Should men also have the "right to choose"

[nehalem256]

Men do have a right to choose.... whether or not to wear a condom. Sure they sometimes break but very few things in life are guaranteed.

What if the woman says "don't worry about a condom Im on the pill", but actually isnt?

When you can magically carry the baby in your body for nine months and relieve the woman of that task then I'm sure this argument will carry more weight.

Reminds me of that joke that starts "if men got pregnant...."

This is irrelevant no one is talking about forcing women to carry babies for 9 months.

We are saying that women cannot force other people to take responsibility to carry a baby for 9 months.

 

[lotus503]

Funny how the woman gets to spend the child's money.

Funny how if the woman dumps the children at the fathers's house and continues spending the "child support" money she does not go to jail for theft by fraud.



And his money is a direct result of working WITH HIS BODY. And if he was not being forced to support a woman's choice he could work less.

Forcing someone to work to support your choices is what exactly?

He had the choice to not get her pregnant.

There is hardly a better example if cause and effect. If a child is born you are legally required to support it.

In most cases the amount of that support is directly related to the amount if time spent caring for the child.

I know guys who have 50/50 custody and pay nearly nothing, one whose ex wife makes more than him actually is paid support by the ex wife.

 

[nehalem256]

Yes both people who engage in intercourse know the end result can be pregnancy. What that has to do with pro life or pro choice I'm not sure.

Pro life folks tend to think an embryo is a person, I think it's an embryo.

So man's choice only creates an embryo. It is the woman's choice that creates a person. Why should she be able to force a man to be responsible for her choice to create a person?

 

[nehalem256]

He had the choice to not get her pregnant.

He had the choice not to have sex.

This is exactly the same argument that conservatives make about women who get pregnant.

To bad liberals also argue that expecting abstinence is impossible.

 

[lotus503]

What if the woman says "don't worry about a condom Im on the pill", but actually isnt?




This is irrelevant no one is talking about forcing women to carry babies for 9 months.

We are saying that women cannot force other people to take responsibility to carry a baby for 9 months.

If the woman deceives then the man should have been more careful who he trusts to stick his dick in.

This happened to me personally with my oldest daughter, mom railed for months how she was unable to get prego, 2nd act without protection and she is preggo.

Thing is its not the child's fault mom was a lying sack O shit. So I happily have my 70/30 custody split and pay 1200 a month to mom.

Even knowing that I'm probably paying for moms hair dresser, car, etc.

But she is a great kid, well taken care of and despite a kooky mom, very well adjusted.

 

[lotus503]

So man's choice only creates an embryo. It is the woman's choice that creates a person. Why should she be able to force a man to be responsible for her choice to create a person?

Because he knew the game going in.

It's not like we don't know the rules

 

[Tom]

more on that point, she has the same options as a man in terms of contraceptives and birth control methods. .. . so now she really does have a choice as to whether or not she's pregnant or not

What's your point ?

 

[schneiderguy]

Men: If he chooses to have sex and gets a girl pregnant he is responsible.
Women: If she chooses to have sex and gets pregnant it's not her fault and you're a sexist virgin loser for suggesting otherwise.

Libruls, treating women like retarded children who can't take responsibility for their actions since 1828.

 

[nehalem256]

If the woman deceives then the man should have been more careful who he trusts to stick his dick in.

This happened to me personally with my oldest daughter, mom railed for months how she was unable to get prego, 2nd act without protection and she is preggo.

Thing is its not the child's fault mom was a lying sack O shit. So I happily have my 70/30 custody split and pay 1200 a month to mom.

Even knowing that I'm probably paying for moms hair dresser, car, etc.

But she is a great kid, well taken care of and despite a kooky mom, very well adjusted.

So you believe that women has a right defraud a man into impregnating her and then force him to support her

How is what you believe any different than what what a certain Missouri senate candidate believes?

 

[lotus503]

Men: If he chooses to have sex and gets a girl pregnant he is responsible.
Women: If she chooses to have sex and gets pregnant it's not her fault and you're a sexist virgin loser for suggesting otherwise.

Libruls, treating women like retarded children who can't take responsibility for their actions since 1828.

I suspect when you carry a child to term and birth it, the law can be adjusted accordingly.

 

[Jhhnn]

Men: If he chooses to have sex and gets a girl pregnant he is responsible.
Women: If she chooses to have sex and gets pregnant it's not her fault and you're a sexist virgin loser for suggesting otherwise.

Libruls, treating women like retarded children who can't take responsibility for their actions since 1828.

Need more straw to stuff into that empty suit?

 

[WHAMPOM]

Women have 100% control over if a child is born because she is the host of the child during pregnancy. If she wants the child, regardless of what the father wants, the child is born. If she doesn't want the child, regardless of what the father wants, the child is aborted.

In the case of the having the child against the mans wishes, i at least think the men should have a way to "opt out". The men and women share equal 50% responsibility in the conception of a child but only men are somehow held to account with no say in the matter. Women should bare 50% of the burden.

Main Point:
If a man decides (and legally attests) during the first trimester of pregnancy that he does not want the child, he is absolved from any legal responsibility and the woman still has HER own choice as to if she wants the child. No rights are removed from the woman. She still has the RIGHT TO CHOOSE, but the man also has a say in his future. The woman MUST alert the man within the appropriate timeframe to allow him to make a decision of forfeit any legal responsibility on his part.
Agree or Disagree?

That "MALE" choice came and went at "condom time" even better if you get the "SNIP". Otherwise you spurt, you support. By the way are you ten?

 

[Jhhnn]

So in other words no matter what a woman does it is taking responsibility. That is certainly convenient

It's mostly just reality, something you seem to have trouble connecting to...

 

[lotus503]

So you believe that women has a right defraud a man into impregnating her and then force him to support her

How is what you believe any different than what what a certain Missouri senate candidate believes?

No I am not saying I agree with those actions, rather understand the law implicitly supports them.

It's like anything really your always going to have those scenarios but the law values the interest of the child above the financial well being of the parents.

You have the choice to not engage in sex and avoid the rules altogether.

 

[WHAMPOM]

So you believe that women has a right defraud a man into impregnating her and then force him to support her

How is what you believe any different than what what a certain Missouri senate candidate believes?

Did you fail the Latex challenge?

EDIT: LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL!

 

[monovillage]

No I am not saying I agree with those actions, rather understand the law implicitly supports them.

It's like anything really your always going to have those scenarios but the law values the interest of the child above the financial well being of the parents.

You have the choice to not engage in sex and avoid the rules altogether.

Sounds like you would support an anti-abortion bill?

 

[nehalem256]

No I am not saying I agree with those actions, rather understand the law implicitly supports them.

It's like anything really your always going to have those scenarios but the law values the interest of the child above the financial well being of the parents.

You have the choice to not engage in sex and avoid the rules altogether.

Everyone here knows what the CURRENT law is.

The question is whether those laws are equal and just.

That "MALE" choice came and went at "condom time" even better if you get the "SNIP". Otherwise you spurt, you support. By the way are you ten?

So you do not see anything inherently about the male choice ended at condom time? And yeah somehow I don't think a lot of doctors are going to be sterilizing 17 year old boys so they can have consequence free sex :\

And the bolded makes you seem like the 10 year old who is incapable of rationally defending his believes. Probably because the only support for them is worshiping whatever choices women make.

 

[lotus503]

Everyone here knows what the CURRENT law is.

The question is whether those laws are equal and just.



So you do not see anything inherently about the male choice ended at condom time? And yeah somehow I don't think a lot of doctors are going to be sterilizing 17 year old boys so they can have consequence free sex :\

And the bolded makes you seem like the 10 year old who is incapable of rationally defending his believes. Probably because the only support for them is worshiping whatever choices women make.

I agree with the law, once a child is born the focus is on the welfare of the child.
I simply don't care at that point what led to it.

Pay up, support you kid you have no choice.

 

[Lithium381]

That "MALE" choice came and went at "condom time" even better if you get the "SNIP". Otherwise you spurt, you support. By the way are you ten?

Yep i've been a member here since i was an embryo that my mom decided not to abort in 2001.

2012. . . .

 

[mmntech]

A more interesting hypothetical case is what happens when the mother does not want the child but the man does. Where as the father is willing to bare full responsibility for raising the child on his own. It's not very common but it does happen. I personally know one dad like this. The fathers rights movement is fighting for this, and financial abortion to an extent. The latter of which is supported by some feminists surprisingly enough.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fathers'_rights_movement#Parental_and_reproductive_rights

 

[lotus503]

A more interesting hypothetical case is what happens when the mother does not want the child but the man does. Where as the father is willing to bare full responsibility for raising the child on his own. It's not very common but it does happen. I personally know one dad like this. The fathers rights movement is fighting for this, and financial abortion to an extent. The latter of which is supported by some feminists surprisingly enough.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fathers'_rights_movement#Parental_and_reproductive_rights

That is an interesting twist, should the law support the dads right to have the child?

 

[LumbergTech]

So you believe that women has a right defraud a man into impregnating her and then force him to support her

How is what you believe any different than what what a certain Missouri senate candidate believes?

You just don't fuckin get it ..do you? Think about the fucking kids instead of your greedy ass self.

 

[Lithium381]

That is an interesting twist, should the law support the dads right to have the child?

i fully support the dads right to have the child, but as mentioned, the woman is the host(so far as science of today is concerned) . . so she has the choice

 

[Lithium381]

You just don't fuckin get it ..do you? Think about the fucking kids instead of your greedy ass self.

i thought it was responsible of a woman to have an abortion if she thought she coudn't properly care for the child. . . . yet there is a double standard for the man?

 

[1prophet]

What if the male is a minor ,14, and the woman in her thirties, a school teacher that seduces him, gets pregnant and has a child, should the woman be able to collect child support from him or his parents after she serves her time or during her incarceration for statutory rape?