. What if a parent is helping clean her 20yo son's room and found illegal narcotics? (using your theory--this is an analogy, so don't nitpick) If the police raided the house for some reason and found it, the house could be seized in many jurisdictions. Would this still be a moral wrong since it was discovered in such a manner?
Morally or technically, I don't believe you should expect a right to privacy in your parent's home. It is THEIR home. THEY pay (or paid) for it, the utilities, the phone, the cable, etc. Now, with that in mind, if you were living there and paying RENT, I believe you would have more of an argument, but even then...since it is your PARENT'S house...you still would be subject to some of these issues as opposed to being on your own.
I've read this entire thread as you asked. I've come to the conclusion that you're experiencing typical delusional post-teen syndrome.
I'll spare you the obvious "move out", "it's their house" and "you're still just a kid" responses. Thoes stand true, regardless of your situation. Hell, half of what you've said are typical teenage type responses, you're always right and the parents are always wrong. Either way it doesn't matter. This is not a difficult situation to remedy as long as you're willing to be 'open minded' as you claim to be.
Here is what I see. You're too stubborn and hard-headed to actually learn from this repeated experiences. What makes you think that telling your mother to stop doing something will actually work? She's set in her ways regardless of how illlogical they are. It's the whole "fool me once...." idea. Since your mother will not cease in her activities you need to be proactive for the time being to avoid further complications. It's easier for you to make simple changes in your mannerisms than to continue to bang your head against the wall thinking you can actually begin to change your mother's ways.
The simple solution is to not use your silly 'organized stacks' approach of organizing while you live at their house. It's definitely not working and is causing you more problems then you'd like to deal with. So your mother doesn't like seeing stacks of paper all over, the obvious answer is to not have stacks of paper all over. Get some file folders and put the papers in there, then the papers won't be stacked up all over and most likely your mother won't touch them. You don't even need a filing cabinet, you can just have stacks of file folders with the papers inside of them. I'm going to assume you have some sort of problem solving skills, so I don't see why this is such an issue.
You've blown this way out of proportion. This has nothing to do with your 'values', or your opinion of what she did as being 'wrong', or 'respect'. This has to do with you taking a different approach to what you're doing in order to avoid the inevitable actions your mother will take. You're taking personal offense to what she is doing, which really is immature no matter which way you cut it.
If you took a fraction of the 'hours' you spent trying to find papers and put it into thinking of and implementing simple solutions, then you would be much better off.
You've spent more time defending yourself in this thread than it would take to grab some folders or something and organize your papers. People are treating you like a child in this thread because you're acting like one. This isn't brain surgery.
I'll spare you the obvious "move out", "it's their house" and "you're still just a kid" responses. Thoes stand true, regardless of your situation. Hell, half of what you've said are typical teenage type responses, you're always right and the parents are always wrong. Either way it doesn't matter. This is not a difficult situation to remedy as long as you're willing to be 'open minded' as you claim to be.
Here is what I see. You're too stubborn and hard-headed to actually learn from this repeated experiences. What makes you think that telling your mother to stop doing something will actually work? She's set in her ways regardless of how illlogical they are. It's the whole "fool me once...." idea. Since your mother will not cease in her activities you need to be proactive for the time being to avoid further complications. It's easier for you to make simple changes in your mannerisms than to continue to bang your head against the wall thinking you can actually begin to change your mother's ways.
The simple solution is to not use your silly 'organized stacks' approach of organizing while you live at their house. It's definitely not working and is causing you more problems then you'd like to deal with. So your mother doesn't like seeing stacks of paper all over, the obvious answer is to not have stacks of paper all over. Get some file folders and put the papers in there, then the papers won't be stacked up all over and most likely your mother won't touch them. You don't even need a filing cabinet, you can just have stacks of file folders with the papers inside of them. I'm going to assume you have some sort of problem solving skills, so I don't see why this is such an issue.
You've blown this way out of proportion. This has nothing to do with your 'values', or your opinion of what she did as being 'wrong', or 'respect'. This has to do with you taking a different approach to what you're doing in order to avoid the inevitable actions your mother will take. You're taking personal offense to what she is doing, which really is immature no matter which way you cut it.
If you took a fraction of the 'hours' you spent trying to find papers and put it into thinking of and implementing simple solutions, then you would be much better off.
You've spent more time defending yourself in this thread than it would take to grab some folders or something and organize your papers. People are treating you like a child in this thread because you're acting like one. This isn't brain surgery.
Maximilian
Lifer
- Feb 8, 2004
- 12,604
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Originally posted by: m0mentary
Originally posted by: clamum
lol :thumbsup:
x2
Seriously, while I agree kinds these days teens feel entitled to do whatever they want, no one ever seems to take the stance that parents have an obligation to raise their children in a manner that also teaches them things like, courtesy, common sense, and tolerance. Its as if providing food and shelter are the only requirements to being an excellent parent on this board.
This thread makes me so glad that none of you are my parents lol.
Skunkwourk
Diamond Member
- Dec 9, 2004
- 4,662
- 1
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Originally posted by: Soviet
Originally posted by: m0mentary
Originally posted by: clamum
lol :thumbsup:
x2
Seriously, while I agree kinds these days teens feel entitled to do whatever they want, no one ever seems to take the stance that parents have an obligation to raise their children in a manner that also teaches them things like, courtesy, common sense, and tolerance. Its as if providing food and shelter are the only requirements to being an excellent parent on this board.
This thread makes me so glad that none of you are my parents lol.
dammit you quoted my bad grammar
Maximilian
Lifer
- Feb 8, 2004
- 12,604
- 15
- 81
Originally posted by: m0mentary
Originally posted by: Soviet
Originally posted by: m0mentary
Originally posted by: clamum
lol :thumbsup:
x2
Seriously, while I agree kinds these days teens feel entitled to do whatever they want, no one ever seems to take the stance that parents have an obligation to raise their children in a manner that also teaches them things like, courtesy, common sense, and tolerance. Its as if providing food and shelter are the only requirements to being an excellent parent on this board.
This thread makes me so glad that none of you are my parents lol.
dammit you quoted my bad grammar
Its overshadowed by theprodigalrebels really really funny post
Instead of removing the cliffs because you are repeating yourself, why not edit the cliffs to answer the questions that are asked the most? Cmon dude.
- Oct 10, 2006
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Originally posted by: altonb1
Originally posted by: irishScott
Originally posted by: altonb1
Originally posted by: bobsmith1492
Huh, my mom never touches my stuff, ever, though she reminds me occasionally that I need to clean up (I just finished school so my stuff is all back at their place in the basement, along with me, and it's all electronics so she has no idea what any of it is
And you know what? That's cool. I don't think ANY of us would be saying the OP should move out if he weren't ranting about his mom touching his stuff. In fact, I think many of us would be aggravated by it, too, if placed in that same situation. HOWEVER, the OP's mom certainly DOES have the right to do it since it is her house. That is the premise we have argued against.
A technical right and a moral right are not the same thing. Call me an idealist, but what she did was simply morally wrong. Everyone has the "right" to free speech, but it's still illegal to scream "fire" in a theater when there's no reason to.
Edit: Yes, it's an analogy, and all analogies are somewhat inaccurate. You get my point, don't nitpick.
I don't necessarily agree it is wrong in either sense, though. I think you are saying it is a moral wrong to go through your stuff at all, and I disagree.
Remove yourself from the situation from a minute. What if a parent is helping clean her 20yo son's room and found illegal narcotics? (using your theory--this is an analogy, so don't nitpick) If the police raided the house for some reason and found it, the house could be seized in many jurisdictions. Would this still be a moral wrong since it was discovered in such a manner?
Morally or technically, I don't believe you should expect a right to privacy in your parent's home. It is THEIR home. THEY pay (or paid) for it, the utilities, the phone, the cable, etc. Now, with that in mind, if you were living there and paying RENT, I believe you would have more of an argument, but even then...since it is your PARENT'S house...you still would be subject to some of these issues as opposed to being on your own.
Unfortunately, it's impossible to generalize. In the scenario you posted, yes it would be morally right; and given that retards far outnumber decent intelligent people, if one were to design a flat universal law then yes you'd be right.
Depends on the individual situation. Granted, no one knows me on this forum. Suffice to say I fail to see how any moral or technical "good" could come out of her randomizing my stuff. All it's done so far is cost me considerable time and effort for no real reason, as it has several times in the last few months. Not to mention delaying the very process she was hounding me to expedite.
And that's where we differ.
In any case, this thread has (due in large part to my own posts) has mutated from a rant into a philosophical debate. Not that I mind, just went a little further than I'd expected.
Originally posted by: irishScott
Unfortunately, it's impossible to generalize. In the scenario you posted, yes it would be morally right; and given that retards far outnumber decent intelligent people, if one were to design a flat universal law then yes you'd be right.
Depends on the individual situation. Granted, no one knows me on this forum. Suffice to say I fail to see how any moral or technical "good" could come out of her randomizing my stuff. All it's done so far is cost me considerable time and effort for no real reason, as it has several times in the last few months. Not to mention delaying the very process she was hounding me to expedite.
And that's where we differ.
In any case, this thread has (due in large part to my own posts) has mutated from a rant into a philosophical debate. Not that I mind, just went a little further than I'd expected.
You know, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results it the definition of insanity?
Believe that everybody else is wrong and you are right is normally a definition of insanity?
Step back grasshopper, for this is only the first of your struggles in life. Every bird must learn to fly without sucking on the food and shelter of it's parent. You'll learn this in time. The mother will constantly nitpick until the bird finally says "enough! I will fly on my own!". that's mom's way of saying "get out, you must learn to fly because I cannot teach you how. You must learn."
So get to learning and get out of the nest.
- Oct 10, 2006
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Precisely. This was a rant, vent, whatever. I was hot-headed, expressing frustration and generally bitching. As such, I suppose I was sort of picking a fight when I posted this (I had a good idea of what ATOT's response would be). I responded aggressively to an insult which then mutated (I like that word...) the thread into it's current form.
This has happened in the past, and it has caused me to spend several hours re-filing crap, but this is the first time it actually posed a real danger to anything important (my return to the University and taxes). So yeah, I blew up
Suffice to say, from my perspective it was and still is entirely about respect and simple common courtesy, and I don't seem to be the only one with this perspective, but.. yeah. That's it. Everything else has already been said.
- Oct 10, 2006
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Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: irishScott
Unfortunately, it's impossible to generalize. In the scenario you posted, yes it would be morally right; and given that retards far outnumber decent intelligent people, if one were to design a flat universal law then yes you'd be right.
Depends on the individual situation. Granted, no one knows me on this forum. Suffice to say I fail to see how any moral or technical "good" could come out of her randomizing my stuff. All it's done so far is cost me considerable time and effort for no real reason, as it has several times in the last few months. Not to mention delaying the very process she was hounding me to expedite.
And that's where we differ.
In any case, this thread has (due in large part to my own posts) has mutated from a rant into a philosophical debate. Not that I mind, just went a little further than I'd expected.
You know, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results it the definition of insanity?
Believe that everybody else is wrong and you are right is normally a definition of insanity?
Step back grasshopper, for this is only the first of your struggles in life. Every bird must learn to fly without sucking on the food and shelter of it's parent. You'll learn this in time. The mother will constantly nitpick until the bird finally says "enough! I will fly on my own!". that's mom's way of saying "get out, you must learn to fly because I cannot teach you how. You must learn."
So get to learning and get out of the nest.
Actually, there are a good amount of people who agree with me in this thread. That, and I never said that...
Everyone's allowed to have a couple of bouts of pissed temporary partial-insanity a year.
And by that I mean that I do intend to actually file my stuff in some form or other. Maybe I'll shove some of the stacks under my bed, assuming I can make room under there...
Finally, I'm not here by choice. If I wasn't on medical leave, I'd be in a Winter session right now catching up from the semester I missed.
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