MSNY
"The Jews return in 1948,"
Stop right there, you just proved that you know nothing of the history of the region.
"The Jews return in 1948,"
Stop right there, you just proved that you know nothing of the history of the region.
<< How exactly? >>
Some were forced out physically; their homes destroyed to make way for Israeli citizens (by the way, if you are a Jew living outside of Israel, Ariel Sharon will pay you $20,000 to pack up your bags and move to Israel so that you can settle on what IS Palestinian land and create an Israeli settlement) and others, although perhaps not physically forced out, left becuase they were not granted citizenship, they were disenfranchised and they essentially became 2nd or 3rd class citizens. Those who stayed (now called Israeli-Arabs) are without a doubt 2nd class citizens. They work for less money in the same jobs as Israelis and there is widespread discrimination against them.
<< Decide what? Whether Palistinians are justified in killing people to get their way? >>
No. I do not wish to justify any method of killing for political gain. It should be recognized, however, that Sharon and the Israelis as a whole are NOT peaceful innocents. They have as much Palestinian blood on their hands as Arafat and the Palestinians have Israeli blood on theirs.
Some were forced out physically; their homes destroyed to make way for Israeli citizens (by the way, if you are a Jew living outside of Israel, Ariel Sharon will pay you $20,000 to pack up your bags and move to Israel so that you can settle on what IS Palestinian land and create an Israeli settlement) and others, although perhaps not physically forced out, left becuase they were not granted citizenship, they were disenfranchised and they essentially became 2nd or 3rd class citizens. Those who stayed (now called Israeli-Arabs) are without a doubt 2nd class citizens. They work for less money in the same jobs as Israelis and there is widespread discrimination against them.
<< Decide what? Whether Palistinians are justified in killing people to get their way? >>
No. I do not wish to justify any method of killing for political gain. It should be recognized, however, that Sharon and the Israelis as a whole are NOT peaceful innocents. They have as much Palestinian blood on their hands as Arafat and the Palestinians have Israeli blood on theirs.
"They have as much Palestinian blood on their hands as Arafat and the Palestinians have Israeli blood on theirs."
That's exactly like saying the US has as much Taliban blood on it's hands as bin Laden and the Talibans have US blood on theirs.
That's exactly like saying the US has as much Taliban blood on it's hands as bin Laden and the Talibans have US blood on theirs.
konichiwa
Are you saying that all of the Arab states attacking Israel and turning the area into a war zone the day after it was created by the U.N. had nothing to do with some of the Palestinians leaving?
Yes, the Israelis drove some of them out. The Arabs had been attacking Israelis trying to live there for years. Now the U.N. had decided to split the region and every Arab country in the region massed their forces to atttack them.
You are aware that Israel has Arabs in it's government? Name one Arab country that has a Jew in it's government.
Did you know that if you live in a Muslim country and are not Muslim that special taxes are levied on you?
Your point?
Are you saying that all of the Arab states attacking Israel and turning the area into a war zone the day after it was created by the U.N. had nothing to do with some of the Palestinians leaving?
Yes, the Israelis drove some of them out. The Arabs had been attacking Israelis trying to live there for years. Now the U.N. had decided to split the region and every Arab country in the region massed their forces to atttack them.
You are aware that Israel has Arabs in it's government? Name one Arab country that has a Jew in it's government.
Did you know that if you live in a Muslim country and are not Muslim that special taxes are levied on you?
Your point?
Red Dawn
Elite Member
- Jun 4, 2001
- 57,529
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The difference is that the Taliban were /are harbouring and helping Bin Laden attack the US, a nation that had not done anything to deserve any of Bin Laden's unprovoked attacks and sure as hell didn't do anything to the Taliban Government prior to the WTC attacks. We were not occupying their land and we were not stepping all over their Human Rights (hell they were doing that to themselves). Plus there were were enough Afgans who wanted to Taliban ousted
Complaining about the Israeli's in no way means that we support the Palestinian Terrorists who commitied atrocities such as the Suicide Bombings that murdered innocent Israeli citizens, it is just to point out that the Israeli's aren't completely innocent themselves. Once both sides admit the truth behind this ongoing situation the sooner they will be on the track towards a settlement. You have to make it so those who are killing you have a change of heart. It won't be easy, in fact it will seem like it will be damn near impossible at first.
Complaining about the Israeli's in no way means that we support the Palestinian Terrorists who commitied atrocities such as the Suicide Bombings that murdered innocent Israeli citizens, it is just to point out that the Israeli's aren't completely innocent themselves. Once both sides admit the truth behind this ongoing situation the sooner they will be on the track towards a settlement. You have to make it so those who are killing you have a change of heart. It won't be easy, in fact it will seem like it will be damn near impossible at first.
<< Stop right there, you just proved that you know nothing of the history of the region. >>
Like I said get over the history lessons, it can't be changed. We need to look for a future solution.
You did not read my previous post then entirely. I'm not taking sides at this point, but I feels the Arabs WILL push the US even more into Israel's corner militarily if they continue down there current road.
I'm really worried that this conflict will INCREASE the threat of terrorism here in the US. I think were on the eve of "the other shoe dropping" since 9/11. It's just a matter of time I think.
Should another event happen here like 9/11 or worse then I think an all out war is inevitable.
"You have to make it so those who are killing you have a change of heart. It won't be easy, in fact it will seem like it will be damn near impossible at first."
I don't think the onus is on the victims to change the heart of their aggressors. Of these two parties with arguably legitimate gripes, one side resorts to terrorist means to achieve their end. I will NEVER condone that no matter how right their position may be. To capitulate under terrorist duress would be a grave mistake. Israel has as much right to defend itself as the US did after 9-11. Good luck getting me to see that any other way!
I don't think the onus is on the victims to change the heart of their aggressors. Of these two parties with arguably legitimate gripes, one side resorts to terrorist means to achieve their end. I will NEVER condone that no matter how right their position may be. To capitulate under terrorist duress would be a grave mistake. Israel has as much right to defend itself as the US did after 9-11. Good luck getting me to see that any other way!
Red Dawn
Elite Member
- Jun 4, 2001
- 57,529
- 3
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<< Good luck getting me to see that any other way! >>
You really think I was trying to get you to change your Opinion ? They don't call you Ornery for nothing. If I was trying to get you to change your opinion I would bring up the subject of how much money we could save by not supporting Israel. I know where your heart lies John , after all I've read hundreds if not thousands of your posts over the last 3 or 4 years
"I would bring up the subject of how much money we could save by not supporting Israel"
Ooh, you bastard! A new low for Red!
Ooh, you bastard! A new low for Red!
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