should I abandon the AMD ship? (Updated)

[Gikaseixas]

Also

What about 4690/4790 vs DDR4 era intel i5/i7??? Broadwell will make everything obsolete
That's the point. You guys will wanna upgrade for sure

Dead end is dead end period

 

[AtenRa]

it absolutely cannot push the 7970 CF sufficiently.

It seams it can push R9 295X but not 7970 CF ??

Or GTX780Ti SLI

Perhaps you have PhysX enabled, that way the game will run PhysX on the CPU.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

Well actually, an 1150 CPU now, like a 4690/4790 is very, very likely faster for gaming than any upgrade that will be available for FM2, so the point is kind of moot.

It's not moot -- people were saying that AM3 was a dead end, but so is 1150. So it is pointless to make the move to 1150 if you're doing it for a future upgrade path. Because 1150 is also a dead end.

The only sockets that are getting the next-gen chips in 2015 are likely LGA 2011 and FM2+.

I still think the OP should wait for DDR4 prices to drop and get something like Broadwell. If he still
wants to roll with AMD, I wouldn't be shocked if a Carrizo-based Six Core for desktops shows up
next year on FM2+. They are going to need something to sell at the $200+ price point -- and I
just don't see 32nm Visheras being able to sell at that price by mid 2015.

But going to a Haswell from an overclocked FX-6300 isn't enough of a boost to justify the investment.

 

[Ramses]

after twenty years of playing with computers, I can say for certainty that it's all a dead end. what matters is what's cheap enough and fun enough in the here and now.

 

[witeken]

Intel can't do integrated graphics as well as AMD, either.

Intel has the fastest IGP since Haswell. Time to catch up. Broadwell will offer a healthy increase and Skylake will add a nice number of EUs.

Things are even worse in TDP limited scenarios. Core M's GPU performance is top-notch.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Intel has the fastest IGP since Haswell. Time to catch up. Broadwell will offer a healthy increase and Skylake will add a nice number of EUs.

Things are even worse in TDP limited scenarios. Core M's GPU performance is top-notch.

Comare Intel's IGP with the IGP in the PS4 or XBone. Actually, don't. This thread really isn't about consoles. Someone said that more cores will likely come in handy since the consoles use CPU's with eight AMD cores. Then someone else tried to turn this into a console performance discussion, not sure why. We should just move on from it.

 

[witeken]

They can't do it at AMD's price point. Having both a CPU / GPU design team under one roof not only gave them an advantage for packaging, but also one for overall cost.

Intel can do it AMD's price point, but they don't. That's a subtle but important difference.

 

[witeken]

Edit: But remember Intel sucks on the graphics side, they can't touch Radeon HD7850 level performance (so far)

Because Intel doesn't release 200W processing units.

 

[Gikaseixas]

Intel can do it AMD's price point, but they don't. That's a subtle but important difference.

Another important difference, could they offer similar performance to the HD 7850 GPU back then???? Even now, they don't have anything close.

 

[witeken]

Another important difference, could they offer similar performance to the HD 7850 GPU back then???? Even now, they don't have anything close.

If they decided to add another couple of slices, sure.

 

[Gikaseixas]

Because Intel doesn't release 200W processing units.

more like 100W

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/HD_7850_HD_7870/24.html

 

[Gikaseixas]

If they decided to add another couple of slices, sure.

Fair, they're a huge corporation, i think they could come up with something but fact is, their best is Iris Pro so far, which pales in comparison and Sony/MS needed something much better

 

[Cerb]

You said AMD was a dead end, he just told you that Intel is in the same boat. Every cpu being sold (except Haswell-E) is a dead end since DDR4 stuff will become mainstream. In other words, socket 1156 is dead end too.

Any existing socket but FM2+ is a dead end, and most mobos won't support new chips on it even if much better ones come out later for it. AMD as being a dead end v. Intel as being a dead and AM3+ vs. LGA1150 as being dead ends are different. There's little point to looking forward to, as major upgrades, near-future AMD offerings, while Intel's should offer another 10-20% stock performance, and who knows what OC potential. It sucks, but what can you do (we got $200 mainstream CPUs from Intel much thanks to competitive pressure from AMD's CPUs, so I'd love to see much better from AMD, but...)? At least AMD has good enough stuff to keep the low-end i3s from having made their way to $150 over the course of the Core generational marches .

 

[Cheesesticksandbeer]

The topic really got the attention of you guys. Thanks for all the feedback so far. I am still on the fence, the second 7970 will be here in a few hours for testing. I am looking at some i7 Z97 builds now, specifically i7 4790k & Asrock Z97 Extreme4 for 380 with a 15$ mail in rebate from microcenter. Still a lot of coin with unknown performance gains with my setup. Gota love upgrading

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

Intel has the fastest IGP since Haswell. Time to catch up. Broadwell will offer a healthy increase and Skylake will add a nice number of EUs.

Things are even worse in TDP limited scenarios. Core M's GPU performance is top-notch.

Not really -- Kaveri is usually faster at playing most games (BF4, Grid 2, etc):
http://wccftech.com/amd-kaveri-apu-a10-7850k-intel-i5-4570r-iris-pro-graphics-showdown/

 

[cbrunny]

This is the AC4 options menu. Which of these options uses the CPU? Which options were you not able to set on high levels on the FX with two Radeon 7970's that you can now max out with an Intel CPU and the same Radeon 7970's? I don't have this game, so not something I can test. Maybe shadows or Physx particles?

I'm not a pro. I don't know what uses the CPU and what doesn't, or how much single threaded performance is necessary to instruct the GPUs to draw whatever or anything like that. I can tell you that my 7970CF did not hit 100% GPU usage under AMD on this game, and now that I'm running Intel they stick to 100%. To me, that's a pretty clear sign of a resolution of a CPU bottleneck.

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

Any existing socket but FM2+ is a dead end, and most mobos won't support new chips on it even if much better ones come out later for it. AMD as being a dead end v. Intel as being a dead and AM3+ vs. LGA1150 as being dead ends are different. There's little point to looking forward to, as major upgrades, near-future AMD offerings, while Intel's should offer another 10-20% stock performance, and who knows what OC potential. It sucks, but what can you do (we got $200 mainstream CPUs from Intel much thanks to competitive pressure from AMD's CPUs, so I'd love to see much better from AMD, but...)? At least AMD has good enough stuff to keep the low-end i3s from having made their way to $150 over the course of the Core generational marches .

It's very true -- I think we have all gotten a bit spoiled.

I know the first desktop computer I used at work was an IBM PS/2 Model 80 that sold for $10,995 new and had very limited upgrade potential. No, that is not a type-o.... It sold for ELEVEN thousand dollars in 1987. And you wonder why IBM can't sell desktops anymore? The market wouldn't support those prices. I think we're doing okay right now -- even if AMD isn't quite as fast as Intel.

 

[SlowSpyder]

I'm not a pro. I don't know what uses the CPU and what doesn't, or how much single threaded performance is necessary to instruct the GPUs to draw whatever or anything like that. I can tell you that my 7970CF did not hit 100% GPU usage under AMD on this game, and now that I'm running Intel they stick to 100%. To me, that's a pretty clear sign of a resolution of a CPU bottleneck.

My guess would be that they didn't show 100% usage because you said you had the settings at low, not because the FX wasn't fast enough for higher graphical settings. If you move everything to the low setting even with your Intel CPU, you might find that they don't reach 100% usage again.

 

[janeuner]

nevermind...

 

[witeken]

more like 100W

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/HD_7850_HD_7870/24.html

You also need a CPU, don't you?

 

[Sweepr]

Sweepr please grow up

i said at the time MS and Sony decided to go with AMD, both Intel and Nvidia didn't have a better solution, very different from saying they're not capable of designing something better.

So, who needs to learn how to read?

Edit: But remember Intel sucks on the graphics side, they can't touch Radeon HD7850 level performance (so far)

Not really. That's what you said:

Yes they did
Nvidia and Intel did not have a better solution, the best performing part came from AMD.

...and performance, don't forget now
I know it's a hard pill to swallow hehe

There were a lot better performing solutions than an 8-core Jaguar CPU and Radeon HD7850-like GPU back then, but it's clear that there were much more important factors than pure performance going on (APU integration, power, costs, time to market, etc.). Either way, saying Intel/NVIDIA/IBM wouldn't be able to deliver a solution with better performance is plain ridiculous. Also your personal attacks are getting pretty boring.

 

[Ranulf]

Look at the Dead Rising 3 benchmarks and picture that next year with some titles. The difference is night and day in some games, especially minimum FPS. AM3+ is dead in the water and an 8350 just falls apart against a Haswell i7.

How can I take DR3 seriously for any benchmarking? Its a console port that is meant to run at 30fps. The devs themselves have said they guarantee nothing beyond that.

As to the OP. I see no logical reason to upgrade right now. The price performance numbers just aren't there for me. Its a good reason to upgrade if you want to and have the cash.

 

[cbrunny]

My guess would be that they didn't show 100% usage because you said you had the settings at low, not because the FX wasn't fast enough for higher graphical settings. If you move everything to the low setting even with your Intel CPU, you might find that they don't reach 100% usage again.

Uh, no. I tried higher settings and had piss poor framerates with AMD & turned down settings to improve performance. In the attempts at high settings, GPU usage did not hit 100% or anywhere close. It would be pretty foolish to not try higher settings.

You are probably right about turning down settings on my Intel platform though.

 

[Maximilian]

OP should have put a poll up.

Now you've got 7 pages of whatever to wade through :|

Yes abandon ship, new tech is fun to tinker with :thumbsup:

 

[PG]

Just to add fuel to the fire....

There are rumors that Carrizo will not be coming to FM2+ but will be mobile only, we will be getting a Kaveri refresh instead of Carrizo on FM2+ desktop, and AMD will not have anything using DDR4 until 2016.
If this is true then FM2+ isn't so future proof either. 1150 at least has Broadwell to look forward to, if you have Z97.