should we end tipping?

[brainhulk]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/end-restaurant-tipping-112546842.html

A recent move by Sushi Yasuda, a high-end Japanese eatery in New York, to prohibit customers from leaving gratuities — the restaurant raised menu prices by roughly 15% to cover waitstaff salaries — is prompting discussion about whether the no-tip movement could reach, well, a tipping point.
And it is a definite movement: Such renowned restaurants as Thomas Keller’s Per Se in New York and French Laundry in Yountville, Calif.; Alice Waters’ Chez Panisse in Berkeley, Calif.; and Grant Achatz’s Alinea in Chicago have similar policies in place. So did the recently closed Linkery restaurant in San Diego, where owner Jay Porter found that service improved because of the policy, despite widespread beliefs that the tradition of tipping fosters a culture of accountability.
Porter’s argument? Having a reliable income is empowering. “If you don’t have to think about money, you can focus on doing your job well,” he wrote earlier this month.

 

[highland145]

The cows really don't mind.

 

[JulesMaximus]

 

[MontyAC]

 

[StrangerGuy]

I can't be the only one that prefers a higher fixed bill than a lower one with tips. At least for the former I know exactly what to pay without the social interaction baggage.

 

[highland145]

I was correct. That one doesn't give a damn.

 

[rivan]

So did the recently closed Linkery restaurant in San Diego, where owner Jay Porter found that service improved because of the policy, despite widespread beliefs that the tradition of tipping fosters a culture of accountability.
Porter’s argument? Having a reliable income is empowering. “If you don’t have to think about money, you can focus on doing your job well,” he wrote earlier this month.

Interesting that this would come up.

I read Porter's series of blogs on the matter last week. He raises a number of good (but not faultless) points before devolving somewhere around blog entry 7 into 'tipping = misogyny'. I think his view is myopic at best - someone who's worked in the trenches of a restaurant, come up with a hypothesis about what's working and what isn't, found a few things to read that are generally supportive of his point of view and decided he's right about everything.

For what it's worth, I think we'd be better off with a set service charge too. It'd end up saving me money, probably.

 

[JamesV]

As someone who waited tables and managed restaurants for years, ending tipping would be a terrible idea.

First, no waiter/bartender/hairdresser/whatever in the world accurately reports their tips. Some restaurants even tell their employees how much they should claim (percent). A straight 15% of all my checks in a night would not equal the same amount of money I'd make from tips.

And how about the common occurrence of kids coming in (worked at Denny's once), who might sit there a couple of hours and buy two coffees, yet leave a tip almost the size of the check? How about the drunks that give huge tips sometimes (I've received $50 from parties of four occasionally).

And how about the times I've gotten far more tips than any other waiter because I'm just that damn good? Being paid the same as every other waiter, and not getting a premium because I work harder is a slap in the face; like some socialist setup almost.

It would hurt servers to be given a percentage of their sales (unless of course they are a crappy waiter). For upscale restaurants it is completely different, but again an issue raises it's head - you tip out bartenders as a waiter at the end of the night... how much of your flat 15% do they get, and what does that leave you with?

For an expensive restaurant this may work, because the tips are going to big to begin with, but for the other 99.9999999% of waiters it would be terrible.

 

[Red Storm]

If you end tipping, that isn't going to translate into customer savings, they would just up their prices to offset the loss. I'd much rather have that part of the bill be in my own control, where I can properly tip good employees that do a good job versus those who do a bad job.

 

[drebo]

I tip good service extremely well. I tip poor service poorly (but never $0...my belief is that a 5% tip is more demoralizing to the waiter than a 0% tip would be.)

Ending tipping would penalize the good servers while rewarding the poor servers.

 

[Oyeve]

I tip good service extremely well. I tip poor service poorly (but never $0...my belief is that a 5% tip is more demoralizing to the waiter than a 0% tip would be.)

Ending tipping would penalize the good servers while rewarding the poor servers.

This is my belief as well.

 

[Murloc]

And how about the times I've gotten far more tips than any other waiter because I'm just that damn good? Being paid the same as every other waiter, and not getting a premium because I work harder is a slap in the face; like some socialist setup almost.

better waiters work at better and more pricier bars.

In Europe there is no tipping and it all works just fine. Sure, being a waiter in a restaurant that doesn't require expertise or qualifications is a poor man's job (that's why it's all portoguese people doing it here) here, but that's natural, it's not like you're designing rockets. So I don't see why the wage system should be different for a waiter than how it is for the dish washer. The dish washer doesn't get tips for clean plates, it's expected.

 

[soulcougher73]

I sure hope so. If they restraunts cant pay a living wage on its own then thats too bad. They need to figure out a new business model that is sustainable on its own.

 

[Gillbot]

If you end tipping, that isn't going to translate into customer savings, they would just up their prices to offset the loss. I'd much rather have that part of the bill be in my own control, where I can properly tip good employees that do a good job versus those who do a bad job.

This

 

[biostud]

better waiters work at better and more pricier bars.

In Europe there is no tipping and it all works just fine.

There's is tipping, it's just not mandatory in the same way as in the US.

 

[Puppies04]

As someone who waited tables and managed restaurants for years, ending tipping would be a terrible idea.

First, no waiter/bartender/hairdresser/whatever in the world accurately reports their tips. Some restaurants even tell their employees how much they should claim (percent). A straight 15% of all my checks in a night would not equal the same amount of money I'd make from tips.

And how about the common occurrence of kids coming in (worked at Denny's once), who might sit there a couple of hours and buy two coffees, yet leave a tip almost the size of the check? How about the drunks that give huge tips sometimes (I've received $50 from parties of four occasionally).

And how about the times I've gotten far more tips than any other waiter because I'm just that damn good? Being paid the same as every other waiter, and not getting a premium because I work harder is a slap in the face; like some socialist setup almost.

It would hurt servers to be given a percentage of their sales (unless of course they are a crappy waiter). For upscale restaurants it is completely different, but again an issue raises it's head - you tip out bartenders as a waiter at the end of the night... how much of your flat 15% do they get, and what does that leave you with?

For an expensive restaurant this may work, because the tips are going to big to begin with, but for the other 99.9999999% of waiters it would be terrible.

Your arguements regarding earning the same as someone else who isn't as good as you are invalid. Tips should not be banned they should be discretionary as they are at most places in the UK. The model the US uses is nothing to do with "tipping" in its proper sense as you are expected to do it even if you felt you got poor service.

Tip = giving your server extra because you felt they performed well not paying their wage because the business owner pays them jack shit.

 

[jagec]

I tip good service extremely well. I tip poor service poorly (but never $0...my belief is that a 5% tip is more demoralizing to the waiter than a 0% tip would be.)

If so, you're in the minority. Most people don't change their tip percentage that much, no matter WHAT kind of service they get.

 

[SlitheryDee]

No, but we should push hard against any kind of mandatory or automatic tipping. It should be a simple merit based kindness that isn't necessary for servers to make a decent wage. That's the only way they won't feel as entitled to it as they do.

 

[HumblePie]

Your arguements regarding earning the same as someone else who isn't as good as you are invalid. Tips should not be banned they should be discretionary as they are at most places in the UK. The model the US uses is nothing to do with "tipping" in its proper sense as you are expected to do it even if you felt you got poor service.

Tip = giving your server extra because you felt they performed well not paying their wage because the business owner pays them jack shit.

This...

Tipping should be only for excellent performance and not the "mandatory" model we currently have in the US. Then again, if I get poor service I do tip a penny. I also explain to the manager afterwards what I did and why. Since the places I go to normally that accept tips are places I frequent, the person that got a bad tip from me typically hasn't worked there afterwards either.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

If you end tipping, that isn't going to translate into customer savings, they would just up their prices to offset the loss. I'd much rather have that part of the bill be in my own control, where I can properly tip good employees that do a good job versus those who do a bad job.

Then why don't you expect the same freedom everywhere else? How about knocking 5% off the price of groceries and give customers the option to tip the cashier if she gets you through the line adequately and doesn't squash your bread? Cut teacher salaries and allow parents to tip for A's. Lower prices at Home Depot so that you can tip the person who can tell you which aisle to go to for plumbers tape? It's pretty silly to claim that tipping is an essential part of restaurant service while interacting with dozens of employees in other businesses who are providing customer service and are not being tipped. You should either have the right to pay all employees what you think they're worth or all employers should just pay their people a living wage.

 

[ichy]

There's is tipping, it's just not mandatory in the same way as in the US.

An extra Euro would be considered a tip for good service over there, it's not like in the US where it covers the majority of a waiter's pay.

 

[thestrangebrew1]

I heard on a freakonomics podcast a few months ago that tipping is somewhere in the range if $43 billion/yr we Americans spend. It was either freakonomics or planet money. Anyways there was some pretty good arguments as to why we should reconsider tipping, cant really remember them right now but I'd encourage anyone to listen to it. I think tipping should be optional and not mandatory personally. Restaurants need to step up and pay a good wage though. If I liked the service I'll tip on top of this.

 

[Crusty]

There's a bar around here that pays all the staff liveable wages. They get mad at you if you try and tip them, offended really.

 

[KMFJD]

Then why don't you expect the same freedom everywhere else? How about knocking 5% off the price of groceries and give customers the option to tip the cashier if she gets you through the line adequately and doesn't squash your bread? Cut teacher salaries and allow parents to tip for A's. Lower prices at Home Depot so that you can tip the person who can tell you which aisle to go to for plumbers tape? It's pretty silly to claim that tipping is an essential part of restaurant service while interacting with dozens of employees in other businesses who are providing customer service and are not being tipped. You should either have the right to pay all employees what you think they're worth or all employers should just pay their people a living wage.

Yeah pretty much this...if the service is bad you don't go back, owner loses business and fires the shitty waiter. It's a concept that works almost everywhere in the world except in the US.

 

[StrangerGuy]

Then why don't you expect the same freedom everywhere else? How about knocking 5% off the price of groceries and give customers the option to tip the cashier if she gets you through the line adequately and doesn't squash your bread? Cut teacher salaries and allow parents to tip for A's. Lower prices at Home Depot so that you can tip the person who can tell you which aisle to go to for plumbers tape? It's pretty silly to claim that tipping is an essential part of restaurant service while interacting with dozens of employees in other businesses who are providing customer service and are not being tipped. You should either have the right to pay all employees what you think they're worth or all employers should just pay their people a living wage.

Actually you make a very good point, they is nothing that makes waiters or croupiers any more special than other customer-oriented jobs.